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  #31  
Old July 19th, 2008, 11:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pitgrrl View Post
Big Dog Mom, did you ever figure out what you were going to do?
Sorta...

I have about a third of a bag of J/D left. I am going to use it, but next Wednesday, when I take Maggie up for therapy, I am going to have a conversation with her specialist about it. My mommy instinct is that there are much better (and cheaper...) foods out there than J/D. But what's turning me off is that I'm trying to take three or four pounds off of Maggie, and even though I've cut back on the quantity of kibble, Maggie hasn't lost an ounce, and I think it's because the J/D is too carb heavy. Your thoughts?

I am giving Maggie 800 IU of Vitamin E a day now, supplementing with Glucosamine/Chrondroitin/MSM, 15 ml of Cod Liver Oil, and just started a Vitamin B Complex like Dr. Lee talked about.

I may have mentioned in another thread that Maggie is having acupunture, electrical stimulus therapy, laser therapy, and hydrotherapy for her degenerative myelopathy, and I can honestly say that after three sessions, I can see a change. She's not like she was 5 years ago, but there are subtle improvements (no more peeing in the house, getting up a little easier, staying up longer when she's up, more alert,...).
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Last edited by Big Dog Mom; July 19th, 2008 at 11:09 PM.
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  #32  
Old July 19th, 2008, 11:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Dog Mom View Post
Sorta...

......But what's turning me off is that I'm trying to take three or four pounds off of Maggie, and even though I've cut back on the quantity of kibble, Maggie hasn't lost an ounce, and I think it's because the J/D is too carb heavy. .......
The carbohydrate content in a food makes a significant difference, not only in weight loss, but other areas too.

Carbs are sugars that are placed in fat stores unless they're burned & turned into energy. Dogs bodies should rely upon protein & fat for energy - not carbs. Remove the grains (carbs) & the weight falls off, if appropriately calculated for weight loss.
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  #33  
Old July 19th, 2008, 11:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Goldens4Ever View Post
The carbohydrate content in a food makes a significant difference, not only in weight loss, but other areas too.

Carbs are sugars that are placed in fat stores unless they're burned & turned into energy. Dogs bodies should rely upon protein & fat for energy - not carbs. Remove the grains (carbs) & the weight falls off, if appropriately calculated for weight loss.
THIS MAKES TOTAL SENSE TO ME. I just personally lost 60 pounds, and the way I did it was cutting out pretty much all carbs and all sugar. So if that worked for me, I can see how it could work for Maggie as well. I honestly believe that if I was feeding Maggie the same quantity of Wellness Senior as I am now feeding her J/D, I think she would have dropped a little weight by now.

Case in point is that I have NOT reduced her brother's kibble quantity and switched him over to J/D as well, and I think he may actually have put on a few pounds - he's going to the doc for a checkup on Wednesday, too, so if he gained weight, that will be all the evidence I need to go back to Wellness Senior, unless you guys think there is a better kibble-base.

Oh, BTW, my friend's dog is on J/D, and they just raised their prices. She paid almost $73 USD for a 30 pound bag this week. That is just ridiculous. Wellness Senior is about $53 USD.
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  #34  
Old July 19th, 2008, 11:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Big Dog Mom View Post
THIS MAKES TOTAL SENSE TO ME. I just personally lost 60 pounds, and the way I did it was cutting out pretty much all carbs and all sugar. So if that worked for me, I can see how it could work for Maggie as well. I honestly believe that if I was feeding Maggie the same quantity of Wellness Senior as I am now feeding her J/D, I think she would have dropped a little weight by now....
This is why so many dogs (& humans) have Type II Diabetes. Too much carbs (sugars) in the diet.

Anyway, many "senior" formulas are too low in protein. As dogs (& humans) age, the body actually needs more protein because the lean muscle tissues experience catabolization (the muscle eats itself) unless we increase protein & exercise. Be sure that whatever food you choose has AT LEAST 26% protein & try adding some hard-boiled eggs & raw meat as well. It is ideal to feed raw meat separately from kibble because they are digested at different rates. Maybe some raw in the morning & kibble in the evening, or visa versa. I LOVE Primal & Nature's Variety raw patties & bones - they are just awesome!!!!!!!

