Tinkle Dog....*frown*

[Lyrical44]

Ok, I know you CAN teach old dogs new tricks, it CAN be done, but HOW?!

I looove dogs, but I am NOT a particular fan of my moms dog Whiskey, aka Tinkle Dog...I know, I'm descriminating, but the dog drives me bonkers!! lol, shes cute, but you cant cuddle her, because she smells bad! I have to wash her AND her kennel EVERY day, because she wont stop messing in it.

I have very little background for her, I know shes a PB Yorkie, and shes registered, we dont have her papers though, they stayed with her last owner, who knows my mom really well. BUT the last owner was not really home that often, and resulted in a couple issues with Whiskey, # she doesnt like large dogs, because she accidently got attacked by a choc. lab at her old home, but that one is easily divertable, she interacts with Bennie through a baby gate so that she can see he isnt as scarey as she thinks he is, #2 that she messes her kennel ALL the time, like EVERY night and #3 that she was never house trained, its a real pain, and totally not her fault, which I understand, but....for her health, is there a way I can re-train her? I've tried the usual methods, and, pee pads being bad, we even tried those too, because we really dont want her messing EVERYWHERE, and figure if we can get her to do it in one spot, we can slowly train her to use that spot, until its outside, you know? I dont even want a quick fix here, if it takes a YEAR Im willing to put in the effort, but for now, I have stopped crating her at night, and when im not home, because its sooo unhealthy for her to lie in her own messes, and she wont stop messing in there!

Oh....and she was trained in french...not great? lol

[Lyrical44]

These pics make her look like she only has one eye...she has two lol

[boxerlover2008]

First off, I would get rid of her crate entiterly for now. She has gotten used to going to the bathroom in there everyday, so it doesn’t bother her anymore. She probably associates that place with going to the bathroom, and may always will. This happened with my puppy. When we started just leaving her gated in one room instead, it stopped. Because she knew better that she couldn’t pee on our floors, but never thought there was anything wrong with peeing in her crate – because we were never there when she did it, to correct her.

I’ve never potty trained an adult dog before, so I can’t really help there. But I would just say put her on a schedule like we did our puppy before she figured it out herself. Bring her out first thing in the morning, after naps, after eating/drinking, first thing when you get home, right before bed, etc… And praise her everytime she goes, while she’s going. Not after. I think by doing this for a while, you will get to know her schedule and when she has to go.

I’m no expert but these are things that helped me. I’m sure others will have great ideas to help you in the long run! Good luck!

[Lyrical44]

Thanks for the advice, we do have her on scheduled pee outings, and she goes outside, but she comes back in and does it again, inside. So we take her back out when she does it. She just doesnt seem to want to learn. We do leave her in the room she messed in though, because then she kind of feels ashamed, and I had heard this is something that is supposed to help, but its not helping either, and I really dont like making her feel guilty because it just doesnt seem fair, if guilt makes my stomach hurt, I wonder what it does to her right? She is a really good dog for the most part, but the inside messing needs to stop, we rent a place now, and *thankfully* it isnt carpeted, except my room, where she isnt allowed, but no landlord is going to appreciate dog tinkle and poo on their floors.

[Bailey_]

Leaving her in the same room w/ it won't make her feel guilty. It's normal for a dog to pee and poo, therefore if you acknowledge it and don't remove it immediatley, but allow it to sit there hoping that she will be embarrassed or guilty will do nothing but make this matter worse.

[boxerlover2008]

Sorry I couldn't be of more help. But good for you to sticking through this and trying to help her. Maybe some owners of yorkies on here will chime in.

Another thing we do, is use bells. I think this will only be good for you though, once she starts to realize to ask to go out. We bought this little dog stuffy thing at the pet food store. It hangs over your door handle and has bells at the end of it. Stella rings the bells every time she has to go out, so I always know. We started by everytime we’d take her out, we’d lift her paw to the bells to ring them, say good girl and go outside. She picked it up within a few days.

