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  #61  
Old June 21st, 2010, 02:25 PM
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I may be slightly off course with this thread but I just want to point out that we have no right to dictate to other countries when our own is nothing but a piece of crap where animal welfare is concerned.
I completely agree. And no, we have no control over what another country does. However, this ruling will carry over to our country, which is what concerns me, and I'm sure many others. It may have been made overseas, but, unfortunately, we will most likely see the ill effects here as well.
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Old June 21st, 2010, 02:37 PM
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I completely agree. And no, we have no control over what another country does. However, this ruling will carry over to our country, which is what concerns me, and I'm sure many others. It may have been made overseas, but, unfortunately, we will most likely see the ill effects here as well.
If so, we are no worse. I can tell you that our Christians are dumping animals like chips at the moment...and they seem pretty good at it. Practice makes perfect.

Most foreigners do not have animals in their household as their beliefs have followed them here. I have yet to meet a muslem that has a dog. If they do, then I am sure I can add one more to the X amount of dogs looking for a 2nd chance. Really, the numbers that will be discarded are minimal in comparison to the westerners dumping.
  #63  
Old June 21st, 2010, 02:38 PM
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Originally Posted by marko View Post
I feel very bad for the dogs that will be affected by this ruling because I love dogs.
QUOTE]

Interesting statement only because we as Canadians do horrible things to our own dogs. Take a look at the dogs at Mile 26. Look at our shelters and pounds that are packed with animals dogs and cats that are going to be killed. Look at the petstores filled to the rafters and our government here in Canada do absolutely nothing to stop this sickness. And why...because it boils down to money, which is just flippen SICK.

What are Canadians doing to stop our own shortcomings? Why are we worried about those animals in another country when we cannot even preach to our own people.
So true
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  #64  
Old June 21st, 2010, 02:47 PM
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However, this ruling will carry over to our country, which is what concerns me, and I'm sure many others. It may have been made overseas, but, unfortunately, we will most likely see the ill effects here as well.
This is the crux for me, well written!

How many American/Canadians Muslims would actually return their current pet because of this Fatwa from Iran? This is why it would be so interesting to hear from Muslim members, they would likely have the better 'skinny' on this. We are just speculating i think.
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  #65  
Old June 21st, 2010, 02:54 PM
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basically folks,,here and abroad we can't treat other humans humanely,,,i seriously can't see animals being treated better. Drive by shootings, bombs,,kids walking into highschools with guns killing classmates is happening more and more often. We look at our ancestors of old and say what barbarians they were,,really have we changed? Only thing i see a change in is the choice of weapon. To a society where humans are expendable and where we think we're better than,,,i don't see the animals fairing very well.
  #66  
Old June 21st, 2010, 03:02 PM
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Originally Posted by marko View Post
This is the crux for me, well written!

How many American/Canadians Muslims would actually return their current pet because of this Fatwa from Iran? This is why it would be so interesting to hear from Muslim members, they would likely have the better 'skinny' on this. We are just speculating i think.
Honestly, I don't think that the numbers are going to be as high as us Christians Marko. Infact, I think that it will be minimal here in this country. Therefore I don't see why this is even a concern. My concern is OUR people. By ratio the abandonment of animals is greater in numbers.
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Old June 21st, 2010, 04:37 PM
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If so, we are no worse. I can tell you that our Christians are dumping animals like chips at the moment...and they seem pretty good at it. Practice makes perfect.
I understand your position as a rescue worker, and I'll take what appears to be an attempt to stab at Christianity and myself as just frustration on your part. Never did I put anyones religion or beliefs down, nor say that Christians always observe what's right or in the best interest of the animal. Nor did I try to purposefully get a rise out of/or hurt anyone. I was simply responding to Marco about there not being anything that I was aware of in the Christian faith that states you should not own a dog. EVERYONE dumps animals, regardless of religion, heritage, race etc. And it's equally as disgusting regardless of who is doing it. There was no need for you to say what you did.
  #68  
Old June 21st, 2010, 04:39 PM
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Originally Posted by marko View Post

How many American/Canadians Muslims would actually return their current pet because of this Fatwa from Iran? This is why it would be so interesting to hear from Muslim members, they would likely have the better 'skinny' on this. We are just speculating i think.
Agreed Marko!
  #69  
Old June 21st, 2010, 04:43 PM
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Honestly, I don't think that the numbers are going to be as high as us Christians Marko. Infact, I think that it will be minimal here in this country. Therefore I don't see why this is even a concern. My concern is OUR people. By ratio the abandonment of animals is greater in numbers.
You're probably right, the numbers won't be as great, but it's still a concern. Any amount that adds to what we have already is a concern, and heartbreaking. This isn't a matter of who will suffer the greatest loss and at who's handsbut more that there will be additional innocents that will pay the price for our(the human race) inhumanity. This isn't a contest.