But, if you've tried eliminating the grains, increasing exercise, etc. & nothing works, then it may be time to check the thyroid.

Last edited by Goldens4Ever; July 20th, 2008 at 08:58 AM.
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  #35  
Old July 20th, 2008, 08:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Dog Mom View Post
THIS MAKES TOTAL SENSE TO ME. I just personally lost 60 pounds, and the way I did it was cutting out pretty much all carbs and all sugar.
Actually, case in point, one of my dogs, no matter how little kibble we fed him and how much exercise we gave him, was always a chunker. It was just impossible to take weight off this dog.....until we cut out grains entirely and went to a raw diet.Weight dropped off with no effort and people keep commenting on how both dogs looks younger now than they did a few years ago

Let us know what happens with the specialist. I hope you can figure something out that works.
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  #36  
Old July 20th, 2008, 10:05 AM
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I supplement Maggie's (and Maxx's) meal with different meats, fish or eggs with every meal - sometimes chicken, sometimes liver, sometimes fish. I tried the raw diet on Maxx and Maggie a few years back and they both rejected it, which I didn't expect. Tried both Primal and Nature's Variety. Maggie can't exercise very much because of the DM - limited strength in the back legs.

What do you guys think is a good kibble base? Do you like the Wellness Senior? What do you like?

BTW, I failed to mention earlier that Maggie is hypothroid, and has been on thyrosyn for a few years now.
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  #37  
Old July 20th, 2008, 09:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Big Dog Mom View Post
....Do you like the Wellness Senior?...
"Senior" formulas are somewhat of a farce to me. Many of the commercial companies formulate those senior formulas with too low of protein & too low of fat. They should have moderate to high(er) levels of protein & moderate fat. Orijen does have a good senior formula though.

You don't necessarily have to feed a "senior" formula - I never will. As long as it contains appropriate levels of protein & fat, that is what's important. But, because she does struggle with weight issues, you have another dilemma. HOWEVER, in my practice, I have found that increasing the fat content (with Nutiva Organic Extra Virgin Coconut Oil) actually helps dogs loose weight because increased fat leads to increased energy, which helps their bodies burn more calories.

Last edited by Goldens4Ever; July 20th, 2008 at 09:58 PM.
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  #38  
Old July 21st, 2008, 01:56 PM
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Newbie to pet food (in many ways apparently...)

Does anyone have food recommendations for a 15 month old lab (Solo) and a 2 year old cat (Nicolas). Are certain foods more suitable to specific breeds?

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  #39  
Old July 22nd, 2008, 05:10 PM
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I was told that Orijen is only available in Canada.

Is this true?
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  #40  
Old July 22nd, 2008, 06:11 PM
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Here's all the stores that carry Orijen in Colorado.