Also, maybe the smell of the urine is still in the room and that makes her go more. I know there are products you can buy, or make, that help get rid of that odour.

[bendyfoot]

How big is the crate she sleeps in?
How old is she?
Is she pottying anywhere other than the crate inside the house?
Has she always had access to pee pads or is this just something you're now trying?
How are you cleaning her bedding after she messes her crate?


Bringing the dog back into the room with the mess won't help. Showing a dog a mess after the fact won't help either; they will not associate any unpleasantness with their pottying even seconds after it's happened.

Dogs don't really do "shame"; any shame-like behaviour you see is more likely fear of consequence (yelling, etc.) which they've learned will happen.

I might have some ideas after I get more info.

[14+kitties]

You have some problems, don't you? Is this one of the dogs your mom used to breed? Have you taken her to the vet to rule out ALL possibilities of illness'? Bladder infections, birthing related issues, etc.....
I have never heard of a crate being small enough to house a yorkie the way a crate is meant to work. It is supposed to be big enough for the dog to stand in and lie down to sleep comfortably, not big enough for her to go to a corner and pee/poo and then to another spot to sleep. When I housetrained my toy poodle eons ago now I couldn't find a dog crate that small so I used a cat carrier. Maybe you could try that.
Some suggestions I have that may or may not work......
Keep her on a leash at all times attached to you or your mother. This way she is aware of what you are doing at all times and you are aware of what she is doing. If she squats you can move quickly to correct and get her outside.
Get rid of pee pads entirely. As far as I am concerned they do nothing but teach a dog it's ok to pee in the house. Much harder to break bad habits later.
As soon as she is up in the morning, take her out. Take her out from then on during the day on a regular basis until she is used to going out and doing her business outside. Do not let her back in the house until she has gone. If she goes and then comes indoor and goes again, turn around and take her back out. When I say regular basis I mean every half hour/hour. I know she is an older dog but she needs to be treated the same as a pup until she knows she is supposed to use the outside to pee/poo. Do not let her go out on her own. You need to go out with her at this point and until she has been trained properly.
Praise her when she does what she is outside to do. Jump up and down, get excited about her peeing. It may look ridiculous to the neighbours but she will catch on.
Lastly - be consistent. Without consistency she will never be trained.

You can use this recipe to scrub the rooms she has used for her personal bathroom - 1/4 cup rubbing alcohol, 1/4 cup vinegar, 1 cup water. Mix in a spray bottle and use to clean thoroughly.

[Lyrical44]

If she isnt placed into her crate, she wont go into it. She messes when we are asleep, so I have stopped crating her, because its just unhealthy for her.

We wash her blankets, and the floors with diluted bleach, and then we scrub them with our mop and floor cleaners, it basicly eliminates all traces of her messes.

I DO NOT leave messes on the floor, thats a) yukky, and b) asking one of my other dogs to cover the scent. Bad idea, even worse invitation lol.

Whiskey was very poorly trained in the first place.

She messes anywhere in the house that she wants to, and we cant seem to get her to even just choose a single room...

[Lyrical44]

Yeah, Ive got issues galore..Whiskey is a rescue/adoptee she was given to us in loo of being left at home alone all the time, as she was being. The others, Lishka and Pudgey (before his disappearance) are well trained, we've had them since they were puppies, so we have been consistant with them.

I am willing to openly admit that Bennie's issues are my fault, my life was pretty hectic and I let slip on Bens training, and Im kickin myself in the petootie for it now.

Whiskey is 5, and never has had puppies, the only one that we have thats been bred is Lishka and actually, her 2 litters, spanned a year apart were accidental. (Dont go into me for the accidental bit, I know she should be fixed, but Im broke, and I have been for a long time due to some very personal issues) Lishka's babysitter (same one both times) let her out and didnt watch her with Pudgie, and she ended up a-breeding. She doesnt breed now, nor will she ever again.

Anyways sorry, Whiskey, 5, never had pups, crate trained, (cat carrier I suppose), well tempered, with a few minor exceptions when she is abruptly woken up, no bladder problems, up to date shots.