Last edited by Rgeurts; June 21st, 2010 at 05:14 PM.
  #70  
Old June 21st, 2010, 05:22 PM
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You're probably right, the numbers won't be as great, but it's still a concern. Any amount that adds to what we have already is a concern, and heartbreaking. This isn't a matter of who will suffer the greatest loss and at who's handsbut more that there will be additional innocents that will pay the price for our(the human race) inhumanity. This isn't a contest.
From my very limited knowledge of Islam and from what SSS has already explained to us, I strongly doubt that an opinion/ruling made by one spiritual leader in Iran will have any great effect, if any, on the other Arab countries or the rest of the world.
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  #71  
Old June 21st, 2010, 07:18 PM
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I strongly doubt that an opinion/ruling made by one spiritual leader in Iran will have any great effect, if any, on the other Arab countries or the rest of the world.
I have to say i totally disagree with you. Do the names Hitler,Hussein or Bush come to mind. One individual, yet they managed to convince thousands to do what they wished. Millions lost their lives because of one individual. Hopefully history wont once again repeat itself at the cost of animals lives this time.
  #72  
Old June 21st, 2010, 07:35 PM
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I have to say i totally disagree with you. Do the names Hitler,Hussein or Bush come to mind. One individual, yet they managed to convince thousands to do what they wished. Millions lost their lives because of one individual. Hopefully history wont once again repeat itself at the cost of animals lives this time.
Aslan, I had to laugh when I saw you mentioned Bush in the same sentence as Hitler and Hussein.
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  #73  
Old June 21st, 2010, 08:00 PM
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Aslan, I had to laugh when I saw you mentioned Bush in the same sentence as Hitler and Hussein.
lol,,well the way i see's it,,,different method but same results..innocent people are being killed( these poor people are getting it from both sides).
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Old June 21st, 2010, 09:14 PM
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Aslan, I had to laugh when I saw you mentioned Bush in the same sentence as Hitler and Hussein.
Lmao... too funny

But true!!
  #75  
Old June 22nd, 2010, 07:27 AM
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lol,,well the way i see's it,,,different method but same results..innocent people are being killed( these poor people are getting it from both sides).
I completely agree.
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  #76  
Old June 22nd, 2010, 07:52 AM
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Aslanpoor Bush
I would just say,don't kid yourself in to believing these clerics in Iran have no power,they are THE power,who rule what is acceptable or not in peoples lives.
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  #77  
Old June 22nd, 2010, 10:04 AM
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I understand your position as a rescue worker, and I'll take what appears to be an attempt to stab at Christianity and myself as just frustration on your part. Never did I put anyones religion or beliefs down, nor say that Christians always observe what's right or in the best interest of the animal. Nor did I try to purposefully get a rise out of/or hurt anyone. I was simply responding to Marco about there not being anything that I was aware of in the Christian faith that states you should not own a dog. EVERYONE dumps animals, regardless of religion, heritage, race etc. And it's equally as disgusting regardless of who is doing it. There was no need for you to say what you did.
I think you misinterpreted my intention. It was not intended to stab anyone and my frustrations are not geered towards anything you said actually. I mention my religion only because I see more of US abandoning animals then any other religion. So chill. It's all good.

My major frustration is based on animals being abandoned in general. Call it despiration I guess. One thing is for sure however, regardless if it is one animal or 1000 animals that are abandoned - you are right - others will perish.

Please do not feel any frustration pointed at you or anyone else for that matter. It was merely to make a statement based on observation.
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Old June 22nd, 2010, 10:51 AM
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Originally Posted by BenMax View Post
I think you misinterpreted my intention. It was not intended to stab anyone and my frustrations are not geered towards anything you said actually. I mention my religion only because I see more of US abandoning animals then any other religion. So chill. It's all good.

My major frustration is based on animals being abandoned in general. Call it despiration I guess. One thing is for sure however, regardless if it is one animal or 1000 animals that are abandoned - you are right - others will perish.

