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  #61  
Old August 4th, 2004, 11:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cactus Flower
Speaking of ridiculous....

Just wondering if you have had your dog declawed as well?
And while you're at it, you of course will want to have all of your pets' teeth removed. They can be just as dangerous as claws (or moreso). Because, like you said, fights and "accidents" will happen. Teeth have been known to cause a LOT of "serious injury".

Perhaps you'd be interested in having a pet turtle? Oops, no, they have claws.
A fish? Ah, but those scales can be abrasive, and they are very hard to de-scale.
A pet rock? Nope, those can fall off a shelf and hit someone's head....
Excellent points, Cactus Flower!! I have deep, permanent scars on my arms from the puppies in my life playfully clawing at me. My cat has never done permanent damage! As for how the kids deal with it - I have a 5yr old and a 10mth old - they are taught to respect the animals as much as the animals are taught to respect them, and of course are CONSTANTLY monitored when they're together. My furniture? The cat (once he left kittenhood) isn't interested in doing anything more than sleeping on the sofa. As for my screens, you can get pet screen at your local hardware store. My sister's very large dog claws at it like he's trying to dig his way into the house, and it's held up just fine.

For the love of God, please don't compare spaying/neutering to having a cat declawed. Besides the obvious benefit of population control, someone has already listed the multitude of health benefits to spaying/neutering. I sincerely doubt a cat will contract "claw cancer" if you don't declaw it!

I was glad to read the original poster decided not to put her cat through this. Good for you!!
  #62  
Old August 4th, 2004, 11:01 AM
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Sorry, but true, was there for declaw and spay.

Small town, personal relationship with the vet and at that time (just starting college) was considering that vocation so as an 'intern' had to participate. The job was too sad for me and better left to those who don't get all upset over sick and injured pets.
  #63  
Old August 4th, 2004, 11:03 AM
sammiec sammiec is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michel
The job was too sad for me and better left to those who don't get all upset over sick and injured pets.
Guess it's not too sad to see the animals that come in and have had an infection set in because they were declawed and scrapped their way through the kitty litter and got an infection in their paw. It's all inflammed and they cannot walk on it because of the pain, that's not sad enough eh?
  #64  
Old August 4th, 2004, 11:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sammiec
Guess it's not too sad to see the animals that come in and have had an infection set in because they were declawed and scrapped their way through the kitty litter and got an infection in their paw. It's all inflammed and they cannot walk on it because of the pain, that's not sad enough eh?
Indeed that would be sad. Shame on the owner who doesn't maintain appropriate cleanliness.
  #65  
Old August 4th, 2004, 11:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michel
Indeed that would be sad. Shame on the owner who doesn't maintain appropriate cleanliness.
It can depend on the type of litter my friend....
  #66  
Old August 4th, 2004, 11:08 AM
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Michel said: Small town, personal relationship with the vet and at that time (just starting college) was considering that vocation so as an 'intern' had to participate. The job was too sad for me and better left to those who don't get all upset over sick and injured pets.

I think someones nose is growing.....and it doesnt matter either way does it really? It was the cat lying on the operating table, not you. You get upset over sick and injured pets? Hmmmmm..... interesting, you still feel this procedure is acceptable.......READ OTHER POSTS IN THIS THREAD.....EDUCATE YOURSELF 1ST
(as for litter.....use shredded newspaper instead)
  #67  
Old August 4th, 2004, 11:22 AM
sammiec sammiec is offline
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Good posts Shae!

LOL, this was an interactive image... it's supposed to show the hand without fingertips....
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  #68  
Old August 4th, 2004, 12:35 PM
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Angry You people!

