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Old May 10th, 2010, 12:56 PM
P.Morris P.Morris is offline
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Crucial Message/Finnigans Fate!

New HERE! -and I'll apologize for introducing myself to Pets.ca in this manner. But, I feel that my "letter" is of a crucial concern too many?

If you are about to leave your loved canine, with a Dog Grooming Service, and haven't previously researched, or acquired creditable references? -- Please don't do it!-- I recently just did. And have suffered the ulitimate for it!

It took only a one hr. unattended grooming visit, to return my dog, that had the ability to jump from the car, on a lead into an establishment. Into that of a "half-brain dead animal", not even knowing it's name, for pick-up.

What took place, within that hour, I will never know? --But, in asking the Groomer, as I departed, in a state of shock, as to what had happened? I was told, "The dog got a little tired." as a reason, for it's pathetic, physical condition. -- The dog, shortly on removal home, went into a comatose state. And from that, into a backyard grave, in less that 24hrs. after leaving this Professional establishment.

After a week of "crying", I called the Groomer, and asked her to lead me through the one hr. groom, of which I was absent.-- Did being told "Nothing happened" surprize me? -- Not really! - Not from a person, who's vocabulary, saw the word "tired" and "animal trauma", as meaning, one in the same.
Did the Groomer, show any type of sympathy, care, or concern, over hearing of the dogs death? -- Absolutely none! -- In fact, her heartless words for reason of death were, "Look? Your dog was old. And old dogs, just die??"

My 11yr.old Westie, had never required any type of veterinarian care, other than that of it's regular shots, all its life. He depended on me, for protection. And I let him down! With an individual, who should have never been "trusted" in the first place.-- An individual? Who today? --Is only a phone call away, and awaiting your business!
Please! --for your dogs sake? -- Remember this "letter", and my recent experience, before you ever entrust your beloved pet, ALONE, with anyone, that you haven't thoroughly researched.
My "tears" won't retreive Finnigan. -- but my WARNING, just might save yours from the same Fate! PAT/ Hanover, Ont.
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Old May 10th, 2010, 10:07 PM
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I am so sorry for your loss.....little one..
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Old May 10th, 2010, 10:13 PM
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As difficult as it is, thank you for sharing your story, Pat .

RIP Finnigan .
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Old May 10th, 2010, 10:24 PM
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What a tragedy Pat, I'm so sorry. I had a similar experience with a puppy, well over 20 yr's ago now. It was that experience which taught me to ask my friends for references and confirm with the shop owner that the animals are NOT sedated before, during or after grooming. Again, I'm sorry for your loss.
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Old May 10th, 2010, 10:24 PM
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Oh Pat, I am so sorry for your loss
Your story sent shivers down my spine, such a horrible experience.

I will definitely remember your story and it's caution if ever I have to leave my pup with someone. Thank you for sharing.
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Old May 11th, 2010, 07:40 AM
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So very sorry for your loss. How absolutely devasting for you! I know it's probably too late now that he's buried, but just wondering if an autopsy would have helped at least to find out what caused the dog's death. Perhaps it would have shown if dog had been drugged or suffered some heart problem?

I know for some animals grooming can be a very stressful experience if they've had one bad grooming. My daughter's Min. Schnauzer got cut very badly on his neck one time by one groomer that required stitches. Even though he's got a good groomer now, he's never forgotten that bad experience and is always very nervous when he has to be groomed which is about 4 times a year.
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Old May 11th, 2010, 08:35 AM
P.Morris P.Morris is offline
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Crucial Message/Finnigans Fate

Dear Dog Lovers! - This is just an over-all THANK YOU, to everyone that has understood, and made contact with me, over the tragic death of Finnigan! Your kind words, have meant a LOT, to me, in my time of sadness!

