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  #181  
Old July 27th, 2007, 03:58 PM
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want4rain want4rain is offline
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Originally Posted by dtbmnec View Post
I think the point being that it should be left up to the experts. To people who DO know the business and don't let Fluffy mate every other day for the next six years.

It'd be like just about anything else. If I need to go in for open heart surgery I'd like to know that the guy opening me up has a degree and has done it before with SUCCESS. *has visions of some creepy crazy almost doctor like figure standing over her with a scalpel and tossing things out of her body saying things like "oh well we don't NEED that!" and "well this can go too!"* Gah.

You see what I'm saying?

Would you rather have Dr. Frankenstein or even a five year old kid with a scalpel or an actual open heart surgeon do the surgery?

Megan
not really. if everyone lined up for the single best or even the 5 best heart surgeons in the world then there would be a fair group of people who would never see the cure.

i dont know, i guess im taking this personally because we are not the elite yet my family breeds our family dogs and every time i see someone calling all non elite breeders a BYB (insert image of scoundrel with a greasy beard, beady eyes and hundreds of puppies in 2'X2' cages) i feel guilty of somethign i use to feel proud of. it feels liek there is a very very black and white view on breeding dogs. these people who make up breeds for profit, crank out puppies until the mother is falling apart.... they are evil without question but i dont feel my family is.

-ashley
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  #182  
Old July 27th, 2007, 04:00 PM
m_feng m_feng is offline
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Please define designer breed

Please define designer breed. Frankly, I have not done any research on designer breed. I just got a Leonberger this year, I guess it is consider as a designer breed. I got her from a reputable breeder. In fact, I do not consider anything from the puppy mills or pet stores as designer breed. These pets are just designer breed look alike. I think you need to do some research on designer breed too. I compare designer breed to designer clothes just because they are what I love to have. Perhaps, there is a little bit of trying to make a statement. What's wrong with it. I don't feel guilty about doing this. I guess every once in a while, people would love to make some personal statement. Just like you mention about you work with the disable people and seems to know a lot in breeding. In fact, breeding of designer dogs or cats is a completely different issue. What you had mention in your paragaph is a bit off topic. Sorry if I offend anyone for saying this. I just like to express myself.




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Originally Posted by LavenderRott View Post
I think you need to do a little bit more research into your designer breeds. No animals were killed or tortured so that I could wear some fancy shirt.

While the occasional labradoodle comes from someone's backyard (which I DO NOT defend in any way, shape, or form) a vast majority of them come from your ever popular puppy mill. Now - when you can honestly sit there and defend breeding sick, crippled dogs who never see the light of day (and if they do, it is because they are caged outside with little to no protection from the elements) or walk on grass - then we can have a serious conversation about your point of view. But I doubt I will ever think that it is ok to breed dogs so that you (or Britney or Paris) can make a fashion statement.
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  #183  
Old July 27th, 2007, 04:26 PM
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Originally Posted by want4rain View Post
not really. if everyone lined up for the single best or even the 5 best heart surgeons in the world then there would be a fair group of people who would never see the cure.

i dont know, i guess im taking this personally because we are not the elite yet my family breeds our family dogs and every time i see someone calling all non elite breeders a BYB (insert image of scoundrel with a greasy beard, beady eyes and hundreds of puppies in 2'X2' cages) i feel guilty of somethign i use to feel proud of. it feels liek there is a very very black and white view on breeding dogs. these people who make up breeds for profit, crank out puppies until the mother is falling apart.... they are evil without question but i dont feel my family is.

-ashley
You're right not everyone would get the best care and that's fine. But are you going to let a five year old do the surgery? Probably not. Are you going to let someone who's watched/helped out/done bits of previous surgeries? Probably. I mean we all have to start somewhere right?

