Dogs and cats that get stung by bees - Pet podcast #21 - Transcription

Bee Stings in Cats and Dogs

Please note that this is an audio transcription of our pet podcasts. Grammar and punctuation may not be perfect.

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Marko: Hi there everyone and welcome to the 21st Pet podcast on pets.ca. My name is Marko. We are coming to you from Montreal, Quebec, Canada, and today is July 7, 2007, 07/07/07, perhaps the luckiest day of the year and lucky for you because we're doing this week Pet podcast today as well, so yeah. For today's show, we're going to be doing something a little bit different. We're adding a new segment to the show, but before we do that, let's go on to the comments. I very much like to thank luckypenny who commented on our last podcast with regard to CDS, Cognitive Dysfunction Syndrome. She quite appreciated the podcast and Dr. Lee's information in particular. Dr. Lee really gave a really well-rounded synopsis of what CDS is, which is like a little primer, but it was really well rounded and he presented a lot of information about senility and dementia when our pets get older what happens to them cognitively. It was really very interesting and luckypenny in particular commented, so thanks very much luckypenny for commenting. We love to get comments and as always, you can do it of course through the bulletin board on pets.ca or you can do it through the blog directly, www.pets.ca/blog, or of course you can just send me an email directly, pets.ca ( A T )gmail.com. You can provide suggestions, feedback, criticism, anything you'd like. We just love to get comments. The show is basically for you guys. So, if you provide us more feedback, we'll be able to give you more of what you want.

For today's show, it's going to be a little bit different. We're going to be answering the question or rather, Dr. Lee is going to be answering a question that toonces has post on our bulletin board. Toonces is a regular member. Thank you for posting that question, toonces. It's a question on bee stings. Bee season is upon us and many areas have a lot of bees and a lot of members and guests and pet owners in general are concerned about what happens if our pets get stung by bees and allergies to bees. So, Dr. Lee gives us quite a good primer on bee stings and that's coming up. Before we do that, we thought we'd like to add a new segment to the show, just change it up a little bit, make it a little more interesting and it's going to be pets in the news, that type of thing, but instead of the average story that may well not end so nicely, we thought we would focus these segments on good news or good mews, which leads us into what we're going to call this. We're just trying it out, but we'd love to have a good name for it. A couple of things that come to my mind are The Good Mews, The Woofy Times, The Doogie Telegraph, not really sure. If members or guests or anyone have suggestions as to what we should title this segment, please just send them our way and for sure we'll consider it. I guess for today we can go with The Good Mews.

Today's story in The Good Mews is a story that we found via The North Bay Nugget and there we read about Michelle Jameus. She loves animals so much that she is running across the country to stop the practice of euthanizing healthy pets in shelters. There's going to be a link to the actual story located at nugget.ca. Michelle also has a blog at nokillcanada.blogspot.com. I'll put both in the show notes so you can access them easily, but basically we wanted to congratulate Michelle for doing this great task and what she's doing is she's just spreading the word across Canada. She's going from one coast to the other coast, jogging 30 to 40 kilometers a day and she's stopping at Tim Hortons and things like this just to talk to the average pet owner about the importance of spaying and neutering your pets. Obviously, the pets.ca members know so well, especially now, how important it is to spay and neuter, but we were all newbies once and we didn't all have this great information. Shelters are overflowing with animals and a lot of times it could be so much diminished if we would just spay and neuter our pets. So, Michelle is trying to spread that message coast to coast across Canada and I'd like to personally congratulate her. Really, if people are interested in the story, they should have a read. It's a short story and it's really heartwarming and she's doing good work. So, kudos Michelle.

Now, onto today's main segment where we answer toonces' question about bee stings on the bulletin board. Instead of talking about the interview, let's just get right into it now.

So, for today's show instead of covering a full topic with Dr. Lee as we've done for the past two podcasts, thanks again, today Dr. Lee is just going to answer a question from the bulletin board. Hi Dr. Lee. Thanks again for agreeing to answer this nice question for us.

Dr. Christopher Lee: Hi. Thanks for having me today.

