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Old December 5th, 2005, 03:38 PM
Mrs Bungle Mrs Bungle is offline
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ALLL pitbulls at the Toronto Humane Society

My fiance and I went out to the humane society on the weekend and it was ALL pits.. Like maybe 5 dogs of other breeds (including a BEAUTIFUL Presa Canario) and the rest were all Pittys...

Now heres the question, WHY? Okay, I realize that theres the new ban and stuff but were these pits dropped off becuase they were agressive? did the owners of these dogs drop them off here becuase they felt they couldnt deal with the ban? were the owners afraid of the dogs or something? I dont get it.. why would you get rid of your dog?!??!

Someone fill me in please....

Oh, and one more question.. This thing with all the "pit bulls" or other selected breeds, attacking people, dogs, etc.. is this a new thing, or has this just been getting way too much media attention and thats why this ban was put into place?

sorry for the silly questions, but i had to ask....
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Old December 5th, 2005, 04:37 PM
Me and Kayla Me and Kayla is offline
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Originally Posted by Mrs Bungle
My fiance and I went out to the humane society on the weekend and it was ALL pits.. Like maybe 5 dogs of other breeds (including a BEAUTIFUL Presa Canario) and the rest were all Pittys...

Now heres the question, WHY? Okay, I realize that theres the new ban and stuff but were these pits dropped off becuase they were agressive? did the owners of these dogs drop them off here becuase they felt they couldnt deal with the ban? were the owners afraid of the dogs or something? I dont get it.. why would you get rid of your dog?!??!

Someone fill me in please....

Oh, and one more question.. This thing with all the "pit bulls" or other selected breeds, attacking people, dogs, etc.. is this a new thing, or has this just been getting way too much media attention and thats why this ban was put into place?

sorry for the silly questions, but i had to ask....
No such thing as a silly question, and I'm certainly not the best authority to answer your questions, but I'll give it a shot.

As a Pitty owner, because of this ban, we have been put into a position of FEAR. Fear of our dogs doing anything that any other dog would do, but we are now under an unreasonable law that states that the authorities can enter our house without a warrant and take our pets, arrest us, and ultimately charge us with a potential 10,000 fine or 6 months in jail. We are even afraid of our neighbours. People we used to wave to, as we walked our dogs are now in a position to cause us extreme hardship.

Dogs attacking dogs and people is nothing new. Pitties are NOT the only dogs that can do this. In fact, they have a much lower ratio than many other breeds. This IS about media hype and VOTES.

People are being forced to weigh out the love for their pet with the potential hazzards of owning him/her. No one should be put in this position, but we are. Some people can deal with it and some can't so they choose to relinquish their pets. If the dogs were very aggressive, the Humane Society would not allow them for re-adoption.

Me and Kayla
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Old December 5th, 2005, 08:37 PM
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Other than the fact that if they are found guilty of any violation the dog will be destroyed and the owner subject to jail time and a fine owners of pit bulls and pit bull mixes are now second class citizens who are subject to terrible slurs, insults and even violence (how dangerous can these dogs be if a woman walking one can be attacked). Some people can’t take that so they give up their dog.

Sure you can complain about harassment but it would have to be pretty severe for the police to lay a charge. Of course if you stand up to somebody they just have to say you threatened them with the dog. You don’t dare make a stand. Reminds me of a Bob Seger song.

Well, you walk into a restaurant
Strung out from the road
And you feel the eyes upon you
As you're shaking off the cold
You pretend it doesn't bother you
But you just want to explode


Most times you can't hear 'em talk
Other times you can
Oh, the same old clichés

Is that a woman or a man
And you always seem outnumbered
You don't dare make a stand


Although I am the owner of a non-pitbull type dog legally evaluated and registered in a city, which had BSL long before the provincial ban went in, I occasionally get comments and looks from idiots. Just not to my face.

When my girlfriend is walking our other dog far enough behind me so that it appears she isn’t with me she hears something that just ticks me off but she doesn’t tell me until it’s too late to say anything. She hears one of the two women that just passed my dog and I on a sidewalk (that I stepped off of to allow them to pass) say to the other “one of those ripped my neighbour’s kid’s face off’ If I had heard I could of turned around and asked them “Was that a Rhodesian or a Doberman that did that”.