Would "Mummumum" please Reply? -- What did you mean, in your words, "and confirm with the shop owner that the animals are NOT, sedated before, during, or after a Grooming?" -- Are you telling me? that Groomers, use sedation, while performing in this trade? -- If so? I'm shocked! Please educate me?
Reason I ask, is? In conversations, with friends of mine, and explaining the condition of the dog, when I picked him up. They kept saying, "It sounds like the dog, might have been drugged." -- And I kept saying! "No! I can't see anyone doing that. I could see myself [the owner] doing it. But, not a Groomer! It wouldn't be legal for them to administer a drug, without the owners permission. --- Therefore? Please educate me, "Mummumum?"

In Memory of Finnigan, I have decided to go on a rampage, and learn all I can about the Dog Grooming Industry. My "finds" are turning up some interesting info. -- March/2010, ALL, the Ont. Dog Grooming Schools, are "shut down", by the Prov.Government, until they legally adhire, to the LAWS, pertaining to that listed as a Private Career College.
Did you know? That ANYONE, willing to attend for about 200hrs. in one of these unregulated Schools, will end up with a bought Certificate, and then warrent the name as a Professional Dog Groomer, and open for business? The best I found, [in horror] was an on-screen School, offering a "distance learning program". Where you could teach your self at home, under phone call guidance. -- Figure, that one out, for Professional experience?

I'd say that the LAWS, have to change, pertaining to the Dog Grooming Industry? - But? that's a joke! -- As there aren't any Laws, in the first place, to protect, either that of Dog Groomer, or a Pet Owner. -- Would you not agree, that maybe it's time, some were put in place?? --too protect, everyone? And maybe, save our "best friend", that we leave un-protected in these establishments? -- I knew Finnigan, would eventually die! But, I sure didn't think it would arrive, in this manner!

I want to "thank" Pets.ca, for being here! And in particular, "ALL YOU" out there, that are using it. -- It's a real tool, and means, of sharing, over the love of our Pets. And God only knows? My Pets, are my life. -- they ask for so little, and yet return so much. -- We need better protection Laws, in this country, for the sake of animals. Hopefully? I won't be swimming in the pond, alone, to see this happen? --- thanks for listening. Thanks for caring. -- Pat/ from Hanover, Ont.
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Old May 11th, 2010, 10:07 AM
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I am SO sorry this happened to you P. Morris and thanks you for sharing your story.

Some groomers are just terrible and it's SO wise to get a referral from someone you know and trust and NOT just go somewhere close because it's convenient. About 7 years ago I brought my cat Ziglet in for a summer lion-cut shave. He came back with 6/10 nails bleeding from being cut too close. A bandanna was put around his neck but was tied so tight that l'il Zig was wheezing. The groomer told me my cat was difficult and gave me attitude.

Anyway sorry to have threadjacked but I just wanted to reiterate just how important it is to 'know' the establishment that is putting their hands on our beloved pets.

I'd like to offer you my deepest condolences P. Morris

sweet Finnigan
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Old May 11th, 2010, 10:42 AM
P.Morris P.Morris is offline
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Crucial Message/Finnigans Fate

Quote:
Originally Posted by catlover2 View Post
So very sorry for your loss. How absolutely devasting for you! I know it's probably too late now that he's buried, but just wondering if an autopsy would have helped at least to find out what caused the dog's death. Perhaps it would have shown if dog had been drugged or suffered some heart problem?

