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Two Dogs, Dog Parks and No Recall
We've had Scarlett for a little over a week now, and I think things are progressing as well as could be expected with a "pound puppy". She needs a lot of work, but what's really driving me crazy is how she and my other dog, Harley, are doing together. Scarlett's a total terror with Harley. Any time both dogs are out together, it is a non-stop beat up fest with Scarlett doing the beating. Harley's older, slower and in general she's a VERY laid back kind of dog. Scarlett, at 7 months old, is anything but and is clearly trying to establish herself as alpha over Harley. Lots of straddling, growling, and biting at ears or neck. The girls spend a lot of time taking turns in the crate.
Scarlett is very dog oriented, interested, whatever you want to call it. Took her to her first obedience class yesterday, and she spent over half the time barking like a nut because she couldn't get to the other dogs. I've been thinking if I could get Scarlett to the dog park a few times a week, she could get her "doggie" fix and run off enough energy that when I got her home, she might be tuckered enough to play a little more civilly with Harley. Beyond that, its just really good exercise. Here's the problem....she has no recall. She'll come to me in the house most times when I call her, but never when she's going at it with Harley. Considering her fixation on other dogs, I doubt she'll come to me at the park. How the heck do I take her there and yet ensure that when it is time to go, I can get her back on the leash? Not sure if I brought both dogs, when I called Harley who has perfect recall, would Scarlett follow her?
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I used to have a Multiple Personality Disorder, but the doctor says we are fine now. Harley - 8 year old Beagle x Dobie Jet - 10 month old Labrador Retriever |
#2
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You have only had this dog for a week. There is absolutely no way you should turn her loose in a dog park! Forget the fact that she is not going to come to you - you haven't had her near long enough to even begin to predict what type of behaviours she might display in that environment. What if she isn't dog friendly? She may well be fine one on one but in a pack situation - you are opening yourself up to all kinds of trouble.
She sounds like she needs a ton of work. First - stop leaving her loose with your older dog. Keep her on a leash. If she starts harassing the other dog - remover her from the situation. If she can remain calm, she can have a treat. Keep going to classes.
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Sandi |
#3
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So why is it you want to take a dog with no recall who is showing aggression tendencies towards other dogs to an off leash dog park?
IMO I would steer clear of dog parks until she is showing 100% recall with no aggression towards other dogs. To me it just makes more sense. She clearly needs tons more training to get to that point.
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Assumptions do nothing but make an ass out of u and me. We can stick our heads in the sand for only so long before it starts choking us. Face it folks. The pet population is bad ALL OVER THE WORLD! |
#4
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I don't know if this is something you have considered, but daycare can be a tremendous help in teaching appropriate play with other dogs, and will tire her out. Find a daycare that does not just throw her in with other dogs and let her go for it. Find one that actually teaches basic obedience and proper socialization. Where I live there are a few, not sure about your area. It also keeps them from getting lonely if you work or are away alot.
It has done wonders for our youngest (now 6 month old Giant Mal), and boy... did he need help learning to play! They even throw the dogs with "extra" energy to spare on the treadmill. He would come home after daycare, and instead of pouncing on our old boy (11 yr old Mal/GSD) and having to be taught some manners, he would just howl at him, try to kiss him a little, then fall over and go to sleep. A tired dog is usually a more well behaved dog
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"Obey my dog!" - Mugatu "Who can believe that there is no soul behind those luminous eyes!" ~ Theophile Gautier "Dogs are not our whole life, but they make our lives whole" - Ok... whoever said this has never had a sick or special needs baby. They ARE our whole life! R.I.P. my sweet, handsome Thorin. You are missed dearly Dec. 25, 1999 - Mar. 4, 2012 |
#5
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I'm open for feedback, kind of have to be to put yourself out on forums such as this, but it would be nice if it were constructive. I have every intention of continuing with training, of course, and I already mentioned that I'm keeping the dogs separated. Hope I don't get flamed on this, but felt I had to put in my . Again, I might just be overly sensitive, but I don't recycle dogs so Scarlett's here for good and I really want both dogs to be happy.
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I used to have a Multiple Personality Disorder, but the doctor says we are fine now. Harley - 8 year old Beagle x Dobie Jet - 10 month old Labrador Retriever |
#6
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I'm on my way to work so have to answer quickly.
No sensitivity needed. I was basically putting what you said in your post into one short sentence. Because if you look at it that way it really does not sound good, does it? I was simply putting into context. What we are saying, as LR said, you've had the dog for a week. You are having issues with her at home. How do you think you can handle her at a dog park when she has no recall, there are other dogs running around, and most of the time, unless your park is different than most, you have inattentive dog owners standing around yapping. How were you planning on controlling her? Umbilical training, always on leash, most definitely when your older, quieter dog is out, is a possibility. Nothing In Life is Free may help. Continued training is a must. http://www.dogtipsdaily.com/umbilica...s-respect.html http://www.pets.ca/dogs/articles/not...-is-free-nilf/ I am sure there will be many dog savvy folks joining in soon. Maybe they can give you more constructive ideas.
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Assumptions do nothing but make an ass out of u and me. We can stick our heads in the sand for only so long before it starts choking us. Face it folks. The pet population is bad ALL OVER THE WORLD! |
#7
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All of you have given me great resources to start working with. Scarlett's definitely a bit more of a handful than my last shelter dog, who I adopted at 4 months and who will soon be celebrating her 5th birthday with me.