I also think this is one of the the cruelest things that can be done to a cat. For those of you who think it is OK, why don't you guys go get just 1 fingernail removed? Then, let everyone know how it was & how it feels afterward. Besides, you really don't need it to survive, so it wouldn't hurt anything. Also, as far as I'm concerned, comparing spaying/nuetering to declawing is like comparing a vasectomy/hysterectomy to a boob job...There is no comparison. I have a question for those of you who condone this & have had it done to your animals: What if your beloved pet gets out of the house one of these days & gets mauled by dog & the only reason it did is because it's declawed? How are you going to feel then? I'm sorry, but I would much rather pay for new screen or have torn up furniture than hurt my animals like that, and perhaps, get them killed in the long run. My personal opinion is that if you don't like animals scratching on furniture, etc......DON'T HAVE ANIMALS! (Inside @ least)

I understand lots of animals "calm down" after they get older and either don't start scratching at all or quit (if they did), but I have a 2 yr. old nuetered tom (Chauncey) and he is still just as playful as the day we I got him, so if you're waiting for you cat to "out grow" something, don't hold your breath...(Of course, Chauncey's a little spoiled too!

I'm extremely glad the original poster decided not to have this done to her cat, I think you'll thank yourself in the long run!
  #69  
Old August 4th, 2004, 12:38 PM
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Originally Posted by hddlstn02
My personal opinion is that if you don't like animals scratching on furniture, etc......DON'T HAVE ANIMALS! (Inside @ least)
I think you mean well; but please do not encourage people to leave their pets outside. There are very many harmful and deadly things outside. They should NEVER be left permanently outdoors.
  #70  
Old August 4th, 2004, 01:44 PM
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Michel....... Let's say for arguements sake you DID witness the surgery. (I still think you're lying ) Let's also assume your cat recovered well (which doesnt make the procedure any more humane!) This doesn't make it acceptable! Did you witness also your cats immediate recovery? I am referring to the next several hours of just waking up from anesthetic. I doubt it. Of course you wouldn't hang around there all afternoon watching and waiting. I have witnessed 1st hand horror stories ok? I had to try to restrain and calm a cat down that was shaking her front feet and crying out so violently that her bandages flew off, she repeatedly banged her little feet against the kennel walls, blood spurting everywhere. I ended up having to stab her with more Torb (pain med) as the vet on duty held her down wearing rabie protective gloves as this kitty was so out of control she bit the kennel door bars and ended up doing damage to her jaw!This is just 1 story! I have many. Just b/c you (not nec. your cat) had an ok experience does not make it ok! Some women recover after a rape or abuse.....some do not. IT DOESN'T MAKE IT OK TO RAPE. Some recover from drug use just fine......is it ok to abuse drugs? You'd recover ok if I broke your arm.......but do you really want me to break it? Better yet, how about we amputate your toes joints (crunch) as we do a cats during a declaw....after all, you said yourself, it's no big deal. Think about it
  #71  
Old August 4th, 2004, 03:39 PM
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Not worth the time it takes to type

These people that condone declawing obviously have no idea what it really entails.

Some years ago I knew a person who had her cat declawed. The cat escaped out the front door one day (it was an indoor cat - declawed to save the furnature)...
I've seen the cat trying to defend itself without front claws....not a pretty sight.
I've seen the cat trying to climb a tree to escape a free roaming dog....couldn't climb worth a bean. It was lucky the dog couldn't run as fast as it could scared.
I've seen the cat try to jump from one ledge to another. It couldn't make the jump because it still thought it had claws.
You see, a cat will use the front claws to help it maintain a grip on whatever it's jumping on, in conjunction with the back claws. That's why a lot of times you'll hear the scraping sounds the cat is making as it completes the jumps. If it doesn't have the front claws, there's no grip. It can lose its balance and fall. When caught off guard like that, a cat will not always land on its feet.

Asking these people to compare the love you have for the animal, when you get it spay/neutered to reduce the "call of the wild", unwanted kittens, fighting, spraying, the health risks, with the selfishness of having the front feet operated on to dock the toes before the first knuckle, is something that can't be done.

All those who truly love animals, and who want what's best for them, not their furnature, or the little scar they may get from a claw scratch, know how cruel it is to have the poor creature declawed. To try and explain this to the (seamingly) uncaring, uninformed people, is a waste of breath. We all know that the animals are really suffering from long term effects of this surgury (I named some earlier in the post) but they're oblivious.
  #72  
Old August 4th, 2004, 03:52 PM
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There is absolutely no debating this issue,declawing is a cruel mutilation,that should never be performed on any innocent,unsuspecting little cat.
We here in Canada,with very outdated 100yr old animal-cruelty laws($$$$ speaks!),should follow many European countries,where declawing,debarking etc....is outlawed.
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  #73  
Old August 4th, 2004, 04:36 PM
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Red face Sorry....