I know for some animals grooming can be a very stressful experience if they've had one bad grooming. My daughter's Min. Schnauzer got cut very badly on his neck one time by one groomer that required stitches. Even though he's got a good groomer now, he's never forgotten that bad experience and is always very nervous when he has to be groomed which is about 4 times a year.
HI Catlover! -- You know? I've been "beating my self silly" since the dogs death, as to what I could have done differently, to protect him? And I keep asking my self??- Did I "over stress" Finnie, in leaving him there? Did he have an illness, that I didn't know about? What did I do wrong, in my one hour of absense, away from him?
What I didn't put in my first letter, for info, as "Nothing happening", according to the Groomer, was? That she did inform me, through our somewhat, "testy conversation", that the dog, while on the grooming table, was both "vomiting and deficating" as she worked on him. -- I was shocked! "Why didn't you stop, and call me? Didn't you know, the dog was in distress, at this point?" --To which she said, "I was half-way through the groom, and wasn't about to stop!" -- In other words? I left the dog there. And, by the looks of it? With the dog, held in a "loop" and restrained. It was enough, to toss him, over the edge, and likely into a seizure, of some type! --- When I picked Finnie up, after this, he looked like he had suffered "brain damage" due to "trauma."
Was the dog, choked, to produce this? Or was he "stressed" into it? --dead dogs, don't talk!
Had the dog, been in pain, or gasping for air, on pick-up? I would have gone right to the Vet. But, he appeared, just as if, he were staggering "stoned". And all I wanted to do, was get him,and I, home, and out of a stressful situation. -- About the only, thing, that I can give thanks for? Was, that he died in a very peaceful, and painless manner. Once home! he curled up, and fell asleep, and just never woke up. -- As you can see? This still doesn't remove my guilt over the matter? -- Because, I put him there, and that's what happened, because of it! --thanks for you care, and concern! - PAT
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Old May 11th, 2010, 12:34 PM
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I am so sorry to hear of your tragic and heart breaking situation. How horrible. God Bless your angel.
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Old May 11th, 2010, 01:49 PM
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Finigan
PMorris
There used to be a good groomer on 2nd Ave in Owen Sound. Don't know if she's still there or not as I moved away eight years ago. She never sedated. Very seldom used the neck noose to keep heads up. She was very good with all sizes of dogs.
I can't even remember a groomer in Hanover. Guess I've been away way too long. My mom lived there up till her passing almost two years ago.
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Old May 11th, 2010, 02:16 PM
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RIP sweet Finigan your humans wanted only the best for you, but you know that. Thank you for sharing your story so that others can be aware. I would never have thought to ask a groomer if they sedated or not, and it does sound like this is what happened to Finigan. It's a very hard, but valuable lesson you have learned and shared.
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Old May 11th, 2010, 02:17 PM
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PMorris,,first i am terribly sorry to hear about poor Finnigan, that shouldn't ever happen to anyone. Unless the laws have changed since i used to groom, Groomers are not allowed to administer any form of drugs to your animals. A grooming salon affiliated with a vet could but ONLY with written consent from the owner.

From the sounds of this groomer, was she extremely young by anychance? What your describing sounds more like a head injury along the lines of a concussion. I pray that this little didn't lose patience with your baby and give him a crack in the head. I would seriously be contacting a lawyer to see what legal rights you have. No it won't bring back Finnigan but it may stop it from happening to someone else. Again i'm sorry for your loss.

Finnigan
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Old May 11th, 2010, 06:23 PM
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I am so terribly sorry to hear about your loss! I'm sitting here trembling and as I read what Finnigan went thru. Your poor sweet baby!!

I didn't know that groomers drugged animals either! Never mind without the owners permission! Is there anything u could do legally to prehaps shut this groomer down so she'd never do this to another dog?

I have just gotten a shih tzu and she will need to be groomed in the next few weeks and I will definately NOT leave her alone. Thank you for letting us know about poor Finnigan and again I'm sorry.

Finnigan
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Old May 11th, 2010, 07:43 PM
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Drugging animals wasn't legal then either. But it did happen and I don't doubt that it still does happen. There are lots of unethical people out there.

Unfortunately, without a necropsy there is no way to know what happened to your sweetie.
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Old May 11th, 2010, 08:44 PM
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PMorris, I am so sorry for your loss. 11 is not old for a Westie! I know it is really hard for you right now, and getting the word out is so important, but please don't beat yourself up over this. It is so hard not to feel guilt. I had a very sick dog and I gave her medication prescribed by a specialist vet. This medication killed my dog. I have had so much guilt and grief knowing that I put these pills in my sweet girl's mouth. In reality, we both know that neither of us did anything intentionally to harm our sweet dogs. Keep working to get the message out, but please let your guilt go. You didn't cause this.

