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Old August 28th, 2007, 03:12 PM
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Isolde Isolde is offline
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Unhappy Wow, how confused I am right now …

Ok, so I don’t trust commercial foods at ALL (kibble, canned) . To me most of these companies are just money grabbing conglomerates that don’t really care about the animals. There full of chemicals, by-products, digest and other stuff that I really don’t want in my pet’s system. With these out of the question what is left ??? …

I am inclined to believe in the RAW, BARF diets or some sort of homemade diet however this particular site is in the back of my mind:

http://www.secondchanceranch.com/tra...eat/index.html

I am wondering if any of this stuff is true. I can tell that a lot of the “information” is blown out of proportions and misleading but is it true that a lot of dogs on RAW type diets have an enlarged pancreas and in general pancreas problems?

Also I have never really seen a dog that died from eating a raw bone, is it even remotely possible for a dog to die because of this? I know that cooked bone has a different molecular structure so it splinters but I thought that raw bone is safe . ..

I also know that dogs and cats are quite capable of dealing with the bacteria in raw meat, they have some nice acids in the stomach that take care of that plus their digestive systems are short so again an adaptation that helps.

I agree that dogs are lactose intolerant and diary products should not be fed. Eeew, I hate milk too

Ok so how about some sort of homemade cooked diet and no bone or raw meat. How can I make sure that my dog gets enough calcium and all the other vitamins and nutrients that it needs?

Where can I find some good information regarding the cooked diets? I found a lot about raw and barf but not much about cooking the food. Either way I really don’t want kibble …

thanks!
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Old August 28th, 2007, 03:34 PM
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want4rain want4rain is offline
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personally, id get some books, read up on where you want to go and then give it a shot. i started out on a homemade diet and eventually went to a raw one supplemented with a few non meat meals. its been very very trial and error and LOTS AND LOTS of poop patrol.

the internet has loads of information but i havent found a complete single source for information on things like WHY you dont waant to go over board on raw eggs but sooft boiled are great, eggs are the basis for all other proteins to be graded on, GREEN tripe can not be sold with human grade food and human grade tripe is all but useless... the kind of ratio of phospherous to calcium you want... clam(or was it oysters??) contains loads of taurine... i just started out googling things like 'homemade pet food' and BARF/raw stuff. if you browse the Raw/BARF forum here you will find several great external pages within the first page of threads.

my opinion on homemade versus raw??(glad ya asked!!! ) i think both are great but i will say that i noticed the biggest change after making the leap to raw. ill swear by it any day!! while our pooch didnt have much of a energy/coat/teeth change after starting him on raw(he is still a puppy and we started him young) but our cats (at 3yo each) have made a remarkable change. id say that whatever you decide, meat should be raw. it really made THAT much of a difference!

i hope you enjoy this journey as much as your furbabies will!! cause i promise you, they will throughly enjoy their new diet!! seeing Mister lovingly 'groom' a whole chicken into his tummy is just too funny and to see our little house cats rip apart a hunk of meat, chew up bones and all is quite rewarding. i cant even go into the kitchen without getting bombarded anymore.

-ashley
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Old August 28th, 2007, 03:37 PM
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luckypenny luckypenny is offline
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There are some really excellent brands of holistic type kibble available. Take a look at some of the threads in the Dog and Cat Food Forum for some great suggestions.

You'll find some home cooking books, among others, here. http://www.dogwise.com/Browse/SubCat...nd%20Nutrition Check out your local library to see if any of the books that interest you are available there.

If you're worried about feeding bones, you can always add bone meal and egg shells to a dog's raw diet instead, however, bone meal is more costly. Whatever you choose to do, I'd recommend you research carefully before you begin. Good luck.
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Old August 28th, 2007, 03:53 PM
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Isolde Isolde is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by luckypenny View Post
There are some really excellent brands of holistic type kibble available. Take a look at some of the threads in the Dog and Cat Food Forum for some great suggestions.

