#91
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amen! amen!
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Abigail~ APBT~ 2 Jersey ~ APBT~5(ish) Kato ~Rottie~ 5&1/2 Wendellan~ Feline~ 10(ish) Theedee~Feline~10(ish) "Da-Goob"~ APBT/Dogo x (5-6ish) "My Pitbulls are better behaved than your kids!" (my favorite bumper sticker) |
#92
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Thanks for your concern GF. It's actually healing nicely. I've gone out a couple of times since it happened and also worked two days. It's a wonder what makeup can do these days. Sometimes I think we all need to take a step back and look at others around us who have it so much worse than us. When we do we need to thank whatever higher being we believe in for giving us the ability to deal with our lives - no matter how tough we think they may be. As my mom used to say - There's always someone who has it rougher than you.
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Assumptions do nothing but make an ass out of u and me. We can stick our heads in the sand for only so long before it starts choking us. Face it folks. The pet population is bad ALL OVER THE WORLD! |
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So....Could we at least agree on one thing here. And that is: we want better understanding of how dogs are greeted/ socialized in civil society.
I'm taking baby-steps here...with a plan. Those of us, who would like to see dogs as welcomed parts of civil society ~ please contribute to the discussion. Nonetheless...What's okay in your town/city? Do you leave your dog outside the No Frills while you shop for an hour or is it okay to bring her in to Desjardins? Or, is it best to leave the little monster at home? Last edited by hazelrunpack; April 23rd, 2011 at 10:39 PM. Reason: Edited for rudeness |
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I also won't leave my dogs outside of any location, mostly just because I'm paranoid that someone will take them. IMO what this all comes down to is bearing the responsibility as an owner and ensuring we understand our dogs - including fears/aggressions and what triggers them. We cannot "assume" that everyone will know proper dog etiquette. My dog Tippy is extremely afraid of men. I cannot count how many men will approach us and ask to pet her. I always ask them not to, and the majority of guys will give me the "Oh animals LOVE me" line and attempt to pet her regardless of my initial warning - until she instantly bares her teeth, begins to cower and I have to physically step between her and the person (who usually look a bit surprised by her reaction, go figure.) Tippy has not yet bit anyone, but I honestly think she could if pushed. When we are out in public, I am constantly on gaurd....because I know that even though people still understand that they need to *ask* before petting her, some still try it when I say no. I have to be on my toes at all times when we are out in public, and she is getting better around men - slowly but surely. But if she did bite anyone, while on my watch, I would take full responsibility for it and not put the blame on the other person - EVER. I am the one who my dog needs to be able to rely on, I am the one responsible for making sure things like that don't happen, I am the one that needs to bring my dog home safely after choosing to take her outside in the public, in the first place. But that's just me.
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~B~ "If you are a dog and your owner suggests that you wear a sweater. . . suggest that he wear a tail." Bailey (Labradoodle) Tippy (Collie/ShepX) Vali (American Bulldog) Artiro (Cane Corso) |
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Hmmmmm, interesting opinions about dogs being brought into stores. When I lived in Germany back in the 80s it was quite commonplace for a family dog to be brought into stores and RESTAURANTS. Yep, and guess what, due to all the social interactions, the dogs were well behaved. They would lie under the table during dinners, just meander through the stores, pretty much ignore humans and follow their family.
I personally am all for well behaved dogs being brought into stores, they make me smile while I am doing a chore that I find absolutely deplorable. The only store that gives me any joy is Global Pet Foods. They always have dogs and cats running around (OK, the dogs are on a leash and not running, but the kitties sure are ).
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Cat maid to: Rose semi feral, a cpietra rescue, female tabby (approx 13 yrs) Jasper RIP (2001-2018) Sweet Pea RIP (2004?-2014) Puddles RIP (1996-2014) Snowball RIP (1991-2005) In a cat's eye, all things belong to cats.-English Proverb “While we are free to choose our actions, we are not free to choose the consequences of our actions.” Stephen R. Covey |
#96
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I agree that it "would" be nice to go shopping with well behaved dogs....but the real world is full of flawed pet owners - so for me this is a terrible idea.
For every 1 dog that is perfectly trained there are thousands that are not..... Given how irresponsible many pet owners are (with obedience training) and the fact that untrained dogs are still animals with teeth - why anyone would want to take the chance that the dogs would be well behaved in a store is beyond me. "Well behaved dog" as a store policy is one of those words that is VERY ambiguous, therefore dangerous. Will someone evaluate every dog that enters a store for "well-behaviorness". Policies like this are just screaming for for additional injuries and lawsuits. What's not ambiguous is no dogs allowed period. (except service animals). The chance of injury is close to zero in this case. Store puts up a big sign stating the policy (and that if you ignore the policy store's liability is ZERO and you personally will be responsible), inform the employees of the policy. Now the problem is pretty close to being solved...
