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Old October 17th, 2004, 10:56 PM
AlmostRN AlmostRN is offline
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Question Mouthy Rottweiler

Help!

We have a granddog..a 100 pound, one year old, beautiful male rottweiller named Chico. He is out of control when it comes to barking and biting at us (not in a mean way). He does this constantly. He is well trained in other aspects. He does not jump, stays off funiture, well house-trained. He seems to need attention 24/7. What can we do to break him of this terrible problem. My son cannot keep him at college and we do not want him to leave our family but this problem is serious...any suggestions will help!!
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Old October 17th, 2004, 11:08 PM
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heeler's rock! heeler's rock! is offline
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Sounds like he suffers from separation anxiety. How old was he when your son got him?

When he bites you, say "OUCH!" in a high pitched voice. I know it sounds weird, but it simulates the yipping sound dogs make when they're being hurt. When you do that, stop all play completely, and don't even look at him. When he's calm, play again but as soon as he bites, repeat the process.

As for the separation anxiety, is anyone home during the day? When you're gone out, does he bark and whine a lot?
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Old October 17th, 2004, 11:18 PM
AlmostRN AlmostRN is offline
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I agree that he seems to suffer from separation anxiety. Chico was eight weeks old when my son adopted him. He has been with my son daily and had this problem even as a younger pup but it has really escalated in the past month. Chico loves other dogs and seems to be bored and aggitated when he is not out on a walk or run with us. There is only so much "play time" we can give him. His extreme time is at night, when we are all home...constant barking/biting at us for our attention, even after hours of play. Last night it went on until well after midnight. My son is leaving him here with us when he returns to school next week, I am in school myself, and am worried that I will not be able to break him of this. He is not left alone at this time but I need to know that I can leave him when I have too.
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Old October 18th, 2004, 08:39 AM
Lucky Rescue Lucky Rescue is offline
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Exactly how much exercise is this dog getting and where? I mean, do you take him places - for long walks, runs, out in public?

And what do you do when he barks and bites at you?
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Old October 18th, 2004, 02:54 PM
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lilith_rizel lilith_rizel is offline
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Our pup, Cano is a dog who needs alot of attention too, but only when he is inside, does he want all that he can get! I have been giving him set times, when it is just jis time with me, or just his tim with my husband, and also a set time where it is "Family Time" with him, my husband and me. He also has certain times where it is personal time, and he is getting better at not always wanting all the attention when he is indoors. He has actually been wonderful today, spending mst of the time sleeping in his crate. Fairly new, to see him just walk in there and see him lay down for a nap. I just hope that he's ok, I will see what he's like tomorrow. Maybe he couldn't sleep well last night, and after the long hard weekend of playing constantly, he might just be over exhausted.

Your son's dog is only a year, give him time, he is still faily young. If he does start to bark, say no or hush. Then when he calms down, and is quiet for a few minutes, pet him and give him a bone. Giving him attention when he barks, makes him think that barking is a good thing, and it will just get worse. We don't pet our puppy, until he sits down, and stops running around the house, and he has gotten a bit better in the past few weeks. He knows that he will only get attention if he is being good, otherwise we ignore him until he does.
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Old October 18th, 2004, 05:04 PM
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LavenderRott LavenderRott is offline
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You say the dog is well behaved. Does this mean he was taken to formal classes and taught, or was he taught at home?

Rottweilers are large, powerful dogs that are also very intelligent and, as working dogs, need to be exercised. If he was in formal classes, next time he starts this behavior, snap on a leash and put him through his paces.

He should have learned not to put his mouth on anyone months ago. For some reason, he did not. Allowing him to put his mouth on you and bark at you for attention is allowing him to be the boss. In just a few short months, this dog is going to be just like a rebellious teenager and you are going to have your hands full!

I suggest a training class as soon as you can find one. If he has already been to one, then work on what he has already learned in the meantime, but look for a good instructor. A majority of rottweiler owners will tell you that these dogs need to be in some kind of structured class until they are about 3 years old. It helps you bond with the dog and gives the dog something to do. This breed is smart and a brain that is not being put to good use will find other things to do to burn off energy.
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Old October 19th, 2004, 04:48 PM
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tenderfoot tenderfoot is offline
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Time to grow up

