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  #31  
Old March 21st, 2007, 02:49 PM
Prin Prin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quote in wmarcello's post
The reason an ingredient list for pet food says "ground corn" instead of just "corn" is because whole corn is finely ground before it is added to the food. The outer layer of the corn kernel is impervious to stomach acid and grinding the corn is necessary to expose the very digestible inner part of the kernel to the digestive process. Unfortunately, there are people that would rather sell their "corn free" product than to give out correct information. Interestingly, many of these companies do not have access to the corn growing states. The most basic research can attest to the high digestibility of ground corn."
Yeah, that's just not true. I'm sorry, but if you just compare the stools of two dogs, one fed corn food and one fed corn-free food, you'll see the difference. The stool of the dog fed corn will undoubtedly be bigger, lighter in color AND tastier to stool-eating dogs around. Why tastier? Because it's so rich in protein because it passes through undigested.

If you don't grind flaxseed, you don't digest it. If you grind it, you digest it much better. But that's just not the case with corn.

Who to believe? Why not try a good food for a bag and see for yourself? It won't hurt to try it, and you might be surprised at the results. If you're not surprised, you can always switch back. It's much easier to switch back to a food like Nutrience anyway, because it's so loaded with stool hardners and digestive aids, that the cat will barely have to digest any of it on its own. Holistic food is harder to digest in the beginning because our animals have to relearn how to digest on their own...
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  #32  
Old March 21st, 2007, 03:51 PM
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wmarcello wmarcello is offline
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@rainbow:
Thanks for the link. Fredericton came up with 6 hits. Five of them I didn't know existed, and the last one is the one I mentioned earlier where I didn't think they carried the stuff. Fortunately though on the way home, before even reading your post, I stopped by and saw that they carried Felidae among other brands mentioned here. Some of the brands were ridiculously expensive (like Wellness) and I would probably never buy them for that reason alone. I was however pleasantly surprised that Felidae was quite affordable. It was actually cheaper per Kg than many of the brands I listed at the beginning (Nutro, Pro Plan, Techni-Cal, Feline Plus, and Eukanuba), and the ingredients seem much better. The only ones cheaper were Nutrience, Iams, and Science Diet. I initially didn't pick Iams and SD because of the by-products and grain being used as the main source of protein. I figured Nutrience at least used chicken meal as the main source. Anyways, all that to say that I'll definitely mention Felidae to the other half, and more than likely we'll at least give it a try.

@prin
I'm still having trouble knowing what info to trust. I'll take your word on the dog stool , but I find it hard to believe that product sites like the one previously listed and big product sites like Purina would be able to just blatantly lie like that.

http://www.purina.com.sg/caredog_article2.html
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  #33  
Old March 21st, 2007, 03:59 PM
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Scott_B Scott_B is offline
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Well, is Purina..of course they're going to market ingredients in order to sell their product. We have nothing to gain on this site by making things up and recomending some foods over others. Purina has everything to gain. Its all about $$$$$$
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  #34  
Old March 21st, 2007, 04:04 PM
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wmarcello wmarcello is offline
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Originally Posted by Scott_B View Post
Well, is Purina..of course they're going to market ingredients in order to sell their product. We have nothing to gain on this site by making things up and recomending some foods over others. Purina has everything to gain. Its all about $$$$$$
And everything to lose. They have a marketing division. There's no way they would be so blatant in their false advertising.

I'm assuming that their data is right, but there is something that they are not mentioning. I want to know what they're not mentioning.
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  #35  
Old March 21st, 2007, 04:08 PM
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Scott_B Scott_B is offline
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Its all in the wording. 99% of the people who buy their product never read whats in it. And if they did, theyy'd read its 91% digestabl. Hmm, must be good then.

Think about it..Its a cheap filler. Where would dogs or cats EVER eat corn in the wild? Roaming the neighbourhood? They wouldnt. So why put it in pet food? Cheap filler that people make money off of selling to pet food companies. Simple as that.
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Please please please give Maggie the steak! Its not too big for her little mouth!