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Please tactfully EDUCATE or IGNORE posters you don't agree with. Please PM me & Include URLs and post #'s for any issues and it's my pleasure to help. I'm firm - but fair. Mind the Rules and enjoy your stay. Newcomers FAQ - How do I post on this BB? Pet facebook group Check out the Pet podcast Follow me on Twitter |
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I have to agree with Marko on this one.
I also want to address the question about leaving "fido" outside unattended while shopping for an hour. I personally think that it's not worth the risk, regardless of what type of dog you have or how well trained that dog may be. I shudder when I see a dog tied to a bike rack beside the Safeway doors, grocery carts narrowly missing running over their paws or tail, people passing every which way, it can be very overwhelming for the dog, you can see the anxiety in their eyes, and when a dogs anxiety level is so high that's when bad things can happen. Once there was a GSD, that was obviously not very people friendly, tied up by the doors. It would growl, snap, bare it's teeth, lunge and bark at people going by. You couldn't take a wide berth because it was tied up right beside the door. You could have the sweetest dog on the planet, the best trained dog, but the human factor remains, and there are people out there that would gladly take your dog and do God knows what to it. For instance dog fighters are opportunistic, they see your lovely little pooch sitting there unattended and decide it would make a great bait dog. Or a group of perhaps not well trained teenagers take your dog and douse it in gasoline and set it ablaze, we hear these stories far too often. I don't believe leaving "fido" unattended in a public place is ever a wise thing to do. Just my opinion.
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Abigail~ APBT~ 2 Jersey ~ APBT~5(ish) Kato ~Rottie~ 5&1/2 Wendellan~ Feline~ 10(ish) Theedee~Feline~10(ish) "Da-Goob"~ APBT/Dogo x (5-6ish) "My Pitbulls are better behaved than your kids!" (my favorite bumper sticker) |
#98
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I'm quite content leaving my dogs at home while I'm shopping anyways. Last thing I would want to be doing is worrying about who is approaching my dog or what my dog is doing while I'm trying on shoes and stuff.
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Courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyways. ~John Wayne |
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~B~ "If you are a dog and your owner suggests that you wear a sweater. . . suggest that he wear a tail." Bailey (Labradoodle) Tippy (Collie/ShepX) Vali (American Bulldog) Artiro (Cane Corso) |
#100
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the only stores my dog goes into with me are home depot and petvalue (food store), I use a 16 foot flexi leash when we walk and have for our last 3 dogs, in fact its the same leash, when near people or walking on a sidewalk like in Brockville, her leash is shortened to 4 feet and she walks nicely beside me, on the bike path its extended to its full length, when she spots a bike, a joker or a rollerblader she comes back to me automatically and walks by my side, I "lock" the leash just in case she decides to join the kids passing by.
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#101
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I agree with LMPG and Erykah,do not bring a dog if you go shopping,we don't see it her very often though.
I have Bailey on a 15foot leash,but only because I want her to be able to sniff things etc..which she does a lot,however,if someone approaches us I pull her in right away,because she does snap at some people. I never let anyone pet her.
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"The cruelest animal is the Human animal" 3 kitties,Rocky(r.i.p my boy),Chico,Vinnie |
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Can you imagine what a nightmare shopping must be for the person who is really scared of dogs? We shouldn't make light of that simply because we dog lovers aren't. I am scared of spiders and to imagine a shop crawling with them is creeping me out just thinking about it. LOL.
Bailey, erykah, Marko and LMPG, had to agree with all you've said. Interesting point about someone vetting each dog as it walks in the door, Marko. They'd risk being bitten but also, how would they know if it's a dog aggressive dog? I enjoy my dog free time while I shop and because my dogs are reared the way they are, we have never ever had separation anxiety. (from me or them. ) Leaving them unattended anywhere outside my home though is not on, except for at a vet clinic of course if they need to stay there. |
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You guys are too much. Not every Tom, Dick & Harry would bring their dogs with them when they shop , I would imagine most people wouldn't want to bring their dogs, I don't think it's all that convenient.
