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  #31  
Old November 4th, 2006, 09:05 AM
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kimC1, is there anything about the way you contain the dog that could be changed to limit his access to any other cats? Is he allowed to roam around on your property unsupervised? Can you check your yard for cats each and everytime he goes out? If your yard isn't fenced, can you take him out on a long line?

I'm not at all trying to criticize, I too have two dogs with crazy prey drive and it takes alot to keep them and other animals out of trouble. I would be horrified if they ever got ahold of another animal, but that would be my failing, not the fault of the dogs.

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There is no way that I would "rehome" this dog. He will be 6yrs old in January and has not been raised around small children. He has never shown aggression towards children, adults and the neighbor's dogs but I could never forgive myself he he hurt someone.
I think it's very responsible of you to realize that re-homing him could be a disaster, but because finding a good home for a pitbull is hard enough, much less one who will take on a dog who is that intolerant of cats, not because he presents a danger to people. If the dog has never shown any aggression towards people, then his prey drive should not be any indication of the stability of his temperment in regards to humans. It's an entirerly different type of behavior.
  #32  
Old November 5th, 2006, 02:49 PM
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Did the attacks on the cats all occur outside?

Some dogs are fine with a cat that is indoors but outdoors if they see a cat run it simply becomes prey in their eyes like any other small animal outside.

Also do the JRT's play chase after the cat, if he is seeing that occur that can cause pack instinct to kick in.

I have greyhounds with a fairly high prey instinct between them and my eskie they have caught and killed birds and rabbits, my cats are kept strictly indoors and there is no chasing of the cats allowed for any reason, if they do they are corrected with a spray of water from a squirt bottle. Walking up to sniffing is fine This is not to say this would work for all dogs, any dog that you can break their focus on a cat or drool and stares just at the sight of a cat is going to be non cat trainable
  #33  
Old November 5th, 2006, 06:57 PM
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My dog has killed 3 cats.

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Originally Posted by happycats View Post
TD I think with Chico's situation, she had her cats first, and loves them very much, so if she got a dog and it killed her cats, rehoming the dog would make more sense no? (she is already attached to her cats)

I know if I now got a dog and it killed any of my cats I would have no choice but to rehome the dog.....but then again I would never ever get a dog that killed cats, (and no I'm not talking about Pits, many breeds can and will kill cats) I would research research research, before I bring a dog into my home.

I think the only answer for you KimC, is to try not to attract stray cats, and don;t ever own one. I don't think your dog will change, and no I don't blame your dog, this is just something he does, instinct.

Ummm I had a standard poodle that hated small animals and if given a chance would not hesitate to kill them. It is not necessarily the breed of dog although some breeds are more prone to this behavior but the dog itself. I have two golden retreivers, one has an extremely high prey drive while the other has none at all.
I think it is very unfortunte that your dog is like this but I think you will either have to re-home him or get rid of your cats. They obviously cannot live safely in your home or in your yard while the dog is around.
  #34  
Old November 6th, 2006, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by jesse's mommy View Post
Not another one....:sad:
Isn't the point of the forum to share one's opinion in order to try and help one another whether we agree or not. Is it appropriate to make comment on others opinions in such a close-minded way, as if to single them out????? This was neither warranted nor appreciated!!!! If you wish to challenge someone's thoughts do so in a PM or a more tactful fashion, thanks.
  #35  
Old November 6th, 2006, 07:16 PM
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Unfortunately Pit Bulls were bred to fight to the death, a dispicable fact which says a lot about humans. It is in their genes, an instinct.The best fighters with the strongest instincts were the ones often bred. Many Pits cannot resist the instinct...not all...but some. That's why I'm in agreement with muzzling in public, and responsible Pit Bull ownership...not breed-bans. I've heard way too many stories of Pits attacking smaller animals on the street, to the horror of the victims owners, and the courts do judge the attacker a threat to the community and they are euthanized. They can turn quickly on other animals, even if they were previously fine, I agree that the Jack Russell should be separated when unsupervised. I would much rather err on the side of caution then regret being too trusting. And now that there is a pattern of behaviour involving cats.....never let your dog get near another. As Dr. Phil says the best predictor of future behaviour is past behaviour.

how would being muzzled in public have prevented this....these where family pets killed on there own home turf. As far as responsible pit bull ownership...i think you really mean't to say dog ownership right?.....cause any dog can kill not just pits..i see why your not in favour of breed bans cause your breed could be next,just wait till pits are not the poster child of evil and they try to ban goldens......and as far as reading too many stories about pits attacking animals in public....well we all know that a yorkie that attacks a pit is not to attractive as a headline.......i also think we are not being told the whole story here....someone forgot to tell the original poster that pits don't make good guard dogs...they are people orientated......and if this person gave the dog away once then this dog must not be high up in the family.
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  #36  
Old November 6th, 2006, 07:26 PM
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Well, kimC1, He is a handsome boy, and I know what you mean with living in the country and the SPCA not taking the 'stray' cats... they seem to believe that they are your cats and kittens that are breeding out of control and you are trying to "dump" them off, I understand that this must happen alot, however, they do not give the benefit of the doubt.

you are definately in a real tough spot with this situation. Im sorry that you are going through this and I admire that you are standing by your dog...