Marko: Always our pleasure and happy July 4th, Dr. Lee. Dr. Lee is nice enough to even do this on Independence Day, so thanks very much. So, I'm going to get right into the question and it's a question on bee stings and the question is as follows. "Last night, my girl Currie was stung by several bees and went into anaphylactic shock. It was so scary. She could not breathe. Her face was swollen, her eyes closed, her underside and ears went bright pink and her gums very pale. I called the emergency vet and they told me to give her 25 mg of Benadryl every 6 hours (3 doses in total) and she was fine. I urge all of you to have that on hand as it saved her life. My husband is allergic to bees and we did have an EpiPen, but the dose was too strong for the dog, but you can get an EpiPen from the vet for dogs. I set my alarm for 3:30 a.m. for her second dose. We did not sleep all night. I was so worried about her, but this morning she was fine and ready to take on the day." So, I guess Dr. Lee, I wonder if you could give us tips in general on bee stings for both cats and dogs. How important is it to be aware of this phenomenon that I'm sure occurs all the time?

Dr. Christopher Lee: Bee stings can range from being mild, painful irritant up to a life-threatening problem. The difficulty is that if the dog, cat or human is sensitive to the bee sting and has an allergic reaction. An anaphylactic reaction can kill dogs, cats or even humans with just as little as one sting. So, the problem with bee stings is that death and serious complication can arise from as little as one bee sting if the patient is sensitive to it. Also, multiple bee stings, you can have a level of venom inside of the patient, which can cause a serious problem. It can lead to heart problems such as [unintelligible], kidney problems, liver problems, and overall systemic reaction. While sometimes we can get one bee sting, it's also not uncommon to have multiple bee stings. When a bee stings a dog or cat, they actually release enough pheromone that triggers other bees in the area to become more aggressive. Also, carbon dioxide and dark colors will enhance the aggressiveness of the bees. So, when you mix that all together, you can have quite a number of bee stings in a very short period of time. As far as treatment, Benadryl is important, but may not be the only thing that's necessary. There are five proteins inside a bee venom and only one of them is going to be directly affected by the Benadryl. So, Benadryl is important, but certainly if the patient is having systemic reaction such as something above and beyond just the isolated sting type, a trip to the veterinarian may well be warranted. If the dog or cat is having anaphylactic reaction, death can occur usually within one hour, so getting the patient to the emergency hospital is important thing to do.

Marko: I'm sorry to interject. For those listeners that may not know what anaphylactic shock is, can you give us like a 10-word definition kind of thing?

Dr. Christopher Lee: Anaphylaxis is a rapid allergic reaction, which is going to include a number of systemic overall body changes. You can have pale gums, weakness, lethargy, difficulty breathing, overall hives where you're having a breakout across the entire body, things like that.

Marko: Excellent. Thank you. So, I got a quick question for you, Dr. Lee. You know, humans get bit by bees occasionally. I've been bitten once or twice. I know lots of people have and I know lots of pets have also been bitten once or twice by a couple of bee stings. First off, if your pet is not allergic to bee stings, a one or two bee stings on a dog or cat going to be a serious matter for your pet?

Dr. Christopher Lee: Not necessarily. A lot of it does have to do with signs. The more stings, the worse it's going to be. In general, there have been some studies that suggest that you need 14 to 20 stings per kilogram in order to get into a life-threatening situation. The problem is that with five different proteins that are being injected into the pet, the more things that are available [unintelligible] patient and their individual sensitivity all have to be factored in. I think the importance is that if your pet has been stung by a bee, one, it is a serious issue; two, if there are any signs above and beyond that, well, that is a problem.

Marko: Okay, excellent. Do you know offhand or is there any data that you're aware of that suggests the percentage of let's say cats and dogs that are naturally allergic to bees?

Dr. Christopher Lee: No, there is not any data that I'm aware of as far as exact numbers that may be out there. Certainly, I see patients that are allergic to other things, dogs that have history of allergies seem to have a higher percentage of having adverse reactions to other allergens such as bee stings.

Marko: Okay. Let's say people live in an area that really have a lot of bees and there are bee problems year after year and people are concerned about this, that perhaps their pets are indeed allergic to bees. Is there a specific test that a pet owner can take through their veterinarian that will say, "Yes, indeed. You are allergic to bee stings. Be very careful."

