Walking a monster

[kayla]

My 8 month puppy is sooooo hard to walk! She pulls until my arm feels like it's going to be ripped out of its socket. I stop when she pulls, tell her to sit/stay, which she does, but as soon as I take a step she's off again at full speed. I tried using a lupi but she broke it pretty quickly, it didn't really stop her pulling anyways, just made it easier on my arm. I tried a choke once but never again, it only worked to give her a hacking cough which she still has. I am going to get her another harness asap (a stronger one this time). She has also broken 3 retractable leashes in a matter of days. On the way back from the park she is much better, she knows heel and does it perfectly. It is just on the way there that she goes nuts! I have even tried playing with her indoors to tire her out before I take her to the park but even that doesn't work. I'm having so much trouble with this and it's making walking her really unenjoyable! Please help!

[LavenderRott]

I would ditch the retractable leashes for starters. Check into a good leather one.

[kayla]

Yes I figured that one out (only took three tries ) Now I'm using a thick nylon leash which is still intact.

[poodletalk]

Hi Kayla, sounds like your dog needs to take some dog obidence classes. They will teach your dog how to walk properly on a leash, sit, heal, stay and lie down. I would also get yourself a proper leather leash. (They have some nice leather leashes and matching leather collars at JE Mondou store)If you live close to the southshore, I can give you a name of a trainer. She's excellent and she works with the treat method. The last couple of minutes of class, the dogs have time to socialize with each other.

[Trinitie]

This may start an ugly discussion, but, if you're not dead set against the thought of it, a prong collar made for short hair dogs may be the answer.

Prong collars made for short hair dogs are made of plastic and have little nubs instead of actual prongs. It's far more humane than a choke collar as the dog doesn't like the pressure of the little points against it's neck and a couple of corrections is usually all it takes to get the dog to follow along. The more you train with it, the more you can get the dog to understand what you want it to do. The plastic prong collars are actually more gentle on the dog than the metal ones.

Just to head off one of the arguments I can hear in my head already:

Prong collars DO NOT puncture the skin if used in a proper fashion. Consult a trainer to learn how to use it properly. DO NOT assume that you can figure it out for yourself. You'll just make the dog scared to go for walks.

I hope this helps.

[jjgeonerd]

Gabby also used to pull a lot. She now pulls very little, if at all, and is getting better all the time...and she only wears a wide flat collar. I have nothing against prongs or chokers, but training can accomplish the same thing.

Try this: Think of a command to give her that means stay close. We use "close" (go figure ). Whenever she pulls, stop walking and give the leash short quick tugs until she stops pulling and releases pressure. As soon as she does that praise her like crazy. The tugs should be hard enough that she feels it, but not so hard that it moves her around. They are designed as an annoyance, but she shouldn't be dragged around.

After she stops pulling you can start walking again...at which point she will start pulling again...just keep repeating the cycle until she gets the hang of it. You can also take 2-3 steps backward every so often when she pulls so she learns that she goes in the opposite direction when she pulls.

Most important is to BE PATIENT. The first few walks likely will last a while, but you'll only go around the block. Eventauuly she'll get the hang of it. We actually started by walking Gabby around the house and giving the command. Once she got the hang of it there (within one night) we went outside. Good luck!

[GsdDiamond]

We use a metal prong collar on our Diamond, and let me tell you....the difference is night and day!!

When we first started our walks... I thought she was gonna rip my arm out of it's socket too! Our obedience class instructor recommended a prong collar and we saw an immediate difference. Now, after being trained on the prong collar, she knows how to walk properly.

On a side note, under the same conversation, we started to go to the off leash park. Using the prong collar for regular training has enabled us to "heel" Diamond while walking down the path without a leash. She still bolts, or tries to ....when she sees another dog, but we try to see the dog first and release her. She thinks we're still doing it! LOL

[Sneaky2006]

I'd like to echo what Diamond said. But Yukon wouldn't just pull our arms out he just dragged us He's soooo strong. We went with the prong collar and the difference really is night and day.
He stays right by our side and our walks are way more enjoyable for the both of us.

[Lucky Rescue]

The instant your dog pulls you, and you follow (however unwillingly) he has won. Dogs do what works!

No device or collar is going to work without training as well. I recommend obedience classes for every dog. Good for the dog, good for the bonding between you, and it will teach you HOW to train.

Agree with LV. No retractable leashes. You have no control over the dog with these, and they are only for well trained and obedient dogs to use.