She is the example of the perfect little dog......except the peeing and pooping on the floor.

[14+kitties]

Cleaning with bleaches does not work as a lot of bleaches have the same ingredients in them as does urine - ammonia. You need to clean with something that gets rid of the smell entirely. YOU may not be able to smell it. SHE can.

[Lyrical44]

You know....its funny you say that about ammonia the SPCA came to my house once under a false accusation, and said that we should use ammonia on our hall, to cover the smell...i kinda thought that was wrong....but who am i to question? right? mom gets lots of pet scent removers, shes really sensitive to smells, especially pet smells, makes her sick

[bendyfoot]

Ok some thoughts.

Pretend this dog is a little baby puppy and start completely from scratch.

First disinfect everywhere she's peed or pooped with a good ENZYMATIC pet stain cleaner, including the inside of the crate. I would also replace the bedding in there.

Her crate should basically only be large enough to stand, turn around and lie down comfortably. If she can pee in one end and lie down on the other, it's too big.

Next, get a 6 or 8 foot leash. Attach one end to the dog and one to your belt loops or around your waist, any time you're home with her. Watch closely for any signals that she needs to go: take her out at these times and praise like crazy. If you catch her having an accident (and you should if she does because she'll be tied to you) say NO firmly, scoop her up and take her outside to finish. It would also probably helpful to teach her a potty word (we just use "go pee") so she also has a sound cue about when its appropriate to go. Keep her on a very strict potty schedule otherwise.

[Bailey_]

You've gotten some wonderful advice as to house-training. If you follow what Bendy and 14+ have advised, I have no doubt that you will see an improvement. Good luck, keep us posted.

[Lyrical44]

I have picture of my Lishka in a kennel the size of the one Whiskey lives in, and its NOT too big, its just the right size for her itty bitty self lol. She just...messes and lies in it, which is why I have stopped putting her in there, she doesnt CARE if she curls up in her own mess.

She is always with us, and we DO correct her and usher her outside when she tinkles, the problem is, that even dancing, claping, singing her praises she doesnt get it. She is FRENCH....I learned "vien ici" "asseyezvous"(sit) cant spell it all "bonjour" "merci" and "tres bien" with a few of the other I dont speak french, I love you, and my name is....I need aparently a french tutor, but she doesnt seem to listen to any french either because we were told "fait pee pee" would get her to pee outside...it does NOT work.

[Lyrical44]

annnd I forgot to attach the picture... abuhhh lol. I was going to say something else....but I seem to have forgotten.

One of the problems with keeping Whiskey tied to me, is Bennie...I have to pay TONS of attention to him because his training is to NOT try to shove me on my bum or face, and STOP eating things, he stomps Whiskey....so I cant tie her to me, and deal with Bennie, and everything else that goes on in this zoo...

[kandy]

I would agree that for now you need to totally quit using the crate - she's been trained that it's okay for her to potty in there and then lie in it. Her natural instinct to not potty in the place she sleeps has been destroyed. I agree with starting over, just as if she was just a bity puppy going through her first lessons on house training, and the umbilical training should help to keep her from getting ready to pee without you realizing it.

Nature's Miracle is a really good enzymatic cleaner that you can get at almost any pet store.

When you give her these commands in french, you might try immediately repeating the command in english. I think if you are consistent in that, you'll have her understanding english commands in no time. I know any dog that only knew french commands would be at a total loss in my house. LOL You might try treats for getting her to listen.

[14+kitties]

Ok, hate to say it but now it sounds like you are making excuses as to why you can't train her the way she should be trained.
If you can't do what needs to be done then your mother should be doing it. It is, after all, her dog. She should be the one teaching the dog.
A five year old dog is not that old. She should be able to be trained pretty quickly. Give up on the French. She will learn quickly what English words she needs to learn.
Consistency is really the key here.

