i have satans dog

[theduke]

I bought this dog from a kill shelter and when i got him he was over a year old. now, this dog chews and i mean he chews wires, bottles, carpet, beds, walls, cats pretty much anything that can be chewed he chews. he has many many real bones (the ones that cost a lot) and the bones that can be easily chewed. i know for a fact he has had some training because hes one stupid dog but he knows the sit and lay down commands. not only does he chew he also cant sit still for more than 5 seconds and he only sleeps like an hour a night. im almost postive he was abused by his old owners because he gets startled very easily and he always has to be close to you.

now getting rid of him really isnt an option cause he would be put to sleep if he goes back to a kill shelter cause hes a really big dog and if someone were to test him if to see his temper he would fail cause he will snap at you if you try and take away whatever hes chewing. also this dog is just so darn helpless i mean he got caught in a phone wire not really caught but he though he did so he just stood there and whined till i got him loose. i just cant see myself giving him a death sentence i mean im sure he doesnt mean to be this way and hes a very good looking dog.


i know my grammar is bad but any info of maybe meds or something to help him would mean all the world to me

thanks

[StaceyB]

It sounds like this dog has had very little or no training and he seems like he is not getting enough exercise. Whatever amount of exercise he gets double it. I would also get him enrolled in training classes. He doesn't learn manners on his own. He needs to be taught. What breed is he?

[Sneaky]

Yes,
I would say your best option for this dog is
to train him.
You cant expect the dog to learn the rules on his
own. Training classes would be excellent for you.
Also, dogs often chew things they are supposed to
when they arent getting enough exercise or mental
stimulation. Perhaps a few new toys and bones and
some more fetch and some walks may help in your training
process.

[shannonRN]

Yes, lots and lots of activity and mental stimulation, which includes training. Train useful commands, like come and stay, but train tricks, games and whatever else you can do to keep this guy busy. "Drop" would be a really good command for this guy.

Dog-proof the place as much as you can. Everything out of reach. My GSD ate everything and anything when he was younger--pulled curtains off the wall, blankets off the bed, ate books, remote controls, shoes, and just anything he could reach if we got sloppy and left something around. You need to make these things very inaccessible and then reinforce him for using the toys you provide for him. I would only reintroduce these things gradually when you get his behavior under control and he reliably uses doggie toys.

I would crate train him for the times you are not there to keep him and your house safe, but keep in mind that he should not be crated for prolonged periods of time and confining him may make the problem worse, in a way. He will need that much more activity and stimulation when he is 'free.'

This dog sounds like he could have used a really experienced dog owner/trainer, but do your best and don't give up on the guy.

[theduke]

thanks guys i also realize now this is the wrong forum for this post. to asnwer some questions the dog i guess is a black lab but his short hair i would say is kind of rough. i really have no idea what he is. now for the training i really cant afford that right now but when this is possible i will for sure. i mean yes i guess i could learn how to train my dog before i can take him to a pro? he actually has another dog to play with (sorry forgot) but he chews on her the whole time so yeah he just goes for walks and i guess thats about all he does

i wont give up ever on this dog no matter what hes already ruined tons of stuff. i kind of feel cheated right now because this dog was replacing my golden retiver that died in 2003. she would sleep with me i mean she was just a perfect loving dog but right now this dog )satan dog) doesnt feel like my dog. ill admit right now i was looking for the easy way out thats why i didnt buy a puppy i was hoping this wouldnt have been a problem if i got a older dog

[Roxy's_MA]

Well, another upside to getting the adult dog is you saved a life

Maybe you could get a book to help you with the training at home until you can afford to take her to obedience. Good Luck!!

[StaceyB]

Why do you thnk that you posted in the wrong forum?
Labs need to have a lot of exercise. You can also teach your dog a few manners and simple cues to get you started but adding to your exercise program will make a big difference. Check out training facilities in your area, you may be able to find one who will offer a payment plan. You will need to train this dog as if it were an 8 wk old puppy. He has no useful skills yet and will need to learn them. Nothing you are going to do will be a quick fix but there are things you can do to make life a little easier while he learns the rules.

