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Old December 22nd, 2009, 07:41 PM
echoica echoica is offline
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Thumbs up PC Brand Nutrition First - Reinvented

...and it's in the grocery store!! Not kidding. It is much more pricey than the rest on the shelf but cheaper than the brand names in specialty stores. The ingredients are on par with many of the brand names though! Check it out...

Main Ingredients: Chicken Meal, Chicken, Brown Rice, Dehulled Barley, Oatmeal, Chicken Fat (Preserved with Mixed Tocopherols)

Addt'l Ingredients: Potatoes, Natural Chicken Flavour, Whole Dried Egg, Herring Meal, Salmon Oil, Tomatoes, Brewers Yeast, Phosphoric Acid, Whole Sweet Potatoes, Whole Carrots, Whole Blueberries, Whole Cranberries, Whole Apples ... blah blah blah etc.

Those are some pretty impressive main ingredients for a grocery store food. Kudos to PC for putting the effort into making a quality, affordable food!!
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Old December 22nd, 2009, 07:57 PM
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Welcome to the forum, echoica.
We love photos of your pets- just thought I would be the first one to ask
Just out of curiousity, you don't work for PC Brands do you? You sound like a social marketing strategy
Anyway, welcome and enjoy.
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Old December 22nd, 2009, 08:22 PM
echoica echoica is offline
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Originally Posted by Macomom View Post
Welcome to the forum, echoica.
We love photos of your pets- just thought I would be the first one to ask
Just out of curiousity, you don't work for PC Brands do you? You sound like a social marketing strategy
Anyway, welcome and enjoy.
Haha! Nope I don't work for PC

I did post a thread with pics to the 'Introduce Yourself Here' forum but I got a message saying that he has to be approved first?! Weird!?

I have 2 cats and 2 dogs:
* Bella, Black DSH, 6 years old, adopted from the SPCA
* Riley, Maine Coon (with brown tabby markings), will be 4 in Feb, also adopted from the SPCA
* Casey, Lurcher (Border Collie x Greyhound), brindle with white markings (he is the dude in my avatar), just turned 1 year old, another from the SPCA
* Rikku (my latest addition), Pure Border Collie, red & white, 4 months old, from a BC rescue

Thanks for the welcome!!
  #4  
Old December 31st, 2009, 09:16 PM
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Welcome to the forum Echoica your animals are lovely. I went to the PC Brands website but was unable to find any of the Nutrition 1st dog food with vegetables and fruit listed as ingredients. Maybe they don't have the food you bought on their website yet. Can you give us the full name of the PC food?

The ingredients list I found on the website for the PC Nutrition 1st Premium Dry - Chunks - Chicken & Rice Adult dog food is:

Chicken, chicken meal, brewers rice, ground corn, corn gluten meal, poultry fat (naturally preserved with mixed tocopherols, a source of vitamin E), ground barely, fish meal, poultry flavour, beet pulp, flaxseed meal, dried whole egg, yeast culture, salt, dicalcium phosphate, potassium chloride, calcium carbonate, mannannoligosaccharide, choline chloride.

The ingredients list for the PC Extra Meaty Chicken & Rice Dog Food that doesn't specify whether it is dry or canned is:

Chicken, brown rice, ground corn, ground barley, corn gluten meal, poultry by-product meal, poultry fat (naturally preserved with mixed tocopherols, a source of vitamin E), meat and bone meat, liver digest, flax seed, dried whole egg, brewer's dried yeast, calcium carbonate, safflower oil, zinc sulphite, ferrous sulphate (iron), l-tryptophan, vitamin supplements (A, D, E), niacin, copper sulphate, manganese sulphate, calcium pantothenate, riboflavin, thiamin mononitrate, biotin, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), sodium selenite, vitamin B12, calcium oidate, folic acid, menadione sodium bisulphite complex (source of vitamin K activity).

Can you please point me in the right direction for the food that you mentioned?
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Last edited by dbg10; December 31st, 2009 at 09:16 PM. Reason: spelling
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Old January 2nd, 2010, 03:44 AM
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President's Choice has made this so confusing .....their old formula was called President's Choice Nutrition 1st and their new formula is called President's Choice Nutrition First and they still haven't updated their website.

The list of ingredients for the new formula was posted by Hound Dog in this thread ....

http://www.pets.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=66434

It has too many grains imo and also:

1. Herring meal .....it is likely preserved with ethoxyquin unless President's Choice has specified to the supplier that they want it preserved naturally.