But you don't know the history of the dogs. I understand that you aren't cranking out Fluffy's every two days and all but at the same time you don't know what kind of genes are being passed on to the puppies. I mean perhaps the line of dogs that you are currently breeding happen to have some recessive gene that, oh I dunno, makes their teeth turn purple (yeah so I'm making it up, sue me ). So you breed and breed and breed and all of a sudden you end up with Fluffy the 457th who has purple teeth! Now imagine that purple teeth is instead a horrible genetic disease of some sort. Not only does Fluffy the 457th have it, but all the dogs BEFORE Fluffy also have the chance of passing it on.

It would be my understanding that if you (not trying to single your family out at this point) really did want to breed dogs for a living you would learn from one of the "elite." I can't see them being overtly protective about "well known" tricks of the trade and they aren't going to live forever. That you would care, not only about the dog's/puppies' welfare, but the genetics and potential for passing something on to other dogs. Maybe even something that is now "close to extinction" due to careful breeding (no more dogs with purple teeth).

Unfortunately, many people only see the one type of breeder. The back yard breeders who do have Fluffy's every two days. The type who keep their animals in small cages and just don't give a rat's *** about the dogs. Many people on this board are from rescues or work closely with them. They tend to be the ones who see the bulk of BYB and the "refuse" that come from them.

For me, dogs go woof (oh all right they got tongues too bah!). I don't do breeding. Its not really my thing and I haven't read through the entire thread either (btw what the heck is a Morkie? Mork and Mindy's child? yeesh). I'm just trying to use common sense along with what I do know/have heard.

Megan

P.S. m_feng: psst...designer breed...lab with a perm...that's all I have to say! (ok if you're looking a serious answer you won't find it with me...sorry )
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  #184  
Old July 27th, 2007, 05:18 PM
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i think with my family its a case of 'take the good with the bad'. we dont sell her pups, we keep them in our family, we have a home for all of them and if we dont, gramps keeps them. they are all stupidly pampered... you can tell that gramps and my aunts and uncles dont have kids in the house anymore. *chuckles* so far there has been considerable interest in my generation on who will get Jillian #6 (or which ever # he is on now) and perhaps generic testing will come into play then. i DID bring it up with gramps a few months ago, he said to me "dogs got along just fine before genetic testing, they will get along just fine without it now." *sigh* he also doesnt believe that a fish tank needs fresh water once every 2 to 3 weeks.

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(btw what the heck is a Morkie? Mork and Mindy's child? yeesh)
i almost snorted coke all over my laptop. it hurt!

-ashley
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  #185  
Old July 27th, 2007, 05:36 PM
Jim Hall Jim Hall is offline
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Sorry a little off topic why would you want to breed a standard poodle with any thing? If you have allergies, the poodle is fine and if you want a high energy retrieving type dog, poodles are fine and they can be trianed to be just about anything. they have been used as sheep dogs guard dogs
retrieviers i have even been told they have been used as pointers
and the pic of the labrapoodle is in my opoinion butt ugly

My friend had a standard and i swear it was the smartest dog i have ever known I have known people who were dumber. than franco
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  #186  
Old July 27th, 2007, 06:16 PM
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Originally Posted by m_feng View Post
Please define designer breed.
2 breeds mix together = MUTT !!! Because that's what people who breed 2 dogs from different breeds gets. They only call it designer breed so people like you spend $$$$$ for a mutt So you're telling me there's not mutts in shelters ? I think you need a reality check.

Last edited by Frenchy; July 27th, 2007 at 06:23 PM.
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  #187  
Old July 27th, 2007, 06:19 PM
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LavenderRott LavenderRott is offline
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Originally Posted by m_feng View Post
Please define designer breed. Frankly, I have not done any research on designer breed. I just got a Leonberger this year, I guess it is consider as a designer breed. I got her from a reputable breeder. In fact, I do not consider anything from the puppy mills or pet stores as designer breed. These pets are just designer breed look alike. I think you need to do some research on designer breed too. I compare designer breed to designer clothes just because they are what I love to have. Perhaps, there is a little bit of trying to make a statement. What's wrong with it. I don't feel guilty about doing this. I guess every once in a while, people would love to make some personal statement. Just like you mention about you work with the disable people and seems to know a lot in breeding. In fact, breeding of designer dogs or cats is a completely different issue. What you had mention in your paragaph is a bit off topic. Sorry if I offend anyone for saying this. I just like to express myself.

