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Old March 24th, 2011, 10:42 PM
SamIam SamIam is offline
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Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Canada
Posts: 447
Okay, two at a time...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Criosphynx View Post
what? where did I say that?
I am telling you how the dog might react to your training.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Criosphynx View Post
firstly, if the dog learns when you have treats and when you don't. You are not training with food correctly. Thats a totally separate issue
Some dogs have very good noses. Should I plug his nose?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Criosphynx View Post
you are rewarding an incompatible behavior. In theory the reward used with be of higher value than the intristic biting behavior... We aren't waiting around of it to extinguish...
Rewarding the alternate behavior IS discouraging the unwanted behavior
While you are treating, the aab might be rewarding. When you stop, the dog has to make a choice. Behaving now has a reward history, but biting is still a lot of fun and it feels good on the teeth and sometimes they squeal when you do it. We need to extinguish the biting/mouthing/jumping completely, before someone gets hurt.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Criosphynx View Post
Plus, the dog has already shown that attention removal is NOT aversive to the dog. Or aversive enough, so no reason to keep using it if its not working.
That's right. -P didn't work, I want to use a non-abusive +P, but you say you can do it without. Maybe I just have more experience with persistent big bouncy rude dogs, but I've met some who enjoy themselves way too much for anything to work without me stepping in and saying "Hey! Back off and mind your manners! This behaviour is not acceptable!"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Criosphynx View Post
kids pee in diapers. We reward them for peeing in toilets. Its self reinforcing to urinate without waiting. The behavior goes away because your making the NEW behavior MORE reinforcing...its not about extinction...extinction would just be ignoring the dog...which I already said would not work for self reinforcing behavior...
Some kids are tough, too! Especially with the fancy new "dry" diapers. Punishment that may me necessary in this case might be mom/dad saying they're disappointed, trust me they usually do this at least once, or switching to big kid pants, which feel icky when wet.
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