[SarahLynn123]

Training is definatly the key, Im working on that as well. Another device that I seen on the news the other day looks like it would work wonders! Its a harness that hooks up at the front, so when the dog pulls he/she is actually going to pull himself right around to face you (will be walking backwads if he pulls) So in order for the dog to have a regular walk he cant pull! Not sure if its on the shelves yet, but they use them at the humane society for walking the dogs. Its absolutly pain free, which is why I was really interested.
Hope things get better!
Sarah

[twodogsandacat]

I wasn't 'allowed' to use a prong. So doing something I would never recommend now - I tried everything else. It didn't feel fair to me or the dog.

Halter: He learned how to turn and walk backwards.
Harness: He learned to walk sideways. A harness doesn't work in that situation.

Finally my back went out. After back surgery I had to put my foot down. A trainer suggested a prong collar. What was I waiting for???? Now he doesn't even feel it as there is always slack in the leash.

However: go to a trainer to teach YOU how to fit it and use it.

[mona_b]

Originally Posted by LuckyRescue

The instant your dog pulls you, and you follow (however unwillingly) he has won. Dogs do what works!

No device or collar is going to work without training as well. I recommend obedience classes for every dog. Good for the dog, good for the bonding between you, and it will teach you HOW to train.

I agree with this.

I also know of a few people who have used the prong for training.But when they put a regular collar on,it was back to square one with the pulling.This is why when they are puppies,training is very important.Especially the "heel" command.I have trained my dogs this at an early age.The biggest mistake is letting your pup pull you on the leash.Some people think it's cute.But as the pup gets bigger,it's not so cute anymore as they are ripping your arm out.

I admit I never took my dogs to obedience classes.But that's only because I knew how to train them.But I do recommend it to those who don't.

Sarah,I know which devise your talking about.It's been out for some time.A friend used it on her rescue a few years ago.It was great.

[kayla]

She does know the command "heel" but doesn't listen to me when we are going to the park, only on the way back. Every time she pulls I stop, but it hasn't had any effect on her. It's like she can't think of anything but her goal: the park. I just took her out for a 2.5 hour walk and didn't go to the park, after about 30mins she realized we weren't going to the park and "heeled" for me, then saw another dog and forgot everything. I also just went and bought a harness for her, not because I thought it would help with the pulling but to protect her trachea, she has developed a weird cough.

What does a prong collar look like and where do you get one? I have never seen one. Maybe I will try that, at this point I am quite desperate! Would any trainer show me how to use this?

[mona_b]

The prong has small "spikes" that are inside of the collar.Most pet stores have them.I would definately talk to a professional trainer about this.They will teach you how to use it.

[Prin]

You have to go to a trainer to learn how to use a choke collar or prong collar and to learn how to leash train. This is something that most people do not figure out for themselves the first time. You can do serious damage to your dogs throat if you use either collar incorrectly. A retractible leash with a choker cancel each other out. Either you are leash training with a proper leash and a choker or you are not training and being pulled on a retractible leash.

If your dog dominates you while walking and you don't learn to conquer that, there could be some major problems down the road. You really have to go to obedience training and learn the techniques to train your dog.

[jjgeonerd]

Although there are plenty of products designed to make your dog mind during walks, there is no magic one that always works. Gabby used to pull with a choker on (2 different styles), and a friend's dog pulled with a prong on...not as hard, but still pulled.

Training is the answer, but it takes both patience and consistency. A standard collar is sufficient with the correct training. A good example is horses...no person alive would be able to control a horse by force, with or without a collar, but with proper training force isn't needed.


Just my 2 cents.

[kayla]

I have never used a retractable leash and choke together. When I use the retractable I used it like a normal leash, wrapped around my hand so it has no give. I just liked it for when I reached the park so she could have more room to run but I could still have control. Now I let her run off leash, she is completely reliable when I call her. She can see a dog across the field and start running full throttle and all I have to do is call her name and she comes running back to me (the magic of treats ).

I know dogs need training and that there is no quick fix. I used to help train and show Irish Wolfhounds (and horses) and grew up around many, many dogs. I thought I would remember how to do it from this experience, guess not.. I think obedience class would be a good thing to refresh my memory and to train me more than my dog, and have already decided to take her when I am in Vancouver in 4 weeks. Unfortunately I can't start one in Montreal for such a short time. If anyone knows of a place in Mtl where you can walk in and pay per class please let me know! But meanwhile I need advice, I'm hoping there is some great technique out there I have never heard of! So far I am learning to switch up her route (tried it again today) and it seems to work pretty well. But even with a well-trained horse, as soon as they know they are turned around and headed for home they are pretty hard to control

[Sneaky2006]

Hi Kayla, check out this website, it was given to me by Lucky (thanks Lucky!) and it shows what it is and how to fit one. But I do agree with what was said about training along with the use of a prong collar.
http://www.leerburg.com/fit-prong.htm