We learned how to groom our Scotties ourselves. I just worry so much about the possibility of the horror you lived. Be at peace sweet Finnigan
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Old May 12th, 2010, 06:11 AM
P.Morris P.Morris is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marko View Post
I am SO sorry this happened to you P. Morris and thanks you for sharing your story.

Some groomers are just terrible and it's SO wise to get a referral from someone you know and trust and NOT just go somewhere close because it's convenient. About 7 years ago I brought my cat Ziglet in for a summer lion-cut shave. He came back with 6/10 nails bleeding from being cut too close. A bandanna was put around his neck but was tied so tight that l'il Zig was wheezing. The groomer told me my cat was difficult and gave me attitude.

Anyway sorry to have threadjacked but I just wanted to reiterate just how important it is to 'know' the establishment that is putting their hands on our beloved pets.

I'd like to offer you my deepest condolences P. Morris

sweet Finnigan
HI Marko. -- "YES", you got it!! This grooming visit, was because of "convienence", to where I live. Where I should have returned to a Groomer, a matter of miles away, that had been recommended by my Vet, that I know loved dogs, and was good with them. -- I'm just one, stupid old lady, for the choice I made. And now, I'll have to live with it! -- Pat
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Old May 12th, 2010, 06:58 AM
P.Morris P.Morris is offline
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Originally Posted by aslan View Post
PMorris,,first i am terribly sorry to hear about poor Finnigan, that shouldn't ever happen to anyone. Unless the laws have changed since i used to groom, Groomers are not allowed to administer any form of drugs to your animals. A grooming salon affiliated with a vet could but ONLY with written consent from the owner.

From the sounds of this groomer, was she extremely young by anychance? What your describing sounds more like a head injury along the lines of a concussion. I pray that this little didn't lose patience with your baby and give him a crack in the head. I would seriously be contacting a lawyer to see what legal rights you have. No it won't bring back Finnigan but it may stop it from happening to someone else. Again i'm sorry for your loss.

Finnigan
HI Aslan, -- I'm glad you did a reply, as I'm greatfull to hear from someone that "once groomed!" -- It would be nice, if a few others, in the business, would join in, for "info" to others? -- Thanks, for telling me, about how or who would be passing out DOPE, for a dog, during this visit. - As this Groomer, was on her own, and I doubt, have access to it. Not attached to a Vet Clinic.

What still sickens me, is your suggestion of a "whack in the head?" This? or choking him, with the "loop", is my thought, when I picked him up. -- I'll never, ever forget, the way the dog looked, in that grooming crate, April 6/2010.! -- He sat, way back, in the cage. Head hung, as if he'd been beaten, in some manner. And the most vacant stare, looking out at me, not even knowing his name, when I called to him. - I had to reach in, and haul him out, by his collar. --And he had no idea, on "who I was!" -- I was almost sick to my stomach. -- She referred to this as "tired!"

Young,& Inexperience? Definitely! -- And after the death of the dog? I did some research on her, to look into the references, she then gave me. She used a Vet Clinic. And on calling them. Found out, that she was there at one time, as a High School Co-op Student, put had never handled or cared for an animal. She was there ONLY, to OBSERVE, and never an employee. -- The Vet, was horrified, after he heard my story!

What, the Vet and I, agreed on, was? That if "your grooming a dog, and it is both "vomiting and deficating" at the same time, in a "loop",, on the table? You stop the grooming! and call the owner, for pick-up! -- Is this not right? What's your opinion on how you would have handled it??