[Lyrical44]

Im not particularly sure if anyone has like...read about Bennie...he is here ALOT for the fact that he is a monster, and to be completely honest Im more interested in not getting scratched to crap, and my 5 year old neice and 1 year old nephew not getting trampled by Bennie. I have to train them both.

I also dont know if anyone noticed that Im on her ALL day, because Im home alone, my mother WORKS all day to support my unemployed butt so she really cant tie the dog to her and train her, hence the reason I am offering to do it. ( I would do anything for my mother, and I would rather that she wasnt brought into anything that seems even slightly negative towards her, please and thanks )

I am NOT looking for reasons NOT to train her properly, I am looking for ways it can be done to accomodate BOTH dogs I have to train, since I quite obviously cant tie them BOTH to me in order to train them. I am not going to keep Bennie in his crate all the time while I train Whiskey. I am conscious of BOTH my dogs in need of training, and honestly dont appreciate being told that I am using any excuse I can to NOT train them, I work my bum off in order to keep things healthy and happy for my puppers...

So, that all being said I will try the advice I have been given and keep you all updated.

Thankee

[14+kitties]

Originally Posted by Lyrical44

I also dont know if anyone noticed that Im on her ALL day, because Im home alone, my mother WORKS all day to support my unemployed butt so she really cant tie the dog to her and train her, hence the reason I am offering to do it. ( I would do anything for my mother, and I would rather that she wasnt brought into anything that seems even slightly negative towards her, please and thanks )

Ahhhhh cool your jets chicky!! It's all good. BUT - you just said something yourself that maybe you should take a look at. The fact that you say you are on here all day....... how much attention can you be paying to the dog? Now don't get upset. You asked for advice and this is exactly what I would be saying to someone's face if they were standing in front of me.

[Lyrical44]

Haha, no not like 24/7 lol, no I am not THAT much of a computer junkie, I pay tons of attention to the dogs lol. They sit here in the living room with me, and I sit by the living room door, so I can see what they are doing, and when they ask to go outside lol.

I didnt mean to get snarky...so I am actually sorry for my little outburst...My mom does support me though, and we are having a hard time right now, so I get my hackles up when people question her motifs for not training the dog lol.

I do spend alot of time online, I do online courses, but like I said I am in the wonderful position in the living room to watch when the dogs ask to go outside haha. I have my eye on Whiskey all the time but thats not hard, because she is on LAZY little dog, luckily not fat, lol.

I really do appreciate the advice.
I did forget to say that we stopped with the training pads, because they are just ridiculous. I am trying my hardest to get myself and the dogs settled into this new place and train them in it too.

[breeze]

keeping an eye on them and waiting for THEM to tell you when to go out is not enough..
YOU should be setting the schedule for them so that they do not have a chance to mess in the house.. only then when the times are set and NO accidents you can let them tell you it is time to go out.. if that means letting them out every hour so be it, you are at home take the time to train them

[Lyrical44]

Ok, I didnt say I waited for them to tell ME to take them out, I said I can see when they ask. I set the schedule for Whiskey, Loo doesnt need to be told, she ASKS. Whiskey does not. I am at home, and I am taking the time to train them, or I would deffinately not be asking for advice. its between mom and I that Whiskey's messes have become slightly less frequent but they are still happening even with her on a schedule.

[breeze]

then take her out more often.

[Lyrical44]

Im gettin a little fluffy here, I need the advice, but I would really like for it to be constructive, because I could take Whiskey out every ten minutes and she would still pee on my floor, its been trained into her, I need a "de-trainer" or a "reverse-trainer" Its not like I dont take the dogs out, it happens, every 15-20 minutes, and that is MORE than enough time between pee times, if the dog is peeing more than that it is an issue, but Whiskey is healthy, vet checked and healthy.

[Bailey_]

Lyrical,

My family recently aquired a 5 year old papillionX who, by all intents and purposes, was most likely never house-trained. We've had him for four days and are already seeing an improvement.

