Tummy trouble

[otter]

We've been "off the air" for quite some time now, sorry about that, and now I'm feeling a bit guilty coming and asking for advice but i'm sure hoping you might have some experience that might help me through.

Here goes...Miss Molly (10yr golden retriever) barfed twice yesterday - once with an empty stomach so just yellow liquid (smelly though) and then last night her dinner mostly came up about 4-5 hours after she ate (i'm guessing, I must have been asleep but i'm going by how much was dried up when I got up at 6am). I'm totally stressed out cause i'm stuck here without a vet and were totally snowed in (I mean REALLY snowed in, 3 hour drive to the vet would take me all day now and being stuck in snow storm with sick dog might kill us both).

Until yesterday, we've been battling with gastro issues pretty much since I got her (soft poops, not great eating) and she's had it checked out with the vet and vet had no worries about it, just thinks that's Molly's "normal". In the past month we've been trying out new kibbles, trying to find something palatable to her, with no great luck (back in October we stopped feeding her food of 1.5 years cause i'd heard so many bad things about it's new formula, she was on Canidae). About two weeks ago I gave up on kibble for a bit and started making home cooked meals, then went back to trying kibble again. Needless to say, i've not been doing a good job feeding this poor pup lately. Yesterday she had a home cooked meal of turkey and carrots after not eating for about 24hours (she didn't eat dinner the night before or breakfast yesterday cause I was trying to get her to eat kibble again).

So, the question is... do I try and keep feeding her or, leave her stomach empty until I can get out of this town and to a vet (hopefully we can leave tomorrow and at least talk to the vet, not likely they will see her until Monday unless she's dying (pray not!!)?

Oh, Molly is happy and full of her usual zest for life.... though she's afraid of the living room now cause that's were she barfed Everything I can think of checks out ok, she's drinking (well, eating snow right now), playing, tummy is grumbling like it always does, gums are pink, eyes are white, nose is wet, poop is a bit dark but pretty normal for her, still has a ball in her mouth at all times.

Just in case you forgot what she looks like....(the "look" is cause I have the ball this time )

[pitgrrl]

Just fasting for 12 - 24 hours can often get them over whatever funky tummy thing they have going on (obviously if they're still acting relatively normal, not puking every 5 minutes or showing other signs of distress).

I typically do a 12 hour fast, offering water and/or pedialyte often to make sure the dog is well hydrated, and then give a very small meal of plain meat, a bit of steamed yam or pumpkin and slippery elm.

If the food is held down, then I'll give another very small meal again in a few hours and, if all is well, continue with multiple small meals for a day or so afterwards.

Good luck!

[hazelrunpack]

Some dogs' tummies get upset if they're empty too long, so maybe hers was just overtaxed by the amount of time it had been since she'd last eaten. If it were us, we'd probably try just small amounts of the home-cooked, a few times a day to at least get some nutrition to her. If she digests it, ; if she doesn't, at least it's less to clean up.

Is she on probiotic at all? Plain yogurt is a great probiotic...that might help as well if you have any.

[diandpat]

Wow, my sympathies to you. I have a 14.5 yr old golden who all of a sudden out of the blue will vomit once or twice and go on like everything is just fine and dandy, while I am worried sick imagining every bad thing it could be in my head.

You certainly can't go to the vet in that weather so you need to try to work with what you have at home. I am a huge fan of Bepto or Pepcid (one maybe two doses just to settle her tummy...nothing long term) and boiled rice with rinsed white chicken meat.

Perhaps the turkey was too greasy for her and she just did not digest it well.

We are lucky we have never had kibble problems here. Both dogs are on Orijen (reg or fish/we alternate) and doing well. For a treat I give them Merricks wet food once or twice a week. Just a spoon or two with their kibble for dinner. They digest that well too.

If Molly is still goofing around and not seeming too lethargic I would just watch she doesn't dehydrate and see what tomorrow brings.

BTW, I think you have been offline a LONG time and ONE measly picture is probably not going to cut it

Please keep us posted how the day progresses and good luck!