This young man needs to grow up and get some manners. He has learned somewhere along the way that this behavior works and gets him attention. It is great that he is well mannered otherwise but time to keep teaching him some more.
It would be good to exercise his vocabulary more through out the day to help him start to have self control out of resepct for you. Working the 'down-stay' would be great. He is bored and wants more interaction from you and working him in a healthy way would be a good answer - but always on your terms not his.
The barking is his way of demanding your attention. Like a little kid who thinks they should be the star of the show. He is probably a little spoiled and needs to realize that you call the shots, not him.
He also needs to learn to be alone and entertain himself. Otherwise you are going to have a very insecure, frightened 100lbs monster on your hands. I recocomend that he learns to be good in a crate. Do this in little increments of time and put him in to a solid sided crate for naps or to get his favorite toy or bone. Do not leave the house when you start him off. He needs to see you there to reassure him that he is not being abandoned. Then leave for seconds to minutes and come back. Do not say goodbye or hello. Do not look at him. Just come and go. As he gets used to this, then extend the time you are gone. If he howls or complains either ignore it or correct it, but DO NOT say "it's okay your just in the crate for a few minutes" in a sweet tone. That would be rewarding him for bad behavior. DO NOT let him out of the crate if he is complaining. Wait until he has been good and quiet for at least a minute before you let him out. DO NOT get all excited when you let him out. This would set him up for failure. Let him out of the crate, take him to potty and act like it's not a big deal.
I would reccomend that you teach him to be "easy" when he gets too mouthy. We do this by letting him play with your hand GENTLY and if he presses down too hard (too hard for a child), then you firmly and sharply (not loudly) say EASY - as you press your hand into his mouth and make it uncomfortable for him. He will want to spit your hand out. Then offer your hand again and repeat this until he 'gets it'. He should either turn his head away from your hand or go to another game he likes better. If he thinks it's a game then you are not being clear enough with your "NO mouthing" message. He is testing you and treating you like a play-mate, not like a respected parent. You are correcting his bad choice of mouthing you too hard and asking him to make a better choice until he does. Too often we teach failure to dogs by avoiding teaching good choices and rewarding the bad ones.
We do not recommend the high pitched OUCH, because that places you in the submissive role and teaches him that he can back you down with his intense mouthing/biting. We would rather have you take the assertive leadership role and teach him it is not okay to put his mouth on you like that.

Last edited by tenderfoot; October 19th, 2004 at 05:22 PM. Reason: typos +
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Old October 19th, 2004, 05:09 PM
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Quote:
I would reccomend that you teach him to be "easy" when he gets too mouthy. We do this by letting him play with your hand GENTLY and if he presses down too hard (too hard for a child), then you firmly and sharply (not loudly) say EASY - as you press your hand into his mouth and make it uncomfortable for him. He will want to spit your hand out. Then offer your hand again and repeat this until he 'gets it'. He should either turn his heard away from your hand or goe to another game he likes better. You are correcting his bad choice of mouthing you too hard and asking him to make a better choice until he does. Too often we teach failure to dogs by avoiding teaching good choices and rewarding the bad ones.


Isn't this the same thing as ouch? This sounds even worse! You're letting the dog mouth you, which isn't acceptable AT ALL! It shouldn't be that complicated to get your dog to not mouth you. I have taught all my dogs OUCH and it doesn't in any way make me submissive to them. By stoping all play and not rewarding him, you are showing him that he can play with you, but the second he mouths, he doesn't get to play anymore. It reinforces your role as alpha, rather than rewarding him for mouthing. By not removing your hand immediately, you're still letting him mouth you and he's still being rewarded for it!!
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Old October 19th, 2004, 05:15 PM
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Quote:
We do not recommend the high pitched OUCH, because that places you in the submissive role and teaches him that he can back you down with his intense mouthing/biting. We would rather have you take the assertive leadership role and teach him it is not okay to put his mouth on you like that.
What? I don't get this statement at all......how is yelping or saying ouch making anyone submissive? It teaches him that he is hurting you when he mouths like that, and my guess is that his intention is not to hurt you, but to play with you. If you say "OUCH!" loudly and high pitched and stop all play, this teaches him that mouthing is not acceptable and you will not tolerate it. he will not get his way if he wants to play rough.

Tenderfoot, you say that you want to teach the dog that it's not okay to put his mouth on people, but yet you want them to keep their hand in the dogs mouth until he is "more gentle"? If he did that to a kid, even gently, it is not acceptable at all, not matter what.