Dr. Christopher Lee: In general, the test is going to be when they get stung by the bee. It is important to know that once there is a known allergy to the bee sting, subsequent bee stings are going to only make matters worse.

Marko: Okay, but there's no specific test? If I'm a beekeeper and I got three sheepdogs and I want to know if my sheepdogs are allergic to bees, there is no test I can take beforehand?

Dr. Christopher Lee: Other than getting your pets stung by the bee, not that I'm aware of.

Marko: Very good. It's actually very good to know. I guess I'd like to ask now, what about EpiPens? Is that something that people should carry all the time? When should pet owners get an EpiPen? I guess that EpiPen, if they are going to get one, it needs to be specific for dogs or cats and it shouldn't be a human one.

Dr. Christopher Lee: Correct. That medication is going to be based off of signs. I think that, again, dogs that had prior anaphylaxis to a bee sting, owners that are worried or people and pets that live in an area of high bees, that may be a great option for you. I think the important thing is to get the EpiPen and run it by your veterinarian first so they can show you how to use it, what dosing, and when to use it.

Marko: Excellent. I guess I just have one more quick question. I was curious to know the difference between let's say bees and wasps, bees, wasps, hornets. Are they all similar? Are they all different?

Dr. Christopher Lee: When you're looking at bees versus wasps, bumblebees, bees, and killer bees, those are all going to be in the general same type of toxins. The difference between killer bees and non-killer bees is actually their aggression has nothing to do with venom. So, being stung by a normal bee is just as dangerous as being stung by an African Bee.

Marko: And just as dangerous as being stung by a wasp or a hornet?

Dr. Christopher Lee: They seem to have less signs of anaphylaxis with wasps and the toxins are a little bit different.

Marko: Okay. I guess for our last question perhaps. I was curious if you could let us know about Benadryl. What dose should we use? How should we decide when to administer Benadryl in case our pets are bitten by bees?

Dr. Christopher Lee: Benadryl is a great medication. One thing is that with the five different proteins that are inside of the bee venom, it is important to know that the Benadryl only addresses C-peptide 41, so the other proteins are not going to be affected by the Benadryl. Benadryl is a wonderful medication and overall very safe. The important thing is to make sure that it does not have any other active ingredient. Benadryl Sinus, Benadryl Cold will commonly have Tylenol mixed in. It's not something you want to give your pets, especially cats.

Marko: Such an excellent point. Some people might hear this podcast and think, "Oh, I have Benadryl," and give the wrong type of Benadryl. Again, it needs to be plain Benadryl that they are giving. Is that correct?

Dr. Christopher Lee: Plain Benadryl, there's a little bit range on the dose depending on which dose you need for your pet. I would recommend that you ask your vet.

Marko: Right. So, if your pet does get bitten by bees and you are concerned, don't just go shoving Benadryl down their throats. Call your vet and found out the appropriate dose for the size of your pet.

Dr. Christopher Lee: Correct and an even better way of going is to ask your vet before the bee sting at your next visit. That way, when it does happen, you can be prepared in case you won't be able to get access to your veterinarian immediately because, again, majority of the serious anaphylactic signs are going to occur within one hour.

Marko: Very good. So, thanks so much, Dr. Lee, for answering this question with quite a lot of information. It's much appreciated. I know in so many parts of Canada and the US, bees in the summer are a serious problem. People are always concerned about bees. So, now, hopefully we've allayed their fears just a little, little bit. So, thanks again for answering this question and we will speak to you in the very near future again.

Dr. Christopher Lee: Glad I could help. It's been a pleasure.

Marko: Thank so much to Dr. Lee for helping us answer toonces' question on bee stings. Dr. Lee has been so generous with his time lately answering questions on the bulletin board for our members and it's a real treat to have him on our team. Dr. Lee owns two animal hospitals in Arizona and he has a website at aachospitals.com. If you're in the area of Arizona, you can surely give Dr. Lee a call for a visit for your animals. So, thanks very much for listening everyone. As always, you can subscribe via iTunes or any other podcatcher really easy by clicking the "Subscribe to iTunes" button on the front page of the blog or by copying the address into your favorite podcatcher. So, thanks so much everyone for listening. I hope you have a great rest of the week or a weekend. We'll see you all soon and please give your pets a little scratchy under the chin for Marko. Bye for now.

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