Chosing a dog for obidience and agility...

[pick]

Hi I have been 2 months looking books and internet about dogs for agility and obidience. Since from 60 days I have choosed a portuguese pondengo, but since I have been visiting school dogs and talking with (creators/breeders??
I'm sorry, I am portuguese and I just have a little dificultie to translate: how I say somoene who always have dogs breeding with race for sale??)

Well the point is: they told me that all what I have been searched is wrong or not correctly at all. I don't know what to do, woh we choose a good dog for agility/obidience?

By the way: I live in apartment, sow it's good if he gets well in a place with any garden or like that (but with a lot of walks and exercises_the best I could get to himXD)

Can any1 else hope me choosing? I'm confused... =(

[hedgiemama]

Any dog can be good for obedience, its all about how you train them. If you put alot of time in to training your pup it can be an obedience star. Also any dog can do agility, some might be better suited though, you see a lot of border collies, shelties and quicker dogs doing it, you dont too often see something like a newfoundland dog doing agility, although it is possible. Try looking at a shelter you might find the perfect dog there.

[chico2]

Hi Pick,it's a little confusing,you want a dog who can do agility,but you say he will only get one hour of exercise a day.
Agility training and doing,probably takes a little more than 1 hour/day.
Good luck in your search and let us know what you picked,ok

[pick]

Originally Posted by chico2

Hi Pick,it's a little confusing,you want a dog who can do agility,but you say he will only get one hour of exercise a day.
Agility training and doing,probably takes a little more than 1 hour/day.
Good luck in your search and let us know what you picked,ok

more than 1???

I thought that was lot for tham, how much they can take??



P.S: by the way, I have edit the post for more easely understanding ok?

[hedgiemama]

some dogs one hour of exercise would by okay for, but high energy dogs like labs, border collies, aussies, boxers, pit bulls, jack russell terriers. If you only have 1 hour a day to exercise them maybe something with less energy would suit you better such as a **** tzu (such hreat little dogs ) daushcands, you have lots of possibilites. good luck,let us know what you pick

[Longblades]

Perhaps you have edited your post but I don't see anything about the dog getting only one hour of exercise a day. Assuming that's the part you edited I have to say how much I agree.

Your dog will not likely need an hour of training a day, probably that's way too much. But to excel in agility your dog will have to be conditioned. I think you need to examine how far you might want to go on both sides. Agility is very physically demanding and even advanced obedience is going to require a certain level of fitness for the jumping involved. It's a big, big, big committment for both of you. That's why my first Lab and I quit agility. The darn dog just kept getting better and better at it and I did not have the time to devote to the conditioning and training she needed to keep competing.

My current Lab, three years old, needs more than an hour a day of off leash running simply to dispel his high level of energy.

More and more where I am agility classes are offered for fun with no intention of competition. Maybe this would suit you?

I do have to laugh a bit because you did not mention the Portuguese Water Dog. My sister's trainer breeds these dogs and also teaches obedience and agility. Her dogs are her best examples though she does not seriously compete, just trials now and then for fun.

I have never heard of the Portuguese Podengo. I googled them and it seems to me the smaller, smooth coated type rather resembles an Ibizan hound. Lovely looking dogs. Like the Ibizan the PP is a sighthound and a hunter. At the following link it says they enjoy agility.

http://www.canadasguidetodogs.com/podengo.htm

When my girl and I were trialing in agility the dog most serious competitors had were either Border Collies or Jack Russels. My trainer used to say, "oh you poor people whose dogs are in the same height category as a BC or a Jack but aren't one of those breeds" LOL, her warped way to encourage us I guess.

But as said above many, many breeds enjoy and do well at either of the activites you mention. Many at both at the same time too. My trainer bred and trained Airedales. Other people in my classes had miniature Schnauzers, Labs, Keeshonds, Papillons, Shelties as well as the BC. The only dogs I remember doing very poorly at the agility was one Siberian (and just that particular dog, not the whole breed) and one poor little Basset who kept stepping on her ears when on the dog walk so it was not safe for her. She seemed to like it though.

I wonder if because the breed you have chosen is quite rare that the breeders you have contacted are very thoroughly scrutinizing potential buyers? My very brief bit of reading on them says they are primarily a hunting dog and perhaps the breeders want them to be used for the sport they were bred for? What did they tell you was wrong with the dog and the use you have in mind? Are you a first time dog owner? They do sound as if they need an experienced handler. Good luck, let us know how this turns out. It would be neat to see photos of a PP here, if you do get one.

[pick]

I have edited because in my idea, wich I'm not sure if I'm not correct, a agility/obidience dog of apartment just needs 1h or few more to exercise and dogs who requires more time can't leave in apartment, it was just with the intention to be more clear just that.

I always have sow that the obidience it was more a "playing-training", I mean not seriuous training but I confess that you have opened my eyes for something wich I'm wasn't seeing very clearly how distance is between agility and obidience, my mission now is to choose carefuly one of tham.

But by the way: if it needs more than 1h, if it necessary I have 3h or more, I have said 1h because I sow that agility dogs of an apartment just have energy for 1h and the ones who leaves in a big garden requires more time.
Since sow if 3h or more are necessary, sow it will be, time it's not my problem!

What's sow importante for you have mean the water dog by the way??
When you have that expression: "...but aren't one of those breeds". I just have make half of the translation could you explain from another way?