2. Vitamin K .....I would want clarification if it is Vitamin K1 or Vitamin K3. If it is Vitamin K3 it is menadione sodium bisulfite complex which is also believed to cause cancer.

The last time I was in Extra Foods here I checked out the price and it was $39.99 for the large bag. You can buy Acana (www.championpetfoods.com) here for $45.99 for the large bag and it has better ingredients. Acana is also made at their own manufacturing plant so well worth the extra six dollars imo.
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Old January 2nd, 2010, 08:00 AM
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I too think it is too grain heavy, and you can get good food at a specialty store for a similar price. I dont like any pet food at a grocery store, purina, iams, ol roy, they are all the same, you pay $5 for one kind or $35 for the other. The food you mentioned is an imrovement over the corn based foods, but still over priced imo.
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Old January 2nd, 2010, 01:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by echoica View Post
This ingredient list is not current. Please see the main ingredients in my first post for the CURRENT list (Brewer's rice has been removed from the formulation by PC for example)
Glad the brewer's rice has been removed but, as I stated in my above post, I still would be more concerned about the type of Vitamin K they use as well as what the herring meal was preserved with by the supplier as PC does not need to list ethoxyquin on their label as an ingredient if "they" did not add it.

I do agree that it is better than the other brands at the supermarket but it is overpriced imo when compared with Acana.
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Old January 2nd, 2010, 02:54 PM
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A friend of mine is feeding the salmon and potatoe and her 2 are doing good on it.and it's cheaper then the california natural herring and sweet potatoe that i'm feeding.

Not everyone can afford acana or their dogs don't do well on it.jag did at first then had a major weight loss well on acana and is now putting weight back on with the california natural.with i might have two switch to the pc brand myself due to $$

Last edited by angeldogs; January 2nd, 2010 at 03:00 PM.
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Old January 2nd, 2010, 03:01 PM
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Originally Posted by angeldogs View Post
A friend of mine is feeding the salmon and potatoe and her 2 are doing good on it.and it's cheaper then the california natural herring and sweet potatoe that i'm feeding.
Is that the Acana Salmon & Potato? I haven't seen it in the pet store lately and thought they must have discontinued it.
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Old January 2nd, 2010, 03:04 PM
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I was feeding the acana adult.i can't afford their salmon or any of their fish.i paying a little less for the california natural the i was the acana.
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Old January 2nd, 2010, 03:07 PM
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I just checked Champion Pet Foods website and it looks like they no longer make the salmon and potato formula. The only fish formula they have is the grain free Pacifica one.


http://www.championpetfoods.com/acana/products.php
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Old January 2nd, 2010, 03:11 PM
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Originally Posted by angeldogs View Post
I was feeding the acana adult.i can't afford their salmon or any of their fish.i paying a little less for the california natural the i was the acana.
How much do you pay for California Natural back there? Both of Naturapet's California Natural and Innova formulas are alot more expensive than Acana is here and their EVO formula is $79 for the large bag.
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Old January 2nd, 2010, 03:14 PM
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I'm paying 56.00 for the california natural before taxes and 64.00 for the acana before taxes.the califoria natural is a 30lb bag and the acana is 29lb bag.
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Old January 2nd, 2010, 03:18 PM
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Originally Posted by angeldogs View Post
I'm paying 56.00 for the california natural before taxes and 64.00 for the acana before taxes.the califoria natural is a 30lb bag and the acana is 29lb bag.
Is that the regular Acana (with grains) or the grain free Acana Provincial?
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Old January 2nd, 2010, 03:23 PM
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Quote:
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Is that the regular Acana (with grains) or the grain free Acana Provincial?
With the grains.
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Old January 2nd, 2010, 03:29 PM
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Originally Posted by angeldogs View Post
With the grains.
WOW .....it's $46 for the regular Acana here and $57 for the Acana Provincial.

Have you checked out Horizon Complete? ....

http://www.horizonpetfood.com/Produc..._complete.html

I would use that before PC Nutrition First as they also have their own manufacturing plant and use quality ingredients.
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Old January 2nd, 2010, 03:33 PM
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It's the price and the horizon with grain was about the same price as the acana.the pc is cheaper for me.
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Old January 2nd, 2010, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by angeldogs View Post
It's the price and the horizon with grain was about the same price as the acana.the pc is cheaper for me.
I emailed President's Choice twice asking about the form of Vitamin K they use and also whether or not the herring meal was preserved with ethoxyquin by the supplier but never got any replies.

Vitamin K3 (menadione sodium bisulphite complex) and ethoxyquin are two big red flag ingredients imo.