I think you need to do a bit more research about YOUR breed!!

Leonbergers are so very far from a designer breed. The breed originated well over 100 years ago in Germany to guard and herd flocks of sheep. You can find out more information about them here: http://www.leonbergerclubofamerica.com/

There is no such thing as a designer breed look alike. All of your little - oodle mixes are designer breeds and, unlike the Leonberger, they are bred strictly to make big money.
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  #188  
Old July 27th, 2007, 06:53 PM
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here is what Wiki says abotu it-

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Designer_dog

(anyone see the Cockachon?! it was tea coming out my nose this time!)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog_breed

and last but not least-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puppy_mill

-ashley
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  #189  
Old July 27th, 2007, 06:57 PM
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Originally Posted by LavenderRott View Post
I think you need to do a bit more research about YOUR breed!!

Leonbergers are so very far from a designer breed. The breed originated well over 100 years ago in Germany to guard and herd flocks of sheep. You can find out more information about them here: http://www.leonbergerclubofamerica.com/

There is no such thing as a designer breed look alike. All of your little - oodle mixes are designer breeds and, unlike the Leonberger, they are bred strictly to make big money.
they are considered a "rare breed"

http://rarebreed.com/breedlist.html

which are a group of dog breeds that are not considered purebred for whatever reason.

another Wiki-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/America...ed_Association


-ashley
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  #190  
Old July 27th, 2007, 07:00 PM
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poo, i couldnt make all of this one post??

it appears that goldendoodles?? or was it labrdoodles? were bred to be seeing eye dogs for blind people with allergies. noble aspiration in my opinion. for whatever reason there are now hundreds of -oodles and -poos that serve no aparent purpose other than for people to make money.

-ashley
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  #191  
Old July 27th, 2007, 07:06 PM
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Originally Posted by want4rain View Post
they are considered a "rare breed"

http://rarebreed.com/breedlist.html

which are a group of dog breeds that are not considered purebred for whatever reason.

another Wiki-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/America...ed_Association


-ashley
No - Rare breeds are not a group of dogs that are not considered purebred.

Rare breeds are just that. Rare. With a very limited gene pool.

Leonbergers are eligible to be registered as a rare breed with AKC and can be shown in the Rare Breed group. Usually, this means that the breed IS an established breed but that it doesn't have the stud book to be included in "regular" groups. With time, I am sure that the Leonberger will find it's way into the Working Group with AKC.
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  #192  
Old July 27th, 2007, 07:18 PM
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i see i see!! i wasnt entirely sure but my impression was that rare breeds and aspiring purebreds were kind of lumped together.

i think i did pretty good for cramming between making pizza and calming a pooch afraid of the thunder and a fussy teething baby and a questioning 8yo. im still learning!

-ashley
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  #193  
Old July 27th, 2007, 07:24 PM
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ok but they are still ugly i mean a labs and poodles are wonderfully magnifcent breeds. a poodle is a retriever correct? what group does a Std bred poodle go into in show comp?
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  #194  
Old July 27th, 2007, 07:28 PM
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Originally Posted by want4rain View Post
i see i see!! i wasnt entirely sure but my impression was that rare breeds and aspiring purebreds were kind of lumped together.

i think i did pretty good for cramming between making pizza and calming a pooch afraid of the thunder and a fussy teething baby and a questioning 8yo. im still learning!