Just for to finish, you have said that if we would start for fun but the reason wich I hadn't mencion (my be I shoulded) it's because I want to make a first greed (or even second) in a cinotecnic bachelors. It's not just because I love tham I really want to work with tham and for this bachelors it has been explained to me that for to be a good canin monitor (if is this the correct translation) it's most usually recruted not just because he help, understand or any think else, but it must show good results in the competions showing that he work hard with their pets everyday. Well I get supose that the competion are just 50% of the requirements for to be a monitor.

I can't just be a lover dogs I need to work with tham...




P.S: water dog? just by curiosity is that o water dogwner portuguese?
Well it could be more easy for me to talk with him if he is member here of the forum (not saying that he's better to talk than the forum, just more easy to translate if he has the same nacionality )

[Longblades]

Don't worry, I think we are managing OK with the language.

When you have that expression: "...but aren't one of those breeds". I just have make half of the translation could you explain from another way?

When my trainer said this she meant that Border Collies and Jack Russel are SO GOOD at agility that the rest of us would have a hard time competing against them. It was partly a joke.

Here is a link to information on Portuguese Water Dogs: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portuguese_Water_Dog And from that same site:

In Portugal, the breed is called Cão de Água (pronounced Kow-the-Ah-gwa; literally "water dog"). In its native land, the dog is also known as the Algarvian Water Dog ("Cão de Água Algarvio"), or Portuguese Fishing Dog (Cão Pescador Português). Cão de Água de Pêlo Ondulado is the name given the wavy-haired variety, and Cão de Água de Pêlo Encaracolado is the name for the curly-coated variety

Sorry, I don't think the lady who breeds these dogs and trains my sister's dog in agility is a member here and even if she was I don't she speaks Portuguese.

The hours you need to work with your dog are not chipped in stone. It's just that the higher energy dogs who do seem to do well in a sport like agility tend to need more exercise. My own Lab boy, at about age one to two, absolutely needed an hour of running off leash in the morning and another at night. Now, at age three, an hour in one day is a short day for him. I think the point most of us are concerned about is you can't just slot the dog into your timetable and expect it to work. The dog may, is likely even, to require more than you think.

Not sure, this may be a language problem, but obedience and agility are quite different disciplines. It seemed to me you wanted a dog to do both with. That is a lot of work, and expense. Going to competitions is expensive, mostly because of the travel costs.

[Choochi]

I see a few problems with your plan.

If you want to be very competitive, it will be very hard to train the same dog to excell in both obedience and agility at the same time. They actually require very different reactions and behaviours from the dog. Agility requires a dog that does not look at you while running but takes directions, the dog also must make his own decisions to take equipment some times before or without you even giving the command. Obedience dogs on the other hand must listen to you with military precision, all of their movement is very precise and controlled, and the dog must maintain eye contact during most of the time while performing. As the end behaviours are very different, it is very hard, especially for a novice to train the same dog to a competitive level in multiple sports. In fact majority of the pros will have dogs specifically for each sport.

Not having prior experience with dog training, you can certainly compete, but it is highly unlikely that you will become a serious competitor, not just because of your dog, but because of your lack of experience. Hence, I don't think serious competition should be your goal. You would have a lot to learn about the sport and training involved before being ready for serious competition. That doesn't mean you can't do it for fun, in which case you can get any dog you like, even a mutt from the shelter or rescue group. I think your bigger concern should be picking a breed that best suits your lifestyle and who's personality and learning style best matches your own. You will be much happier with your dog this way.

Regarding the time spent on training, obviously the more time you can commit to the training the end result will be much better. With dog training however, you can't really train your dog for 1 or 2h straight. Their brains will fry. It is far more effective to have many short sessions through out the day, 5-15 min max per session. Your dog will learn faster, it will retain the knowledge faster, and the training will be fun.

For agility training, there is also the equipment. There is a lot of training you can do at home for basic agility handling skills, such as shadow handling, targeting, rear body awareness exercises, shaping certain behaviours, but at some point, you will need to train with the equipment. Once you are becoming better (especially if you live in an apt and don't have your own backyard where you could set up your own equimpent) this will mean traveling to a training facility to use their equipment. That will add to the time budget, and will also cost.

Obedience for the most part is far easier to teach at home as you don't require that much equipment for it.

In both cases you will need instruction, so the cost of classes evens out.

[pick]

Originally Posted by Longblades

The hours you need to work with your dog are not chipped in stone.

Not sure, this may be a language problem, but obedience and agility are quite different disciplines. It seemed to me you wanted a dog to do both with. That is a lot of work, and expense. Going to competitions is expensive, mostly because of the travel costs.

remember: I can be more than 1h, I just thought that's their limit that they can take, sow woh much they could fine for me. actually I pretend to take all my free time with him (by the way how we know that we aren't giving to much exercise to him?)
Time it's not problem for me if it is 3h or more he needs fine to me, fine and perfectly for me and it's better to take short sessions (more fine to me sow!)

Now: I never thought that agility/obedience could be soooww diferent realy. I always thouth that the obidience was a "1st degree" for to get well in agility but I have been reflecting in the Choochie words and I will choose the obidience!



Sowww, what I conclude for now is what race will be choosen for obidience (his charactheristics and temperament) and in theory studying all the obience notions (notions and metodology!).
Well gentleman I guess I have find my path before choose the one...



Thanks all you guys! =)