Does anyone have experience with canine Diabetes?

[GoldenAngel]

That is great to hear that he is off the glyburide... poor thing.

I am a diabetes consultant for an insulin company and I can safely say your vet's treatment protocol is better than about 90% of physicians that I work with who routinely use glyburide with everything (including insulin) without realizing it can cause hypos (and this is in humans!).

Even when I read about vets using Lantus in cats (a higher grade insulin than the majority of humans are on)... interesting that vets are using better medicine than GPs...

I hope your boy continues doing well!
Best wishes...

[sugarcatmom]

Originally Posted by buddingartist

It appears that a batch or number of batches had variable concentration during that time.

I totally understand you not wanting to get into a debate about this with your vet (or with me, for that matter!). You need to have a vet on your side, but also remember that diabetes is a home-managed disease. YOU are the one living it day to day, the vet only sees Buddy a few times a year. If you do choose to go with Caninsulin, it's going to be even more important for you to learn to hometest Buddy's blood glucose as soon as possible. But it's not just about variability in consistency, it has to do with future availability.....

Your vet is wrong about this being a "batch" issue. It's a problem with the nature of this crystalline insulin, so ALL Caninsulin is currently affected. While Intervet/Schering-Plough are working to solve the issue, current market supplies of Caninsulin will be exhausted and diabetic animals may soon have no choice but to switch to another insulin. Which is why it makes no sense to start a new patient on Caninsulin. This is directly from the horses mouth, updated Jan 8th, 2010: http://vetsulin.com/PDF/VetsulinExternalFAQs.pdf

Are there specific serials that are in question, or are all serials affected?
The FDA Alert pertains to all unexpired serials of Vetsulin currently in the field.

http://vetsulin.com/PDF/TransitionLetter01062010.pdf

As discussed in our letter dated November 30, 2009, it is imperative that you transition all of your diabetic patients off of Vetsulin as future supplies of Vetsulin will be very limited in early 2010, and then exhausted.

There is another insulin choice your vet has apparently forgotten about, and that's Humulin N or Novolin NPH. That was always the insulin of choice for dogs long before Caninsulin came along. Here's the kicker - you can just walk into any pharmacy in Canada and buy a vial, no prescription needed. It's cheaper than Caninsulin, and you can also use syringes purchased at that same pharmacy. No need to by the U40 syringes from the vet at greatly inflated prices.

Oh ya, and there is a lawsuit now against Schering-Plough over this:
http://toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll...78/0/OPINION02

Anyway, I'm glad Buddy is hanging in there. Good luck tomorrow! One thing to think about when they're teaching you how to give the injections is that animals don't have the same inherent fear of needles that many people do. Once you get over your own fear about the process and realize how easy it is, it will be smooth sailing for both of you.

[buddingartist]

WOW Sugarcatmom.

I've prepared a note for the Vet for tomorrow (e.g. water intake etc. etc) and now I don't know whether I should include the final alert FAQ and the letter.

At this time, I definitely won't include the article about the lawsuit cause I don't want to scare him into kicking us out of his practice. I'll talk it over with hubby and sleep on this one.

Oh, did I mention I'm freaking out right now?

[buddingartist]

Update for Sugarcatmom

Talked it over with hubby and he says <Give him a copy of everything. The vet needs to know and we want answers>.

So I'm including copies of everything and we'll see what happens.

Tks

[buddingartist]

Of interest to Sugarcatmom and to all Canadian diabetic pet owners whose vet uses Caninsulin (name used Canada) Vetsulin in US

http://www.intervet.ca/binaries/E_Ca...100-200544.pdf

Who can you trust?

[sugarcatmom]

Originally Posted by buddingartist

The vet needs to know and we want answers>.

I'm sorry to freak you out, that wasn't my intention, but I strongly believe that we are the best advocates for our pets. Knowledge is power! If the vet is insistent on using Caninsulin then so be it. Perhaps he just doesn't feel comfortable dosing with anything else. Do ask him though, what sort of supply he has, and if they have a backup plan in case that runs out. Also check the expiry dates on the vials because apparently most of the issues with consistency have been on insulin reaching the end of it's shelf-life.

Good luck!!

[buddingartist]

Good day to all. Update on Buddy

My <little man> came home at 5:30 last night and I must say he was quite a bit perkier than he has been in weeks, although he woke us up at 12:30am, 4:30am and 6:30am. That was good news for us because when we took him in in the morning, he had lost another pound.

When I walked in the clinic, I heard Buddy bark and they told me that he had been very good all day, didn't bark and must have heard mommy's voice and he wanted to go home (of course, I had given them Buddy's blanky and made sure they used it).

The vet is starting him on 8 units, once a day and we will be going back on 5February for another full day to do another Blood Glucose Curve. He wants Buddy's little body to get used to the insulin (and I suspect he wants us to get used to the needle.

Now for the funny part

This morning, to thank me for helping (all day) hubby lay down the tiles in our bathroom, hubby made me breakfast. While eating, I started thinking oh crap, I have to use a needle on my baby and you guessed it..... I barfed (sorry don't mean to gross anybody out) and hubby thought it was because I was exhaused from yesterday (he was as nervous as I was so I decided not to tell him until after the injection.

I read and reread the instructions that our vet gave us, roll bottle, bring it down to 8, plunge needle in bottle to push air in, put 8 units in the seringe, etc etc relived his demonstration, went on the internet to gain additional confidence in injecting properly, practiced holding the needle, how to work the plunger etc, etc.