COLORADO



Arvada
Paws N Play

7403 Grandview Ave

Arvada, CO 80002

Phone: (303) 420-2525

Aurora

Pet Palace

4082 Parker Rd

Aurora, CO 80014

Phone: (303) 699-4554



Samanthaz Katz & Dogz

22978 E. Smoky Hill Rd

Aurora, CO 80016

Phone: (303) 627-7387

Boulder



P.C.ís Pantry

2600 30th Street

Boulder, CO 80301

Phone: (303) 245-9909

Whole Pets

2835 Pearl St

Boulder, CO 80302

Phone: (303) 444-4733

Breckenridge

Paws & Claws

1705 Airport Rd Unit 3

Breckenridge, CO 80424

Phone: (970) 547-9633

Brighton

Play! Stay! & More LLC

184 E. Bromley Lane

Brighton, CO 80601

Phone: (303) 659-7676

Castle Rock

Bennington Mercantile

200 Perry St

Castle Rock, CO 80104

Phone: (303) 688-3016

Colorado Springs

Healthy Products for Colorado

108 E Cheyenne Rd

Colorado Springs, CO 80906

Phone: (719) 650-8481

Mike's Natural Pet Market

3620 Jeannine Drive

Colorado Springs, CO 80917-8001

Phone: (719) 570-1488

Conifer

Healthy Pet Supply

25797 Conifer Rd #A

Conifer, CO 80433

Phone: (303) 816-7003

Denver

Chewy's Bonetique

200 Quebec St

Denver, CO

Phone: (303) 344-2663


Earth Dog Denver LLC

370 Kalamath St

Denver, CO 80223

Phone: (303) 534-8700

Mouthfull's

4224 Tennyson St

Denver, CO 80212

Phone: (720) 855-7505

Quality Paws Natural Pet, Inc

46 Broadway

Denver, CO 80203

Phone: (303) 778-PAWS

FAX: (303) 778-0788

www.qualitypaws.com

Elizabeth

Magic Dog

796 E Kiowa Ave (HWY 86)

Elizabeth, CO 80107

Phone: (303) 646-8900

Estes Park

Estes Park Pet Supply

543 E Wonderview Ave

Estes Park, CO 80517

Phone: (970) 586-8442



Evergreen

Chow Down

3719 Evergreen Parkway

Evergreen, CO 80437

Phone: (303) 674-8711

Healthy Pet Supply

1254 Bergen Parkway

Evergreen, CO 80439

Phone: (303) 679-1028

Fairplay

Chow Down

503 HWY 285

Fairplay, CO

Phone: (719) 836-4909

Ft Collins

Poudre Feed - South

6204 S. College Ave

Ft Collins, CO 80525

Phone: (970) 225-1255

Golden

Gold n Paws

710 Golden Ridge Rd

Golden, CO 80401

Phone: (303) 278-8566

Lakewood

Cosmo's the Retail Store

10210 West 26 Ave

Lakewood, CO 80215

Phone: (303) 232-1477

Lafayette

Struttin Pup

1385 Forest Park Circle

Lafayette, CO

Phone: (303) 665-3038



Littleton

Heroís Pets

8086 W. Bowles Ave

Littleton, CO 80123

Phone: (303) 972-1926

Longmont

Blue Hillís Dog & Cat Shop

2255 N Main St

Longmont, CO 80501

Phone: (303) 651-2955

Four Paws & Company

1225 Ken Pratt Blvd #108

Longmont, CO 80501

Phone: (303) 485-1565

Parker

Essential Pet LLC

9841 S Parker Rd

Parker, CO 80134

Phone: (303) 805-6545

For Paws Bakery & Pet Spa

17051 E Lincoln Ave.

Parker, CO 80134

Phone: (303) 840-5999

www.forpawsbakery.net

Muttz N' Stuff

12620 Washington Lane #303

Parker, CO 80112

Phone: (303) 790-9490

www.muttznstuff.com

Westminster

Muttz Pet Goods & Gifts

11225 Decautur Street

Westminster, CO 80234

Phone: (303) 460-0117
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  #41  
Old July 23rd, 2008, 10:19 PM
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Thanks, CLM. I am going to check it out in Boulder.

BTW, Maxx went to the vet today and guess what? HE WEIGHS MORE THAN HE HAS EVER WEIGHED IN HIS LIFE, and he's only been on J/D for about 5 weeks. He went from 109 to 114, a pound a week. That's whack.

R.I.P. J/D, at least for Maxx.
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  #42  
Old July 23rd, 2008, 10:27 PM
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Quote:
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.... HE WEIGHS MORE THAN HE HAS EVER WEIGHED IN HIS LIFE, and he's only been on J/D for about 5 weeks. He went from 109 to 114, a pound a week....
That's very sad - sorry to hear you're struggling so. :sad:

The J/D is almost 50% carbohydrate....that's the problem. And, it's WAY TOO LOW in protein. The protein needs to be significantly INCREASED & the fiber & carbs need to be DECREASED.

But, when you switch to a noncommercial food, don't forget about the detox stage. I recently had an article published on this. Please see attached.
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File Type: pdf HTArticle.pdf (97.8 KB, 288 views)
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  #43  
Old January 1st, 2009, 04:39 PM
Kariburley Kariburley is offline
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J/D dog food

I have a senior male Rotti/Shepard cross , after a breif visit to the vet hospital after an allergic reaction J/D was recommended to me for his hips and weight issue .