[Roxy's_MA]

I think the OP meant that it should be under training and not Pet health.

[justncase]

Your dog sounds abused(previous owners), hyper, and may possibly have pica, a condition caused by malnutrition whereby an animal will chew, lick or eat all manner of inedible things. I don't know about putting training first for a dog like this. You may just drive him around the bend( if he isn't there already) I would say improve the diet to the best you can afford ,a really good high-quality dog food with meat not just corn and fillers and add lots of raw beef with the addition of plant-derived colloidal minerals , digestive enzymes, and probiotics foods . As for his behavior ( snapping, etc), if you really knew what he's been through you may wonder why he isn't acting alot worse. There are two Bach Flower Essences that should help - Vervain and Star of Bethlehem. 5 drops as needed on a little bit of wet food. Even every minutes.It's non-toxic so you can use it as much as you want and you can even add some to the water bowl( 10 drops ). A health food store should be able to help you with buying the above items.

[coppperbelle]

Your dog sounds just like mine did 4 years ago. Sounds like he may have separation anxiety. Do you have a crate? This will help keep him safe when you are not home or able to watch him. I could not crate my dog as she would pee and poop in the crate and then walk in it. Needless to say there was an awful mess when I got home.
You can ask your vet for medication. I tried Clomicalm on my dog but it didn't really work. There are other medications available that may relieve some of the stress he is feeling.
How long have you had him? It took my dog months for mine to settle in and begin to trust. She still has some issues with trust and probably will for the rest of her life.
For now give him lots of exercise.
I want to commend you on adopting this dog and your committment to keeping it. With time and patience I am sure you will be rewarded with a great companion.

[raingirl]

If you need a suggestion on a training book, get "Teach yourself visually-Dog Training". Here is a link so you can see what it looks like:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...books&n=507846

It's a positive based training book, and most of the trainers are super dog trainers (including one that I went to who was a consultant for the book).

It's a really good book for teaching step by step.

[StaceyB]

So many dogs who have not been socialized come across as a dog who has been abused. I don't think this is an abused dog. I think somes rules and more exercise will solve the problems.
If this dog were 3 months old showing the same behaviours what would you say. This dog has as much training as a very young puppy so the same training steps need to be taken.

[justncase]

Originally Posted by StaceyB

If this dog were 3 months old showing the same behaviours what would you say. This dog has as much training as a very young puppy so the same training steps need to be taken.

If the puppy came from a kill shelter, I'd probably say the same. Some dogs have been driven stark raving mad when rules and training were pushed too early, especially when they came from a history of abuse.

[StaceyB]

Different opinions I guess. I would say the opposite. I believe that when a routine has been set up and the dog knows what is expected of him the household environment will be far less stressful and he will begin to settle in and follow those rules. It will take a lot of patience and hard work because it is much easier to teach a new good behaviour than to change a bad one.

[justncase]

Originally Posted by StaceyB

Different opinions I guess. I would say the opposite. I believe that when a routine has been set up and the dog knows what is expected of him the household environment will be far less stressful and he will begin to settle in.

That would work if you had a normal dog under normal circumstances. In this case, it isn't.

[StaceyB]

Besides where he came from I didn't get any info that would state a bad history besides the fact that he is a year old with no training and mental/physical stimulation. Many shelters are kill shelters.
I would like to ask the op whether this dog is distructive only when he is home alone. He could have some degree of separation anxiety.

[theduke]

you guys are really great! i dont get near this much help comapred to other boards i go to (human health boards).

