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  #31  
Old April 10th, 2010, 11:32 AM
muddmutt muddmutt is offline
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Hellow, Thanks for that tid-bit about the baby powder, I'll give it a shot next time I can get near him. Our vet is closed every other Sat but they do have an appt next Sat. He did have a tick on him couple weeks ago and I'm not sure if I got the head out. That was before the frontline on the 1st, got the tick like the 25th of March, so not sure if that has anything to do w/his mood swings.
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  #32  
Old April 10th, 2010, 12:49 PM
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muddmutt, I had not read this thread before I posted an answer in "Worst Case Scenario", so didn't know he was already neutered. The only thing I'd add is that you seem to be in Desi's bad books, so I think you'll have to make extra efforts to get in his good graces again. Every time you walk into a room where he is, call him to you or if he doesn't come go to him and give him something special....little piece of cheese or chicken or cat treat.....whatever it is that he really likes. Rather than growling at you, I think he will be looking forward to seeing you. You can gradually wean him off the treats, so that he doesn't expect one every time. Give him lot of petting or playing with him instead. I think he'll view you soon as the good guy instead of the bad one.

Try this and let us know how it goes.
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  #33  
Old April 10th, 2010, 01:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by muddmutt View Post
Desi was neutered 1 week after we adopted him, he was approx 4-5 mos old. We adopted him 2 days later, and it was only after we contacted them about his seizure that they alerted us of his abused past. They do go out a little, never unsupervised and never after dark. Just want them to be happy. Lucy always stays close and even spends much of her time on a picnic chair while Desi scouts for mice....always comes in before dark though. Right now he is crying down there, my lord, this is so difficult.
But the point is he does go outside. He may be on sensory overload smelling all the other cats in the neighbourhood. If he is a stressed kitty in the first place smelling all of these other smells won't help. Cats are very happy being indoor only. I presently have seven in my house. Four have been housecats their entire life. They do not act any differently than my other ones who, btw, don't even bother to try to go out. They are happy and content being indoors.
The whole idea of getting him to the point where he is not attacking you and your other cat anymore is to find things that may be setting him off and stopping it, right? I am just suggesting this may be one of the things that set him off.
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  #34  
Old April 11th, 2010, 07:30 PM
muddmutt muddmutt is offline
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Hiya Winston- I sort of got misdirected with the Willy story http://www.pets.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=66452 posted somewhere here, and have been posting there but want you to know that the Baby Powder really WORKED-Things are gradually moving back to normal, but still taking him to the Vet on Saturday, see if they can find an issue and/or give me something to keep him even. Thanks alot for all your advise, much appreciated P.S. keeping my cat

Last edited by muddmutt; April 11th, 2010 at 08:41 PM.
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  #35  
Old April 11th, 2010, 08:28 PM
muddmutt muddmutt is offline
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Hi 14 kitties...how do I get him back to being an indoor cat? I believe part of his anger is the fact that I make him come in and don't let him out at every "meow"..this is very frustrating and the significant other believes quite the contrary as you, that he wants to stay out and is angry with me for not letting him out. I am on my own regarding this, no support, except for this site, and mind you, I sit in front of a PC all day and this is the last thing I want to do is type away my evening, but I care for Desi and want him to be happy and content, I appreciate all your advise and only wish I never let him out to begin with. Keep in mind the first 5 years we lived in an apartment on the 8th floor, so they were not going out. Now were in this 4 level townhouse with the deck off the woods. It began innocently, letting them on the deck and Lucy has always been so good and still is, stays close. He takes off and running. One night he growled at me for corralling him in. I just don't know how to proceed.

Last edited by muddmutt; April 11th, 2010 at 08:43 PM.
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  #36  
Old April 11th, 2010, 08:44 PM
Jim Hall Jim Hall is offline
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treat him as a new cat dont hit him dont touch him ,sit on the floor by his food when you feed him he sounds fearfull, talk to him As far as wantong to go out can you or someone stimulate him with play?
Wear the sucker out
I am going to say somethiong not really supported by most folks here

Let him out most lilily he will get it out of his system and spent more and more time in side
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  #37  
Old April 11th, 2010, 09:12 PM
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OMG I am so glad the baby powder worked!! You may have to keep some on hand...Listen as for not letting him out....just dont! plain and simple. He may cry and whine a little but redirect that if possible with play! if he see's other kittys outside then maybe close the curtains until he gets it out of his sytem.