Perhaps you could phone their 1-800 number and see if you can get any answers.
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Old January 2nd, 2010, 03:43 PM
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I will get their 1-800 and see if i can't get an answer.i will also try and get the ingredients from my friends bag and post them.
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Old January 2nd, 2010, 03:49 PM
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Originally Posted by angeldogs View Post
I will get their 1-800 and see if i can't get an answer.i will also try and get the ingredients from my friends bag and post them.
Good luck.

I really hope that there is no ethoxyquin and that it is Vitamin K1 that they use as then it would be a good alternative and great competition to all the premium brands out there.
  #21  
Old January 2nd, 2010, 04:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rainbow View Post
President's Choice has made this so confusing .....their old formula was called President's Choice Nutrition 1st and their new formula is called President's Choice Nutrition First and they still haven't updated their website.

The list of ingredients for the new formula was posted by Hound Dog in this thread ....

http://www.pets.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=66434
Thanks Rainbow
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  #22  
Old January 2nd, 2010, 09:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by echoica View Post
honestly are we this picky about our own food
We should be. But we should be even more picky about our pet's food because in many cases (unfortunately) all they eat is a highly processed commercial diet. Pet food companies have hoodwinked society (and vets) into believing that only commercial pet food should be fed, that "table scraps" and "people food" are bad for them. What a load of hooey. So if we're going to rely so heavily on these foods as our pets' main source of nutrition, it better be a quality product with every ingredient under scrutiny. Too bad that's not the case for the majority of pet owners, who are far too gullible to slick advertising and pretty packaging.

Quote:
Originally Posted by echoica View Post
i find it hard to believe dog food is so political that it feeds into the vets pockets or something ridiculous...
Believe it. Pet food is a multi-BILLION dollar industry. You'd be naive to think that the bottom line for pretty much every single pet food manufacturer isn't $$$. And vets are just shills for some of the biggest players (Hill's, Medi-cal/Royal Canin, Purina, etc), having been brainwashed in school and then sucked in by the lucrative earnings. You said in another post you were a vet-tech - did you actually go to school for that? Because if you did, you would have seen it first-hand. Some links you might be interested in:

http://www.pets.ca/forum/showthread....light=Hill%27s
http://catnutrition.wordpress.com/20...food-and-vets/
http://www.hans.org/magazine/322/Pet...Before-Recalls
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14708361
http://catnutrition.wordpress.com/20...owed-any-more/
http://www.bornfreeusa.org/facts.php?p=359&more=1


And a book that should be on every pet owner's reading list:
Not Fit For a Dog! - The Truth About Manufactured Pet Food
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  #23  
Old January 2nd, 2010, 10:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by echoica View Post
Well, I don't think I am "naive" or "brainwashed". And I think a lot of professionals would be offended by some of those statements - particularly those of us that really care for animals even if nutrition is not our #1 specialty. And last I checked, yes, one does have to go to school to become a vet tech??!! lol

I think you could try to be a little less food-nazi for those us who cannot afford your suggestions. And most of us are probably too lazy for it [true story ]. Do we love our pets less? I think not.
Ummm echoica - I am trying to find the right words as to not offend. Sugarcatmom is hardly a "food-nazi". I for one find that term offensive. SCM has done more research on pet foods, both dog and cat, than the majority of vets. She is our number one food guru here. She has spent countless hours reading, researching, doing everything she can to find the best information to help pets. I can not tell you how many pets she has indeed helped. Many people credit her with saving their cat's lives. She goes out of her way to look up the information to try to help.
Food is indeed the number one cause of a lot of illness in cats and dogs. Look at the recalls in recent years. Dry food for cats is deadly. Especially males. Cats need their fluid intake with their food, not beside it. It has been proven time and time again that dry food kills cats. Period.
One of SCM's favourite sites and one she didn't include on the list she gave is: http://www.catinfo.org/ Maybe you could take the time to read it and learn. You may be amazed by the wealth of info included in this document which, I might add, was written by a very well respected vet.
And - may I also add the very best food you can feed your animals, both cats and dogs, is a raw diet. I think you would be surprised to learn with a little knowhow and practice it is actually the most cost effective way to feed. It can also save megabucks down the road on vet bills.
Recently in another thread you said that you had thought of leaving this site because your opinion didn't seem to get much respect. I am hesitant to say that if this is how you take some well intended information then wow. Just wow! Please, stick around. We welcome everyone who is here to have fun and learn. But please if you expect respect you also need to give it.
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  #24  
Old January 2nd, 2010, 10:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by echoica View Post
Well, I don't think I am "naive" or "brainwashed" - I think a lot of professionals would be offended by some of those statements - particularly those of us that really care for animals even if nutrition is not our #1 specialty
Offended or not, they're true. Those that are offended the most are probably the ones for whom those statements are most applicable . I'm not saying these people (and you) don't care for animals. They just don't know enough real information about what cats and dogs should be eating. And unfortunately, due to their position of authority, they have far more influence on the average pet owner than they should, given this blatant conflict of interest.

