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Old June 27th, 2012, 01:44 PM
HutchOven HutchOven is offline
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Blue Buffalo vs Canidae

Hi first post here. I'm looking for help on whether or not I should change my dog food. Right now my GSD is getting Blue buffalo adult chicken along with GNC hi and joint, and multivitamin supplements. I found a local Vet supply shop that sells Canidae and i've read it could be better.

I am mainly looking to switch to a poultry free food and I think the closest BB gets to that is there fish flavor which still has chicken fat in it. Is it worth the extra work to switch to the Canidae food? If so can someone recommend me to a flavor I should get?

Also, with all this grain free stuff there is out there now, is this only for dogs with allergies or is grain free just a better idea all around?
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Old June 27th, 2012, 01:46 PM
HutchOven HutchOven is offline
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Here are the ingredients to some i'm looking at

-Blue Buffalo Fish
Ingredients
Deboned Whitefish, Peas, Oatmeal, Whole Ground Barley, Menhaden Fish Meal (source of Omega 3 Fatty Acids), Flaxseed (source of Omega 3 and 6 Fatty Acids), Natural Fish Flavor, Whole Potatoes, Tomato Pomace (source of Lycopene), Whole Carrots, Whole Sweet Potatoes, Dried Egg, Blueberries, Cranberries, Barley Grass, Dried Parsley, Garlic, Alfalfa Meal, Dried Kelp, Yucca Schidigera Extract, L-Carnitine, L-Lysine, Glucosamine Hydrochloride, Chondroitin Sulfate, Turmeric, Chicken Fat (preserved with Mixed Tocopherols), Dried Chicory Root, Oil of Rosemary, Beta Carotene, Vitamin A Supplement, Thiamine Mononitrate (Vitamin B1), Riboflavin (Vitamin B2), Niacin (Vitamin B3), d-Calcium Pantothenate (Vitamin B5), Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B6), Biotin (Vitamin B7), Folic Acid (Vitamin B9), Vitamin B12 Supplement, Calcium Ascorbate (source of Vitamin C), Vitamin D3 Supplement, Vitamin E Supplement, Iron Amino Acid Chelate, Zinc Amino Acid Chelate, Manganese Amino Acid Chelate, Copper Amino Acid Chelate, Choline Chloride, Sodium Selenite, Calcium Iodate, Salt, Caramel, Potassium Chloride, Dried Yeast (source of Saccharomyces cerevisiae), Dried Lactobacillus acidophilus fermentation product, Dried Bacillus subtilis fermentation product, Dried Enterococcus faecium fermentation product


-Canidae Beef and Fish
Ingredients
Beef, ocean fish meal, oatmeal, beef meal, brown rice, white rice, rice bran, peas, cracked pearled barley, millet, canola oil, tomato pomace, natural flavor, flaxseed meal, choline chloride, suncured alfalfa meal, inulin (from chicory root), lecithin, sage extract, cranberries, beta-carotene, rosemary extract, sunflower oil, yucca schidigera extract, dried enterococcus faecium fermentation product, dried lactobacillus acidophilus fermentation product, dried lactobacillus casei fermentation product, dried lactobacillus plantarum fermentation product, dried trichoderma longibrachiatum fermentation extract, vitamin E supplement, iron proteinate, zinc proteinate, copper proteinate, ferrous sulfate, zinc sulfate, copper sulfate, potassium iodide, thiamine mononitrate, manganese proteinate, manganous oxide, ascorbic acid, vitamin A supplement, biotin, niacin, calcium pantothenate, manganese sulfate, sodium selenite, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), vitamin B12 supplement, riboflavin, vitamin D3 supplement, folic acid, papaya, pineapple.

-Canidae Lamb and Rice
Ingredients
Lamb meal, brown rice, cracked pearled barley, rice bran, peas, millet, canola oil, lamb, tomato pomace, natural flavor, flaxseed meal, potassium chloride, choline chloride, suncured alfalfa meal, inulin (from chicory root), lecithin, sage extract, cranberries, beta-carotene, rosemary extract, sunflower oil, yucca schidigera extract, dried enterococcus faecium fermentation product, dried lactobacillus acidophilus fermentation product, dried lactobacillus casei fermentation product, dried lactobacillus plantarum fermentation product, dried trichoderma longibrachiatum fermentation extract, vitamin E supplement, iron proteinate, zinc proteinate, copper proteinate, ferrous sulfate, zinc sulfate, copper sulfate, potassium iodide, thiamine mononitrate, manganese proteinate, manganous oxide, ascorbic acid, vitamin A supplement, biotin, niacin, calcium pantothenate, manganese sulfate, sodium selenite, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), vitamin B12 supplement, riboflavin, vitamin D3 supplement, folic acid, papaya, pineapple.
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Old June 28th, 2012, 04:29 AM
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Budgie-mom Budgie-mom is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HutchOven View Post
Hi first post here. I'm looking for help on whether or not I should change my dog food. Right now my GSD is getting Blue buffalo adult chicken along with GNC hi and joint, and multivitamin supplements. I found a local Vet supply shop that sells Canidae and i've read it could be better.

I am mainly looking to switch to a poultry free food and I think the closest BB gets to that is there fish flavor which still has chicken fat in it. Is it worth the extra work to switch to the Canidae food? If so can someone recommend me to a flavor I should get?

