12 month old boxer on meds since 8 weeks with no answers, please help

[eander]

hi all, i have a male boxer, hes 12 months, heres the long story. I first saw him @ 13 weeks, at the puppy connection, when i inquired about him they said he was taken away for the litter at 6 weeks because he has kennel cough which he was treated for by antibiotics for and was cleared by a vet and given his first set of shots. They said i had 3 days to take him to a vet for a check-up and if problems arrise they would either refund my money or pay for treatment. At the vets office, i had 4 questions i had concerns about, he seemed skinny to me, he had a slight hair loss on his head, his tail seemed to not be healing right and he had a healed scare like a dog puncture bite. my vet checked and said he was fine on all accounts, gave him his shots and home we went. 2 weeks later i was back, the bald spot was getting bigger, the vet this time scrapped and said he has dema mange, so meds for skin and daily baths. 2 weeks later were at the vets again, this time he peed in the house, something he never did before and it smelled like death, the vet did a uranary test and said bad infection, on antibiotics. 3 days after he finished the meds he had these little bumps all over his back and neck, back to the vets,the scrapped again, no more mange but now postule pockets of infection, back on antibiotics, and this has been the norm for us 2 weeks on meds, 2 days later bigger bumps show up, back on meds. There has to be something to help my poor pup, if anyone has any idea i would love to hear it, Im not sure my vet cares as much as we do to put it nicely. I am now reading on diets and hyperthyroidisim which both seem to have skin issues ass. with them, thanks again
eander

[LavenderRott]

Are you taking your pup to the vet recommended by the pet shop? If so, then your next move should be to find a new vet.

I hate to say it, but your puppy most likely came from a mill, where dogs are bred enmasse with no care or thought given to health. Because of this, your pup most likely has autoimmune issues and slight infections (that become more serious) are probably going to be a way of life. It also means that you might never cure your dog of the mange but you may be able to control it. A new vet should be able to help you with this.

My mom has a pet shop chihuahua that requires monthly heartworm drops to keep the mange at bay.

[Dr Lee]

Originally Posted by eander

Im not sure my vet cares as much as we do to put it nicely.

I am now reading on diets and hyperthyroidisim which both seem to have skin issues ass. with them, thanks again
eander

Whether the pet store referral vet or not, I agree with LavenderRott, if you don't feel comfortable and that your vet cares, then a second opinion could be helpful.

Thyroid disease would be exceptionally unlikely. Hyperthyroidism does not commonly occur in dogs and hypothyroidism would also be rare at this age.

Demodex is a type of mite that is 'supposed' to be in our skin. Some dogs become allergic to them as their immune systems mature and then have to be treated for it. As you treat a demodex dog the medication, in this case dips like Mitaban, kills the mite. The dead mite then decomposes in the skin releasing its internal contents. This process often leads to a secondary bacterial infection. Also demodex treatment should continue past two negative scrapings. If demodex was initially found, it is likely that the skin issues are still tied to this mite. It might be helpful to address this concern completely before we look for a second skin issue.

Also was the urine cultured or just a urinalysis? do you have the test results?

[eander]

no, we called them to inquire about the kennel cough and treatment and they seemed like they had no notes at all just that they gave him antibiotics, we have taken him to a diffrent vet but we are now questioning this vet since all he does is scrape and give meds, we asked why no blood tests, to which he replied there are 2 dog skin specialists in va. they cant test but its 2000.00 to start or just keep him on antibiotics

[eander]

hes been scrapped 4 times now, the last 2 times the vet said no mange, but pustules, or bumps with infections. we treated hime for 6 months, with the vets skin med and giving him baths with 4heaping tablespoons of mule 40 borox and a bottle of peroxide and two bottles of h20 all mixed up, let it stand for 3 minutes, everyday for 3 weeks theen every other day, then 3 times a week and so on, his skins great no peeling or flaking, just this horrific tumor like bumps whern ever he gets off of antibiotics for more than 2 days. the vet even asked what we were doing for his skin, he said it looked great . but why does he keeping getting the bumps? when we go for 3 days with no meds they get big and it seems to hurt to touch some of them at times, thanks!!

[Dr Lee]

Originally Posted by eander

...we asked why no blood tests, to which he replied there are 2 dog skin specialists in va. they cant test but its 2000.00 to start or just keep him on antibiotics

Just FWIW blood tests are not generally run for kennel cough or demodectic mange. If we are concerned about other underlying problems issues: systemic inflammatory conditions, bone marrow suppression, kidney, liver, etc... then blood work becomes useful. In asituation of ongoing and multiple problems, I think a basic blood test would be useful however it is not unreasonable for the initial veterinarian to not have run blood tests.