I truely hope you can find a solution soon.
Best of luck.
Sorry I have no thoughts or tips for you.
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  #37  
Old November 6th, 2006, 10:08 PM
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Were they killed inside or outside the home?Inside, keeping them separate,and a muzzle would work,outside,a leash would work.And get some help with training etc Where do you live?Do you have BSL?

Last edited by LL1; November 7th, 2006 at 09:45 AM.
  #38  
Old November 7th, 2006, 07:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coppperbelle View Post
Ummm I had a standard poodle that hated small animals and if given a chance would not hesitate to kill them. It is not necessarily the breed of dog although some breeds are more prone to this behavior but the dog itself. I have two golden retreivers, one has an extremely high prey drive while the other has none at all.
I think it is very unfortunte that your dog is like this but I think you will either have to re-home him or get rid of your cats. They obviously cannot live safely in your home or in your yard while the dog is around.
Just wanted to know, what your quote meant?
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  #39  
Old November 7th, 2006, 07:46 AM
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That is exactly why pitbulls are banned here in my city in Ontario . no offense by all means, but if any of these were MY cats...I would be insisting your dog be put down. I do not agree on having a pit bull, nor do I agree on ever had bred them in the first place. WHO in the world breeds an animal to kill and then try to keep them as a pet!? Sorry (this is likely the only issue I feel so passionatly about) NEVER EVER get another cat! And watch out for the cat lovers in your neighbourhoood, cuz if your dog hurts their cat, you may be in for a big problem (at least if they are anything like me!!)
PS I hope your dog doesnt have a love for the taste of blood now...watch your kids...your neighbours kids...the kids at the park.
spudster

Last edited by spud; November 7th, 2006 at 07:58 AM.
  #40  
Old November 7th, 2006, 07:48 AM
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If you have a cat and need to rehome your cat send it to me, ill find it a nice home.
  #41  
Old November 7th, 2006, 09:18 AM
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Originally Posted by spud View Post
That is exactly why pitbulls are banned here in my city in Ontario . no offense by all means, but if any of these were MY cats...I would be insisting your dog be put down. I do not agree on having a pit bull, nor do I agree on ever had bred them in the first place. WHO in the world breeds an animal to kill and then try to keep them as a pet!? Sorry (this is likely the only issue I feel so passionatly about) NEVER EVER get another cat! And watch out for the cat lovers in your neighbourhoood, cuz if your dog hurts their cat, you may be in for a big problem (at least if they are anything like me!!)
PS I hope your dog doesnt have a love for the taste of blood now...watch your kids...your neighbours kids...the kids at the park.
spudster
Are you kidding? A taste for blood? That's a myth right up there with locking jaws.
Most dogs will display some degree of prey drive in the right circumstances, ofcourse some more than others, but that is not a breed specific trait. Further, prey drive and human aggression are entirerly different behaviors, and your suggestion that going after a cat is a prelude to attacking a child shows nothing but a lack of understanding of even the most basic of canine behavior.

Frankly, if you're only worried about whether your neighbours have pitbulls or not, you're not keeping your cats or other animals safe. Clearly there was some serious errors in management on the part of the OP, and hopefully they have learned from their mistakes and will take better precautions in the future, but it has nothing to do with breed. Perhaps your time would be better spent worrying about responsible and knowledgable pet ownership, then pitbulls.