Before that he was on nutro senior dog food w/ glucosomine , Rymidal for his hips and a glucosomine supplement , and thyriod meds !

He has been on Jd for 6 months now and no difference I am putting him back on the nutro or something else that is within that price range , I spend over $200.00 a month on his food and pills alone , its just too expensive and since its not doing anything different , I just can't see the point .

With 3 cats as well one with food allegries and a senior cat with early kidney failure , I swear the vets must get a cut from the food companies for pushing their extremey high priced products .

Any suggestions for dog food would be greatly appreciated .

thanks
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  #44  
Old January 1st, 2009, 04:43 PM
Kariburley Kariburley is offline
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wellness senior dog food

Who makes wellness senior i might like to try it if I can get it in Canada .
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  #45  
Old January 1st, 2009, 05:02 PM
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Based on earlier replies, you're probably better off not using a senior formula, but going with a high protein low/no grain diet.

Orijen was mentioned and I know from personal experience that it is a truly awesome food and it's made right in Alberta!!
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  #46  
Old January 2nd, 2009, 08:20 AM
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Global Ryan's Pet Foods

Try: Global Ryan's Pet Foods
http://www.globalpetfoods.ca/home/home.htm
This pet food retailer sells many of the natural/holistic foods not found anywhere else in Canadian retailers. I suggest a store location query on their site. Good luck, finding the right food for your pet is challenging but well worth it
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  #47  
Old January 2nd, 2009, 03:59 PM
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Everyday people come to our store and they tell us how they were recommended Hills for their dogs. I shudder every time I hear this because I have reviewed the ingredients and in my opinion they are not great. One food in particular, made me want to cry :" RD" ingriedients ground whole grain corn, Powdered cellulose, Chicken by products, soybean meal, peanut hulls, BHA BHT and ethoxyquin . Need I say more ! How could this food be recommended by a vet?
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  #48  
Old January 2nd, 2009, 09:18 PM
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Our GSD was put on a similar food (purina joint care). We also found it very expensive and were skeptical about the benefits. We later learned more about dog nutrition and commercial pet foods and discovered that most vet diets are full of crap ingredients that can do more harm than good (fillers, etc.). Since most of the "joint-healthy" ingredients are actually derived from fish (ie omega fa's) I would recommend finding a good grain-free fish-based food such as Orijen six fresh fish instead. You may also consider supplementing with raw chicken necks which are loaded with cartillage, great for joints.
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  #49  
Old January 5th, 2009, 11:36 AM
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to the poster with the older dog..

Have you considered home cooking? I know it can be a bit scary in the beginning..we are always worried we'll screw it up. I do it now, out of necessity, because of kidney deficiency. But i wish I'd done it from the beginning.

There are a lot of really good formulas of commercial dog food. I know Wellness, Orijen, and EVO offer high protein stuff. You don't need to bother with senior formulas.

Hill's in my opinion isn't worth the cost. You are right that the vets shove it down our throats because that company is who sponsored their class in vet school or whatever. So they offer it. I would only say get on a vet rx food if your dog is really ill and must be on a strict diet. and even then, I think if you educate yourself, you can come up with a home made diet or a combo home/commercial to feed that can be just as beneficial! My dog did terrible on Hills. Got gross yeast infections and gained tons of weight..his coat was dull..it was just awful.

I also suggest getting some supplements in..particularly Omega 3's, vitamin E, and COQ10. Whatever you get in the local drugstore, or health food store is fine.

I highly recommend these supplements for senior dogs, especially larger breeds. They are excellent for circulation and inflammation..not to mention you get the added benefits of shiny coat!

These supps along with home cooking have brought my dog down from onset kidney FAILURE to what we are now calling 'slight renal insufficiency'..


If they can benefit a really sick dog, imagine how they can help a healthy dog who's just along in years???

of course glucosamine is a good idea, shark cartilage is great too.
of course with all these homeopathic remedies..you have to be consistent in usage and it may take a few weeks for them to work..but they are worth it in my opinion.