Also while dermatology specialist can definitely run into the 2k range, basic consultation and case evaluation are usually in the 150-250 range.

Good luck.

[14+kitties]

What are you feeding him? I know that the good Dr Lee is helping you. Bless you Dr Lee for taking the time you do to help us all.
Could it be the boxer has food allergies? If he is being fed a kibble filled with grains and by products would/could it produce the same results as eander is seeing? Also, we have had other pups on here who have a bad allergic reaction to chicken. Is there any type of chicken in his kibble?
We have food gurus here who are very very knowledgable about food issues. Hopefully they will pop in soon.
I am probably way way off.

[eander]

yes, thanks doc.!! the diet was the second thig i am checking on. i have been tol to check out....solid gold dog food, california natural and canidae, not sure which to try but please i am game for almost anything, thanks.

[14+kitties]

I don't have dogs with food issues so don't know a whole lot about it. But from what I have gathered feeding a cheaper kibble filled with grains/corn is not doing the dog any favours. Dogs can not digest corn at the best of times. If the dog has an allergy to corn than it would make it far, far worse.

[Winston]

14+ you beat me to it? I would also wonder now especially since you have done 4 scrapings? What does he eat?

My boy used to get big sores on his tummy that reminded me of large chicken pocks....after putting him on a high protein good quality food and it took it away! he also used to get the itchies really bad and that stopped almost immediately. I was feeding him vet food for many years before the change over. I was stunned because I paid alot of money for the food not thinkning it was causing the problem?

Good Luck...would love to see some pics of your doggy!

Cindy

[eander]

ooo, also did i mention hes on the small side, hes 44 lbs and the vet said hes only going to be 45 -maybe 50. but i think he looks skinny, he does love the 100% natural chicken dried strips. the vet had him on ukanuba, then iaams, we have to mix in a small container of wet puppy food for him to eat any quanitity at one time. but what should i get to try next to make sure its not a food allergy?
again, thanks

[Winston]

Do you know if Orijen is available in your area? I use this one and its been fantastic for me! Some other good brands that come to mind are Canadie , Wellness, Now?

What I would do it remove chicken from his diet first. Alot of dogs seem to have allergies to chicken. Then perhaps try him on something that is just one type of meat and then see how he does. At the same time when you change the food I would go with something that has no grains in it. So that you can rule out 2 things 1 if its meat or grains. You may need to keep some of the old food and transition him to the new one.

Have you ever given him a fish oil on his food? You can buy bottles of fish oil at the pet store. I usually get one that is herring oil. I just squirt it on his food and he eats it all up!

Here is a link to the Orijen food. I buy mine at Ryans or Pet Valu here in Canada. I think you can check online where it is available.

http://www.championpetfoods.com/orijen/orijen/

Oh and check out the food forum there is so much valuable info there!

Cindy

[14+kitties]

Sorry Winston.
I would think the most important thing is to read the ingredient list. If the kibble has corn/grains listed as the first, second, third ingredient, avoid it. You will be paying more for the food but isn't your dog worth it?
A good quality canned food would be even better than the kibble from what I understand. Also, there are a lot of people on this forum who feed raw to their dogs. They swear by it.
Swing by the food forum and check it out. See what you can learn. Start your own thread in the food section on food. I bet you will get some very surprising answers.

[14+kitties]

Now see Winston. That time you beat me!!

[Winston]

Raw has come along way too now! You can buy it already prepared at most pet stores now! its more expensive than preparing yourself though.

Can you take a picture of the bumps to show us? I am not sure if you can post pictures yet or not...but that may help anyone looking at it?

[eander]

just tried to upload his pict but it says upload failed. sorry, i'll keep working on it tho

[14+kitties]

Originally Posted by eander

just tried to upload his pict but it says upload failed. sorry, i'll keep working on it tho

It could be the picture is too big. Try resizing and uploading it again.

[eander]

hes had 3 urine tests done 3 diffrent times, they just say yes he has an infection, once they did say even the color was horrible, but no diagnosis per say as to why, i am just told that hes got imune issues and thats why all the problems

[eander]

ok! his picture is beside my profile now! lol even tho it says cant upload its there.

[Winston]

Ive tried to resize this pic for you but its a bit distorted...

[eander]

thank u so much!!! Ive been out all day looking for a good diet I found BLUE, no corn, no wheat, nothing on the bad list , I cant believe all of the tests and meds and not once was I asked about his diet if this works i dont know if i should scream or say thank god!! lol

[14+kitties]

don't get too excited yet. Let's see if there is an improvement. Even if it turns out not to be the reason for his issues he at least will be on a better diet, right? It sure can't hurt!
Give it a few weeks to see how things progress.
Good luck. Let us know how it's going!!