Again, sorry if I came off as defensive, but I'm here looking for suggestions and I appreciate the advice that you all have posted here so far. Trust that I will look into everything and keep you apprised on Scarlett's progress. Might seem naive, but I'm convinced there's no such thing as a bad dog, just bad owners. Trying my best not to fall into the latter category. If that means I ask a stupid question from time to time, so be it. Better a stupid question than a disastrous result.
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I used to have a Multiple Personality Disorder, but the doctor says we are fine now. Harley - 8 year old Beagle x Dobie Jet - 10 month old Labrador Retriever |
#8
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Oh, there most certainly ARE bad dogs! But they are much harder to find then bad owners, which seem to be a dime a dozen and live on just about every block in the U.S. (and Canada too, I am sure!).
For a cat lady - that 14+ has some good links in her bag of links. Your new pup sounds like her early training and socialization was lacking. No big deal. With the information given to you and some training classes you will have an amazing companion.
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Sandi |
#9
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LOL... nookie monster is a very bad puppy! Just take a look at the Sept. photo challenge
But he had no socialization and was taken away from his mother at about 5 weeks, so it isn't his fault. Thorin is helping to teach him, but it's going to take alot of time and work.
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"Obey my dog!" - Mugatu "Who can believe that there is no soul behind those luminous eyes!" ~ Theophile Gautier "Dogs are not our whole life, but they make our lives whole" - Ok... whoever said this has never had a sick or special needs baby. They ARE our whole life! R.I.P. my sweet, handsome Thorin. You are missed dearly Dec. 25, 1999 - Mar. 4, 2012 |
#10
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First, congratulations on the adoption !
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I also agree that right now is not the right time to be taking Scarlett to a dog park (not really crazy about them because, unlike yourself, lots of people don't care whether their dogs will listen to them or not in such an environment). I'm wondering how the trainer of your class handled Scarlett barking at the other dogs? Did she give you any pointers on how to help calm/refocus her?
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"Education is a progressive discovery of our own ignorance." -Will Durant |
#11
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Don't have that luxury here. These two are going to HAVE to find a way to get along. Harley's pretty mellow, so at first she just tries to avoid Scarlett but eventually she'll get involved. She'll play nice for awhile, tail up and wagging, but Scarlett is really rough / rambunctious and eventually Harley is done with it. Harley will snarl and snap at Scarlett, however, this just gets Scarlett MORE worked up and the whole thing escalates a notch. As rough and loud as it has gotten, no one has been hurt but I don't know if that's because I intercede at that point, and usually one or the other ends up crated for awhile. Over the first couple of days, Scarlett would try to mount Harley and "hump" her, although I haven't seen that recently. Actually, Scarlett is now trying to get a BIG mouthful of the Harley's scruff at the back of the neck. Those were the behaviours that made me think she's trying to dominate Harley. And the few minutes she will stand still while they are playing, she's typically standing crossways over Harley's back (she's a bit taller). Harley's recall is excellent, so I can call her to me but as she's doing that, Scarlett's coming along too and still trying to jump and nip allover Harley. I haven't had much luck getting Scarlett to calm down for more than a couple of seconds before she's back at it. I literally have to stand over them while they play, ready to pull one or the other out. I don't think Scarlett's dog aggressive though, because we spent 3 hours over at a friend's house and she has a 1 year old male cattle dog and a 4 month old female dauschund mix. The bigger dogs went at it for three hours, with no fighting (lots of playing and chasing each other like they had the zoomies) and even the little one got into the action from time to time.
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I used to have a Multiple Personality Disorder, but the doctor says we are fine now. Harley - 8 year old Beagle x Dobie Jet - 10 month old Labrador Retriever |
#12
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She is a puppy with energy to burn. You need to find something more interesting then the other dog. When my pup wants to play rough with my older dog - he is redirected to a rousing game of fetch with me to burn that off.
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Sandi |
#13
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Yep, working that. Right now she seems to find dogs more interesting than anything and everything else. But I'm starting to think that might be a bit of an early socialization issue. She likes people and is developing a tendancy to follow me around, but it has been a somewhat slow warm up process. Maybe she came from a background where there were more dogs and less people to orient herself around.
Anyhow, with much work, trust, patience and time, I have every reason to believe she'll turn out just fine.
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I used to have a Multiple Personality Disorder, but the doctor says we are fine now. Harley - 8 year old Beagle x Dobie Jet - 10 month old Labrador Retriever |
#14
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Quote:
Dealing with the repercussion of that is interesting because then I become her favorite human chew toy. She's pretty easy to redirect in that area, so no harm, no foul. In terms of NILF, I've always practiced that with Harley, and it's already paying off with Scarlett. Took one evening and one morning to get her to figure out that if she doesn't sit by the door, she's not going out. And that's without having to tell her. Just auto response....love it. Maybe I'm just going through new parent syndrom. LOL
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I used to have a Multiple Personality Disorder, but the doctor says we are fine now. Harley - 8 year old Beagle x Dobie Jet - 10 month old Labrador Retriever |
#15
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I still believe in Cesar Milans methods (although some here may disagree)
Scarlett needs to know "your" the boss, and that harassing Harley is not acceptable, so you need to stop her (separating dogs, I find teaches them nothing, unless you need the break that is, or if you not there) She needs to be corrected every time she goes after Harley, if you keep all over her she will eventually get it, and stop. As for dog parks I think it's to soon, a better idea would be doggie dates with younger and just as energitic dogs, in an enclosed area, she would probably do better with males.
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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ What is man without beasts? If all the beasts were gone, men would die from great loneliness of spirit. For whatever happens to the beasts, soon happens to man. All things are connected. ~~Chief Seattle (Duwamish tribe)~~ |
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