I'm curious, why do only pitbulls bother you? Other breeds have fighting histories, and like pitbulls they also have many other qualities which make them wonderful pets for a responsible owner. To single out one breed entirerly misses the point and does little to actually reduce any harm inflicted by dogs, that is something only braoder education and better all breed laws would be able to fix.
  #42  
Old November 7th, 2006, 10:00 AM
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I truly mean no disrespect. I see that you admire your pitties; as much as I admire my kitties.
I just cant imagine actually trying to introduce ANOTHER cat to a dog that already killed one.
I agree I should not single out one breed, I was just commenting that the particular breed we are discussing here is banned in my home town.
Please also note that this is as a result of too many attacks on children and inocent people and family pets causing permanent disfigurement and emotional scarring as well as a few deaths...all of this ended up causing this bi law.
I have been bitten by a dog, my husband was bit, and my daughter was bit in the face ( I guess dogs just dont like us..) so I am a lot cautious when I hear of such violent behaviour displayed by your dog.
good luck.
  #43  
Old November 7th, 2006, 11:00 AM
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Originally Posted by spud View Post
I truly mean no disrespect. I see that you admire your pitties; as much as I admire my kitties.
I just cant imagine actually trying to introduce ANOTHER cat to a dog that already killed one.
I agree I should not single out one breed, I was just commenting that the particular breed we are discussing here is banned in my home town.
Please also note that this is as a result of too many attacks on children and inocent people and family pets causing permanent disfigurement and emotional scarring as well as a few deaths...all of this ended up causing this bi law.
I have been bitten by a dog, my husband was bit, and my daughter was bit in the face ( I guess dogs just dont like us..) so I am a lot cautious when I hear of such violent behaviour displayed by your dog.
good luck.
I agree that the dog should have not further access to cats, as it is truely sad that 3 have been killed. I must respectfully, but adamently, disagree that bill 132 was passed in Ontario only for reasons of public safety. Had this been the only agenda, there would have been many other, more practical and effective types of legislation. 132 was instead a great attention grabber, one which relies on media and government manufactured hysteria, which is then calmed when a bandaid is carelessly slapped on a problem which is complex and multi-faceted.

What would you say to the victims of dog bites inflicted by other breeds? Is their suffering not as important because it did not involve a pitbull? How would you explain to the thousands of responsible, vigilant owners, who's dogs have never so much as hurt a fly, that are now required to muzzle their dogs? How do I explain to my family that I can no longer go visit them on holidays because my dogs, who have never posed a threat to anyone, can't legally enter the province they live in? Perhaps most importantly, what would you say to the dogs who are taken away from their owners or euthanized not because of a history of aggressive behavior, but simply because of their breed?

I would suggest you do a bit of reading on the subject of both bill 132 and the breeds which fall under the umbrella of "pitbull".

http://www.ontla.on.ca/hansard/commi...embly/M009.htm
http://www.bdnhumanesociety.com/calgary_solution.htm
http://www.pitbullsontheweb.com/petbull/
http://www.pbrc.net/breedinfo.html
http://www.doglegislationcouncilcanada.org/
http://www.understand-a-bull.com/
  #44  
Old November 7th, 2006, 11:24 AM
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Originally Posted by spud View Post
I have been bitten by a dog, my husband was bit, and my daughter was bit in the face ( I guess dogs just dont like us..) so I am a lot cautious when I hear of such violent behaviour displayed by your dog.
good luck.

You have all been bit by pitbulls?
  #45  
Old November 7th, 2006, 12:21 PM
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Great info you posted.
no, not by pitbulls - we were all bit by different kinds breed and ages of dogs. I'm just saying dogs don't like me, or my family apparently...I have read the stories in the newspapers and seen pictures on the news about boys and girls attacked by pitbulls and it is devistating to see such damage! so , for me, when I see bills passed that are for my safety and other innocent members of society then I guess I support it.
I would not want to see some great dog owner who has a great harmless dog have to put it down just because of its breed, but I would like to see them stopped being bred all together. Dog lovers can choose from many many other less contraversial dog breeds. I believe any animal that has the potential to kill a person should not be bred and kept as pets. There are plenty of dogs that bite out there, big ones little ones, and any animal that does bite another animal or person should be put down. So in order to save a super dog from a potentially dangerous situation muzzle him so he cannot bite some kid whos pulling on his tail or some kid that bends down innocently just to pet him, but looks in his eyes and the dog takes that as aggression and bites. I have to agree on the muzzle thing, It s the only thing that makes me feel safe when passing a dog i dont know on the street or in the park.
  #46  
Old November 7th, 2006, 12:24 PM
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Hmm... ALL cats attack me. Maybe I should look into a tabbyban.
  #47  
Old November 7th, 2006, 12:28 PM
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Hmm... ALL cats attack me. Maybe I should look into a tabbyban.
Just a couple of weeks ago a cat jumped out of the bushes and attached himself to my dog's head, so I would absolutely support your tabby ban Prin
  #48  
Old November 7th, 2006, 12:34 PM
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LOL! ha ha ha! actually sorry you were attacked, I do hear of the occasional crazy cat...and I am quite certain that lots of them get put down every day. I had a cat who attacked me when we had our first baby (he settled down once he realized the baby was staying though) someone said there is a different value for cats and dogs..I thinks its true about the importance chain...so are guinea pigs and then rats at the bottom of the importance list?