Quote:
Originally Posted by sammiec
I think you mean well; but please do not encourage people to leave their pets outside. There are very many harmful and deadly things outside. They should NEVER be left permanently outdoors.
I'm sorry, but I don't agree, animals are made to be outside & as long as they have owners that take care of them & don't leave harmful things in their area they'll be fine. I understand bringing animals in in the dead of winter or in the hottest temp.'s in the summer, but I don't think it hurts to have them outside the rest of the time. I do live in a rural area in Missouri, so maybe if I lived in the city I would feel differently, but where I live, animals are just fine outside. And, like I said, they are made for the outdoors, their bodies show this. I really don't want to start an argument over this topic, I was merely explaining my view on declawing. (Which I still think is very WRONG!)
  #74  
Old August 4th, 2004, 04:41 PM
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Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cactus Flower
Speaking of ridiculous....

Just wondering if you have had your dog declawed as well?
And while you're at it, you of course will want to have all of your pets' teeth removed. They can be just as dangerous as claws (or moreso). Because, like you said, fights and "accidents" will happen. Teeth have been known to cause a LOT of "serious injury".

Perhaps you'd be interested in having a pet turtle? Oops, no, they have claws.
A fish? Ah, but those scales can be abrasive, and they are very hard to de-scale.
A pet rock? Nope, those can fall off a shelf and hit someone's head....

He, he, he! This had me cracking up. I totally agree w/ you! I love your wit! Keep it up.
  #75  
Old August 4th, 2004, 06:22 PM
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Thank you
  #76  
Old August 17th, 2004, 01:07 PM
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Here's a small example of why you shouldn't declaw. This is fairly minor comapred to some complicaions, but a complication none the less. You'll find it in the thread "declawed cat"
  #77  
Old August 17th, 2004, 05:17 PM
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Thank you Shae....I'm headed that way...
  #78  
Old August 19th, 2004, 07:07 PM
boris boris is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Luba
Good question to ask before doing it!

DON'T!! It's cruel and very painful to the cats. Others with cat knowledge more extensive then my little bit of info can give you the graphic details of what they have to endure and go through.

It's not necessary, so pls dont' do it!

Oh, please...Sure, it's not comfortable after any surgery. But if it's getting done at the same time as a neuter or spay, then the "hurt" is just relative. The anatomy lesson of what goes on during a declaw is just inflammatory rhetoric. Jeez, getting one's below the belt "equipment" chopped off is not exactly a party for the animal, either. In fact, I think if a cat could talk, he'd tell you to remove his claws before you even consider touching his goodies.

All three of my prior cats were front declawed at the same time they were spayed/neutered, and they all lived happy lives of over 20 years each. The major concern is if the cat ever gets outside and loose for a few hours or even days, which inevitably happens to everybody's cat. The declawed cat is then at a major disadvantage if it gets itself into a battle with another cat. I now have two Russian Blues, and that is the sole reason I'm not having them declawed. Yes, I'd like to have them declawed, but I know from prior experience they will eventually sneak outside. It's only a matter of time. I want them to be able to battle with another cat if they have to. But then again, I don't have young children who could get badly clawed by an angry pet. If I did, my decision just might be different.
  #79  
Old August 19th, 2004, 10:23 PM
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Boris,com on the hurt is "relative",to whom? You?
I would never dream of causing any of my cats,that kind of pain to save my furniture.....anyone even contemplating mutilating their cat to suit their own needs,should look into getting an aquarium instead.
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  #80  
Old August 20th, 2004, 09:18 AM
boris boris is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shae
Here is a sample list of countries where it is deemed illegal or inhumane to declaw.
Brazil
Australia
New Zealand
Yugoslavia
Japan
Austria
Switzerland
Norway
Sweden
Netherlands
Northern Ireland
Ireland
Denmark
Finland
Slovenia
Portugal
Belgium
England
Scotland
Wales
Italy
France
Germany
I ended up refusing to assist in declaw and taildocking. I took my job very seriously, it takes a lot for me to refuse to fulfill a duty / task at hand.
I can name just as many countries where it's deemed O.K. to eat a declawed kitten for this evening's dinner. What's your point?
  #81  
Old August 20th, 2004, 09:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boris
I can name just as many countries where it's deemed O.K. to eat a declawed kitten for this evening's dinner. What's your point?
OK, so name them...
  #82  
Old August 20th, 2004, 09:36 AM
boris boris is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chico2
Boris,com on the hurt is "relative",to whom? You?
I would never dream of causing any of my cats,that kind of pain to save my furniture.....anyone even contemplating mutilating their cat to suit their own needs,should look into getting an aquarium instead.