Please do not feel any frustration pointed at you or anyone else for that matter. It was merely to make a statement based on observation.
US meaning christians ? and the reason US (if it means christians) are dumping more animals is becuase we WAY out number other religions here in North America. That being said, the dumping has NOTHING what so ever to do with religion, it's all about "upbringing" IMO. If you grew up with dumping parents and relatives , it's likely you will be a dumper too. (not always though) I know many reformed dumpers
Or If you grew up with parents who felt/believed animals are to be used/exploited, and are in no way a "pet", then you would probably be that way and raise your children that way.
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Old June 22nd, 2010, 10:54 AM
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if you're talking North Americans as us,,,wonder if you did an actual study on nationality background how many would be white anglo saxon north americans as opposed to any other ethnic background. No that is not meant as a racist comment ,just curioius.
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Old June 22nd, 2010, 10:58 AM
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if you're talking North Americans as us,,,wonder if you did an actual study on nationality background how many would be white anglo saxon north americans as opposed to any other ethnic background. No that is not meant as a racist comment ,just curioius.
I don't care if I come off racist but ... I do believe french people here are less ... educated , on many things , including pet care and responsible pet ownership. I was once the contact person for one rescue , french people would dump , english people would rescue. Not at the time , but the majority.

Last edited by Frenchy; June 22nd, 2010 at 11:05 AM.
  #81  
Old June 22nd, 2010, 11:33 AM
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US meaning christians ? and the reason US (if it means christians) are dumping more animals is becuase we WAY out number other religions here in North America. That being said, the dumping has NOTHING what so ever to do with religion, it's all about "upbringing" IMO. If you grew up with dumping parents and relatives , it's likely you will be a dumper too. (not always though) I know many reformed dumpers
Or If you grew up with parents who felt/believed animals are to be used/exploited, and are in no way a "pet", then you would probably be that way and raise your children that way.
Us meaning Westerners, Christians, white, black, green or purple. It has nothing to do with religion you are right - but that is what this thread was turning into - a religious directive and that is why I say what I say. Funny how we take no offense talking about those of different religion but as soon as someone says Christian...well then the backs go up. Not a nice feeling is it?

You hit the nail on the head though HappyCats = it is definately upbringing which comes into play. Very good point.
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Old June 22nd, 2010, 12:57 PM
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I think you misinterpreted my intention. It was not intended to stab anyone and my frustrations are not geered towards anything you said actually. I mention my religion only because I see more of US abandoning animals then any other religion. So chill. It's all good.

My major frustration is based on animals being abandoned in general. Call it despiration I guess. One thing is for sure however, regardless if it is one animal or 1000 animals that are abandoned - you are right - others will perish.

Please do not feel any frustration pointed at you or anyone else for that matter. It was merely to make a statement based on observation.
My apologies for misunderstanding. And I do agree, you have very valid points. And I can understand the frustration you have. I don't work in the rescue field and get frustrated enough, though my husband and I will soon be volunteering once we (hopefully) get our little guy to a healthy state. It's worse than having a toddler, he gets into and eats everything he comes in contact with! Have to watch him like a hawk
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Old June 22nd, 2010, 02:21 PM
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My apologies for misunderstanding. And I do agree, you have very valid points. And I can understand the frustration you have. I don't work in the rescue field and get frustrated enough, though my husband and I will soon be volunteering once we (hopefully) get our little guy to a healthy state. It's worse than having a toddler, he gets into and eats everything he comes in contact with! Have to watch him like a hawk
No apologies required at all Rgeurts. Sometimes words on a screen are not interpreted or relayed to in an appropriate manner.
  #84  
Old June 25th, 2010, 06:27 AM
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guys, do you know what fatwa means?

its a religious opinion or suggestion.

meaning, it doesnt affect irani's in canada, usa, kuwait or w.e

because now a days, law is what predominantly runs a country.

so no, unless people are forced to by their parents or whatever, they arent really affected by this law (not religious fatwa or w,e else) that has been passed down by iran.

remember, its a law, not a religious restriction.

so if a guy in iran gets fined for taking his dog to the park , its not "in the name of islam" its "in the name of the law"

get it? fatwa doesnt mean war, law, etc... etc... it means a religious opinion.

for those of you who think muslims who abide by islam politically, religiously etc...etc... as somethig sad, well, lets look back waaaaaaaay back when Muhammed (PBUH) was alive. lets go back 1000 years ago.

the time islam ruled the world way back in the day, there was no blood shed, there was peace, and love.

when the christians ruled, there was much bloodshed.

when the jews ruled there was also much bloodshed.

so that what does that mean?

it means when islam was really in play and affected everyone, no one of christianity, and judaism where killed because they were different.

did you know its against islam to bother someone of another belief? did you know your supposed to leave them be? and not force islam on them?