Our town was trying to bann cats actually. They wanted them to remain indoors only or on a leash...it didnt pass, but im sure some individuals will push it again...all these people and all these preferences eh...when will we all learn to liive together? Violence in our teens, in our dogs...in our schools where does it stop ?
  #49  
Old November 7th, 2006, 12:36 PM
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Hmm... ALL cats attack me. Maybe I should look into a tabbyban.

Awww Prin, are you sure they are "attacking" you?, cat's LOVE to play, maybe your just reading them wrong

Tabbyban!!! no way, kitties are SO sweet!!
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  #50  
Old November 7th, 2006, 12:44 PM
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Our town was trying to bann cats actually. They wanted them to remain indoors only or on a leash...it didnt pass, but im sure some individuals will push it again...all these people and all these preferences eh...when will we all learn to liive together? Violence in our teens, in our dogs...in our schools where does it stop ?
Actually that sounds like a good idea. Maybe then people will start to have their cats spayed/neutered and take care of a lot of the problems associated with cats outside.
But that isn't banning cats, that is just making the owners become more responsible for their pets. A ban would involve no one being allowed to own the cat. That is a different thing altogether. Right now, dogs are basically kept indoors or on a leash all the time, but even with that, comes the people wanting a breed banned (not contained in a house or on leash) actually banned.
  #51  
Old November 7th, 2006, 12:44 PM
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My dog has killed 3 cats

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Originally Posted by happycats View Post
Just wanted to know, what your quote meant?
Sorry, should have been clearer. I was just reiterating what you said that it is not necessarily just pits but that all breeds can be dangerous to small animals. Mine happened to be a poodle which is not generally thought to be vicious but she was.
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Old November 7th, 2006, 12:53 PM
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Sorry, should have been clearer. I was just reiterating what you said that it is not necessarily just pits but that all breeds can be dangerous to small animals. Mine happened to be a poodle which is not generally thought to be vicious but she was.
Oh, thanks ! We had a BC, sheepdog cross, who killed everything that moved!! but she wouldn't kill cats, because she had been raised with a very dominate cat, who always put her in her place.
You are right though, any dog can kill a cat, breed means nothing!
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  #53  
Old November 7th, 2006, 12:54 PM
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Awww Prin, are you sure they are "attacking" you?, cat's LOVE to play, maybe your just reading them wrong

Tabbyban!!! no way, kitties are SO sweet!!

lol no, I know they attack. Just by the way the owners are shocked when it happens, I know. Even the nicest kitties attack me. One even pierced a vein in my arm and two tendons. But they're still cute. I'd rather ban puppymills and bybs instead.

When does the violence end? When people realize you don't have to be crazy to go to a shrink... And when (some) parents step up and PARENT- furparents AND skinparents alike.

Edit: Now that I think about it... Tigers and Lions and Bears and things attack all the time too, but for some reason we (most of us anyway) accept that they are animals, with instincts and biiiiig teeth and stay far away.
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Old November 7th, 2006, 12:58 PM
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lol no, I know they attack. Just by the way the owners are shocked when it happens, I know. Even the nicest kitties attack me. One even pierced a vein in my arm and two tendons. But they're still cute. I'd rather ban puppymills and bybs instead.

When does the violence end? When people realize you don't have to be crazy to go to a shrink... And when (some) parents step up and PARENT- furparents AND skinparents alike.

Edit: Now that I think about it... Tigers and Lions and Bears and things attack all the time too, but for some reason we (most of us anyway) accept that they are animals, with instincts and biiiiig teeth and stay far away.
My one cat "Lucky" would just LOVE you!! He senses fear, and goes for it
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  #55  
Old November 7th, 2006, 12:59 PM
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lol I have no fear. I have expectations. I think I have dog smell running through my veins or something. I definitely set something off in kitties.
  #56  
Old November 7th, 2006, 01:27 PM
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Great info you posted.
no, not by pitbulls - we were all bit by different kinds breed and ages of dogs. I'm just saying dogs don't like me, or my family apparently...I have read the stories in the newspapers and seen pictures on the news about boys and girls attacked by pitbulls and it is devistating to see such damage! so , for me, when I see bills passed that are for my safety and other innocent members of society then I guess I support it.
So wouldn't your own experience tell you that better animal/owner laws need to be put in place and enforced, or even just decent enforement of leash laws etc., would actually be in the interest of public safety, rather than singling out a few breeds and claiming that without them, everyone will be safe? Clearly the bites you and your family sustained would not have been prevented by a breed ban, so why support it?

