Some Ethel Advice Please

[chico2]

Phoozles the one lady I use,is in New York state,I usually pay $5.95 for shipping,it's delivered as regular mail and sometimes in less than a week.
I don't know if I am allowed to show it here,but here is her site.
www.WhiskersWagsAndMore.com

[phoozles]

Originally Posted by 14+kitties

Hang in there. Hopefully the diffusers will work for you. I still have tons of hope for her to fit in.
I can't stop thinking if she was in a large dog crate in the same room with the other cats that things would move along faster. I know I keep harping about something that may not work for you but I found for me crates worked great!
Minimo has done sooo well in the catuary with that method. There is still hissing, some growling, a little swatting, but she isn't full out attacking. I noticed yesterday she is even letting certain ones get close to her and she ISN'T hissing! I'm not saying it's ideal but it sure is a lot better than it was!

If you decide to give it a try you can probably pick up a used crate for next to nothing off kijiji or a free newspaper or something.

Hmm.. we tried a regular crate.. All it did was make Ethel really tense. Alley and Jake refused to come up to her, but on the odd time that they did, there was a lot of noise. Ethel kept flipping around in the crate - she didn't like it.. Maybe a bigger one would make a difference...

We'll give the diffusers a chance first.. and then I'll try the bigger crate - I kind of see her room as a giant crate as it is, though.. but I'm definitely open to ideas!

[Love4himies]

Originally Posted by 14+kitties

I can't stop thinking if she was in a large dog crate in the same room with the other cats that things would move along faster. I know I keep harping about something that may not work for you but I found for me crates worked great!

OMG, I was think of putting Sweet Pea in the large kitty condo cage I got from SOS Miow so Sweet Pea can watch Puddles walk around, but can't attack. Right now they are always seperated.


for the hijack, phoozles.

[phoozles]

No problem L4H!

I think you should definitely try it - they never get to see each other, so I think it would be a great next step!

[14+kitties]

I don't know if it would work or not. Just saying it's worked so far for me with Minimo. She still does the swatting and hissing but not nearly as much and she is out with the others probably 85% of the time. She doesn't go after them. It's just if she feels too threatened by having the rest of them around her, normally when I come in to feed them or visit, she will hiss and sometimes swat. But that's normal.

Phoozles - it was a normal cat carrier you had Ethel in, wasn't it? Or am I thinking something else? I am talking the big wire crates for dogs. There is tons of room for her to lay in, eat, even have her litter box in if you want to keep her in it overnight. I will take a pic of how I have the one set up in the house for mine if you want. I know I couldn't be without mine.

[14+kitties]

This is what I am talking about Phoozles. The blanket over top is there so they can have some quiet time. You wouldn't need it for getting the cats used to each other. The litter box is inside the cupboard to make it a little nicer to look at. The top shelf of the cupboard gives the kitties another place to lie but you don't need that either. I use mine a lot for recouping kitties and sleeping so it's always set up and ready to go.

[ancientgirl]

That's a nice setup. Maybe something like that would help Ethel not be so protective of her space and help her be more comfortable around the others.

[phoozles]

That is a nice set up - the picture helps.
The good(?) news is that Ethel doesn't seem to be just protective of her room. I had Jake and Alley locked up in rooms upstairs, and when I let Ethel out, eventually she went up and started harassing them under the door . This shows me that it's not just her room that makes her hostile - it's the cats themselves. I'm seriously that the diffuser will work! (cuz I'm spending more money than I should be, once again)
I might look into the crate as a final step before full integration - right now I don't think it would do me much good - just because they are all on edge (yesterday was cat hell at my house - all three of them had bit me by the day's end - Jake's getting more and more upset about the strays that show up at our door.. *sigh*). But once the diffusers start to kick in, I think I will try it - it couldn't hurt, right?

[ancientgirl]

Did you say before you have the feliway spray? Maybe use that on their bedding and in spots close to where they are, like furniture corners and such. At least maybe until the diffusers get there.

I need to buy more refills myself. Hoping to ease tensions over here a bit too. I just haven't had the extra cash.