did you know, in islam, taxes are forbidden? hows that for a way of life and politics?

did you know in islam, you're supposed to give 2.5% of your yearly income to a charity?

did you know in islam, when you're going to slaughter an animal, its supposed to take less than 1 second when you cut their throat? and that you were supposed to slaughter an animal alone and not infront of others?

did you know in islam, the rich and poor are all equal and stand side by side. money doesnt dictate where you stand in islam, it has nothing to do with where you pray inside the mosque.

those are just at the top of my head from what i remember while reading this thread.

honestly, because there was not a single muslim replying with you guys at the time of this thread being active, its almost a lost cause.

but im gonna post anyways.

mikischo and marko, you guys are awsome, why?

becausse you spoke from a neutral point of view, i really respect that.

look, i understand you guys are a close knit family on here and all, but you guys where rough around the edges while posting on her.

yes you're entitled to your own opinions, but some stuff was just plain rude.

i mean, its the indirect stuff that were said.

if it took a moderator to tell you to ease up, thats gotta account for something.

no one directly said anything rude, but its the indirect stuff, the reading between the lines.

didnt i say on an earlier post, not to judge islam by iran, india, pakistan, afghanistan, and all these other random countries?

someone said the koran teaches good and bad.

thats not true, it teaches good, and good only.

if you want to really judge the koran, look at the way Muhammed (PBUH) lived. he is the perfect muslim, all muslims try to live the way he did. he lived the way a muslim should live. THATS a muslim, not osama bin ladin, saddam hussain, or whoever else some of you might think represent islam.

thats how i can say, islam and the koran teach good, not bad.

the man who spread it (in every muslims eyes and allah's eyes) is the person closest to being perfect on this imperfect world.

the extremists, are retards who are using islam as a scapegoat for what they are doing. they get these terroristic ideas from their head, not the quran.

i think that cleric in iran, trying to force his opinion by making it a law is ridiculous. he has no right to butt into everyones life.

honestly so much was said on here.

someone said human saliva is more unclean than dogs. well, can you explain that to me? from what i understand dogs saliva can carry viruses and lots of bacteria, so i dont understand that, please explain to me how you know this? was there a test that was done or anything of that sort?
what makes it hard for me to believe this, is that dog saliva burns on your open flesh from what i've been told by a friend who's been bitten by a dog.

please, i encourage questions by open minded people (because if you're narrow minded your just gonna ask and not care about the answer) to ask me questions, i'd be happy to enlighten people about my religion.
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  #85  
Old June 25th, 2010, 06:53 AM
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honestly, because there was not a single muslim replying with you guys at the time of this thread being active, its almost a lost cause.

but im gonna post anyways.

mikischo and marko, you guys are awsome, why?

becausse you spoke from a neutral point of view, i really respect that.

look, i understand you guys are a close knit family on here and all, but you guys where rough around the edges while posting on her.

yes you're entitled to your own opinions, but some stuff was just plain rude.

i mean, its the indirect stuff that were said.

if it took a moderator to tell you to ease up, thats gotta account for something.

no one directly said anything rude, but its the indirect stuff, the reading between the lines.


please, i encourage questions by open minded people (because if you're narrow minded your just gonna ask and not care about the answer) to ask me questions, i'd be happy to enlighten people about my religion.
I think it is time you get past your posting that members have been "rude". If any posts by them have been misinterpreted, they have appologized and have explained very, very clearly, it is not the religion, but the treatment of animals that they care about. This is not a religion site, but a pet site so I don't think this is a site to discuss religion.

You have lived in Canada for 13 years, you know how we love our pets as our children so our passion for them should not come as a surprise to you.

Just my
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Old June 25th, 2010, 06:58 AM
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well thats what makes me so mad about islam and religion in general That for all the good it does, the extremists and fanatics take it a twist it all up I liv in a city and in this area are a lot of muslims from many different couthries and you know what? They are just chasing the dream and trying to do the right thing and make a few bucks just like the latinos the south americans the mid europeans and everyone else around here.

yeah right steve anyone remeber the crusades? Diring the inquisitoin, the muslim coutries and teeriotories were the only place that gave sanctuary and also kept the books and other things civilisation needs.
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Old June 25th, 2010, 07:55 AM
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SSS to enlighten you you aren't the only muslim member on here,,just most haven't posted in this thread. Speaking for myself, i am extremely enlightened and have read many bibles from many different religions. If i choose to enlighten myself on the muslims i will discuss it with our member Onster who would answer with information and not feel she is being picked on.