Buddy and Cleo came back from their walk, I had to hand feed him (cause he never eats this early in the day (11am), gave him his pumpkin (which he loves), and I DID IT.... he didn't even flinch and I, on the other hand, starting shaking.

The date on the insulin is September 2010. I gave him all the documents and there is no concern with supply etc. The needle is 1/2.

Overall, he wants to start slow, monitor and adjust and I am OK with that. When we are both comfortable with the injections, we will be thinking about a glucometer and do home testing. Meanwhile, I was asked to use the Diastix and Ketostix.

Thank you all for caring, for the information, for the words of advice, wisdom and reassurance. Much appreciated

[goldengal]

Hi buddingartist ...... Sounds like yesterday went ok for Buddy. I had to chuckle when you said he is not used to eating as early as 11 a.m. Reminds me of wee Harley in our household. We are up at 5 a.m. on weekdays (and most weekends too), and the big dogs eat fine at that time although Louie, who is on chemo, is having difficulty eating these days, but Harley comes down, goes outside, comes in and sniffs his food and wants to head back to bed. lol

It sounds like you are going to do fine administering the insulin. Kudos to you. Here's hoping Buddy soon regains some weight.

Take care,
Pat

[buddingartist]

Hi Pat

I must say that I truly appreciate your starting this thread on my behalf, the kind people on this site have been so very helpful and considerate.

Yep, our dogs are not morning dogs. We trained them like that because at one point or another, either myself or hubby were working from home, so >quit, mommy or daddy has to work> were the operative words.

As long as the TV is on, they love to lounge on their couch

Oh what a life

Cheers
Louise

[hazelrunpack]

Originally Posted by buddingartist

This morning, to thank me for helping (all day) hubby lay down the tiles in our bathroom, hubby made me breakfast. While eating, I started thinking oh crap, I have to use a needle on my baby and you guessed it..... I barfed (sorry don't mean to gross anybody out) and hubby thought it was because I was exhaused from yesterday (he was as nervous as I was so I decided not to tell him until after the injection.

I read and reread the instructions that our vet gave us, roll bottle, bring it down to 8, plunge needle in bottle to push air in, put 8 units in the seringe, etc etc relived his demonstration, went on the internet to gain additional confidence in injecting properly, practiced holding the needle, how to work the plunger etc, etc.

Buddy and Cleo came back from their walk, I had to hand feed him (cause he never eats this early in the day (11am), gave him his pumpkin (which he loves), and I DID IT.... he didn't even flinch and I, on the other hand, starting shaking.

I know exactly how you feel and good on you that you handled the needle as well as you did!!!!! That part of it just gets easier from here on out!

Meanwhile, I hope his blood sugars regulate easily!

[sugarcatmom]

Originally Posted by buddingartist

and I DID IT.... he didn't even flinch and I, on the other hand, starting shaking.

Good job!!! It does get easier, I promise. You're doing great.

[the gang]

its not the easist thing to do, i have a diabect min pin, its been 2 yrs oct, i was so scared i too was sick, but im a diabect too, so i noticed weight loss and lots of water and pee, it gets better as you go along ,they showed me how to shave his ear just a little bic, and i do the curve because it can get expensive, it took awhile to get inslin right on, and every once in awhile you have to increase or decrease, he needs diabect food for sure, our little man too had a rough time, we have had him since he was 3 months old, now just turned 11, he had chrystals at 3, parillzed at 5, fell off sofa the wrong way, but with our great vet and his own chryo and us he is 85% better than 2 yrs ago diabect , now he is blind from being diabect, he takes 2 times a day inslin .7, best of luck to all of you and if i can be of any help just let me know, take care brenda and the pins

[buddingartist]

Thank you all for advice and encouragement.

We are not imagining things..... we are seeing a difference already. He was more alert during the day, his little walking gait is back and he slept right through the night and hubby woke them up at 8:30 this morning. Very little panting.

Afther their walk, I started feeding him and this time I wasn't giving him the food fast enough compared to yesterday where I had to tease and play to get one kibble in. After the feeding, he got his reward of pumpkin. Under the watchful eye of hubby (because we are both going to learn to master this), I gave him his injection and now he is lounging on the couch like a cool little dude. Once we are comfortable with the injection, we will also learn to do the curve ourselves but we want to go slow but sure.

As for the crystals in his eyes, that started last year and we can't really afford any expensive surgery if indeed they develop into cataracts.

As for his diet, our vet consulted and at this point it is best to keep him on the hypoallergenic food because it took so much work and time to get him to not having multiple interdigital cysts caused by food allergies. I suspect he also has environmental allergies so we also need to keep a close watch on that and therefore the reason why we clean his paws with saline water every night. We will gradually add scrambled eggs once or twice a week (for protein) and pumpkin (for fiber).

Have a great day everyone and again thank you so very much for caring and for your encouragement and support

Louise

[hazelrunpack]

I'm so glad things are going so well for you!

[snorklepuss]

Originally Posted by Frenchy

satin balls :

5 pounds of ground beef (lean) raw
5 cups of oats
3/4 cup olive oil
3/4 cup of molasses (melasse)
6 eggs
1 can of pumpkin puree (not the pie filing , the pure one)
500 mg of cottage cheese

you don't cook them , everything has to be raw.

Its refreshing to here someone any one anyone talk about a raw diet. can you expand on the last 6 ingreidients. Wondering if you've found out via your own experiance and research about those ingriedients. We feed a raw diet now as funny as it sounds to our labs because I swore I would not lose even one more dog to a disease that that I can't prove didn't come from some put together engineered kibble food. But our raw diet really only consists of meat fat bones and tripe in different percents.