I think you should get some Feliway. It is pheramones. I never believed in them and thought it was a big farce but they work! they seem to calm the cats and keep them on a hjappy note! Its a plug in for the wall and it has a refil similiar to the air fresheners you buy. The only one that apparently works is the Feliway Brand and not the Comfort Zone. Not sure of the difference but I just get the Feliway. Mine last me about 6-8 weeks so its not too bad. It may take a week to start working.

Hope things are looking up!!!
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  #38  
Old April 11th, 2010, 10:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by muddmutt View Post
Hi 14 kitties...how do I get him back to being an indoor cat? I believe part of his anger is the fact that I make him come in and don't let him out at every "meow"..this is very frustrating and the significant other believes quite the contrary as you, that he wants to stay out and is angry with me for not letting him out. I am on my own regarding this, no support, except for this site, and mind you, I sit in front of a PC all day and this is the last thing I want to do is type away my evening, but I care for Desi and want him to be happy and content, I appreciate all your advise and only wish I never let him out to begin with. Keep in mind the first 5 years we lived in an apartment on the 8th floor, so they were not going out. Now were in this 4 level townhouse with the deck off the woods. It began innocently, letting them on the deck and Lucy has always been so good and still is, stays close. He takes off and running. One night he growled at me for corralling him in. I just don't know how to proceed.
Y'know, it's always a little humourous to me when people say "I can't make my cat stay indoors." I know they don't mean it's because the cat overpowers them or anything but that is always the picture I get in my head. I mean, picture a what, 10, 15 pound cat making a human that outweighs them at least 10 times let them outside. Does the cat hold a gun to their head? Does he physically make them open the door? Does he demand they let him out or they will get no food?
I don't mean to make light of your situation. Believe me, there is not much I, as a cat owner many many times over, have not gone through. Right now I have four cats in the house that barely spent any time outdoors when they were tiny. Occasionally they may get curious about outside but very seldom ever try to get out.
I have four others that were outdoors full time now in the house. One is very ill so I can't really count him. Another shows absolutely no interest in going out. He did when I first brought him in a few months back. Now, nadda. One more is a house kitty because she did the impossible for a cat. She climbed upside down on an unstable fence to get out of the cat sanctuary I have. Cats aren't supposed to be able to do what she did. The other is being treated for an abscess. She is totally an outdoor cat being semiferal and normally allowed to roam the farm. She won't be allowed any more. I don't want to have to go through patching her up again. She's complaining a little. Well, a lot actually. Meows quite a bit. You learn to harden your heart to their pitiful show of evoking sympathy because you know you are doing the right thing for them.
I noticed you say you "corraled him in". Does that mean you cornered him? If so that is the absolute worse thing you can do to a cat who is showing the aggressive tendencies he is showing. A cornered cat will react with claws and teeth. If all you got was a growl consider yourself very lucky.
The biggest thing you need to do, as I think Winston said, is to redirect his wanting to go out. Get some of those wand toys or even a simple string. Start waving it close to him. Not in his face or he may react in a way you don't want him to. Tie the string to your belt loop and walk around trailing it. He will probably be so intent on trying to catch it he will forget about outside. It is also a great way to bond with your kitty.
You said for the first five years of his life he was an indoor kitty up high on the 8th floor. Mmmmm, 8th floor. He would not have been able to see a strange cat from that level. Or, for that matter, anything else that is now acting as a "trigger" for his behaviour. When he starts acting like he is going to attack try to lure him into "his" calm room. A room where he can chill for a while that has all of his favourite things in it. A room with hopefully no window or a window high enough he can not get to it to look out. If he is at the point where he is going to attack throw a towel over his eyes and try to get him into a carrier. Hopefully from there you can get him to his room. He needs to be able to calm himself past the point of attack.
Sorry this has turned into a novel. He was an indoor only cat for five years. He can be again.
Here are a few websites to read. Maybe have your husband read them too. Hopefully they will provide you with some insight.