BTW, who is this "We" you keep reffering to?
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Old October 19th, 2004, 05:36 PM
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melanie melanie is offline
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i have my mums pup with me at the moment, he is a bit bitey, well after reading the post above from heelers with the ouch in it, i tried it. ouch he ignored me (he is a bit hyper pup) but, the next time he did it i screamed like i was in real pain, folded my arms and turned away from him and ignored him for a few minutes, well what do you know it worked like a charm, he has not bitten me since and that was 2 days ago. thanks heelers, good idea.
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Old October 19th, 2004, 05:48 PM
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Thanks Melanie! I'm glad it worked. I use it now on the dogs I walk and although the neighbours look at me like I'm mad, it works everytime!
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Old October 19th, 2004, 05:49 PM
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tenderfoot tenderfoot is offline
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I am sorry you are getting so upset over this. Perhaps I did not explain things well. I will try to be more careful.
WE - refers to my husband and myself who have been training dogs for many years. We believe in providing clear leadership and balanced relationship with all dogs. We have trained thousands of dogs and have had many rotties in our family (we love rotties for their heart, soul, intelligence and devotion). We have had great success with our methods and have recieved great praise for the simple, clear way we teach.
I understand that your method of teaching a dog not to mouth works with many dogs. We have found that it can give the wrong message to a very pushy dog. I don't mind having a puppies mouth on me, because it is how they relate to the world - exploring with their mouths. But bite-inhibition is vital and so often not taught to the puppies who are taken away from their mothers at too young of an age. We try to teach bite-inhibition the same way the mother would. She would be firm with every mistake the puppy made, but not reject the pup. She would allow him to make better choices and correct each wrong one. The other puppies would yelp and shy away from the aggressor, which would then teach the aggressor that he has power over the other pups, but certainly not over his mother.
There are so many ways to work with a dog and be successful. We have found that the natural methods a mother would use are effective across the board and create respect for the human leader in the relationship.
Please do not think we think our methods are the only way. It is what works for us and we have reasons why.
We have worked with Master Horse Whisperers for 20 years now and have developed our methods from their understanding. This is based on pressure and release - which is how all animals (including humans) communicate. We pressure the wrong decision and reward (release) the good ones. We provide clear leadership along with lots of love and fun.
We have helped turned dog's and their human's lives around and are thrilled to have the chance to do so.
I don't doubt that you are wonderful with dogs and would be happy to chat more with you, but I think it would be best to email each other personally. You can reach me at info@tenderfoottraining.com and let this go back to helping these nice people with their boisterous rottie.
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Old October 19th, 2004, 05:58 PM
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heeler's rock! heeler's rock! is offline
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Sorry if it sounded like I was upset. It's hard to communicate effectively over posts and such. You are right,everyone has there own ways of training and the natural ways mums teach their pups is most definitely the way to go. I've never heard of the pressure release method when a dog mouths, but I'll give it a whirl an dsee what generates the best response.

Where are you located tenderfoot? I am also a dog trainer, but I just started barely a year ago. I am always looking for information on various methods and such of training so I can better my knowledge and help every single client. I haven't had many clients as I don't market myself as a trainer yet. I am scared to teach yet as I don't feel very confident in my abilities yet. Did you ever go through that? You can reply to me by e-mail if you want, doggieden@shaw.ca

Again, sorry for sounding upset. I wasn't upset, just very confused as I haven't heard of your methods before.
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Old October 19th, 2004, 06:31 PM
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Thumbs up Hi

Check your email!
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  #15  
Old October 20th, 2004, 07:00 PM
droop1 droop1 is offline
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Question hyper mixed male rotti

I have a 2 year old male rotti mixed. He's not nuetured, but really hyper and somewhat aggressive. I buy him all kinds of toys to keep him happy and try to wake him regulary, but I can't get him to walk gently on the leash. He's starting to grawl when he see's the people he knows. Any advice?
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Old October 22nd, 2004, 08:16 PM
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tenderfoot tenderfoot is offline
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My first word of advice is to have him neutered. This will hopefully start to calm him down (it could take up to 3 months to get all of the hormones out), and it will change how he smells to other dogs who are currently reading him as a potentially dangerous intact male - which makes the other dogs react to him differently before they even meet him.
Next, you need to start acting like a confident parent. He does not believe you are capable of handling simple tasks like greeting people and he feels the need (either out of protectiveness or insecurity) to take charge. Give him jobs (ie: sit-stay) when people come up to you. You greet the person first and if he is showing good manners and still sitting calmly, then you can have them offer him a treat or pet him. But if he shows any signs of nervousness, then they should ignore him and you should ask him to do something else. (ie: down-stay). Praise him for any signs of friendliness and calmness, but be sharp to notice any signs of uneasiness on his part and keep him working. DO NOT "coo" sweet nothings at him in an effort to calm him - he would hear this as rewarding his behavior and feel encouraged to do it more. Tell him to "knock it off" if he growls, and put him back to work.
It's very much like a rude child. You would not tolerate your child being rude to your guests - you would correct it very quickly and then teach them how to greet guests properly. Same thing. He is being rude and potentially dangerous, stop it now. TODAY! Let him know as his leader that you will not permit 'attitude' from him and then praise him highly for making the good choices.
Buying him more toys is not the answer. Yes he needs toys, but what he really needs is parenting.
It is very important that you start a training program with him. Be sure it is someone who talks about working on your relationship with him, because he needs to start looking to you for guidance and leadership. The more work you do with him the better. Getting eyes from him before he reacts is vital. He needs to look to you for the answers, not just react.
I hope this helps, but it is always best to find someone in your area (who comes highly recommended), who can observe him (and you) and give you advice from there. Best of luck.
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Old October 23rd, 2004, 12:34 AM
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trescanis trescanis is offline
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Excellent advice Elizabeth! It's very nice to see someone with your (and your husbands) experience on this board.

Droop1, you can only help your dog by following the advice you've been offered. Good luck!!

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Old October 23rd, 2004, 11:38 AM
Lucky Rescue Lucky Rescue is offline
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Excellent advice, Tenderfoot. I have to emphasize this part:
Quote:
DO NOT "coo" sweet nothings at him in an effort to calm him
It's so natural for us to try and comfort our dogs if they are acting scared, nervous or are agitated and they definitely take it as praise for acting that way.

For pushy, rude dogs who have been allowed to become the boss of the household, I highly recommend following the methods in this link! You must be consistant and everyone in the house must abide by the rules.

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