Roxy's_MA, i hate to admit this but at this point if i knew i didnt save his life he would have already been gone before i started to look for help for him

StaceyB, thanks for the info. i think he does have some traning though because he knows sit and lay and is potty trained. about the comment train him like a puppy thats a good way of putting it, he still has a puppy face too! ive had the dog i dont know maybe 5 months ago but like i said he was a yearold when i got him. what i see as abused might in fact be something else cause i dont know a lot about dogs ill admit. you gotta figure though why would someone take a real nice great looking dog to a kill shelter?

justncase, thanks i will for sure check out your diet info. my old school way of thinking is buy the cheapest dog food you can find. yes would make sense he was abused really i think this dog could drive a nun into abusing him. i really dont want to think what hes been through... it must have been a nightmare

raingirl, thanks a bunch for that book info.


coppperbelle, i have some crates (cat crates) this dog is just massive though so i would prob need to buy a dog cage and the pet stores around here when it comes to that kind of stuff are just plain scammers for what they charge. ill ask about that med thanks but when i posted that topic i was a little on edge so im gonna take it slow and try all this other stuff first. thanks for commending me on keeping the dog. the way i look at is: the dog may not be smart but what if he knows whats going on? i mean going from home to home and in the end be put down thats just not right. im hoping with the training and such and when he gets older he will calm down.


forgot to add i think hes also a little blind he doesnt know he can go though stuff when he can easily or he'll bump into things

[pamha]

If you have a farm & home type supply store (Big R here) they often have dog supplies cheaper than a pet store. We got a med. size dog crate for about $20 less than I`ve seen in pet stores.

[StaceyB]

The reason someone gave up a dog like him could be for the same behaviours that are driving you nuts. You would be surprised how many people get a dog and think that they just learn on their own how to behave well in the house. Did you get any history on him.
If you give me his size I will tell you what size crate you will need. His last home may have started training with him, probably in the first month they had him but quit or didn't follow through. A dog of his age should have more manners and skills by now. It may also be possible that he was kept outside. I have found that outside dogs house break very easily. This would also explain his lack of manners. Keep your receipt for the crate incase he has separation anxiety. Dogs with it will usually harm themselves trying to get out.

[justncase]

OP, you say you have a dog who " chews and i mean he chews wires, bottles, carpet, beds, walls, cats pretty much anything that can be chewed he chews."..... not only does he chew he also can't sit still for more than 5 seconds and he only sleeps like an hour a night" and you're thinking of crating this dog? In a confined space? If you think he's Satan's dog now wait til you crate him.

[jessi76]

Your dog is very lucky to have an owner like you, willing to work through it all.

You've gotten some excellent advice on many ways to help him, I just wanted to give you a suggestion on a crate (if you decide to go that route) - ebay has quite a few, ranging from $20-$300+... there may be one the size you need, and even with shipping, could be alot cheaper than buying new.

[Trinitie]

Justncase - not necessarily will the dog get worse if he's crated. Most dogs will sleep the day away if crated in a chew proof crate with something in there for them to chew on.

When the dog isn't crated, then it's in training. Consistency is the key to an unruly dog. Routine will help the dog understand their place in the "pack". Also remember "a tired dog is a good dog!" (credit Dr. Stanley Coren)

Is your dog food driven or praise driven? If food driven, keep treats in your pocket and have training sessions before feeding time. If praise driven, find a favorite toy and keep it on hand for a nice fuss-up session when the dog does good.

Kudos to you for adopting this unwanted slobber face!

[savannah]

I must say that this dog is very lucky to have you as an owner. many people would not be as dedicated as you are.

You have been given some really great advice (as this board always does) but i just wanted to add that i have a dog, with what my vet has termed "senility" and i think it is mixed with just plain Anxiety. I have tried the Bach's rescue remedy, a few drops as described above did not work for my dog. I tried a few homeopathic ways to get my dog to settle down, but they did not work so i went and spoke to my vet. At that point i was in tears because I was miserable with the lack of sleep. Since my dogs anxiety is only at night, we only give him the medication just before bed, and it mostly always works. I would suggest speaking to your vet if nothing else the other posters have mentioned works (which hopefully something will)
Someone else mentioned routine, and getting your dog used to a routine. I really recommend that as well. I have found my rescue dog to be "satans dog" when we break the day to day routine. When we follow our regular routine, he knows what's going on, and sleeps through the night. When we have had a hectic day, not even the full amount of meds the doc recommended works. (right now i only give him a half as opposed to the 1 - 3 pills vet recommended).
Good luck!

[justncase]

Concerning the comments:

Trinitie:
"Most dogs will sleep the day away if crated in a chew proof crate with something in there for them to chew on."

