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Old November 8th, 2008, 11:26 AM
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Food allergy?

My puppy (about 4 months old?) had diarrhea for a long time. I regret to say that I didn't act on it as soon as possible (forgive me, first time owner :sad. After trying some different things, I finally took away the food (Authority Harvest Baked Chicken Puppy) and fed him potatoes instead. The diarrhea cleared up. Food allergy (no other noticeable symptoms other than diarrhea), or something else? What's your opinion?

Information regarding the aforementioned dog food follows:

Ingredients:
Chicken, Whole Ground Wheat, Chicken Meal, Whole Ground Barley, Canola Oil (Preserved mixed Tocopherols, A Source of Vitamin E), Carrots, Salmon Meal, Dried Egg Product, Spinach, Tomatoes, Broccoli, Cranberries, Natural Flavor, Chicory Root Extract, Flaxseed, Minerals (Salt, Potassium Chloride, Zinc Sulfate, Zinc Proteinate, Ferrous Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Copper Proteinate, Manganese Sulfate, Manganese Proteinate, Calcium Iodate, Sodium Selenite), Vitamins (Vitamin E Supplement, L-Ascorbyl-2-Polyphosphate, Vitamin A Supplement, Niacin, Calcium Pantothenate, Vitamin D-3 Supplement, Riboflavin, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Thiamin Mononitrate, Folic Acid, Biotin, Vitamin B12 Supplement), Choline Chloride, Glucosamine Hydrocholide, Chondroitin Sulfate, Carnitine.

Guaranteed Analysis:

* Crude Protein (min) 29.0%
* Crude Fat (min) 15.0%
* Crude Fiber (max) 3.0%
* Moisture (max) 10.0%
* Vitamin E (min) 300IU/kg
* Omega-6 Fatty Acids* (min) 3.0%
* Omega-3 Fatty Acids* (min) 0.6%
* Glucosamine* 375 mg/kg
* Chondroitin* 100 mg/kg
* Beta-carotene* 5.0 mg/kg
* Lutein* 2.0 mg/kg
* Lycopene* 1.0 mg/kg

* Not recognized as an essential nutrient by the AAFCO Dog Food Nutrient Profile.

Made in the USA.

Last edited by p13m4n; November 8th, 2008 at 11:31 AM.
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Old November 8th, 2008, 12:09 PM
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I've never heard of that food. But if it doesn't agree with your pup I would recommend trying another brand of food. Sometimes what helps diaherra is a bland diet until the tummy is settled. White rice and boiled chicken and add 1 tablespoon of PURE 100% canned pumpkin. This firms the stool right up.

Have you looked into other brands of food? Orjen and Wellness are very good foods.
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Old November 8th, 2008, 03:57 PM
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Chances are it's not a food allergy. Diarrhea could be the result of many things. Overfeeding? Has your pup been dewormed? May I suggest a visit to the vet to rule out any medical condition. Did you get Authority from Petsmart? Petsmart also sells Blue Buffalo Puppy which is grainy but superior to Authority. If you have time and would like to do some research on dog food the following sites are very helpful and, oh yes posting questions here.
www.dogaware.com
www.dogfoodanalysis.com
Good luck

Last edited by geisha; November 8th, 2008 at 03:58 PM. Reason: add
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Old November 8th, 2008, 03:58 PM
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I don't think diarrhea is an indicator of a food allergy, at least when there are no other symptoms.

Diarrhea may be one, but I believe itching/"corn nibbling", flaky dry skin, possible red rash, skin postules are more likely a precursor for food allergies. Itching was the dead give away with my bitch. She itched constantly! It was really awful.

I agree with totallyhip, I think a better food is in order. I know not everyone has gone grain free, but two grains in the top five in ingredients? Much too much grain in my opinion, and wheat number two? Wheat, barley, soy and corn are the evil grain quatuplets that should be avoided if possible. It's hard to avoid those grains in treats, they're in almost all treats, but food is most important.

Orijen is a fantastic food, grain free and they have a single protein source formula as well, which is like heaven for me! Wellness, Fromm and many others are also coming out with grain free formulas, Now! is an excellent choice for those that have dogs that are less active, but would still like to go grain free. Now! has a normal protein percentage around 23% I think.
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Old November 8th, 2008, 04:18 PM
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I did notice him itching a small bit, only occasionally biting himself but nothing else. He was diagnosed with Giardiasis and worms not too long ago - metronidazole and Strongid-T took care of that; at least it was supposed to...

I tried putting him back onto the same food, just to get diarrhea again. Maybe it's the grains?

As for new dog food, Orijen seems good (how do you pronounce it? Or-eye-jen? Origin?), although my local PetSmart doesn't carry them (nor any pet food of high quality mentioned on dogfoodanalysis, except Blue Wilderness; although I'm not sure they're appropriate for puppies). Are there any good pet food stores in Toronto?

If grain-free, high-quality dog food doesn't work, I guess it's time to take him to a vet. Good timing, I guess - third vaccine shot in a couple of days. Would an allergy test be worth the money?