The whole concept of "pet" is strictly to suit the needs of people. Your entire argument is even more floppy than the fish in your aquarium...By the way, how did you reach your conclusion that your fish are thrilled about having to spend their entire lives inside a glass container not large enough to hold a carton of eggs?
  #83  
Old August 20th, 2004, 09:45 AM
boris boris is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Writing4Fun
OK, so name them...
I don't have to name them. Anybody with any semblance of common sense knows it's true...You can start by taking a closer look at last night's take-out order.
  #84  
Old August 20th, 2004, 09:48 AM
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Boris, you said you can name them, so why won't you?
  #85  
Old August 20th, 2004, 09:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boris
I don't have to name them. Anybody with any semblance of common sense knows it's true...You can start by taking a closer look at last night's take-out order.
Boris, your comments are offensive, insulting and confrontational, and have been so through each and every one of your posts.

I don't know about you, but my aquarium is much larger than a carton of eggs - or several cartons, for that matter.

Does anyone else suspect a troll here??
  #86  
Old August 20th, 2004, 09:56 AM
boris boris is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sneaky2006
Boris, you said you can name them, so why won't you?
Because my hands are holding chopsticks of what I thought was chicken fried rice, but on closer inspection, is actually kitty chow mein. How do you expect me to type without getting it all over my keyboard? It was tough enough just typing this paragraph without getting the whiskers stuck in-between the keys. This is an expensive Dell...Do you intend to replace it for me if it gets damaged?
  #87  
Old August 20th, 2004, 10:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boris
Because my hands are holding chopsticks of what I thought was chicken fried rice, but on closer inspection, is actually kitty chow mein. How do you expect me to type without getting it all over my keyboard? It was tough enough just typing this paragraph without getting the whiskers stuck in-between the keys. This is an expensive Dell...Do you intend to replace it for me if it gets damaged?
So then why are you eating it? And can you try to type a reply without including an insult or racist remark?
  #88  
Old August 20th, 2004, 10:06 AM
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First of all you are disgusting, I didn't want to start an arguement with you, I just asked a simple question that I knew you wouldn't/couldn't truthfully answer and you just proved that.
Did you actually think that would be funny to anyone?
You need help, it's ok.. don't be scared, admitting it is the hardest!
  #89  
Old August 20th, 2004, 10:09 AM
boris boris is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Writing4Fun
Boris, your comments are offensive, insulting and confrontational, and have been so through each and every one of your posts.

I don't know about you, but my aquarium is much larger than a carton of eggs - or several cartons, for that matter.

Does anyone else suspect a troll here??

Why is it when somebody makes an excellent point that totally contradicts your point of view, it's automatically a "troll?" You still haven't answered the question...How is it "humane" to keep a fish inside a shoebox-sized glass container for every minute of its worthless life? Precisely what makes the life of Charlie the Tuna any less important than the life of Morris the Cat, and just who are you to make that determination?
  #90  
Old August 20th, 2004, 10:42 AM
boris boris is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Writing4Fun
So then why are you eating it? And can you try to type a reply without including an insult or racist remark?
Racist???????????
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