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View Poll Results: What shall we do?
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  #1  
Old October 23rd, 2010, 04:13 PM
melissa.n.wood melissa.n.wood is offline
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Unhappy 8 week old puppy pees in Crate

Recently we purchased a 7 week old doberman puppy. We decided on the crate training method since she is going to be quite a large dog and well for our sanity. The first night she was in her crate was a horror. We put her on a schedule of out every hour to eliminate. She cries, barks and scratches to get out and will do her business. We bought a large crate but made it just large enough to fit her bed. She doesn't seem to care if she she does her business in there or not even on a constantly monitored schedule. She is good to go outside to eliminate; sometimes it takes a while but when she does we constantly reward her with praise and treats and reward her with some limited supervised play time. Now we are concerned that because every time she eliminates in her crate she gets let out to go outside. We are at a complete loss. Everything says that all dogs have an innate sense to not use the washroom in their crates which is why the crate method of training is so effective. Currently we have her under constant supervision during the day and at night. My husband is at home with her during the day since he works night and I am at home with her at night. What if anything can we do to make this process easier?
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Old October 23rd, 2010, 04:51 PM
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luckypenny luckypenny is offline
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Hi Melissa . Where did you purchase your puppy from and where was she kept? Is this your first puppy?

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Originally Posted by melissa.n.wood View Post
Everything says that all dogs have an innate sense to not use the washroom in their crates which is why the crate method of training is so effective.
Yes, usually this is so but, often, much depends upon the environment in which she was raised for those 7 weeks before she came home with you. It can take months before a puppy catches on and only with consistency and patience on their guardians' part.

Ideally, puppies should stay with their mothers and litter mates until 8-10 weeks old. You have a wee tiny baby much akin to a human baby who will need time to learn. At 7 weeks, she most likely can't 'hold' it yet as her sphincter muscles still need time to develop.

Although it's lengthy reading, here's a wonderful book I believe all new puppy parents should read (free download). http://www.dogstardaily.com/files/AF...ur%20Puppy.pdf

On housetraining: http://www.sfspca.org/sites/default/...ning-puppy.pdf

On crate training: http://www.sfspca.org/sites/default/files/crating_0.pdf
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Old October 23rd, 2010, 05:02 PM
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shyeyes shyeyes is offline
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regarding puppy school - i don't know about your area but check with them first. most do not accept a puppy that early simply because they are not fully vaccinated. personally i would be suspicious of a place that does not govern good vaccination rules.

i would give it time. 7 weeks is very early - most breeders shouldn't sell their puppies earlier then 8 weeks.
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Old October 23rd, 2010, 05:24 PM
melissa.n.wood melissa.n.wood is offline
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Hi, lucky penny

Thank you very much for that download! Since we have to be home so often now it will be a great read and a great time filler in between potty breaks. It is not our first puppy we have two small pomeranians who were trained using puppy pads. It was a relatively easy experience considering they are so small.

We purchased her from a very nice family who themselves own 4 dobermans (one for each member of the family) We met all four and they were truly wonderful dogs cuddly and gentle for dobermans which was exactly what we wanted. I instantly fell in love with one little girl in particular who was much calmer and quieter than the rest of the litter. The puppies were kept in a pen with newspaper.

I guess in this instance since she is so young we should probably just give it some time. We are both extremely patient I am just more concerned that we are doing something wrong or is there anything to do to help cease the elimination in the crate. For now we will keep plugging away at it constancy I am sure is the key.
Thank you again
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Old October 23rd, 2010, 05:35 PM
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luckypenny luckypenny is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shyeyes View Post
regarding puppy school - i don't know about your area but check with them first. most do not accept a puppy that early simply because they are not fully vaccinated. personally i would be suspicious of a place that does not govern good vaccination rules.
You might find this very interesting reading.

Quote:
In general, puppies can start puppy socialization classes as early as 7-8 weeks of age. Puppies should receive a minimum of one set of vaccines
at least 7 days prior to the first class and a first deworming. They should be kept up-to-date on vaccines throughout the class.
http://www.avsabonline.org/avsabonli...ialization.pdf

Personally, I don't like to see puppies removed from their littermates/mom before 9-10 weeks but would enroll them in a reputable early socialization class as soon as possible. Especially one that has been removed so young.
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Old October 23rd, 2010, 05:45 PM
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luckypenny luckypenny is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by melissa.n.wood View Post
... is there anything to do to help cease the elimination in the crate.
Other than taking her out frequently and praising her when she goes (ignore indoor mistakes unless you can gently interrupt her and take her outside), make certain her crate is only big enough to stand, turn around, and lay down in comfortably. If it's too large, she may be more tempted to eliminate in it. If you have a crate too large, do you have a divider for it?
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Old October 23rd, 2010, 05:51 PM
melissa.n.wood melissa.n.wood is offline
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Hi,

Yes we have an extremely large crate but we have a divider that is only big enough for her little bed which is essentially her size. I guess we will just keep plugging away at it. I welcome any suggestions! and thank you kindly for your responses they make me feel much better! I do feel like I have a new born so its probably just the lack in sleep that is making me frustrated...
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Old October 23rd, 2010, 06:09 PM
Mirela Mirela is offline
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Removing the bed might help as well - she might "go" on the bedding and then push it aside, thus not being really inconvenienced if she goes in the crate.
But as eveyone said so far, she is very, very young, and it will take some time for her to learn both what she needs to do and be able to hold it. Keep doing what you're doing, taking her out often and praising the good times - she'll get it in time.