[eander]

thanks! I am not sure if i can tell since he is still on antibiotics, i guess by the time he finishes the meds it will be 10 day on the new food so within a few days after that i should be able to tell. I threw out everything that had more than 5 ingrediants, we got new treats, new all natural boiled bones, and new shampoo and spray. I am feeling better even if hes not! lol were still having trouble finding any of the listed good diets tho, no gold, or canidae in our are but buffalo blue looks good, well keep him on it for a few weeks & if no skin improvements than we go looking again. Yall have been great and given me lots of info to check out, THANK U .

[LavenderRott]

Due to the recent changes in Canidae, I don't know that I would feed it.

I have had good results in my dogs with Wellness and Kirkland's Premium that is available at Costco.

[kandy]

Do you mean Blue Buffalo?

If your dog is having skin issues that may be linked to food intolerance, I agree with staying away from chicken based products in addition to corn & wheat. Also, you might think about supplementing with some high quality probiotics & fish oil. In your research, you might also look at long term effects of continous antibiotic treatment.

[eander]

yes buffalo blue, it was the best one we could find with no corn or wheat. And yes I am worried about him being on the meds for almost a year now, but when hes not, the huge bumps that are almost golf ball sized get all over him, most of the time they dont seem to bother him but 10 days ago when touching his side he would turn away or look at u quickly like dont do that, so they did hurt, but 3 days on antibiotics and they are gone, so I am not sure what do do , which is why I am here thanks

[eander]

probiotics? like? ....

[eander]

kirkland has no corn or wheat? and how about chicken? I am @ costco weekly.

[Winston]

probiotics probably just meaning some yogurt or something?

as for the kirkland I would wait untill you have tried the Blue product first...does it have chicken in it also? what is the main ingrediant for meat? cause what i would do is stick with one meat source if you can and then see how your dog does on that...then eliminate certain itens next time like chicken? and so on until you find what works best for you.

I give Winston yogurt regularily.

I use a transition powder when I change foods as well from this company....works very well in eliminating the runs when you change foods.

http://www.eaglepack.com/Pages/HS_DigestiveAids.html

Is your boy liking the new food you bought?
Cindy

[eander]

heres whats in it, and I also give my boxer yogurt, hes not big on eating dry food but will eat a bit more when yogurt is on top or 1/2 a can of food.

Deboned Lamb, Lamb Meal, Whole Ground Barley, Whole Ground Brown Rice, Oatmeal, Rye, Fish Meal, Whole Potatoes, Tomato Pomace (natural source of Lycopene), Sunflower Oil (natural source of Omega 6 Fatty Acids), Natural Flavor, Whole Carrots, Whole Sweet Potatoes, Blueberries, Cranberries, Flaxseed, Barley Grass, Dried Parsley, Alfalfa Meal, Kelp Meal, Taurine, L-Carnitine, L-Lysine, Glucosamine Hydrochloride, Yucca Schidigera Extract, Green Tea Extract, Turmeric, Garlic, Herring Oil (natural source of Omega 3 Fatty Acids), Fructooligosaccharides, Monooligosaccharides, Dried Chicory Root, Black Malted Barley, Oil of Rosemary, Vitamin A Supplement, Vitamin C, Vitamin E Supplement, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Beta Carotene, Calcium Ascorbate (source of Vitamin C), Vitamin B12 Supplement, Niacin (Vitamin B3), Calcium Pantothenate (Vitamin B5), Riboflavin (Vitamin B2), Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B6), Thiamine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B1), Folic Acid, Biotin, Choline Chloride, Calcium Phosphate, Zinc Amino Acid Complex (source of Chelated Zinc), Iron Amino Acid Complex (source of Chelated Iron), Copper Amino Acid Complex (source of Chelated Copper), Manganese Amino Acid Complex (source of Chelated Manganese), Potassium Amino Acid Complex (source of Chelated Potassium), Cobalt Proteinate (source of Chelated Cobalt), Potassium Chloride, Sodium Selenite, Salt, Lactobacillus acidophilus, Bacillus subtilis, Bifidobacterium thermophilum, Bifidobacterium longum, Enterococcus faecium.

Guaranteed analysis:
Crude Protein 22.0% min
Crude Fat 12.0% min
Crude Fiber 4.5% max
Moisture 10.0% max
Calcium 1.3% min
Phosphorus 1.0% min
L-Carnitine* 100 mg/kg min
Omega 3 Fatty Acids* 0.40% min
Omega 6 Fatty Acids* 1.80% min
Beta Carotene* 5.0 mg/kg min
Glucosamine* 400 mg/kg max