Quote:
Originally Posted by echoica View Post
And last I checked, yes, one does have to go to school to become a vet tech! lol
Not in the U.S. you don't. And while I do know that in Canada you have to go to school, I wasn't sure if you were just saying you were a vet tech to make it sound like you knew more about this subject than you actually do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by echoica View Post
I think you could try to be a little less pet-food-nazi (I use the term jokingly) for those of us who cannot afford your suggestions.
As long as cats are dying at the hands of pet food manufacturers in the huge numbers that they do, I won't shut up about this, and I won't sugar-coat it for those of you that can't handle the truth. You can take it or leave it, but if you're going to post about it, expect me to respond.

Quote:
Originally Posted by echoica View Post
And most of us are probably too lazy or busy for it [true story ].
If you have time to post on this message board, than you have time to make some pet food. Your laziness, I can't help you with.

I'm sorry that we've gotten off on the wrong foot. Your first post here, (and did very much wreak of shilling for PC, especially since you were doing it on another message board as well). The fact that you have stuck around is admirable. But I dare you to read the links I (and 14+) posted and then come back for more discussion on this.
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Last edited by Ford; January 3rd, 2010 at 09:10 PM.
  #25  
Old January 3rd, 2010, 02:47 AM
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Echoica, I get the impression that your attitude will prevent you from learning anything about pet nutrition. Sugarcatmom is the most knowledgable person here and you don't even want to listen to her.

And, as far as this thread being about PC Nutrition First dog food, you were given our opinions on that. If you don't have a problem with feeding your dogs ethoxyquin and menadione without ensuring that those ingredients are not used, then that is your perogative.
  #26  
Old January 3rd, 2010, 06:04 AM
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thanks rainbow! i am waiting to here back as well. when we do, it should be posted here. from what i have gather so far online it doesn't look like it is the aforementioned. but one cannot be sure unless we hear it from the horses mouth so to speak!!
  #27  
Old January 3rd, 2010, 07:49 AM
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Say wha? Regardless how you pick apart my post, my opinion stands, there is no junk in a grocery store pet isle i would feed my dogs. I NEVER said all foods at a specialty store are great, i said that is the only place they are available. I did say it is a step up from corn based, still wouldnt touch it, and it is expensive for what it is.

I went to school too, yup, worked in a vet clinic til i had kids, and guess what! Scm and others still know a whole crapload than me. I also learned most of what i know (which isnt a lot) from other people, try it.

I am not going to agree, you think its a great food, and thats nice, feed it to your pets, i am glad it is out there instead of the corn, but dogs dont get a choice, we have to pick something that meets their needs in 1 food.
If you could only eat 1 food what would it be? Hot dogs because it is protien and cheap?
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Old January 3rd, 2010, 07:59 AM
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Exclamation

i never said it was a great food. i said it was a positive step forward for a grocery store to come up with something like this. the quality for the price is actually quite good when compared to it's counterparts. likewise, i never said i fed it either.

thanks for all your comments! much appreciated. take care.
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Old January 3rd, 2010, 08:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by echoica View Post
i never said it was a great food. i said it was a positive step forward for a grocery store to come up with something like this. the quality for the price is actually quite good when compared to it's counterparts. likewise, i never said i fed it either.

thanks for all your comments! much appreciated. take care.

Mmmm, seems like this isn't getting any better, doesn't it? :sad: I am sorry to see that certain posts in this thread have been deleted where indeed, unless you buy the food just to have it in your house for visitors, it was inferred you fed this food. I distinctly remember where you said you had already thrown out the dog food bag after dumping the food in plastic containers but that you still had the cat food one available. Those are the threads that have been deleted. How unfortunate. I just don't know how I should feel about all of this. It's starting to feel for sure like a sales pitch.

Oh, btw, what Sugarcatmom does is hardly a "hobby".
Now how about we all play nice?
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  #30  
Old January 3rd, 2010, 12:46 PM
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Why not support brands that put ALL their efforts in to making top quality foods for pets?
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Last edited by Ford; January 3rd, 2010 at 09:14 PM.
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