[otter]

Thanks diandpat, HRP and pitgrrl!. I'm working on more pictures... we haven't been too snap happy lately I think I took the rest of my picture quota for the year when I was in Iceland in September

Good to know that "unexplained" vomiting can happen with older pups... I too, worry to the extreme at every irregularity in my poor girl. I guess dogs aren't as sensitive to going hungry for a day or two

I'm starting to wonder if we've all got a bug of some kind, I noticed the cats both had runny poop this morning and my tummy has been gurgling more than usual for the past couple of days.... maybe i've poisoned us all We all ate the same turkey a few days ago (not the most recent batch, one before). Guess we'll all just take a "snow day" and stay in bed

I'd totally forgotten about trying out some Pepto or Pepcid... I think I have some Zanex (sp) around - another one of those antacid sorts the vet had recommended at one time. Thanks for the suggestion

We've been trying Orijen (Adult, fish, Senior) and Acana Grasslands but she's turned her nose up at all... she ate the adult for a while, then I mixed it with a bit of fish and she went and then wouldn't eat it again. Right now we are kibbleless. Someone gave me a bag of Eukanuba "Taste of the Wild" or something like that (Turkey flav.) and we tried it out (I wouldn't feed it regularly but we were trying everything just to find a taste she liked), that was the night before last (she did eat a bowl)... so that may have contributed to yesterdays barfing too (though she did obviously digest it... cause it didn't show up in the barf, sorry, too much info!!)


We're off to try a scoop of yogurt... with some pepto or something mixed in

[otter]

Originally Posted by pitgrrl

Just fasting for 12 - 24 hours can often get them over whatever funky tummy thing they have going on (obviously if they're still acting relatively normal, not puking every 5 minutes or showing other signs of distress).

I typically do a 12 hour fast, offering water and/or pedialyte often to make sure the dog is well hydrated, and then give a very small meal of plain meat, a bit of steamed yam or pumpkin and slippery elm.

If the food is held down, then I'll give another very small meal again in a few hours and, if all is well, continue with multiple small meals for a day or so afterwards.

Good luck!

Oooo Slippery Elm, I'd totally forgotten about that! I even have some on hand Small meals is definitely a game plan.. I was actually thinking i might be feeding her too much at a time as she often doesn't eat her whole bowl at once anyways but with the yummy stuff i've been cooking she's just gobbled up the whole bowl (and it was a big bowl cause I figured she'd be really hungry, not thinking so well).

Keeping my this is just a "glitch" in her system

[hazelrunpack]

Some of our older dogs over the years have developed tummy sensitivities that were 'fixed' just by feeding smaller meals more times daily. Sort of like going back on a puppy feeding schedule (second puppyhood? ) but with less food overall, of course. I've noticed as hazel has gotten older, we can't digest big meals anymore, either. It's a good excuse to eat small amounts of food all day...the perpetual nosh!

[otter]

Originally Posted by hazelrunpack

Some of our older dogs over the years have developed tummy sensitivities that were 'fixed' just by feeding smaller meals more times daily. Sort of like going back on a puppy feeding schedule (second puppyhood? ) but with less food overall, of course. I've noticed as hazel has gotten older, we can't digest big meals anymore, either. It's a good excuse to eat small amounts of food all day...the perpetual nosh!

I'm a HUGE fan of the "perpetual nosh"!!

Right now she's turning up her nose at everything.... no good :sad:

i'm going to try some slippery elm, just got to find out if it's ok on an empty stomach and how much. any one know?? i'm off to research

She ate some snow, are dogs like humans where snow doesn't help to hydrate at all?? Molly's never big on drinking water (I think she osmosis' it by being in it all the time ) so I put lots of water in her food usually so getting her to drink is a bit of an issue now too.
Gotta research signs of dehydration too.....

sigh....

[pitgrrl]

Originally Posted by otter

I'm a HUGE fan of the "perpetual nosh"!!

Right now she's turning up her nose at everything.... no good :sad:

i'm going to try some slippery elm, just got to find out if it's ok on an empty stomach and how much. any one know?? i'm off to research

She ate some snow, are dogs like humans where snow doesn't help to hydrate at all?? Molly's never big on drinking water (I think she osmosis' it by being in it all the time ) so I put lots of water in her food usually so getting her to drink is a bit of an issue now too.
Gotta research signs of dehydration too.....

sigh....

Slippery elm is a really safe herb, the only thing to keep in mind is that it should not be given at the same time as other medications as it can mess with how other meds are absorbed.

My two are 50 and 58 lbs respectively and I've given up to 1.5 tsp, 3 times a day when we're having serious poop issues.

I've found that for diarrhea giving the powder straight works best, but for upset stomach preparing a syrup from the slipper elm seems best.