-ashley
So long as you are willing to learn - you are doing a GREAT job!!
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  #195  
Old July 27th, 2007, 07:30 PM
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ok but they are still ugly i mean a labs and poodles are wonderfully magnifcent breeds. a poodle is a retriever correct? what group does a Std bred poodle go into in show comp?
Standard Poodles and Miniature poodles are shown in the Non-Sporting group. I believe that the toy poodles are shown in the .......Toy Group.

BTW - the reason for the ridiculous haircuts that they sport in the showring - cuts used to protect the joints and internal organs when retrieving in cold water.
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  #196  
Old July 27th, 2007, 10:29 PM
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Originally Posted by want4rain View Post
i almost snorted coke all over my laptop. it hurt!

-ashley
I'm sorry...it was just the first thing that popped into my head....

Now that I've looked it up its ok. I knew that I had heard it before but couldn't remember what the M in morkie stood for...

Though the goldendoodle/labradoodle for the blind is rather interesting. Neat idea .

Megan
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  #197  
Old July 27th, 2007, 10:37 PM
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Originally Posted by dtbmnec View Post
Though the goldendoodle/labradoodle for the blind is rather interesting. Neat idea .

Megan
The problem is that they don't breed true. Even within a litter, you can't guarantee that all of the pups will have what you are looking for as far as coat and temperment and it gets even worse when you breed labradoodle to labradoodle.
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  #198  
Old July 27th, 2007, 10:38 PM
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The problem is that they don't breed true. Even within a litter, you can't guarantee that all of the pups will have what you are looking for as far as coat and temperment and it gets even worse when you breed labradoodle to labradoodle.
Ah common...where's people's sense of adventure? Bah! (joking!!!!)

That does rather suck its too bad....

Megan
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  #199  
Old July 28th, 2007, 08:49 AM
m_feng m_feng is offline
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Thanks. I learn a lot.

Hi all,

I learn a lot from this site. In fact, I don't really care about designer breed that much. We love the 3-in-1 componet of our Leo. and had done some research on this breed. Anyway, I just don't like people to have pets on impulse. You have to make a commitment with your pets. Don't support the so called "designer breed" from pet stores & puppy mills. I have an agony to adopt a 4 yrs. old dog without knowing it had a severe kidney problem. It was put down for good. This dog was originally from pet store. This is my first time to put down my own pet and I only got this dog for 6 months. All my pets died at home because of old age and were still smiling in their last breath!




QUOTE=LavenderRott;456824]So long as you are willing to learn - you are doing a GREAT job!![/QUOTE]
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  #200  
Old July 31st, 2007, 01:51 AM
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And as for

I do think that anyone who inadvertently breeds is a bad breeder! How can they not be? I am not saying they are bad people - they may be well meaning, just lack knowledge and the entire scope of the problem. Some even mean well. But that hardly gives them the right to add to the growing crisis iof pet overpopulation. I would think the good ones would want t know how they can help instead of breeding! Or if they are serious about breeding, they will learn about how to do it in the proper manner and while I am not wild about more animals being bred when so many die needless and cruel deaths every minute of every day, at least if they obtain a mentor, have a certified pet from a Champion and understand what the standard is, they won't be creating problems.

That's all for me!
LOL! Please read it again! I didn't say people who "inadvertently breed" although I did use all of the above words!

I hate the term "backyard breeder" because everyone gets upset and worries that they are being offended. I know now that to us on here, a backyard breeder is one who breeds indiscriminatly (without regard to standards, health, etc. of dog), however, there are many small breeders out there who literally breed dogs in their backyards and who we are technically lumping into this category. I feel that that's totally unfair and that we may be turning some new people off such breeders.

In my opinion, only the top animals of every breed and type should reproduce. I am *this* close to being all for a nationwide licensing system for dog/cat/horse/etc. breeders because of the poor animals that I've seen and heard of. It makes me sick just thinking of them.
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  #201  
Old March 21st, 2009, 07:58 PM
bosluv001 bosluv001 is offline
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was this my thread you were talking about a long time ago?
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