You'll find some home cooking books, among others, here. http://www.dogwise.com/Browse/SubCat...nd%20Nutrition Check out your local library to see if any of the books that interest you are available there.

If you're worried about feeding bones, you can always add bone meal and egg shells to a dog's raw diet instead, however, bone meal is more costly. Whatever you choose to do, I'd recommend you research carefully before you begin. Good luck.

Hi! and thanks.
So far I have ULTIMATE DIET: NATURAL NUTRITION FOR DOGS AND CATS by by Kymythy Schultze and DR. PITCAIRN'S COMPLETE GUIDE TO NATURAL HEALTH FOR DOGS & CATS by Richard & Susan Pitcairn. I have been also reading the posts on this forum and there is so much information that contradicts itself that right now my brain is mash potatoes!

I have a little dog and I'm afraid to kill it :sad:
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Old August 28th, 2007, 04:06 PM
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erykah1310 erykah1310 is offline
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Heres a good link for you if your considering raw feeding but are worried with what Second Chance Ranch has to say.
Its a very good rebuttle.
http://rawfed.com/myths/rebuttal5.html

You will also find the AVMA has some negative things to be said about raw here...
http://www.avma.org/onlnews/javma/jan05/050115ww.asp
And another good rebuttle here.
http://www.rawlearning.com/responsetoAVMA1.html
Regardless what you feed ( even high quality holistic kibble) there will ALWAYS be someone saying its not good for your dog.

Honestly you wont kill your dog feeding it different things, not even raw. If a dog can survive on Ol'Roy and foods like that , it shows how "tough" they can be.
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Old August 28th, 2007, 04:11 PM
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erykah1310 erykah1310 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Isolde View Post
I have never really seen a dog that died from eating a raw bone, is it even remotely possible for a dog to die because of this? I know that cooked bone has a different molecular structure so it splinters but I thought that raw bone is safe . ..
Yeah its possible, but only if they bite of a big piece and it causes an impaction or perforates their intestines.... I have a worry with this as well, so my dogs get chicken bones ( raw) for their bone ration.


Quote:
Ok so how about some sort of homemade cooked diet and no bone or raw meat. How can I make sure that my dog gets enough calcium and all the other vitamins and nutrients that it needs?

Where can I find some good information regarding the cooked diets? I found a lot about raw and barf but not much about cooking the food. Either way I really don’t want kibble …

thanks!
I compiled a list of links a while back... I will try to find them for you.
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Old August 28th, 2007, 04:18 PM
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erykah1310 erykah1310 is offline
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Found it.
http://www.pets.ca/forum/showthread....ight=raw+links

Now I will be honest with you... when I first considered raw I was terrified to do it. I watched my dogs like a hawk to make sure they werent gulping their food, I fed them each individually to make sure i could watch all of them through the whole meal and I stressed out about not giving them enough "extra" to maintain optimal health.
Once I started, I got more comfortable with the diet and my dogs eating it. THen when the results showed I was amazed.
Raw feeding does require a LOT of research and self educating, but is so rewarding in the end.
There are many different "methods" of raw, BARF, premade, prey model... each has their critics and each has their belivers stating their way is the best way.
In reality, as long as its raw, and follows the basic scheme of 60% meat, 10 % bone, 10% offal ( something like that, cant think of it right now) and then depending on if YOU want to add veggies or not.... your dog will let you know if its working right for them or not.
A little "tweak" of the recipe is all thats needed to fix most issues.

If you do decide to go with raw. ASK all the questions you can think of, no matter how insignifigant they seem at the time.
You can never get enough opinions.
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Old August 30th, 2007, 08:39 AM
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Isolde Isolde is offline
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I’ve been reading all day long yesterday on these sites and I have to say that I still incline towards raw food . I will read all I can on dog nutrition and hopefully my babies are going to be ok. And of course I will be back with loots of questions soon
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