When a carload of kids screams out the window of their car ‘muzzle that killer’ I thank god when they get a red light so I can quietly look at the little jerks as I pass them. Then they don’t say a word or even look in my direction, the spineless little Bryants that they are.

Imagine that EVERY DAY if you own a pit and you may begin to understand how some people could just walk away.
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Old December 5th, 2005, 08:47 PM
Mrs Bungle Mrs Bungle is offline
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I see what your saying...

That really does suck.... Have they set forth plans to ban other breeds of dog? How can they pass this law, if statistically pitbulls are not any different then any other type of dogs?
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Old December 5th, 2005, 08:59 PM
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Great answers Me and Kayla and Two Dogs, Mrs. Bugle if you really want to know if pit bulls are aggressive to humans there are great web sites and for a complete impartial answer you could read the testimonys by experts at the four days of committee hearings, but the short answer is that they have never been bread for human agression. I too am a "pittie owner" and for the past two years have had nothing as prominant in my life as this potential ban and the responses I get from the public. Most these days, are positive, but I have lived, and do live, in absolute fear, that someday someone will knock on my door and seize my dog over some unfounded allogation. For at least a year and a half I was terrified that I would need liability insurance and since I have just opened a small business I would not be able to obtain it, and then....the knock on the door. No insurance, we kill your dog! My dog cowers from me when its time to go out, because he hates his muzzle so much. With all of this I would never give up my dog, and I actually think the bond between the two of us has strengthend because of this but I want the quality of life back for my boy and alll of the rest of the victims of this whitch hunt. I cant even think about the escalation of the abuse of these dogs since this crap with Bryant has started, the abuse and the MURDERS! Its a night mare, you asked if the media is overplaying this, Yes they are, they report pit bull incidents and not incidents involving other breeds, they also report "pit bull" incidents that infact were not commited by pit bulls. Bill 132 is based on Urban Myth and its sole purpose was to elevate the career of one Weasle of a politicion Michael Bryant. But thankyou for asking the questions, far too many people just make assumptions or just take the media at face value. If more people took the time to ask questions we wouldnt be in this mess! :
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Old December 5th, 2005, 09:06 PM
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Hard to believe isn’t it?

How? They have a majority government, that’s how.

Why? Well that’s another story altogether. The number one reason that many suspect was that it provided a nice diversion from real issues of public safety they ignored, an illegal tax increase they called a premium, about 100 broken promises and a possible payback to real estate developers whom made large payments shortly before a greenbelt law was passed where the lines suddenly shifted in the developer’s favour. It provided a high profile issue where the impending fight was great for any newspaper that needed a headline. It’s called scapegoating and it works.

There are no plans to expand it. Then again the same liar that brought the ban in is the man that made that statement so you never know.

The first court case to challenge this law will be in May. Either way it will be a long fight. It will probably be dirty too, but then again so will the election in 2007.
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Old December 5th, 2005, 09:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrs Bungle
I see what your saying...

That really does suck.... Have they set forth plans to ban other breeds of dog? How can they pass this law, if statistically pitbulls are not any different then any other type of dogs?
They ingnored facts and went with what they wanted to hear, Bryant himself got all the media he wanted for the banning of Pit bulls but the leg. leaves the door open for some other sleaze ball to try and score politicl points by banning other breeds. Breed bans have been proven not to increase public safety. Other juristictions like Calgary have sensible laws which include public education and mandatory spaying and nuetering for all dogs of pet quality. We advocataed for this approach and got no where! We are still advocating for sensible legislation that is not breed specific and would be named for Courtney Trempe, a young girl who was killed by a dog, the dog was not a pit bull. Courtneys mothers testimony was ignored by the provincial liberals. There was a coroners report that included 33 reccomendions, none of them breed specific, which was also mostly, ingnored.
:sad:
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Old December 5th, 2005, 09:21 PM
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It is sad that people are surrendering and dumping their dogs. It has always happened, but because of this law so many people just don't want to deal with it and more and more pitbulls are being abandoned.
Many pitbulls in Humane society shelters and SPCA shelters are usually evaluated for their behaviour, before being placed for adoption.
Nothing tends to be wrong with dogs in the shelter, often there is something wrong with their previous owner(s).