[phoozles]

I still have some of the spray left, but I've been using it sparingly because it doesn't really have much in it (guess it's not meant to spray large areas every day).. I will spray a bit tonight and tomorrow, and hopefully the diffusers will be in on Wednesday. I know it can take up to a month for them to take effect..

[ancientgirl]

Yeah, I think since it's concentrated, it's just meant to be sprayed in areas that are small. Maybe that's why it hasn't worked for you. Try just using it on their beds and stuff.

[chico2]

Phoozles,I had a serious spraying problem with Rocky,he's destroyed(with his pee)quiet a few things in my house,the Feli-Way stopped that 99%
He still,if he sees a strange cat outside,will piddle a little though.
I also had problems with his "reversed"aggression and the scars to prove it,the Feli-Way definetly has helped with that.
Your problem with Ethel,is a little different,she is in defense-mode against any other cat,it might be very difficult with her,but I hope you get it all resolved

[phoozles]

Thanks Chico, I hope so too! I'll definitely keep you posted!

[krdahmer]

Oh and just an fyi, PetValu (and I think Petsmart has one too) carries another brand (can't remember the name) that is the same idea as feliway and also fits the feliway diffuser. I didn't really have much money to order the refills and found this one for just under $17... helpful when you don't have money for shipping/ multiple packages etc. Supposed to be similar ingredients and effect. My refills are on their way now from ebay, but that one worked for my brother's cats. I hope that made sense... I'm drinking too much coffee today and feeling a bit out of it.

[chico2]

Dahmer,I tried the Pet-Value one,with no effect on Rocky,but it also does not claim to stop a cat from spraying.
However it just might work on Ethels behavior,calm her down.

[phoozles]

I've had a busy day today!
It involved heading over to the vet and picking up the two diffusers.. I have a lot on my plate today, and won't be home until after 10 PM, but I had some extra time at lunch so I figured it would be best if I could plug them in then instead of waiting until tonight..

When I got home at lunch time, I went straight into Ethel's room through our other entrance, and Alley was constantly harrassing her through the screen door Looks like I'm not starting it too soon!

that this works! I know it'll take a few weeks to kick in, but I'm definitely hoping that it will.

Oh, and my sister is coming to visit on Saturday - she always goes to garage sales with my mom on Saturday mornings, so I told her to keep her eyes peeled for a dog crate

[chico2]

that the diffusers will make a difference.
I just ordered 2 refills on E-Bay,from the same person I always buy from.

The refills are $16.95US each.so I paid $41Us for 2 including shipping,that's a darn good price.
I usually have them within 2 weeks,delivered by my mail-man.

[poodletalk]

14+kitties, my kittens cage set up is almost like yours except I don't have the cupboard thing near the little box.

Personally, I find the cage did wonders for them, it gives them security when I introduced them to new stuff or when they need time to themselves.

This week has been a good week for the kittens, I'm able to pick them up, pet them and now they started purring. Last week, has extremly hard all the did was try to bite and hiss.

Good luck with your new cat phoozles, it takes time and patience but it will come around

[14+kitties]

That's great poodletalk! I don't know what I would do without the crates. They have been a godsend! The litter box is actually inside the bottom cupboard. I cut a hole in the door so I could hide it. Makes it look a little nicer and holds the smell down a bit too. With 6 kitties in the house I need all the help I can get.

Phoozles has had Ethel in the house for quite some time. Ethel is being a stubborn little gal. But then she's got Alley too. I know the breakthrough is coming.

[scol]

Hi Phoozles,

I'm kind of going through the same situation now. It's not perfect. I"ve been trying to integrate a young recently neutered male cat in with a male 6 year old and newish maybe 3 year old female. I haven't tried any sprays or diffusers, as I blew my budget on antibiotics and neuter but the very best thing was for the cats to smell each other around the same areas. I would lock the older male in with me as it was his routine to snuggle at night but every second night or so I"d lock in the new guy, who was really comforted by the attention. I did that for a couple of weeks. Now the two males hiss a little and the female is a little wary of the new one, but they all sleep in my room, the two guys on the same bed, and with only a little grumbling now and then, which is amazing progress. I think the new one is having difficulty as he's rather intense and is much younger so a bit stressful for the others, and a little odd actually, kind of clueless it seems, but it's so much better than the beginning, where they couldn't be in the same room. I would see them sniffing the areas where the other slept and then settling in, and I could see that it was key, as well as having them associate good things with the other around, such as treats when they're all together.