Their impression of power is remarkable. They give one the feeling of immense reserves of energy, of great reservoirs of knowledge, of tolerance of disposition, obstinacy of purpose, and tenacity of principle. They are responsive, and they have a lot of quiet, good sense.

-J. Wentworth Day, from The Dog in Sport, 1938
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  #36  
Old March 21st, 2007, 04:11 PM
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wmarcello wmarcello is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prin View Post
Yeah, that's just not true. I'm sorry, but if you just compare the stools of two dogs, one fed corn food and one fed corn-free food, you'll see the difference. The stool of the dog fed corn will undoubtedly be bigger, lighter in color AND tastier to stool-eating dogs around. Why tastier? Because it's so rich in protein because it passes through undigested.
From dogfoodproject.com in the carb section:

"Corn often gets an undeserved bad reputation. While it is not acceptable as a main source of protein in a dog food (as it is used in combination with corn gluten), as a source of carbohydrates it is no better and no worse than other grains in terms of nutritional value and digestibility. The starch part of corn is highly digestible but the whole ground product has a higher fiber content than other grains (around 7%), which results in slightly larger stools - often incorrectly interpreted as lack of digestibility. Unless an individual dog is intolerant or allergic to corn, there is no need to avoid products which include it in reasonable amounts."

This seems to support the data I previously posted, unless this is only true for dogs and not cats...

http://www.dogfoodproject.com/index....betterproducts
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  #37  
Old March 21st, 2007, 04:16 PM
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wmarcello wmarcello is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott_B View Post
Its all in the wording. 99% of the people who buy their product never read whats in it. And if they did, theyy'd read its 91% digestabl. Hmm, must be good then.

Think about it..Its a cheap filler. Where would dogs or cats EVER eat corn in the wild? Roaming the neighbourhood? They wouldnt. So why put it in pet food? Cheap filler that people make money off of selling to pet food companies. Simple as that.
I'm not debating whether it's filler. I know it's there to pad the protein figures and cut down the reliance on expensive meat protein. I'm debating whether the corn is actually digestible.

From Prin's original comment about Felidae:
"Do you see how much meat is in this food? Do you see how there's no corn? Cats and dogs can't digest corn very well. It's in there as a filler- it boosts the protein numbers and is VERY cheap. Meat, on the other hand, is very digestible, but expensive."
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  #38  
Old March 21st, 2007, 04:17 PM
Prin Prin is offline
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Yep, there is tons of info out there to support both sides, but IMO, if you get off corn, you'll never go back. You'll just see the difference.
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  #39  
Old March 21st, 2007, 04:30 PM
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wmarcello wmarcello is offline
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Originally Posted by Prin View Post
Yep, there is tons of info out there to support both sides, but IMO, if you get off corn, you'll never go back. You'll just see the difference.
I never really doubted that. I understood that corn was an inferior and cheaper source of protein. I just wanted to make sure that it wasn't going to cause my kitties serious digestion problems, and from the info on dogfoodproject it seems like it won't. Now the info about the K3 vitamin and the digestive aids... that I didn't know. Those would be my main reasons to try something new. Now that I've checked the pet store and found that I can get a superior product at a reasonable price, there's a very good chance I'll give it a try when their current food runs out.

Thanks again guys!
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  #40  
Old March 21st, 2007, 04:33 PM
Prin Prin is offline
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It's not harmful to feed corn. But IMO, your cat will be healthier on a food without corn, mainly because the ingredients are generally of higher quality and the proteins are better digested. Too low protein in a cat or dog food can cause serious issues. If corn accounts for a substantial amount of that protein, and your cat isn't absorbing half of it, you could end up with trouble.
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  #41  
Old March 21st, 2007, 04:50 PM
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I agree with Prin on the corn issue. But, there is another thing to keep in mind about corn and corn gluten, wheat, wheat gluten, etc. Corn and wheat are both susceptible to the mould toxins that are fatal to our pets. Therefore, I would never buy any food that contains them.
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  #42  
Old March 21st, 2007, 04:51 PM
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wmarcello, I hope you seriously give the Felidae a try.
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