I fostered a 5 year old APBT in September that had been dumped one day before the Ontario ban took effect in August. In the middle of the day he had been let out of a vehicle on a country road (it was witnessed). This was one of the sweetest dogs I have ever encountered. He was extremely well mannered, extremely friendly and so easy to care for. Such a loving boy. It is amazing that anyone could have just dumped him like a piece of trash. He was intact, so we got him neutered and utd on shots, hw tested, etc. He is now living in an amazing home, with wonderful people and pitbull/mastiff sister in North Carolina, thankfully out of Ontario. He is one of the lucky ones, so many others start off with a similar story of being dumped by their owners for inconvenience, but don't end up with a happy ending.
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Old December 6th, 2005, 09:09 PM
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Yes it certainly is a sad situation.It has been proven that one of the benifits of owning a dog is stress reduction in day to day life.Now that the ban is here it has made owning a pitbull a day to day nightmare for many people.Ill bet that for every dog thats been taken to the pound there are 10 that have been let loose as strays.If the government thinks there is a dog problem now just wait untill these stray pitbulls breed with wolves,coyotes and each other and produce puppies which become packs of wild dogs.Long live the pittys!!!
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Old December 6th, 2005, 10:34 PM
Me and Kayla Me and Kayla is offline
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Originally Posted by Watchdog
Yes it certainly is a sad situation.It has been proven that one of the benifits of owning a dog is stress reduction in day to day life.Now that the ban is here it has made owning a pitbull a day to day nightmare for many people.Ill bet that for every dog thats been taken to the pound there are 10 that have been let loose as strays.If the government thinks there is a dog problem now just wait untill these stray pitbulls breed with wolves,coyotes and each other and produce puppies which become packs of wild dogs.Long live the pittys!!!
Good point! There is another issue that the government has not taken into consideration.

Like Rocky, my pittie is getting down-right phobic about her muzzle and I'm finding that in social situations, she is fine with dogs her size or smaller, but she is getting aggressive with the bigger dogs. I think she feels her vulnerability with them with the muzzle on, which of course is doing nothing for my frame of mind lately. This law is going to turn well behaved, gentle and social dogs into nervous nillies. Keeping them social is becoming a very stressful and full-time job.

Me and Kayla
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Old December 6th, 2005, 11:30 PM
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Unhappy Sad for the Pitties and AmStaffs ect.

I truely feel for all the Pittie and "pittie type" dog owners. I have never owned a pitbull, I am a Rottie girl myself but it breaks my heart what you are dealing with everyday! I have a Rottie/Boxer mix who just so happens to be brindle, therefore I have unfortunately had a few comments thrown my way! Some of the public has the mental capacity of a goose when it comes to dogs! I get frustrated just hearing the comments in general about Pitbulls.Of the very few (3) real live pits I have ever had the pleasure to meet i could not for the life of me understand the "HYPE" Those 3 dogs were all very well mannered and quite frankly the cuddlyest dogs I have ever met! I dont know many "Pit fighters" or serious "drug dealers" and so on so I guess the "REAL PITS" have never been exposed to me! I dont know? I respect the breed and what they, like any other dog, are capabul of! Just to let you all know I will be standing right up front with all of you dedicated and devoted Pit owners/fanciers right till the end of this rediculous law!
My heart goes out to all of the Pit,Amstaff and all anyother beloved pet that has been "dumped" due to this stupidity!:sad:
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Old December 7th, 2005, 01:16 AM
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http://www.austinlostpets.com/kidsko...er/pitbull.htm

I have never owned a pitbull either. A few months ago I was walking Joey and I past this young women with what I think was a pitbull. Joey started lunging towards him so I was trying to walk by without letting Joey get too close, as Joey was dog aggressive especially with larger male dogs.