As for someone, told someone who told your friend and so on,,OMG how ridiculous. That's right up there with cats will suffocate your baby..Yes there is scientic studies proving that a dogs mouth is cleaner than a humans..here is just one of thousands you yourself could have googled.

Methods/Materials
I swabbed saliva from twenty-five dogs and twenty-five humans with variables reduced as much as
possible. To see how much bacteria was in my participants' oral cavities, I put some of each participant's
saliva on a specially prepared blood agar plate, diluted small amounts of the original saliva 1-3 times
(depending where it was placed on the agar plate), and then put the dishes in an incubator for 72 hours at
98.6ºF. Every 24 hours, I checked the bacteria colony growth (while wearing gloves), counted the amount
of bacteria colonies on each section of the agar plate, and recorded my data. To compare results, I created
a control group by putting an agar plate with no saliva on it in the incubator (no bacteria grew).
Results
Canines had consistently lower averages of bacteria growth compared to humans, and very few reached
the highest category of growth (growth in all three segments) whereas most humans reached the highest
category. Humans all had growth on day three, but 28% of dogs had no growth at all on day three. Unlike
most humans who had a total of at least 250 bacteria colonies on their agar plate, most dogs had 100 and
below.
Conclusions/Discussion
To my surprise, the mouth of man's best friend was cleaner than his master's.
  #88  
Old June 25th, 2010, 07:58 AM
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chico2 chico2 is offline
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SSS,I know a little bit about Muhammed and Islam,how it was a religion of peace and love,1000 yrs ago.

You also have to understand something about how we feel,what we see,what we read,the absolute hatred terrorists feel towards anyone western,even their own kind,including women and children,who do not agree with their believes, how a Muslim should be.


Yes,the terrorists are fanatics in the name of Allah and young Canadian men and women are dying trying to protect the people who want nothing but a peaceful life,unfortunately they are failing as did England and Russia(with somewhat different objective) before them.

As for not believing everything I read or hear in the news,it would be difficult to dispute,indiscriminate suicide-bombings,cowardly road-side bombs,killing thousands of innocents, etc,etc..my last

Now,back to the dogs in Iran
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  #89  
Old June 25th, 2010, 08:01 AM
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chico2 chico2 is offline
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Aslan,thank you,for the interesting finds
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  #90  
Old June 25th, 2010, 08:07 AM
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Sew-sew-steve Sew-sew-steve is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Love4himies View Post
I think it is time you get past your posting that members have been "rude". If any posts by them have been misinterpreted, they have appologized and have explained very, very clearly, it is not the religion, but the treatment of animals that they care about. This is not a religion site, but a pet site so I don't think this is a site to discuss religion.

You have lived in Canada for 13 years, you know how we love our pets as our children so our passion for them should not come as a surprise to you.

Just my
i've gotten past that stuff awhile ago. if i didnt, i wouldnt have came back a second time around, would i?

i've been disrepected in person by the way people spoke about my religion. what did i do? nothing, as i should have.
so i can kinda pick up on the things people mean here and there. i've got an apt for it. i usually bursh it off though.

and, people in middle eastern countries dont love their animals as pets?

i understand what you mean, but i think you should have written that without the "You have lived in Canada for 13 years, you know how"

thats a subjective thing to be honest.
i know some people in canada who hate animals, some who love them, and some dont give a rats tail about it.

for god sakes some cop in america or canada had shot an already caught dog.

theres good and bad people everywhere, be it people with power or not.

the fact that more than one person now has said this is a pet not a religious site, means you shouldnt comment about religion to reduce any chance of confrontation.

well, is it fair theres been 60 or so posts just about whether or not its fair for people in my religion to have to go through this, and then when i come and post "its over and done with" ?

im sorry, i didnt bring up my religion, remember? but like i said, ill come up when it does.

and i think i've proven the fact that i need to post. seeing as how theres been so many people who dont even understand my religion posting and discussing things which for all they know werent even real.

i have nothing against you chico, but i cant not use you as a example with the fatwa = war.

fatwa = religious opninion.
did anyone know that?
nope.

im not saying you cant discuss things, im just sayin, its my job to clarify things.

so when someone starts a thread, that HAS to do with islam, and HAS people commenting about islam, i CANT leave my religion to just float around unprotected.

i do appreciate marko and mikischo for defending it becaue they were a a neutral party.

i like this site, i like (most) of the people here.
i dont have a problem, not looking for one. just trying to keep islam in the clear. that so bad?
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