Oh, and people who brag that they have potty trained their 7-8 week old pup in a week...either incredibly, incredibly lucky or just fibbing...

Puppy school is good for social skills but I'm not sure how much would help with potty training.
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Old October 24th, 2010, 12:37 AM
JennieV JennieV is offline
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I just wanted to ask, have you had your lil girl checked by the vet yet? It is always a great idea, to eliminate the possibility that theres something wrong healthwise, like if she may have a simple UTI..
Good luck with it, you got good suggestions so far, keep at it and remember, you have a baby on your hands.. it will take time!
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Old October 24th, 2010, 07:46 PM
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The bottom line--pups and owners need early socialization together in a myriad of situations. This pup left it's home too early, but not long ago, all the books said 7 weeks was the optimum time to go to a new home. The thing is, we all need to learn and continue to learn until we leave the planet--and every day new information about the care and control of pets is racing about the internet. This forum is one of many which has grown to be an easily available source of help to people who need it.
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Last edited by Blackbear; October 24th, 2010 at 10:12 PM.
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Old October 24th, 2010, 10:13 PM
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Please remain civil and on-topic. Thank you.
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Old October 24th, 2010, 10:28 PM
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Dee-O-Gee Dee-O-Gee is offline
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Mirela has a good point in that you should remove the bedding. It would be easy for your little one to eliminate on the bedding then push it aside and not being inconvenienced.

Next; is the crate situated in a high traffic area where she can see everyone? Another suggestion is to cover the crate with a "dark" old sheet like this.....

Name:  101_2007.JPG
Views: 793
Size:  72.6 KB

You could also play a game with the crate and place a treat or her favorite toy inside the crate with the door closed and her standing outside the crate looking in at the treat/toy.

Introduce her to it slowly and soon it will be her haven. She's still very young but with your perserverence and patience, she'll come around.
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Old October 25th, 2010, 11:18 AM
melissa.n.wood melissa.n.wood is offline
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Thank you all so much for you kind responses and help! Your idea's are fantastic. It is a true test of patience with such a young pup! I did want to say that over the weekend we tried many of your suggestions and she seems to be making some improvements. Sunday we only caught her in the middle of one pee and one poop to which we gently brought her outside where she continued to finish her business and we rewarded her! Through the night on sunday night we removed the bedding, she had no pee's in her crate we caught her trying to pooh through the cracks in the crate, and gently took her outside where she finished again. I can't thank you enough for all of your suggestions I will keep you all posted of her progress of the next little while!
Regards,
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Old October 25th, 2010, 12:37 PM
Mirela Mirela is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by melissa.n.wood View Post
Thank you all so much for you kind responses and help! Your idea's are fantastic. It is a true test of patience with such a young pup! I did want to say that over the weekend we tried many of your suggestions and she seems to be making some improvements. Sunday we only caught her in the middle of one pee and one poop to which we gently brought her outside where she continued to finish her business and we rewarded her! Through the night on sunday night we removed the bedding, she had no pee's in her crate we caught her trying to pooh through the cracks in the crate, and gently took her outside where she finished again. I can't thank you enough for all of your suggestions I will keep you all posted of her progress of the next little while!
Regards,

You have a smartypants on your hands OMG - you will have stories to tell with this pup.
Joking aside, the good news it that what she did means that she's got it - "pooping in the crate is bad". This is encouraging.
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Old October 25th, 2010, 10:29 PM
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Dee-O-Gee Dee-O-Gee is offline
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This is where the old saying goes that "you have eyes in the back of your head."

As long as you make the crate training a fun process, it will reward everyone ten times over.

Good luck with the training, please keep us posted and would love to see some pictures of the little one.
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Old October 26th, 2010, 08:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by melissa.n.wood View Post
Thank you all so much for you kind responses and help! Your idea's are fantastic. It is a true test of patience with such a young pup! I did want to say that over the weekend we tried many of your suggestions and she seems to be making some improvements. Sunday we only caught her in the middle of one pee and one poop to which we gently brought her outside where she continued to finish her business and we rewarded her! Through the night on sunday night we removed the bedding, she had no pee's in her crate we caught her trying to pooh through the cracks in the crate, and gently took her outside where she finished again. I can't thank you enough for all of your suggestions I will keep you all posted of her progress of the next little while!
Regards,
I have to say that made me laugh. I've got a little boy dog and used to have a wire crate. Imagine my surprise when I come home from a long shift at work and find pee all AROUND the crate, and none in it. Little bugger.

Not every dog actually understands the don't-pee-in-the-crate thing. But you can't really teach her that peeing on herself (And undesired thing) is going to get her out (A desired thing). Very, very few dogs find the payoff in that discomfort and the things that happen after (A bath, people seeming frustrated, etc) worth it. I, unfortunately, seem to have one of those. Two years later, he'll still refuse to go to the bathroom outside, defecate/urinate in his crate, and cry to be let out.
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