My suggestion to you would be to start right now - with your dogs training. Put all thoughts of her soiling in the house out of your mind. As has been suggested, continue cleaning any soiled areas (IMMEDIATLEY) with the appropriate cleansers. Continue taking your dog outside after she eats/drinks, plays with the other dogs or you, wakes up and before she goes to bed. Treat her like a new puppy in your home.

If keeping her out of her crate is the only way for her not to soil at night, then do it. PREVENTION is key, so if she's used to soiling in her kennel, then do not give her that opportunity. Just make sure that she is somewhere at night that you can easily watch her and monitor her so that she can't wander and soil. If this means she wears a leash attached to your arm at night, then so be it.

With the PapillionX I mentioned earlier, I literally take him outside every 15-20 minutes. But with Gizmo, we don't just put him outside and expect him to go. I need to get his bowels moving so I put him on leash and we go out front of the house, walking up and down the sidewalk. When he soils, I pick it up and praise - when he pee's, I praise. We found that he was far too distracted by leaves & squirrels in our backyard to be trusted to learn proper housetraining techniques by just putting him out there by himself. He needed more direction, more involvement from us.

[Lyrical44]

Its not that she doesnt go outside, she does. She goes nearly every time she is let out. She is allowed to wander and find "the perfect spot" with mom or I watching her and praising her when she goes. I suppose she has made progress since we got her because she never used to go outside at all. But its that she will come in, and pee on the floor inside even after she has peed outside. I am going to try your suggestions, well, mom and I are she is taking part in the training when she is at home. And I really hope it works

[Bailey_]

Originally Posted by Lyrical44

Its not that she doesnt go outside, she does. She goes nearly every time she is let out. She is allowed to wander and find "the perfect spot" with mom or I watching her and praising her when she goes. I suppose she has made progress since we got her because she never used to go outside at all. But its that she will come in, and pee on the floor inside even after she has peed outside. I am going to try your suggestions, well, mom and I are she is taking part in the training when she is at home. And I really hope it works

Lyrical, keep us posted on her progress. Are you POSITIVE that she does not have a UT infection?

A dog, especially a female, simply doesn't pee inside and out because they feel like it. If she's peeing outside and then comes inside and pees, either you've let her in to soon - or she has something going on with her and she needs to be looked at by a vet.

[Lyrical44]

Yeah Im Positive its not UT, it seems like she is holding half, she will do it outside if we keep her out for a while, she will go in one spot, then a little while later go in another. Its not a constant thing, she varies it up sometimes, she will pee, and that will be it, no more pee, and then other times its like shes being spiteful lol...i dont know how to explain it...Ive had lots of contrary dogs, who will pee on your stuff out of spite, Pudgie didnt like Bennie, and my room is Bens territory so Pudgie would mark his territory, and my sisters old dog would get really mad if you told her no, and she would pee on something in MY room to show me who was boss...This one is just much more difficult to train.

[Lyrical44]

I would like to mention, maybe belatedly that I am not new to the world of dogs....not new at all. I have had TONS of dogs, my first dog was when I was an infant, which I had no part in obviously, but I have ALWAYS had more than one dog. You know how you often hear people complaining that there are alot of dogs on your road or in your neighbourhood? and the people are like it must be THEIR dogs that are scaring this or that away because THEY have so many of them? we were THOSE people, I get it alot "Oh your one of THOSE people, with the annoying dogs" Which they never were...but thats besides the point. I have trained dogs to sit and stay and come just with finger motions...I just seem to be having trouble with these two.

I have had males before, but I was younger and my siblings always thought I was too small, but I had them under my finger, with little training, but they were outside, because my dad is a....um....well he just thinks that big dogs belong outside, and I loooove large dogs, they are great companions, so most of MY dogs were almost always outside, until I got old enough to tell my dad it wasnt happening anymore.

Bennie is the most stubborn male dog Ive ever encountered, and I keep him indoors...His training was sorely neglected at first. MY BAD. But I am working hard on it now.

Whiskey...she should have never been bought by the people who bought her...simply because she didnt get the training she needed. So now mom and I are fighting this big fight, and it seems much, much easier with puppies.