I would say get a really good kibble, and begin supplements..even consider supplementing some home cooking too.
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  #50  
Old January 6th, 2009, 09:25 PM
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Ok i have been sifting through this thread taking bits a pieces to try and help my situation. I have an almost 4mth old lab and we just switched her to Hills science diet about 2 1/2 weeks ago as i was recommended by my vet and my sisters vet (who has a 5mth old lab) Right now she is teething and not eating much of her food. She is hit and miss. we feed her twice a day. Like today i came home and her breakfast serving was gone, her dinner i still half in her bowl and thats because my husband hand fed her the half. I'm pretty sure the teeth have something to do with it, but now i really think its the food. Although for the first week she gobbled it down. Now i was told in another thread the Hills is not good for your pet which i am so shocked about i never would have thought this. So going forward what do i switch her onto? I want to keep her on dry food and mix in some wet now and then. Any help would be great!
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  #51  
Old January 7th, 2009, 01:22 AM
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IMO, what you want to avoid in pet foods is by-products, unnamed animal sources, fillers, and preservatives like BHA, BHT, and ethoxyquin. I personally would also avoid anything with corn, wheat, or soy in it.

Brands that I would feed if I fed commercial foods are:

Orijen
Wellness
Innova
Merrick
Canidae
Natural Balance
Avoderm
Back to Basics
Before Grain
Solid Gold
Wysong
Taste of the Wild
Timberwolf

Please not that I believe that because cats and dogs are carnivores, I believe they should be eating a grain-free diet like Innova Evo, Orijen, Wellness Core, or before grain if a raw or home-cooked diet is not possible, but I understand that not everyone can afford grainless kibble/canned and therefore I listed some brands that I believe to be of good quality for having grains.
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  #52  
Old January 7th, 2009, 01:09 PM
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Another ingredient prevalent in Hill's and Medi-cal is menadione bisulphite complex - it's a cheap substitute for vitamin K but can cause problems with the liver, disturbs the absorption of natural vitamin K, may cause allergic reatctions and eczema, is toxic in high levels, amongst other problems. It is sometimes called vitamin K3, dimethylprimidinol sulfate as a source of vitamin K activity - it cannot be utilized by the body. It's not regulated as there is no requirement for vitamin K for dogs and dogs have eaten foods that contain it with presumably no problems. This info is from the dogfoodproject.com. I guess I just question why add a cheap substitute for a vitamin that dogs don't even require? Anyway, there are other foods that contain this as well - Purina, Iams, Eukanumba, Nutro etc.
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Old January 7th, 2009, 03:52 PM
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I know from expereince this is a very frustrating topic!

Not even 6 months ago I was banging my head against a wall trying to find the right dog & cat food. I was fed up with our vet selling us the Medi-cal filler! This wasn't easy!

My advice to people starting to discover the deceiving world of big brand commercial pet food is to research on they're own, and also check the dogfoodanalysis.com site.

Again, I also recommend Global Ryan's Pet Foods as a trusted pet food retailer. The employees at our location are very friendly and knowledgeable! I would not know where to go for Solo & Nicolas' food if they weren't around. The problem I've found with other pet food retailers is that they're not knowledgeable enough with the good and bad about pet foods. They also don't carry the healthier pet foods on the market. Origen, Innova, Acana, Wellness, etc...

Last edited by solo-nicolas; January 7th, 2009 at 03:58 PM.
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  #54  
Old January 9th, 2009, 10:55 AM
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Thank you for everyones help. Luna is now off Science Diet and is loving Orijen. I feel so much better about what she eats. Thank you everyone for the education, i really appreciate it!
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  #55  
Old January 10th, 2009, 05:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gbscri View Post
Thank you for everyones help. Luna is now off Science Diet and is loving Orijen. I feel so much better about what she eats. Thank you everyone for the education, i really appreciate it!
Yeahhhhhhh! Great choice glad to see she is doing so well !!!!!!!!!!!!!
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  #56  
Old January 11th, 2009, 10:08 PM
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If your vet questions the kibble you feed just bring in the ingredient listing, along with the guaranteed analysis etc. then ask to see the ingredient listing of the diet they recommend.
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  #57  
Old January 18th, 2009, 09:54 PM
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If your vet questions the kibble you feed just bring in the ingredient listing, along with the guaranteed analysis etc. then ask to see the ingredient listing of the diet they recommend.
LOL! I would love to see a vet's face when comparing the ingredients. They would probably be so dumbstruck, they wouldn't know what to say. But then again, would they even know how to compare the ingredients?
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  #58  
Old January 20th, 2009, 12:43 PM
RKMaine RKMaine is offline
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Recommend a diet to replace Hill's j/d food

