3 and 4 yr old shih tzu won't house train

[bananachiki]

I'm going to get a lot of flack for this, but when we got our 1st dog he was pretty will house broken and then we got the second one and broke out the puppy pads and left them too long. I think the dogs associated the pad with the floor and thought all floor was free game. They have free run of our unfinished basement during the day while we're at work and mess almost every day down stairs.

Recently they've started peeing on the bed in the spare room when we forget to close the door, this is happening while we're home and the dog door is open. Also they sneak downstairs to mess while we're home and it's cold out and we don't notice them going downstairs (that's where the food and water are).

The dogs eat twice a day but have access to water all the time. I'm not comfortable crate training them all day, and at night they sleep in their bed beside our bed, or if one of us is out of town, on the bed.

I' tired of cleaning up dog messes, and we're looking at moving into a brand new house, which I would rather not christen with dog pee!

[millitntanimist]

Back to basics with you!
This video covers just about everything I would recommend
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QvPiFcG7ROI

Moving will actually be a plus in this scenario. Dogs don't generalize, so you should be able to prevent the behavior if you start working on this now and carry over to the new house (which they will think of as a different place with new rules).

Good luck! Housebreaking is a frustrating problem but it's totally workable.

[BenMax]

I have to agree with millitntanimist. A change of environment, and setting consistant ground rules will actually help the problem you are currently having.
I am proof of that as my own dog was not clean at my home yet with a move she is now perfect. I am now a true believer that environment plays a big role.

[Emie&Mila]

I know you said you didnt like crate training. I didnt either until I got desperate. Putting my baby up all day just seemed horrible to me, some people even left them up while they were home. I however changed my mind very fast when my carpet was getting ruined. I do not leave her in it while I am at home. Only when I am at work and while Im asleep. I get up once in that middle of the night and let her an my other dog out and straight back in the crate. They go out as soon as I get up in the morning, right before I go to bed and every hour on the hour I put on a timer on my microwave so when it went off I took her out. With your dog being older Id say like every other hour will probably be good. I leave water down all the time too, but I do have one dog that roams the house that it potty trained. So I just leave enough for him to quench his thirst and not so much that he is going to have to go so bad before I get home that he cant hold it. Also putting your food and water upstairs will probably help too. block of areas were you cant see them good, so when they go to pee or the other you can see them. If you dont see them do it dont scold them. If you catch them in the act say NO very firmly and pick them up and put them outside. Say go potty or anything that you want to associate with it. If they go to the door even if its just standing there take them outside so and tell them that word so that way they start to associate the door and outside with pottying. Were your dog is older it will probably take longer. You also used puppy pads which I have used in the past but honestly they can ruin a dog on training and make it so much harder for them to go outside because they learn its ok to go in the house. Hope this helps! And good luck I know what a pain pottying training can be. Emie is 5 months old now she likes her crate and it is somewhere she can go to lay down and something that is just hers. She is completly crate trained and she hasnt "went" in the house in over 2 weeks so now Im debating on letting her roam free with my other dog while I am not home. She would have been trianed sooner if I had started crate training sooner it worked miracles!

Oh yea I dont have to set the timer anymore she started letting me know by going to the door, I have seen peopl get too dependant on the timer and there dogs really dont get potty trained because if they wernt taken out every hour they would go inside. The thing is to slowly ween them off and taking them out EVERY time they go to the door is very important in doing this.