[matt]

A prong collar is probably the MOST humane training collar out there. Most people who are scared of it have no clue how it works or how to use it. You do not need a trainer to show you how to use this. It is nice if you have access but do not worry if you don't. There is some excellent info on the internet( the LEERBURG site mentioned is a good one) that can get you started.
WHEN USED PROPERLY with training the effect of the prong does not stop once you take it off. The dog becomes conditioned through the training. It is a "training tool" not a cure all and should be used as a tool. I would only use a metal one though . The principle is the same plastic or not.
Now I will say that if you cringe at hearing your dog voice it's discomfort during the "adjustment period" it will be hard to stick with. The dog WILL thank you later. I currently use prongs on both my GSD's and always have. I know how to fit them and am experienced using them. When you train for Obedience title you CANNOT use them. Dog #1 has her CD and DOG #2 his BH all done without prong . I put the prong back on after the trials.

[kayla]

OMG is this what you guys are talking about???
Looks pretty freaky! I think I will use training without and only use this as a very last resort! I just wish there was a good walk-in trainer in Mtl so I could start right away. I know of one in Vancouver but that doesn't really help my situation right now..
Thanks for the advice everyone!

[jjgeonerd]

Sorry Kayla...didn't mean to imply you weren't familiar with training animals...just trying to make a point that special collars aren't necessary in my opinion. Even though Gabby walks well 90% of the time, she also can go crazy and start pulling when we see other dogs, squirrels, cats, etc. I just chalk it up to her only being 1 year old and keep using the techniques I described in my 1st post. She continually is getting better.

Yep...that's a prong collar. They look evil. Even though I don't use them, everything I've read suggests they are safer than chokers, which can damage a dogs trachea.

[matt]

That's the issue , most people can't get past the look. You will need a training collar AND use it IN CONJUNCTION with training . Both work together and are MOST effective together. Again, because of the type of pressure this collar provides it is without question far more humane and most importantly SAFE. I have NEVER heard of any injury from a prong. You would have to intentionally abuse this collar to harm a dog. A choker , on the other hand, get's abused daily from my observations and there is documented cases (quite a few actually) of crushed tracheas from the misuse and abuse of the common choker. I would encourage you to continue to educate yourself from a variety of sources BEFORE you decide on a course of action. Good luck.

[topaz_n29]

this is the first time i too have seen a prong collar..but i too think that u wud have to know what u are doing with it and do it properly. I have always used an ordinary choke collar..actually i usually have to look for mine..lol..Kassidy my shep/rottie is 2yrs. i forgot to put his on the last time to the vet for heartworm test..2 weeks ago. soo he just had his nylon collar on(i keep my leash in the vehicle.).he was vry well behaved going into the vets..so i think i will not even use it anymore..he goes in and just sits by me till we go in. My other 3 dogs are vry small breeds..so i never use collars at all on them..just carry them in.

[Prin]

I have only ever used chokers. The thing that people don't understand is you have to be ready to correct constantly with a choker. If you let the dog pull you on a choker, there can be serious damage. And the corrections are not hard, just enough to get their attention. It's the suddenness that makes it work not the actual choking. And if a choker is too big, it will be tightened to a certain extent even when the dog is not pulling, and that is not good. The choker has to just barely fit over the ears and that's it. It should be hard to take off and when you are walking it should stay loose without gravity pulling the ring to tighten the collar.

A choker, just like any other dog tool can be very abused. Our big guy had holes in his body from the prong collar when we got him and he pulled like mad anyway. We thought of getting a prong but when we took it off the rack to try it on him he immediately lied down, cried and started vomiting. The thing is because prong collars look like they can do more damage, people are more inclined to learn how to use them more gently.

[topaz_n29]

Prin are u following me..lolol.. But now i see we are both on line.
Yes as i said..i do prefer the choke collar myself...

[Prin]

How can I be following you when I post first? Lol

[topaz_n29]

lolol tooo funny prin

[jjgeonerd]

Originally Posted by Prin

We thought of getting a prong but when we took it off the rack to try it on him he immediately lied down, cried and started vomiting.

WOW That's terrible!

[Prin]

It was like a cue for him. We tried again about a week later because we thought maybe it's just a fluke of timing or something, but he did it again.
It was a bit embarrassing having your dog vomit in a petstore though...

[matt]

That kind of abuse is horrible. A normal prong does not puncture skin UNLESS is has been(and people do this) sharpened to increase the pain factor. I just don't want people to get scared and think that a prong collar hurts the dog. A prong or choker , when abused , can harm a dog. I think that as mentioned earlier, TRAINING is the key, not the collar per say.