I have a 3 year old Golden that I love and got from a rescue league about a year ago. He was diagnosed with mild joint disease. The Vet I used to go to placed him on Hill's j/d, Synovi63 granules, and Previcox (as needed for periods of inflammation). Through exercise I've gotten 8 lbs off of his weight in the past 3 months.

I did away with everything but the Hill's j/d because I didn't know what else to give him. I now feed him 1 1/2 cups of the j/d twice a days and add a tbsp of Missing Link Plus for the glucosamine/chondroiton, two tablets of Nutri-vet brewer's yeast, and two capsules of 100mg Fish Oil concentrate.

After reading many of the comments in this forum, I'm realizing that I probably should find a different food for my dog that isn't so high in carbs (not to mention price!). I'm a single bachelor but willing to cook if that's what my dog needs.

I just need a simple, good recommendation for a dry food and what other meat/vegetable combination I should to each of his feedings. I would greatly appreciate all responses.

Thank you for your replies!
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  #59  
Old January 31st, 2009, 07:14 PM
Dontbeamoron Dontbeamoron is offline
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Don't believe everything you read here

#1. Dogs are NOT carnivores. They are omnivores, like their relatives the bear. This means they eat plant matter as well as meat. I'm sure you've seen your dog eat grass. And I'm also sure some idiot told you there was a secret reason for it like he knows he is sick and needs to vomit. Dogs will eat lots of stuff--even chicken feed, which is made out of--oh my god--corn and other grains.

#2. "By-products" doesn't mean what you think it means. "By-products" has a legal definition and that definition does not include beaks, feet, feathers, etc. What you think is evil crap is actually ORGAN meats--the most nutritious parts of an animal and the very thing that any canine in the wild would eat FIRST after killing their prey.

#3. The first ingredient on the label is NOT the ingredient that is present in the largest amount in the food--because the ingredients are measured by WEIGHT, and the meat in your dogfood was weighed when it was FRESH. Fresh meat is WET. WATER weighs a LOT. When the meat goes into your dog's food it is of course DRY. Fresh meat minus water equals a lot fewer pounds of meat than you thought were in your dog's food. 10 pounds of fresh meat plus 5 pounds of corn allows the food company to claim their food has more meat than corn, but when the meat is dehydrated to put into your food it's more like a pound or two. So CORN is actually the first ingredient, but the food company they can fool you that way because you have no idea how to interpret a pet food label. Guess what company DOESN'T use this trick in their labeling? Hill's. But they should, because then idiots wouldn't make **** up about how their foods are all corn and by-products.

#3. Food allergies are exceedingly rare. Of all the allergies your dog can get, only about 10% are food-related.

#4. Hill's uses human-grade ingredients and voluntarily submits to human-food-organization inspections of their manufacturing facilities--you could eat off the floor in their plant.

#5. Vets are scientists, with as much training, and more rigorous school entrance requirements than, a human M.D. Your vet does actually know how nutrition works and even how to read the nutrition label. I'd love to see YOUR face after he explains to you what a guillible idiot you are for listening to completely uneducated conspiracy theorist morons on the internet.

I could go on, but suffice it to say, people who have glass skulls shouldn't throw stones. And how do you know I'm not an idiot, too? You don't, so you should educate yourself instead of believing what you read here.
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  #60  
Old January 31st, 2009, 07:27 PM
aslan aslan is offline
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i'm just wondering dontbeamoron, 1 what your credentials are that you seem to think your better informed than anyone here.

2 why for your first post on our forum you find it neccessary to be so RUDE to the Op and anyone else who has posted.

and dogs are closer related to wolves than they are bears.

by anychance are you one of the vet students who should be studying the information your passing out instead of slamming threads on a pet forum.
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