http://fly.hiwaay.net/~keiper/indoors.htm

http://en.allexperts.com/q/Cats-1606...indoor-cat.htm

http://cats.about.com/cs/catmanageme...ooroutdoor.htm
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  #39  
Old April 12th, 2010, 08:53 AM
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I have done some more searching to see if maybe there are some answers out there for you. Something I did think of later on was if your cat and your husband are still insistent that he go outside then let him out - on a leash and a harness. A normal collar is too easy to slip out of so a harness is better. In fact until he gets used to this "new" method of being "allowed" outside two harnesses and two leashes are even better. If he slips one he still has a back up. Although until he has his aggression under control I would not be allowing him out. JMO
Because of the fact that you stated he was an indoor cat while living in your 8th floor apartment for five years and you had no issues I don't go with the theory that letting him out will get it out of his system. He is obviously a cat who wants to protect hisenvironment from perceived threats.
Here is an excellent article which helps explain the territorial cat a little better...

http://www.2ndchance.info/aggressivecat.htm

And some ways to help conquer it.......

http://www.hilltopanimalhospital.com...aggression.htm

http://www.buzzle.com/articles/aggre...he-causes.html
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Assumptions do nothing but make an ass out of u and me.

We can stick our heads in the sand for only so long before it starts choking us. Face it folks. The pet population is bad ALL OVER THE WORLD!

Last edited by 14+kitties; April 13th, 2010 at 08:46 AM. Reason: fixed urls
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  #40  
Old April 17th, 2010, 06:42 PM
muddmutt muddmutt is offline
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I took them both to the Vet today and now they are on best behavior, ....they put him on some Prozac (Fluoxetine) so we'll see how it goes. We did use the harness and leash in the beginning, they just don't like them and will not move in them.

Thanks for all your posts/links, was very helpful and I've learned alot.

I still say the baby powder was a great ides to keep these two getting along
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  #41  
Old April 17th, 2010, 11:41 PM
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muddmutt, I think as long as you let Desi outside this will only reinforce his behaviour, rather than "get it out of his system". He is a dominant cat and the sight and smell of other cats, particularly males, will only fuel his aggressive territorial tendencies and get him into fights---which can be expensive as they often get infections and then its $$$ for vet care.

Unfortunatley now that he's had a taste of freedom he likes it and demands it. I've had young kittens that had no interest in going outside, and on the other hand had a few over the years that would try to sneak out while people were coming or going through a door at every opportunity. They just really wanted outside.

You've received some good information in redirecting his attention away from the door by throwing a toy or playing with him. Try always to feed him treats away from an outside door. Ignore his meowing to go out. Likely he will forget his outside experience after some months if he's kept amused inside. Get him different 'toys' to play with from time to time....doesn't have to be anything fancy---an empty box or paper grocery bag, foil ball, indoor practice golf ball (that kind that has holes in it), plastic pull tag off frozen juice can, a feather tied by a string from a door knob, toilet paper roll are some things you can try. A small-dog size "Kong" toy that you put treats in will keep him busy trying to get them out. They're available at pet stores. Just put out a few toys at a time---if he tires of them, change them. Most cats even enjoy watching TV---especially other animals (Animal Planet) and there are special cat DVD's/videos availabe to keep your cat amused---with birds, chipmunks, etc.
http://www.amazon.com/Video-Catnip-E.../dp/B00000JKYM