Reply:
This isn't " most" dogs. This is an abused, hyper, malnourished(in other words, starving for the proper food) dog suffering from a number of emotional problems one of which most certainly is, as someone mentioned, seapration anxiety and this does not fit the norm of what can be described as " most dogs".

Savannah:
" i just wanted to add that i have a dog, with what my vet has termed "senility" and i think it is mixed with just plain Anxiety. I have tried the Bach's rescue remedy, a few drops as described above did not work for my dog. I tried a few homeopathic ways to get my dog to settle down, but they did not work so i went and spoke to my vet. "

Reply:
Bach Flower Essences are not a willynilly art. It's not possible to pick one essence and hope it covers the emotional need then say they don't work . What your vet described as " senility" and what you term as " anxiety" may not be what your dog was experiencing at all. BFE's are exactly tailored to the exact need of the pet. There are at least 6 for fear alone depending on the type of fear experienced.

OP, meet the nutritional needs of your dog, first. That is his first great need. In other words, feed your dog the best nutrition you can afford, lots of raw beef and the supplements I listed previously. IMO, just go with that for a couple of weeks. Sure you can drug a dog who is half-starved , and you can crate him , and you can try to make him conform to a list of rules and regulations, maybe all that later, but you may not have to , later, if you give your dog what he needs now. The proper nutrition , and I don't mean just an expensive bag of dog food, but that and lots of raw beef and the supplements I mentioned. Go with that and see what you're dealing with in a couple of weeks. You may find that you have a different dog, not one who is not half-crazed from malnutrition so much so that he's hyper, can't sleep and eating everything in sight to try and fill that nutritional void he feels.

[StaceyB]

Originally Posted by justncase

Concerning the comments:

Reply:
This isn't " most" dogs. This is an abused, hyper, malnourished(in other words, starving for the proper food) dog suffering from a number of emotional problems one of which most certainly is, as someone mentioned, seapration anxiety and this does not fit the norm of what can be described as " most dogs".

I read through the op's posts again and didn't see anywhere that all of what you stated above is the case.

Though he may have some form of separation anxiety. He may just be very confused as to what is going to happen on a daily basis, constant guessing is stressful. Setting up a consistant routine will most likely help him to calm because he will know what is expected of him. If a dog has not been taught how to behave in our world they won't. A crate may very well help him. It is possible that being left in large open spaces(home) is more stressful and creates more anxiety than having a comfortable den to know he is safe.
Daily exercise, training and routine are an absolute need for this dog.

[Trinitie]

I re-read the original post and have come up with the best solution.

It's almost impossible to say with certainty if this dog was abused or not. It sounds to me like the dog was dumped because of his behavioral problems.

A dog that snaps when annoyed, or if you're trying to take something away from it, is a dog that's not properly trained. This would explain why it's jumpy and nervous. Most dogs who've been allowed to be in charge of the family pack are very nervous and unsure of themselves. Especially at just over a year old.

"Most" dogs will lie in a kennel/crate and sleep refers to just that - most dogs. To begin training this dog properly, crate training is a must. This dog is acting out because he doesn't know any better. He needs structure in his life. Crate training gives him that. It also gives him a safe sanctuary to retreat to when he feels threatened.

This dog sleeps only an hour a night. He needs more excercise during the day. Make him tired at bed time. Put him in his crate, by your bed, at bed time and if he starts to whine/whimper, correct him by hushing him.

This dog needs to be treated like a puppy. He may be housebroken, but he has the manners of a puppy - none. You must become his alpha.

YOU set the feeding schedule - NO free feeding for him (yet)
YOU tell him what he can and cannot play with
YOU tell him what rooms he's allowed to go into when you're not there
YOU tell him what direction to walk in when you're out for walks

YOU are in charge NOT him! Structure. This dog needs structure.

[StaceyB]

I see many dogs like this in my profession and in almost all cases the dog has had no training(manners) and proper socialization, the dog has learned to make his own decisions because his/ her person had not taken this role. The dog has had little or no regular tiring exercise and finds ways to get rid of it on their own, distructive/anxious behaviour. It is very rare that these dogs had been abused.
In almost every case the behaviours can be corrected with exercise, socialization and training.
The majority of dogs are given up because of bad behaviours.