I did NOT see one misbehaved dog while I was there (lived there for a total of 7 years ), whether it be walking on the street, going for hikes (and you are never alone on a hike), or eating in a restaurant. Maybe the dogs are more socialized there, better bred, or they have better owners , but it's really not the nightmare you guys imagine . Or people had consideration for society and would leave their "misbehaving" dogs at home . Just because you "can" doesn't mean you "should". As for the fear of dogs or dog aggression, well that doesn't just suddenly appear in stores, it is there when walking in the park (now that is a nightmare when owners allow their dogs off leash in public parks and one is biking by only to have a dog bite at the heels of the biker ), on the sidewalk, or in the front yard. It does make it unpleasant for those who are afraid of dogs to enjoy the outside because of "misbehaving" dogs, so should dogs be allowed in public parks? On the sidewalks? Really that argument for not being allowed in stores is a moot point, IMHO. Ignorant dog owners are everywhere .
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Cat maid to: Rose semi feral, a cpietra rescue, female tabby (approx 13 yrs) Jasper RIP (2001-2018) Sweet Pea RIP (2004?-2014) Puddles RIP (1996-2014) Snowball RIP (1991-2005) In a cat's eye, all things belong to cats.-English Proverb “While we are free to choose our actions, we are not free to choose the consequences of our actions.” Stephen R. Covey |
#104
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I just want to know, how the Shih Tzu made out. The womens face will heal, all dogs will be banned from the store, the owner will pay the fine, but what about the dog.....
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The more I get to know people, the more I love my dog... There ain't no cure for stupid ...... but we should make sure we laugh and point it out to everyone else |
#105
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I wouldn't care how well behaved dogs are, or are not, I am glad I live in a society where they are not welcome in shops., and certainly never in restaurants. Oh, and in some Parks here dogs most certainly are not allowed. I was told to move on from one in SA when my sister and I went to the Royal Adelaide Show with Dalmatians and she wanted to let them have a break and stretch their legs. A lot of caravan parks won't allow dogs now because of the past misdemeanors of lazy irresponsible dog owners that never clean up after their dogs. I can understand it and accept that there are a lot of people who don't expect or want our CBD to be cluttered with everyone's pets. Why would you need to take a dog shopping? Socialising can be done at a dog park, puppy parties(do your vets run them?) or at obedience classes, with friends etc.. I fail to see what would interest a dog in shops, because given the choice most would prefer to go chase a rabbit, roll in some horse manure, tree a sqirrel or run around with other dogs. Is it for the dog to socialise, or for the owner? Just strikes me that in a lot of cases it is attention seeking.
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#106
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When we were in a "gasthaus" , we would see the dogs just lying under their master's chair or table. No problems, no disturbances. What I found more disturbing was the flies and the bees all over the baked goods in the bakery and the fact there was probably cockroaches that were all over the anything left out overnight . But that didn't seem to bother anybody either . All I am saying, is that when a dog is behaved, it's really no big deal if they are in these places, it's just society's outlook on what is acceptable or not. To each it's own, I guess.
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Cat maid to: Rose semi feral, a cpietra rescue, female tabby (approx 13 yrs) Jasper RIP (2001-2018) Sweet Pea RIP (2004?-2014) Puddles RIP (1996-2014) Snowball RIP (1991-2005) In a cat's eye, all things belong to cats.-English Proverb “While we are free to choose our actions, we are not free to choose the consequences of our actions.” Stephen R. Covey |
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I haven't visited Canada or Germany, L4H, but as you have, are you talking about similar cities? I'm sure if that lady with the Shih Tzu had had it tucked under a table it wouldn't have bitten the other woman's nose, but if she left it home it wouldn't have the opportunity to even see a passing ankle as being tempting. And sorry, Shay, I use it as an example omly because it was allowed to get into trouble, to be truthful about my own dogs, people wouldn't want to be passing too close to a table with a cattle dog under it. LOL. There is just no escaping the fact that if dogs were not allowed in that store, that woman would not have such a nasty injury. Cat owners manage to leave their cats at home for the time it takes to do their shopping.
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#108
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I am strictly talking Germany, NOT Canada. Oh Lord, I don't think you could get a dog into a restaurant here (service dogs excepted of course ).
However, since I have seen both sides, I personally, don't have a problem with well behaved dogs in restaurants or any store. AND I think many dogs are better behaved than some children . Dogs make me smile
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Cat maid to: Rose semi feral, a cpietra rescue, female tabby (approx 13 yrs) Jasper RIP (2001-2018) Sweet Pea RIP (2004?-2014) Puddles RIP (1996-2014) Snowball RIP (1991-2005) In a cat's eye, all things belong to cats.-English Proverb “While we are free to choose our actions, we are not free to choose the consequences of our actions.” Stephen R. Covey |
#109
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I think this whole thread is getting a little off track. Some of you seem to think that dogs run amok in stores here. They don't. Most of the time in this area at least I don't even see dogs in the stores they are allowed in - pets stores. I do see guide dogs in the store I work in. Their trainer has them in daily from the time they are very young babies till the time they leave to go to the learning centre for more extensive training. I have never ever seen a dog in any Home Depots around here.