The women said dont worry hes friendly and likes other dogs too. I felt like a shmuck here I am holding back my cocker spaniel that is probably more aggressive then her pitbull. Her dog just wagged his tail at us. I told her I was just working on our dog with his aggression towards other dogs. Hopefully she didnt think I was one of those typical "oh my God its a pitbull people"
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Old December 7th, 2005, 07:33 AM
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Thanks for asking Mrs Bungle, Not many people outside the pitty world really know what this ban is about or based on, and don't seem to realize there breed could be next. One other reason there are so many pits there, is not because so many are being dropped of, but when people go to the humane society to look for a dog, thats exatly what they are looking for a "DOG" not a "pit bull" after the hate campain run by the Liberals, so many of these sweet inocent dogs are trapped there, because the Liberals have taught people to hate and fear these wonderfull inocent dogs, so there is not much hope for them:sad:
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Old December 7th, 2005, 09:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluntman
One other reason there are so many pits there, is not because so many are being dropped of, but when people go to the humane society to look for a dog, thats exatly what they are looking for a "DOG" not a "pit bull" after the hate campain run by the Liberals, so many of these sweet inocent dogs are trapped there, because the Liberals have taught people to hate and fear these wonderfull inocent dogs, so there is not much hope for them:sad:
I would have to agree with this, that the pitties are getting looked over, however, I also believe that, thankfully, the humane society is being more cautious with whom they adopt these dogs to. If you go to the adoptions page on their website, you will find that some of the dogs have info on their profile and many are only being adopted out to certain types of homes, people who have successfully owned a pit bull before, homes without children or cats, or other dogs.
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Old December 7th, 2005, 09:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Me and Kayla
Good point! There is another issue that the government has not taken into consideration.

Like Rocky, my pittie is getting down-right phobic about her muzzle and I'm finding that in social situations, she is fine with dogs her size or smaller, but she is getting aggressive with the bigger dogs. I think she feels her vulnerability with them with the muzzle on, which of course is doing nothing for my frame of mind lately. This law is going to turn well behaved, gentle and social dogs into nervous nillies. Keeping them social is becoming a very stressful and full-time job.

Me and Kayla
This is why I am going to hold weekly play times for Pits and crosses(Pit play). In all of my training I have yet to see an aggressive pit. I feel that this ban is going to produce aggressive dogs, not get rid of them. Since these dogs no longer have the option of playing off leash with other dogs I figure if I offer this out of my business atleast the Ottawa pits will still have a place to go and socialize.
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Old December 7th, 2005, 10:48 AM
Mrs Bungle Mrs Bungle is offline
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Thank you guys for the answers!!! I just like to know stuff before i go around making judgment calls.. i would hope most people would do the same.. its just sad seeing them all in those kennels....

Its funny because, almost ALL of the dogs that acted agressivley or barked like crazy when we were there, were non pit-bull type dogs... My fiance and I were commenting on generally how calm (mind you they also looked very sad) the pits were.....

Its really sad... I hope the "hype" gets put into perspective and people stop being so ignorant....
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Old December 7th, 2005, 05:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrs Bungle
Thank you guys for the answers!!! I just like to know stuff before i go around making judgment calls.. i would hope most people would do the same.. its just sad seeing them all in those kennels....

....
Unfortunately many people do not do the same mrs. Bungle but thanks again for keeping an open mind! So now you can spread the 'good word" about bullies, and tell people you "consulted the experts LOL
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Old December 7th, 2005, 05:41 PM
Mrs Bungle Mrs Bungle is offline
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AHAHHA.. awsome....

i can be the go between *LOL*

i feel so important!!!! :queen:
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Old December 7th, 2005, 09:16 PM
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Back to the original thread

The Toronto Humane Society has been 90% full of Pit types for at least two years (as long as I've visited, longer i"m sure). Well before the legislation.
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Old December 7th, 2005, 09:27 PM
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True that..primarily because of irresponsible breeding...pitbulls are one of the most popular breeds in Ontario..you can pretty much find at least one in every neighborhood I'm sure. I guess Bryant never thought of that...idiot..