Just to add: funny story, another dog owner at the park recommended a dog food to me. I kept hearing ORANGE, so I had no idea what he was talking about. I guess he meant Orijen. Hah!

Last edited by p13m4n; November 8th, 2008 at 04:22 PM.
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Old November 8th, 2008, 04:25 PM
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It is pronounced "Origen" and is a great food. Alot of us here feed it to our dogs and cats. They also make a puppy formula that is fine to use.

Global carries it and it's available at other pet stores in Toronto as well. Her is the store locator....

http://www.championpetfoods.com/orij...reListing.aspx
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Old November 8th, 2008, 04:37 PM
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Whereabouts in TO are you? Bark and Fitz carries really good name brand foods. Their staff are pretty knowledgeable too
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Old November 8th, 2008, 04:39 PM
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Originally Posted by totallyhip View Post
Whereabouts in TO are you? Bark and Fitz carries really good name brand foods. Their staff are pretty knowledgeable too
Yonge and Davisville - looks like there's a Global Pet Foods store right between Eglinton and Davisville.
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Old November 8th, 2008, 06:24 PM
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Originally Posted by p13m4n View Post
Yonge and Davisville - looks like there's a Global Pet Foods store right between Eglinton and Davisville.
Orijen should be available there.
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Old November 8th, 2008, 08:10 PM
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I went through the allergy routine with my bitch a few months ago. My vet did not reccomend the blood testing you can do for food allergies, basically said it was a waste of money and time. The only fireproof way to determine a food allergy is to go with an elimination diet, that is if your even sure it's a food allergy, and not an atopic allergy.

With food elimination diets you feed a new protein that your dog has never eaten before for 10 weeks. No other protein source for that 10 weeks. If there are any other dogs in your house they have to go on the same diet. Sharing from the same water dish can cause a reaction with severe allergies! It's preferred to go with a single source protein as well, as some dogs can't handle the multiple proteins in dog foods. Nowadays you see two or more proteins in one kibble.

That's what I love about Orijen. No grains. Single source protein. Made in Canada. Salmon is the first ingredient, the best fish to feed. I just don't think you can get any better with a kibble diet, unless you plan on going raw or homemade.

If you decide to change foods and head up the ladder in quality, it's possible that you may see MORE diarrhea! It sucks I know! LOL. It's comparable to people. If you ate McDonalds your whole life, then ate a steak I'm sure your stomach would be upset too! It's the same for some dogs when switching diets to higher quality, less filler kibbles. Not all dogs get diarrhea but it's not uncommon.

Someone already mentioned the canned pumpkin trick and it works very well. I sometimes even use those Nutro Doggy Desserts, they have a Pumpkin Crumble formula and it works just as well if you can't find plain canned pumpkin anywhere (I couldn't! LOL).

Just something that popped into my head, does your puppy get other treats during the day? Peanut butter filled kongs? Table scraps? I know my guys do not handle PB well, it always results in bad diarrhea. Just a thought!
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Old November 9th, 2008, 07:33 AM
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At the moment, I'm just feeding him a strict diet of potatoes (rice once or twice) - have been for probably about a week. Normal stools so far; actually, normal stools came out as soon as I started feeding him potatoes. I guess that could say something.

I'll be going to a Global Pet Foods store later today (hopefully open) to pick up some Orijen dog food. Just want to make sure - the large breed puppy formula would be appropriate for a Golden Retriever, right?

Thanks for all the suggestions - EXTREMELY HELPFUL. I didn't even expect this amount of information. Great forum!

Last edited by p13m4n; November 9th, 2008 at 07:35 AM.
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Old November 9th, 2008, 11:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by K9 Love View Post
I don't think diarrhea is an indicator of a food allergy, at least when there are no other symptoms.

Diarrhea may be one, but I believe itching/"corn nibbling", flaky dry skin, possible red rash, skin postules are more likely a precursor for food allergies. Itching was the dead give away with my bitch. She itched constantly! It was really awful.

I agree with totallyhip, I think a better food is in order. I know not everyone has gone grain free, but two grains in the top five in ingredients? Much too much grain in my opinion, and wheat number two? Wheat, barley, soy and corn are the evil grain quatuplets that should be avoided if possible. It's hard to avoid those grains in treats, they're in almost all treats, but food is most important.

Orijen is a fantastic food, grain free and they have a single protein source formula as well, which is like heaven for me! Wellness, Fromm and many others are also coming out with grain free formulas, Now! is an excellent choice for those that have dogs that are less active, but would still like to go grain free. Now! has a normal protein percentage around 23% I think.
"its hard to avoid grains in treats " Oven Baked Tradition has come out with a biscuit that is grain free (Parallel)Sp? and Evo makes a grain free. I know this because I am Mom to Melvin (bouncy boxer) with allergies to grains
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Old November 9th, 2008, 01:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by p13m4n View Post
At the moment, I'm just feeding him a strict diet of potatoes (rice once or twice) - have been for probably about a week. Normal stools so far; actually, normal stools came out as soon as I started feeding him potatoes. I guess that could say something.