Also, with all this grain free stuff there is out there now, is this only for dogs with allergies or is grain free just a better idea all around?
Actually, grain free is better all around also for humans (contrary to the food pyramid supported by ... grain growers associations, lol) we are not, historically speaking, made to digest grains. Though we have evolved since Mr & Mrs Caveman, our genes and bodies are still the same and our digestive tracts with them.

I doubt whether wild dogs of any kind eat grains at all. Sure, they go for the stomach content in their herbivore prey, but even that is mostly lichen, grass and other straight vegetables rather than grains.

Grains are, however, cheap fillers (pet and human foods alike) and governments subsidize the farmers who in turn pay to stay on the list of "subsidizees" as well as the lab "proof" grains are good for us all.

Personally I keep my grain-based food intake to once, max twice a week. It's just not worth it health wise to have more.
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Old June 28th, 2012, 08:46 AM
Longblades Longblades is offline
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Make sure you check to be sure the Canidae is not on the TOTW recall list. Some Canidae products are made at the Diamond plant in Gaston, forget whether it's N. or S. Carolina.

Grains are absolutely fine for many dogs. Kibble has a filler/binder in it. If it's not grain then it's potato or tapioca or something else. That said I do rotate my foods so that my dog is not getting the same main protein or filler source all the time. Maybe that would interest you? I rotate chicken/corn; lamb/oats and fish/potato. Except the fish one is a TOTW so I need to find a new one. I see no difference in coat, energy, stool except my grain free food, the TOTW, is lower in calories and I have to feed more of it.

Is your dog allergic to the chicken? Why don't you want to feed chicken?

If the Blue Buffalo is otherwise working fine for your pup I suggest you use the protein, fat and Kcal/cup numbers as a guide in choosing your new food.
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Old June 28th, 2012, 03:32 PM
HutchOven HutchOven is offline
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My dog isn't allergic to chicken, but my roommate shares food with me and his Shih Tzu might have a slight allergy to poultry. I figure since he wont pay to take him to the vet, I would at least do my best to change foods and help.

As for the Canidae recall, it looks like the diamond plant only shipped to locations on the east coast of the US. I'm on the West Coast.

In the BB fish, I noticed one of the ingredients is "Calcium Ascorbate (source of Vitamin C)". I read somewhere that VitC causes bloat in dogs. I lost my last GSD due to bloat problems so I try shy away from things like that. Is that true, and would it matter if I went to Canidae or does it have a similar ingredient?
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Old June 28th, 2012, 03:56 PM
Longblades Longblades is offline
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http://docs.lib.purdue.edu/dissertations/AAI3099198/

I'm not up on bloat and Vit. C but the study above from Purdue should help. Very interesting to read that a raised food bowl contributes to increased incidence of bloat. I know I've read that some owners think a raised food bowl is good but I don't know why they think that.

I'm so sorry you lost your GSD to bloat. We, thankfully, have had only second hand experience when friends lost dogs. It's pretty awful.
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Old June 28th, 2012, 05:16 PM
HutchOven HutchOven is offline
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Originally Posted by Longblades View Post
http://docs.lib.purdue.edu/dissertations/AAI3099198/

I'm not up on bloat and Vit. C but the study above from Purdue should help. Very interesting to read that a raised food bowl contributes to increased incidence of bloat. I know I've read that some owners think a raised food bowl is good but I don't know why they think that.

I'm so sorry you lost your GSD to bloat. We, thankfully, have had only second hand experience when friends lost dogs. It's pretty awful.
Oh great! I use a raised food and water bowl. I read a while back on a different forum that a raised food bowl was good for larger breeds.

I will immediately remove the raised bowl. Also according to that, VitC does contibute to bloat.

Edit: And according to that, a dry food containing meat meal with bone in the first four ingredients significantlly lowered bloat. Which neither the BB or Canidae have.

But then I read articles like this that say not to feed your pet "meat and bone meal".
http://www.truthaboutpetfood.com/art...bone-meal.html

Last edited by HutchOven; June 28th, 2012 at 05:46 PM.
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Old June 28th, 2012, 06:34 PM
Longblades Longblades is offline
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No, I think they mean literally. If the ingredient says "meat and bone meal" that is not good. But a named meat meal IS good. It says what animal it came from.

And a named meat source meal will account for a higher percentage of good from the named meat than a fresh meat will. Percentages are by weight. So if the first ingredient listed is chicken any good from the chicken will fall to a lower place in the list when the water is removed, which of course it is when the kibble is cooked. A first ingredient saying chicken meal will stay higher because it already has much water removed.

I like this website for information on how to read dog food labels. http://www.dogfoodproject.com/
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Old June 28th, 2012, 09:29 PM
HutchOven HutchOven is offline
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That site was very helpful. I was mistaken before also. Citric acid seems to cause bloat, not vit c. After reading a while and seeing what was available locally for me, I think I am going to switch to Innova Prime.

IP is grain free and has less ingredients with more protein then BB. The less ingredients are the ones that i'm not really sure what they are. Plus it IP has no citric acid. Please advise me if this is not a good decision.
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Old June 29th, 2012, 10:28 AM
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We use Innova foods and have had no issues with it--we just use the adult formula. Innova was recently bought out by Procter & Gamble, though, so we're holding our breath hoping there will be no ingredient or quality changes...
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