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Assumptions do nothing but make an ass out of u and me. We can stick our heads in the sand for only so long before it starts choking us. Face it folks. The pet population is bad ALL OVER THE WORLD! |
#110
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I don't mind my thread going off topic, I'm rather enjoying hearing so many sides from so many different people. You rarely go into our home depot without seeing a dog. In the summer, our outdoor market is always filled with dogs, in fact they have a special dog day where there is a photographer catching pics of your dogs, a dog "trick" competition where the shoppers choose the winner *L* and a doggie dress up contest, we missed it last year but plan on taking in this years fun. Brina comes there with us all the time and her favorite booth is the dog cookie one. But then again , its a downtown outdoor market. on our bike path, (where I'm getting ready to go to right now) I always give a large berth to anyone coming, Brina and I get right off the path and continue walking.
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#111
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Cat maid to: Rose semi feral, a cpietra rescue, female tabby (approx 13 yrs) Jasper RIP (2001-2018) Sweet Pea RIP (2004?-2014) Puddles RIP (1996-2014) Snowball RIP (1991-2005) In a cat's eye, all things belong to cats.-English Proverb “While we are free to choose our actions, we are not free to choose the consequences of our actions.” Stephen R. Covey |
#112
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Sorry Melinda. I didn't mean it was a bad thing.
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Assumptions do nothing but make an ass out of u and me. We can stick our heads in the sand for only so long before it starts choking us. Face it folks. The pet population is bad ALL OVER THE WORLD! |
#113
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no no, I didn't think you did, but I didn't want mods to close or "remind" anyone to stay on topic, I'm enjoying this.
on a side note, I met our assistant manager of Home Depot on the bike path, she was biking by and stopped to see Brina. We were talking about the incident and she said "I hope you won't stop bringing Brina in to see us" but I told her I would only take her to the garden part of the store, its sort of "open air"....fenced in but only a partial roof. So I guess its up to each store? |
#114
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Cat maid to: Rose semi feral, a cpietra rescue, female tabby (approx 13 yrs) Jasper RIP (2001-2018) Sweet Pea RIP (2004?-2014) Puddles RIP (1996-2014) Snowball RIP (1991-2005) In a cat's eye, all things belong to cats.-English Proverb “While we are free to choose our actions, we are not free to choose the consequences of our actions.” Stephen R. Covey |
#115
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Our dog was like this when she first arrived here.....she disliked men although she wasn't aggressive toward them. It took a lot of time and effort to train her that men were okay...it can be done. |
#116
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__________________
~Friendship is like a bank account. You can't continue to draw on it without making deposits~ ~Tegan 9 year old yellow lab~ ~Wilbur 9 year old LH cat~ ~Mirabelle 18 mos dsh~ ~O'Shawnnessey 18 mos dsh~ ~Darby 1 year old dsh~ ~Mindy 7 yr old shih tzu~ ~Dexter 10yr old Salmon (large goldfish) |
#117
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#118
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When we first adopted Lucky and Penny, I would try to take them to as many public places as possible because of their lack of socialization. However, even when Penny was muzzled, had on her "don't touch" vest, and with me telling people not to touch her...many still did . I always heard either, "oh, it's ok, I'm good with dogs" or "but she's a Labrador, they're friendly dogs" . So, other than car rides and for walks around the perimeter of shopping mall parking lots, I don't take them out in public anymore. It's a shame really and makes me feel as if I've failed them to a certain extent but, it's not a chance I'm willing to take if complete strangers ignore my warnings.
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"Education is a progressive discovery of our own ignorance." -Will Durant |
#119
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If Home Depot say no dogs now, yet Melinda was invited to take Brina back, looks like that will policed exactly as it was in the past. |
#120
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LP, I know what that's like. I had a lovely looking red speckled boy. Handsome fellow with two matched eye patches, a lovely speckled coat, and he would stand in front of people wagging his tail, looking friendly, but he could wag the tail and still be ready to bite . He wanted no attention until he said it was okay, and so I went through that same annoyance with people almost begging me "Are you SURE he'd bite?" "He looks so friendly" , "Are you SURE I can't pat him?". I should have let them, it would have shut them up! We had a visitor though who really was literally deaf to my warnings not to touch him, so she did pat him, and the minute she stopped, he bit her. Luckily it was another cattle dog owner who understood she shouldn't have touched him. I could never have taken him out shopping, my patience with idiots who won't listen wouldn't last that long. LOL
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