Calling a Lawyer, I thought of! But, without going into a longer story! It would be a "she said/she said" for evidence. My goal, from here on in, is to see LAWS, set in place, to protect everyone. -- Not all Dog Groomers, are like the idiot, I went too. -- This means, passing on the "word!" -- I've been in touch with the Ont.Pres. of the Dog Grooming Association. I've contacted the ONT.SPCA. I've made contact with my MPP, up this way. -- and I will continue to write letters, and inform others, until something is changed and done about this Deadly Career/Trade. -- I'm sure by now, that "most" can understand, as to "why??" ---again? thank you, for your sympathy, about Finnigans Fate. ---- Pat
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Old May 12th, 2010, 07:18 AM
P.Morris P.Morris is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottieDog View Post
PMorris, I am so sorry for your loss. 11 is not old for a Westie! I know it is really hard for you right now, and getting the word out is so important, but please don't beat yourself up over this. It is so hard not to feel guilt. I had a very sick dog and I gave her medication prescribed by a specialist vet. This medication killed my dog. I have had so much guilt and grief knowing that I put these pills in my sweet girl's mouth. In reality, we both know that neither of us did anything intentionally to harm our sweet dogs. Keep working to get the message out, but please let your guilt go. You didn't cause this.

We learned how to groom our Scotties ourselves. I just worry so much about the possibility of the horror you lived. Be at peace sweet Finnigan
HI ScottieDog, - Your sympathy's, appreciated! And "yes" 11, is not overly old for a Westie. The guilt, may over time, subside? But, as for now? I'm still layered with it!
As this entire story, has had to do, with Finnigan? I've left out my other friend, Duffy [McDuff] from the picture. He's a half brother, to Finnigan. So, I've still ONE WESTIE, left, for companionship. Of which, I now depend on greatly!
Duffy's the one, that was to "pass first" in this house. Not Finnigan! Finnie, had been healthy all his life. -- Poor old Duff, has been on deaths door, and suffered from bad seasonal skin allergies all his life. -- Steroid shots, and medications, have played a toll on him. He's over weight, mostly blind. But, still follows me, around the house, in a happy mood, and good appetite. -- We both, though, miss Finnie!

Luckily, for grooming? I can handle McDuff, my self. He has a more "wire coat", and due the skin problems, doesn't require the groom Finnie, needed. My "groom", certainly isn't show quality. -- But, at least I don't have to stress the dog out, by dealing with others, to keep him trimmed. I'll never do that again, with any dog. -- Never alone, will one be, away, from me!

Thank You for your kind words, in your reply! -- Pat
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Old May 12th, 2010, 07:29 AM
P.Morris P.Morris is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tundra_Queen View Post
I am so terribly sorry to hear about your loss! I'm sitting here trembling and as I read what Finnigan went thru. Your poor sweet baby!!

I didn't know that groomers drugged animals either! Never mind without the owners permission! Is there anything u could do legally to prehaps shut this groomer down so she'd never do this to another dog?

I have just gotten a shih tzu and she will need to be groomed in the next few weeks and I will definately NOT leave her alone. Thank you for letting us know about poor Finnigan and again I'm sorry.

Finnigan
HI Tundra Queen, -- I'm glad, my message, reached You! And "Yes", please for your dogs sake, know your Dog Groomer. -- Please read, back into some of my Replys, to others again, over my event. -- I also, am looking for more "info" on the drugging of dogs, at a Groomers? -- Plus, I'd love to see LAWS, set in place, to protect anyone and everyone, using the Dog Grooming Services. -- We aren't leaving a "lawnmore" for repair, with these individuals. - We're leaving our best friend, that to me, as a senior, is a "life-line."
I see where you have a young Shih Tzu? - I wish you and this dog, a long life, together. I had an "Apso", for 16yrs. at one time, and she was the love of my life. --but "YES?", you will be dealing with Groomers, with this breed! -- and remember me, and Finnigan, please?? before you ever find one?
Thanks again, for your words of kindness. -- Pat
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Old May 12th, 2010, 09:33 AM
aslan aslan is offline
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PMorris...when i groomed it was in a vet clinic/boarding kennel so there was a vet onsite at all times. Owners signed papers stating that if the pet was to show signs of illness that we could have the vet look at the animal..on the very rare occurrances that an animal became ill,the runs,vomiting,etc. the owner was immediately called even tho we already had permission to treat the animal. If i had ever continued grooming privately then yes i most absolutely would have stopped cllipping and called the owner.