I'll be going to a Global Pet Foods store later today (hopefully open) to pick up some Orijen dog food. Just want to make sure - the large breed puppy formula would be appropriate for a Golden Retriever, right?

Thanks for all the suggestions - EXTREMELY HELPFUL. I didn't even expect this amount of information. Great forum!

You've been feeding him only potatoes or rice for a week? That is not a balanced diet. :sad:

Yes, the Orijen Large Breed Puppy is fine for a golden retriever.
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Old November 9th, 2008, 01:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zomo View Post
"its hard to avoid grains in treats " Oven Baked Tradition has come out with a biscuit that is grain free (Parallel)Sp? and Evo makes a grain free. I know this because I am Mom to Melvin (bouncy boxer) with allergies to grains

Naturapet makes EVO Grain Free Dog Treats and Wellness makes Pure Rewards Grain Free Treats.

You can also make your own which would be alot cheaper. Just google "homemade grain free dog treats" or check the sub-forum here...

http://www.pets.ca/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=38
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Old November 9th, 2008, 01:31 PM
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I agree with rainbow.

Is starch known to stiffen up poops? Maybe the potatoe diet is a simple to explain as that.

Perhaps the sickness' he had haven't cleared up completely? I know my guys have gotten touches of things from swimming in lakes and quick bouts of diarrhea. I think because he was diganosed with Giardiasis not to long ago, I would take him to the vets to rule that out. Then I would pick a good kibble and stick to it for a week or two, feeding canned pumpkin whenever he got the runs. If he still didn't clear up I would be at the vet's again most likely.

Thanks zomo! I'll have to ask my supplier if he can get any of those. Problem with my furry-butt family is I we're grain free AND poultry and beef free.. Crazy I know! It's almost impossible to find a grain free, rabbit, fish or bison treat that doesn't have any of the above proteins. Ambrosia treats were brought into our store not too long ago, elk, bison and fish treats, but guess what the second ingredient was? Chicken meal! Go figure! Talk about deceiving! (sorry off-topic!)

Checking out that link now rainbow, thanks!
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Old November 9th, 2008, 02:17 PM
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Originally Posted by K9 Love View Post
I agree with rainbow.

Is starch known to stiffen up poops? Maybe the potatoe diet is a simple to explain as that.
That would do it!

Though, short term, I think feeding potatoes and plain meat is reasonable as a bland diet option (instead of rice and meat, for example), just potatoes for a week is not a good idea and at best is just covering up what issue there is.
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Old November 9th, 2008, 02:56 PM
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Originally Posted by pitgrrl View Post
Though, short term, I think feeding potatoes and plain meat is reasonable as a bland diet option (instead of rice and meat, for example), just potatoes for a week is not a good idea and at best is just covering up what issue there is.
Hmm, makes sense. Too bad I didn't start a thread back then; at least I'll know better next time.

Well, I bought a bag of Orijen for large breed puppies, and we'll see how it goes. Like I said in my previous post, if this doesn't work, definitely off to the vet. Thanks for all the help!

Last edited by p13m4n; November 9th, 2008 at 03:03 PM.
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Old November 9th, 2008, 03:45 PM
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I've got my fingers crossed for you!! Did you get a can of plain pumpkin as well? It trully works wonders. Just a tablespoon or two and their stiffened right up! At least that will give you, your pup and his bum some rest while you let the new food get in his sysmtem!

GOOD LUCK!
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Old November 14th, 2008, 05:28 PM
geisha geisha is offline
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How is the new diet? Any improvement?
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Old December 1st, 2008, 03:27 PM
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How is your puppy doing?
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Old December 1st, 2008, 10:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by p13m4n View Post
...He was diagnosed with Giardiasis and worms not too long ago - metronidazole and Strongid-T took care of that; at least it was supposed to...

I tried putting him back onto the same food, just to get diarrhea again. Maybe it's the grains?....
In bad cases of Giardia, it can sometimes take several rounds of medication to get it out of their system. You may also want a fecal test for Coccidia as well, which is another parasite that causes stool problems.

In all the cases of GI problems I've seen, once the grains were removed from the diet, the problems vanished.
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Old December 2nd, 2008, 01:40 PM
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My son's newf had almost constant diahrrea when he was a pup. He was treated several times for parasites, although the vet never did do any testing to determine whether he actually had any parasites. He never seemed to gain weight, his bones showed quite clearly. After trying different dog foods with no improvement, I sat down and started comparing the ingredient lists on each food I had tried. I figured out that barley was in each and every one that I had tried, so I looked for high quality foods with no barley in them, and his diahrrea cleared up quickly. He started putting on weight, and now looks like a normal, healthy, beautiful newfie boy.

So while allergies typically manifest in more than one symptom (diahrrea, itching, dry coat, etc) it doesn't automatically rule out allergies just because the only symptom is diahrrea.

And before you buy Wellness treats, please check the bag. I had heard that they were made in China but no one around here sells them, so I cannot look at the bag to verify this. As I'm sure you are aware, China seems to have some very dangerous problems with food quality control, and that includes dog food/treats.
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