Mix 1 heaping tsp. slipper elm powder with 1 cup water and bring to a light boil, stirring continuously, then immediately turn heat down to a low/med. Continue stirring for aprox. 1 minute until mixture has thickened. Allow to cool before giving it to the dog.

I usually give a couple of Tbs. of the syrup mixed with a bit of broth or water and honey if the dog is fasting or added to food if the dog is eating.

[hazelrunpack]

Have you tried chicken broth, otter? If you don't have the low salt kind, you can boil up some chicken yourself and use the water in Molly's bowl after it's cooled. When our dogs are sick and don't feel like drinking or drinking, it usually entices them to at least take in some liquid And sometimes they'll take some of the chicken when they're done with the broth.

You're right about the snow, btw. It doesn't really do too much to keep them hydrated.

[otter]

Thanks pitgrrl!

I'm going to try out the syrup a little later She's not eating right now, nor interested in food, i'm going to give her a bit of a break and try again in a few hours. Keeping my fingers crossed .

Wow, I was reading back a few of your posts on gastro issue pitgrrl... you've sure had your share of troubles! Lots of good info though so thanks so much for sharing

[Frenchy]

No more advices to add , so sorry about Molly's tummy problem. :sad:


Don't worry otter , you're doing a good job with Molly

And whatever food / kibble she'll eat , don't worry about the brand , as long as she'll eat it

[otter]

Originally Posted by hazelrunpack

Have you tried chicken broth, otter? If you don't have the low salt kind, you can boil up some chicken yourself and use the water in Molly's bowl after it's cooled. When our dogs are sick and don't feel like drinking or drinking, it usually entices them to at least take in some liquid And sometimes they'll take some of the chicken when they're done with the broth.

You're right about the snow, btw. It doesn't really do too much to keep them hydrated.

We tried some broth (turkey though) no luck. I'll try some chicken too a little later. I'll try anything. Giving her a bit of a break right now, she's just snoozing.

[chico2]

Otter,nice to see Mollys whitish face again and those beautiful eyes,you can manage to get her to eat

[otter]

Oh my silly dog makes me crazy sometimes.... I dropped a cheesie on the floor and she ate it! She won't eat any kind of dog food, not fresh chicken or turkey, no broth, no rice, no dog treats, no baby food, no yogurt, yet she eats a cheesie Since that was at least SOMETHING in her otherwise totally empty stomach I tired a piece of pita bread too and she ate that. Well, she can't live on bread and cheesies but at least it's something.

I'm quite worried about her though, today she is getting more and more lethargic.. and she went outside and just shivered. Not all is well.

[rainbow]

Do you have any liver or sardines at home? What about canned salmon or tuna? Will she eat pasta instead of rice?

C'mon Molly......you're making Mom worry.

[hazelrunpack]

Is she still pooping and peeing, otter?

[otter]

Originally Posted by rainbow

Do you have any liver or sardines at home? What about canned salmon or tuna? Will she eat pasta instead of rice?

C'mon Molly......you're making Mom worry.

She's never been crazy on sardines and I tried dried liver treats, no luck. Will try some tuna and pasta as well ... I hadn't given either a though as I thought she wouldn't eat anything but since the "cheesie incident" i'm gonna try again. Thanks for the idea

and the encouragement... Molly you sure are worrying me!!!

Originally Posted by hazelrunpack

Is she still pooping and peeing, otter?

We had a good poop last night and peeing today. We'll go for a longer walk and see if that "produces" anything in a bit.

[diandpat]

Wow, Otter, I have to tell you and both Ginger and Hobo had some type of "bug" last week that lasted about 72 hrs and this week my friend's 3 yr old Golden had the same bug. Don't want to say it's nothing but it might just be a bug.

Please don't go to bad places in your head. I know that that is difficult but I gave Ginger one maybe two Pepcids and she really did not show any interest in eating (only took a few mouthfuls of Kraft Dinner-definite sign ) for probably 24 hrs :sad:

She is probably lethargic because her electrolytes are off...just like us when we have been nauseaous.

Keep her comfy and you will hopefully be able to take her in in the a.m. if she does not show any marked improvement tomorrow a.m.

[otter]

I got her to eat 1/2 can of tuna
and the water from the tuna can (I know it's salty but I figured a bit of salt could help)

for it just being a bug

I'm having a really hard time cause this was the way Chloe was in her last days... just eating a dab of this or that. Chloe just got worse and worse, i'm really Molly just gets better and better.