If he was happy before when you lived in the apartment, he can be a happy indoor cat again. Just may take a little more effort on your part. Good luck!
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  #42  
Old April 18th, 2010, 12:05 AM
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muddmutt, just noticed you're in Haverhill. Not in Canada, right? in MA, U.S. or U.K.? So website link to cat DVD probably should be to amazon.com rather than amazon.ca?
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  #43  
Old April 18th, 2010, 08:50 AM
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Yes, the medication will make Desi feel lethargic. IMHO Desi has a behavioural problem to be solved by behavioural modification, not by medication. What did vet say about how long Desi is to be medicated....a few days? a month? forever? I think if you follow the tips you've already received you will see a difference in his behaviour, but will say again, not if he goes outside. Just my
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  #44  
Old April 18th, 2010, 11:37 AM
muddmutt muddmutt is offline
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Desi/catastrophy

Hello Catlover2..thanks for setting me straight on the site, it's a bit confusing, but I am beginning to figure it out. You said something about the Titer test, which the Vet had not mentioned. Regarding the meds, she only gave one month worth and we are to bring them back for a booster in 30 days, but after reading some of the articles you provided me, I think a Titer test is what I should do. I do not want him drugged up either as he is like a different cat. Going to check out the Intuitive a friend told me about. She hasn't given me the details yet, said she would find them and let me know sometime today.
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  #45  
Old April 18th, 2010, 04:13 PM
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It wasn't me it was 14+Kitties asking about titres.....where you posted in the Introduce Yourself topic.

I will be interested in what the "Intuitive" discovers---hope you'll give us an update about that, as animal communication topic is one that interests me very much.
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  #46  
Old April 19th, 2010, 12:17 AM
muddmutt muddmutt is offline
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Desi/catastrophy

I am sorry, I am a mess. Have been monitoring him All night and he seems sick,It is almost midnight and I have to get up in just 6 hours...can't call in because I'm in a training class that has been scheduled months in advance. Not sure if it's the vaccines or something else, although Lucy seems fine, nothing out of the ordinary, sleep/eat, take your seat in the living room, etc. Desi, however has a far away/spent look in his eye and I am worried to tears. We only gave him one dose of the Prozac, not sure if we want to continue that path.

I looked in his ears earlier and looked liked ear mites. Went to my mothers to get some earmite meds she had from last year and administered it to both ears, but mainly the right ear looked massivly taken over by mites. Didn't give in to his pacing that he managed btwn 7 and 9 P this evening, to the door and back to the kitchen, back and forth for nearly two hours... now in the room, of his own will this time, where I confined him last week after his growling. Calling the Vet and ask why she did not look at his ears, mind you we take both in same time, same exam room, yet dual cost Same thing last year..after we take them, a week later discover he has ear mites. Unsure if I even want the FL booster, due 05/15/10. going to try and get a few hours of sleep but will be difficult. In addition > have been checking my email all evenig and haven't heard from the friend with the Intuitive info.

Last edited by muddmutt; April 19th, 2010 at 12:24 AM. Reason: addition
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  #47  
Old April 19th, 2010, 12:44 AM
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Originally Posted by muddmutt View Post
Unsure if I even want the FL booster, due 05/15/10.
What's the FL booster? Do you mean feline leukemia? If so, please DO NOT get this vaccine. There is no reason for an adult cat to get it as they acquire natural immunity to FeLV as they age.

As for Desi's current state, it could be a combo of both the vaccines and the Prozac. What vaccines did he get this time?
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  #48  
Old April 19th, 2010, 06:36 AM
muddmutt muddmutt is offline
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Desi

Well, he got the Rabies (1 year) and Distemper, which I think is coded here as FVRCP (3 Yrs) and Feline Lukuemia (1 year) and they want us to bring him back for the booster- don't think I'm going to though. This morning he seems somewhat better, but still not right. The Prozac was only given the first day and then decided not to give it to him Yesterday...thought it may have been too much with the shots and all after he slept the entire day and night. Or maybe the booster is for the Distemper, I am not sure now, there was so much going on in that room, and they were meowing up a storm I just couldn't get out of there fast enough..

Last edited by muddmutt; April 19th, 2010 at 06:41 AM. Reason: additional line
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  #49  
Old April 19th, 2010, 12:17 PM
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I'm wondering if it's the Prozac making him restless, pacing back and forth, tranquillizers can have that effect on some cats, as well as sleepy. Poor Desi, hope he feels better soon and that you can too.
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