When he first came in it looked hopeless, and that's what I wanted to tell you. I took in the new male in the spring and now it's fall and I'm feeling more optimistic. It can sometimes take a fair while, and patience was and still is key. I really hope it works out for you as I also fell in love with the new guy that was supposed to be temporary and don't want to give him up, even though it was completely harmonious before his arrival, and so for now the balance is upset.

I'm sure this is a lot of redundant information as this board must have covered it all but I wanted to offer some encouragement as it sounds so familiar, and so I feel for you.

I really wish you the best of luck.

[phoozles]

Thank you to everyone for their support
We're still truckin' - lately when Alley will go up to the door to mess with Ethel, it's a lot 'quieter' .. Less screaming at each other, so I'm hoping it's not just a fluke and that it's progress..

[ancientgirl]

We're keeping our fingers and paws crossed here. It sounds like some progress at least. How long have you had the diffusers?

[phoozles]

Just since last Wednesday - probably not long enough to have made any kind of difference, but I'm trying to think positively

[ancientgirl]

Well, thinking positive is half the battle.

[phoozles]

I've had the diffusers plugged in for a week and a half now.

Last night I fed the kitties some treats at Ethel's door.. They seemed okay - Alley was growling, as usual, but I figured her heart wasn't really in it, so it seemed okay..

About 15 minutes later, Alley went back up to Ethel's door and swatted at her, causing Ethel to screech as per usual.. About two minutes after that, FH and I heard a trickling sound - I went around the bar in our living room, and saw Alley peeing next to the fridge

To give you an idea of the area, Ethel's door is about a foot away from the bar. Alley was probably two feet away from her door when she peed.

She's never done anything like this before. I thought the diffusers were supposed to stop peeing in bad areas?! There doesn't seem to be anything wrong with her, healthwise - she's used the litter box every other time except for this one..

*sigh*

[14+kitties]

Oh Alley! She isn't making life easy lately is she? I don't know hon. I am fresh out of ideas. Is it possible she has an infection? Just on the off chance?
I can't figure out why, after Ethel's been in the house for so long, Alley would decide to act out like this now. You would think she would have done it a lot earlier. Like, right after the attack.

[phoozles]

I know - that's the weird thing.. Don't see how she can have an infection, but I suppose it is possible.. But where she peed isn't even remotely close to her litter box.. it's close to Ethel, though.. And why wait two minutes?
Gah - this is so frustrating..

[chico2]

phoozles,IMO girl-kitties might be a little more difficult,I've only ever had one girl-kitty,but she was skittish and very temperamental at times,more territorial than the boys
I am sorry the Feli-Way does not seem to help,it has practically stopped the spraying in my house.
It probably will take a long time for Alley to accept Ethel as a permanent member of the family.
Alley is probably healthy,but reacts exactly the same way Rocky did if something stressed him.
Do you think if Alley was calmer,Ethel would not fight,is Alley the instigator??

[phoozles]

Alley is instigating right now, but Ethel would fight no matter what Alley did.. She often lunges at the door if Alley comes slightly close.. the only time she doesn't is if I'm standing right by the door. The two of them are very stubborn and angry kitties in each other's presence.. I think Alley probably peed because her last skirmish with Ethel freaked her out - maybe Ethel swatted back I just heard it, I didn't see it..

I'm starting to think that the only way these guys are going to get along is if we move. And I have no idea when that's going to happen..

[krdahmer]

Sorry you're not getting much relief with the Feliway... but don't give up just yet... maybe it just takes longer to work on girls... I know I didn't notice a real difference in Smoke until the first diffuser was almost empty! Took more than a month. And I've had them plugged in here since the start of the summer, and I see slow but continual improvement. With a few Buddy induced back slides of course!

Alley may have been startled if Ethel did swat back... maybe she just peed because she got scared? Delayed reaction maybe... or a warning for Ethel not to follow her? Is Ethels litter anywhere near the door?

Keeping our & sending more that these girls start getting along soon! (or at least tolerating each other!)