We'll still plan to head to the city tomorrow. I hate being so far away from vet help. Though I'm soooooooo thankful to all you supportive and helpful pets.ca people

[pitgrrl]

How long has she gone without eating at this point?

I found this, a recipe for homemade "pedialyte". You might have the ingredients on hand

from this link

Try this recipe for homemade Pedialyte to have available in case of unexpected illness:
1 quart purified or natural spring water
2-4 teaspoons raw, unprocessed sugar, or 1-2 teaspoons of powdered fruit sugar (fructose)
1 teaspoon Himalayan or Celtic sea salt

Boil water, add sugar (or fructose) and salt. Stir. Let cool.
Refrigerate what you do not use, but do not keep for more than 48 hours; make a new batch. Safe for pets, particularly puppies and rabbits.

If you can manage to get some slippery elm down her, it may help. I find sometimes if a dog hasn't eaten in a while, they become nauseated from an empty stomach, which makes them continue not to eat, which makes them more nauseous.....and the cycle continues.

ETA: Obviously, the above is irrelevant now. LOL

[otter]

Originally Posted by pitgrrl

How long has she gone without eating at this point?
If you can manage to get some slippery elm down her, it may help. I find sometimes if a dog hasn't eaten in a while, they become nauseated from an empty stomach, which makes them continue not to eat, which makes them more nauseous.....and the cycle continues.

She's been two full days (48 hours) with out a FULL meal (that stayed in her) - but so far today we've got 1/2 cup of water, 1 pita, 1/2 can of tuna with water so, hopefully she's not totally running on empty. Slippery elm syrup is just cooling.
I'm afraid i'm gonna jinx it but so far so good with vomiting

Good point about the empty tummy nausea cycle so i'm happy about the bite or two she has had

The tuna must be playing with her tummy a bit, she's having a wild dream complete with barking and growling and running!

The recipe looks good but i've not got anything but table salt, white or brown sugar and tap water, i'm not sure they would make a very good mix. I'll get some pedialyte to keep in my "first aid" kit, it's a good idea but i've not thought of it before. I think the real stuff has a decent shelf life. Maybe i'll see if a neighbor has some

[mummummum]

How is the Cheesy plunderer today?

[Winston]

Mummummum where have you been??? OMG!!! your back!!

[otter]

Originally Posted by mummummum

How is the Cheesy plunderer today?

the cheesy plunderer is OK... we just came back from a short (sadly unproductive) walk. She's back to snoozing. It was definitely a less energetic walk than normal but, she's walking so I guess I can be thankful for that

Going to try some slippery elm syrup now.

and... some new development on the other fuzzies in the house. It's confirmed, they've both got runny stinky poops too Maybe we are talking bugs could also just be a result of stress in the air and the HUGE pile of snow outside (the kitties usually venture out with me but not today!) they are both eating all the yummy food I have laid out for Molly





no problem for the jack Winston.... I was thinking the same thing!
So good to see you back mummummum!

[TeriM]

Woohoo! MX3 is back !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Awww, I am sorry Molly isn't feeling well. For my guys I find that some scrambled eggs mixed with a bit of plain yogurt is best tolerated for an upset tummy. I would also try and give a pepcid about 1/2 hour before trying to feed. Hope she feels better .

[rainbow]

Well Molly doesn't have much in her to poop out.

And, since the kitties have the runs and you weren't feeling up to snuff I'm thinking it was the turkey you all shared that is the culprit here.

So a round of slippery elm for the whole lot of you.

And sending lots of get well wishes your way.

[Love4himies]

I am sorry to hear Molly is not feeling well. I don't have any advice but wanted to say I missed Molly's beautiful Golden face

[otter]

Originally Posted by Love4himies

I am sorry to hear Molly is not feeling well. I don't have any advice but wanted to say I missed Molly's beautiful Golden face

sigh... Molly's golden face is just about all white now.. I can't believe the difference. Thanks for thinking of my little girl

Kittie tummy trouble could also because they are scarfing down dog food

I hate it when there are a million possibilities for what could be going on and results could be nothing to dire :sad:

My slippery elm syrup isn't syrupy at all.. thought it might thicken as it cools but nope. Maybe i'll just pop Molly a couple of capsules instead. Darn

[pitgrrl]

How's Molly today?