In all the years i groomed i can only ever recall 2 animals being sedated. An english sheepdog and a persian cat. both severally neglected and matted to the skin. The slipknot leash is not something i was ever fond of.
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Old May 12th, 2010, 10:22 AM
P.Morris P.Morris is offline
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Many thanks, on your Reply! -- Every little bit of new news, is of interest, and a help to others. -- You, and your grooming practices, sound responsible. -- And as we know? Not every Dog Groomer, is an "abuser?" -- Pat
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Old May 12th, 2010, 11:25 AM
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lol, i just clipped my little guy,,at the moment he probably isn't liking my practices very much.(hates being clipped).

Seriously if and when you do get another pupper, if it is one that needs grooming, word of mouth is THE best advertising. If you're walking your dog and see someone with a dog that obviously needs grooming done,,ask where they get it done,,google them,,ask your vet. What happened is in no way your fault PMorris even tho i know right now you feel it is. Find out what you can about this groomer,is she registered as a business, if not report her to revenue canada,,if she is report her to the better business bureau. Ask around see if anyone else has had bad experiences with her.
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Old May 12th, 2010, 02:13 PM
binkybuff binkybuff is offline
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In my years of dog grooming, I had to re settle dogs into grooming again. They were so distrustful of the groomer, that they would start yelping as soon as the owners left. One kept biting me, and bit me from then until the day he died.

Several, I did get turned around, however for some it still was quite the tramatic experience for them, although, through time, they did settle somewhat, as long as no one else was there. I also had to fix several grooms, as the people were very upset about the look.

I DID NOT ever sedate animals in my shop. The biter I felt like taking over to the vet to sedate, but never did. I suffered the bites. I did have our local vet on call at all times, when my shop was open. The agreement with the client was, if the dog became ill, I would personally take it to the vet, phoning and meeting them there. Mind you, I owned and operated my own shop, and was the only groomer.

During this time we also had a rabies outbreak and anyone handling animals had to have the prevenetitive shot, and they hurt worse than bruising.

I agree with the others, always, ask someone when you see their dogs, if they are groomed, who did it, and what do they think of the groomer, or groomers. Also, if you find one you like, in a shop, ask for that one only. Your dog will appreciate it, and believe me, you will too. If that groomer can't do it that day, then take the next appointment with them.

I am so sorry for what happened to your pup. There is no exuse for not showing any emotion. One has to love dogs and animals when doing grooming, it isn't just for the $$ , it is the love of the animal, and wanting to make it look good, clean, and even loved by the groomer. I had several favourites among my clients, and would use them any time I did demonstrations.

take care
binky

Last edited by binkybuff; May 12th, 2010 at 02:17 PM.
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  #25  
Old May 12th, 2010, 06:41 PM
t.pettet t.pettet is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: lanark, Ont.
Posts: 1,255
Crucial Message

As a groomer I know we are not authorized to sedate or administer meds without signed approval from a vet so I would take this novice to court and sue the pants off her for her "abuse" while continuing to groom your dear Finnegan while he was so stressed (defecating/vomiting). If you can get a written referral from his previous groomer as to his temperment and ease of handling then you can show-up her incompetence in being able to handle a new client that is also an older dog. Did you perhaps have an autopsy done?
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  #26  
Old May 13th, 2010, 07:50 AM
BenMax BenMax is offline
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Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 10,187
Thank you for sharing you heartwrenching story. It certainly has opened my eyes and ears. I have sent my cats for grooming and the odd foster dog. I will now ensure that I am there and will never leave them alone. I actually do know some amazing groomers who are members on pets. I will go the distance and bring them my pets as this has scared the h*ll out of me.

I am so very sorry for your tremendous loss.. Please find peace.

RIP little angel.
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