[justncase]

In the above two replies no one has addressed the reason for this behavior ( posted by OP) :

"I bought this dog from a kill shelter and when i got him he was over a year old. now, this dog chews and i mean he chews wires, bottles, carpet, beds, walls, cats pretty much anything that can be chewed he chews. he has many many real bones (the ones that cost a lot) and the bones that can be easily chewed."

No amount of crating or training is going to give a malnourished dog what he needs. Chewing wires, bottles , carpet, beds, walls, etc is a sign of pica pure and simple. In fact it is a standard textbook case. Fix that first.

Abused? Let's see what the OP had to say ( and he's seen the dog and has lived with him for a year)

" im almost postive he was abused by his old owners "

If the dog is as impossible to live with as the OP has said, can abuse be ruled out completely somewhere in this dog's history? And how was that abuse distributed- emotional? physical? dietary?
As far as I'm concerned, OP, deal with the pica first. Feed your dog the best you can afford with the added supplements mentioned and see what kind of
dog you have in two weeks. You may be pleasantly surprised.

[StaceyB]

I think we have addressed it and offered solutions for the behaviour. Though a better quality diet would be great I don't think it is the cause of his behaviour. He has only had this dog 5 months and did say that he hasn't done any training. There has also been a comparison of their last dog(well behaved) and this one and may be having a difficult time bonding with him.

[Trinitie]

Originally Posted by justncase

In the above two replies no one has addressed the reason for this behavior ( posted by OP) :

"I bought this dog from a kill shelter and when i got him he was over a year old."

No amount of crating or training is going to give a malnourished dog what he needs. Chewing wires, bottles , carpet, beds, walls, etc is a sign of pica pure and simple. In fact it is a standard textbook case. Fix that first.

Why do you insist this dog has pica? The dog chews. Plain and simple. My puppy chews anything she can get her mouth on, and she doesn't have pica. It's a training issue, otherwise we could accuse the OP of keeping the dog malnourished. Nowhere does the OP state that the dog is not eating his food. He simply states that the dog is chewing anything and everything. Please do not read more into it than is stated.

Abused? Let's see what the OP had to say ( and he's seen the dog and has lived with him for a year)

The OP simply states that the dog was adopted at over a year old to replace the companion lost in 2003. The OP does not say that they've HAD the dog for over a year. The OP states they've had the dog only 5 months, and the dog is still a puppy.

" im almost postive he was abused by his old owners "

If the dog is as impossible to live with as the OP has said, can abuse be ruled out completely somewhere in this dog's history? And how was that abuse distributed- emotional? physical? dietary?
As far as I'm concerned, OP, deal with the pica first. Feed your dog the best you can afford with the added supplements mentioned and see what kind of
dog you have in two weeks. You may be pleasantly surprised.

The OP says that they THINK the dog has been abused. Yes, the dog may have been abused, that's not being ruled out. BUT, it does primarily appear to be a training issue. Only telling the OP to work on pica and feed the dog the "best you can afford with the added supplements" is NOT the way to go. The most expensive food does not guarantee the BEST food. With the best food, supplements are not needed.

OP - I highly recommend you talk to a behaviourist to rule out temperment issues. If the temperment of the dog is good, and it's only a training issue, then you can easily get a handle on this out of control pup.

Your dog needs to be exercised by walking him, not just plunking him in the back yard with another dog to play. They will not exercise themselves enough to burn the excess energy. Once you find yourself taking the dog on evening walks, just before bed, you'll find that the dog will sleep for more than an hour a night. Other than that, follow the simple training methods mentioned above. The dog must earn it's freedom in the house. Simply giving the dog the freedom you "think" it needs isn't the way to go. If you do grant too much freedom and allow the dog to do what it wants, you've giving the dog the rights to make its own rules as it goes along. Something you definately don't want to do. Once you keep this dog in line, you may find that it's a good companion, just like your long lost friend.