If Husky's were the most popular breed, they'd be filling up shelters. If you go to Calgary...the HS there has tons of labs and collies...because its a popular breed out there...same goes here...doesn't really have to do anything with anything else...of course, there are also just dumb people overall that get the dogs because they look "cool"..and realize that they need alot of exercise and attention..and are a handful of energy..but of course, I guess idiots expect dogs to be like plants and just sit still and be watered...*shakes head*

So far, only about three people within the last 3-4 months have abandoned their dogs because of the legislation...and one of them was really stupid...the daughter wanted to keep the dog but the mother (who owned the rental unit), didn't want to get a bad reputation..it was supposedly some posh area...*rolls eyes*
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Old December 8th, 2005, 06:30 AM
Me and Kayla Me and Kayla is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pitbulliest

So far, only about three people within the last 3-4 months have abandoned their dogs because of the legislation...and one of them was really stupid...the daughter wanted to keep the dog but the mother (who owned the rental unit), didn't want to get a bad reputation..it was supposedly some posh area...*rolls eyes*
I have visited the Newmarket HS many times and have only ever seen one pittie in there at a time, but who have all been adopted out to wonderful families. Maybe the 'country people' don't feel quite the pressure that us city folks do because they have more open spaces to sneek their pets into for a good run?

Me and Kayla
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Old December 8th, 2005, 10:58 AM
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I always check the humane society website to see what dogs are there, and I have seen two pitties in the last 4 months. Like Pittbulliest said, they are full of Labs and Border Collies out here in Alberta.
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Old December 9th, 2005, 09:25 AM
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It doesn't help that the THS islocated beside Regent's Park, Canada's first and worst housing project.
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Old December 9th, 2005, 09:38 AM
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I live quite close to the THS, and most of the people I see surrendering their dogs, cats, ferrets,etc. drive there.
There are other types of dogs there too, they don't always put them on the online posts, because they get adopted out too quickly, and it seems they don't feel a need to post them until they have been there for a certain amount of time.
I also happen to know that the people from regent park have worked very hard to clean up their community, there was only one incident of gun violence this summer.
Personally, I think the worst part about regent park is not the people who live there, but the people who come from other places to peddle their wares, and even worse, the people who drive around buying them.
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Old December 9th, 2005, 09:44 AM
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Ok, how do I put this in a delicate way w/o coming across ignorant.
In some of the lower income areas there seems to be many of these breeds that don't get fixed or trained and are able to run the neighbourhoods which means many, many puppies. These dogs may or may not find homes and seem to be given up too easily when they don't behave.
I believe this is why the HS is full of them. They are cheap to get in these areas and in turn easy to get rid of. On the flip side many do go into good homes where they are trained and fixed.
I sure hope this came out the right way.
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Old December 9th, 2005, 10:00 AM
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I don't think you're coming across as ignorant, but I do think that you are mistaking poor people for poor pet owners. I'm sure there are just as many people who can afford to have their pets spayed or neutered, who just don't bother. Being poor doesn't make you a bad person, or a bad pet owner, for that matter. it only makes it harder to get out of poverty.
If you read the info on the THS website, you'll see that most of the animals that come in have already been altered prior to them being in the shelter system, indicating that the people who are giving their pets up are giving them up for reasons other than poverty.

Last edited by papillonmama; December 9th, 2005 at 10:20 AM.
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Old December 9th, 2005, 10:22 AM
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Sorry, I didn't intend to say that not having money makes you a bad pet parent. There are many who are great parents.
I know that there are many reasons why people give up their pets whether they have money or not and there are exceptions to everything. I don't know how to write exactly what I am thinking.
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Old December 9th, 2005, 11:36 AM
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Sadly, many people who have serious money get pets thinking they are like stuffed toys - they don't have bodily functions like the rest of us. They don't have particular body odor - some breeds more than others. One fellow asked me how long his dog would smell like a puppy - I told him until he started to smell like a full grown dog. They put rose geranium talc on the puppy to try and mask the smell - with of course the resulting skin condition. Dog was returned to breeder.
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Old December 9th, 2005, 12:06 PM
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Our HS is in kinda of a crappy industrial area closer to the lower income areas. I thought humane societes rented in these locations because the rent is most likely less and they can spend more on actual programs for the animals.
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Old December 9th, 2005, 12:18 PM
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If thats the case.. they shouldnt be open in down town toronto at all!!

Everyone knows its alot more expensive generally down there...
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