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Originally Posted by spud View Post
I would not want to see some great dog owner who has a great harmless dog have to put it down just because of its breed, but I would like to see them stopped being bred all together. Dog lovers can choose from many many other less contraversial dog breeds. I believe any animal that has the potential to kill a person should not be bred and kept as pets. There are plenty of dogs that bite out there, big ones little ones, and any animal that does bite another animal or person should be put down.
But why should my right to own whatever breed I want, assuming I'm a responsible and considerate owner, be infringed upon by laws which don't even accomplish greater public safety? Should anything which is contraversial be given up?
I'm all for dogs who are deemed dangerous, by a fair and qualified body which is not biased against certain breeds being dealt with appropriately, as am I in favour irresponsible owners who actually do put the community at risk being hed accountable, but none of that has to do with breed.

When you say "potential to kill a person" what do you mean? Size?....we'd have to ban pretty much ever dog. Did you read the testimony given in Ontario to which I posted a link above? Did you read what Donna Trempe had to say about the dog attack on her daughter? A pitbull ban would not have prevented that.

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So in order to save a super dog from a potentially dangerous situation muzzle him so he cannot bite some kid whos pulling on his tail or some kid that bends down innocently just to pet him, but looks in his eyes and the dog takes that as aggression and bites. I have to agree on the muzzle thing, It s the only thing that makes me feel safe when passing a dog i dont know on the street or in the park.
I'm confused about what a "super dog" is. A really great dog? A dog with super canine powers? I have no idea if my dogs are super or not, but they certainly don't need a muzzle to keep children safe. Infact they are regularily poked and explored by toddlers, barked at, screamed at and cried in front of and the they've never done anything other than wag their tails, dole out a few licks and patiently wait while kids touch them all over. They're not special or exceptional, they're just exhibiting proper pitbull temperment.

If you're ever in Montreal, you have an open invitation to meet my dogs, I have yet to see anyone spend more than 5 minutes with them and not be totally charmed, even if they were originally convinced they would be eaten.
  #57  
Old November 7th, 2006, 01:57 PM
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Were they killed inside or outside the home?Inside, keeping them separate,and a muzzle would work,outside,a leash would work.And get some help with training etc Where do you live?Do you have BSL?
LL1

you can't keep any dog muzzled 24hrs a day or chained in the yard.....
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  #58  
Old November 7th, 2006, 02:03 PM
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I agree,and wouldnt suggest that.

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LL1

you can't keep any dog muzzled 24hrs a day or chained in the yard.....
  #59  
Old November 7th, 2006, 03:11 PM
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I don't think pit bulls in general have much of a prey drive . . . They're dog-aggressive, which is different. Some breeds that are known for high prey drive are sighthounds (bred to run down prey), terriers (bred to independantly hunt vermin), and nordic breeds (I'm not sure if they were specifically bred to hunt, they're mostly used for sledding these days. But it would make sense if the Inuits originally used them for hunting too.) And also hounds, I'm thinking? Not sure about that one.

Anyway, lots of breeds have a tendency to chase smaller animals. But plenty of individuals from those breeds can be taught to live peacefully with cats . . . or may not even have any interest in them to begin with! Likewise, individuals from breeds who are traditionally peaceful with other animals (like labradors) can have a very high prey drive and be dangerous towards smaller animals.

The breed I've heard the most horror stories with (in the vein of "the dog and cat lived peacefully together for years and then I came home to a dead cat") is daschunds. Perhaps because cats are approximately the same size as the badgers they were bred to hunt? I don't know, just a theory.
  #60  
Old November 7th, 2006, 06:21 PM
wdawson's Avatar
wdawson wdawson is offline
Papa D
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: dog loving hamilton,ont
Posts: 4,319
SPUD

funny how in one breath you agree that pits be banned and pits should not be kept as family members as they are killers....then in the next breath you tell us all your family members have been attacked by different breeds of different ages and not a pittie in the bunch ....thats why bsl does NOT work.
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Wayne
Dad To :
George 18 year beagle, Rest in peace little buddy....love
Beathoven 7 year old mutt
Maggie 5 year jack russell
Felix 15 year tabby
Ozzie 12 year tabby
Tigger 10 year long hair cat
marley just a pup
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Lettin the cat outta the bag is a whole lot easier than puttin it back in.

Most of the stuff people worry about ain't gonna happen anyway.
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