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-   -   My Yorkie with cancer... (http://www.pets.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=83251)

razorace January 15th, 2013 12:26 PM

My Yorkie with cancer...
 
:cry: First I know she is 15 yr. old and she has had this breast cancer for many years. The vet said not to remove lumps at her age as she has developed 50 to 75 % kidney failure now..I was wanting to make sure I am giving her all the special food she needs..She has been on c/d diet for many years, she has had 3 bladder stones removed. I know there is nothing I can do for her now, and it breaks my heart, I just want to make sure I am doing all I can for the rest of her life to make her comfortable. I read somewhere that giving her table food is good for kidney failure, I only have given her chicken breast that I boiled. What food should I be feeding her? Stay with the c/d? I know she needs more water in her food..Please if anyone has any suggestions as to what I should make sure her diet is each day I am all ears. She is still active, but we are having to bind up the tumor as it is bleeding and draining,,she seems to welcome the tshirt tied around her with the mini pad inserted in it. Well thank you for reading and any thing you can offer to me I appreciate it so much..I am just lost ..

Barkingdog January 15th, 2013 02:44 PM

If it was me I would let my dog eat anything he wanted to in the little time he had left.

Dog Dancer January 15th, 2013 09:56 PM

I agree with barkingdog that eating table food (not garbage) won't likely make too much difference at this point. Trust your heart to do what is right for your girl. I'm sorry I can't offer any advice to your specific questions, but hopefully someone with experience with cancer in their pet will come along shortly. Love your girl as you already do, and always put her needs first when deciding your course of action. :pray:

razorace January 16th, 2013 03:13 PM

Thank you so much for taking the time to read and answer my concerns, the Dr. told us she was not in pain, I have a doggie diaper wrapped around her middle and it is draining right much all of a sudden, this may be some kind of sign, I know we only have her for a short time more, and she is even at the stage she does not want us to hold her or cuddle her..I really am heart broken at that..She does stay hidden more...And I agree to just let her eat what ever we can get in her...Thank you again for responding. God Bless you all for this site and the ones who enter..:pawprint:

Barkingdog January 16th, 2013 04:58 PM

[QUOTE=razorace;1052257]Thank you so much for taking the time to read and answer my concerns, the Dr. told us she was not in pain, I have a doggie diaper wrapped around her middle and it is draining right much all of a sudden, this may be some kind of sign, I know we only have her for a short time more, and she is even at the stage she does not want us to hold her or cuddle her..I really am heart broken at that..She does stay hidden more...And I agree to just let her eat what ever we can get in her...Thank you again for responding. God Bless you all for this site and the ones who enter..:pawprint:[/QUOTE]

My dog had trouble eating when he had cancer so I fed him hot dogs as he loved them and it was about the only thing he would try to eat. I had a dream about my dog last night and he was not able to walk , this dream reminded me of how sick my dog was and that I did the right thing for him by putting him down. It did not feel like the best thing for my heart but I knew in my mind it was the best thing for my dog. I think you should spend as much time as can with your beloved dog , she need to have you with her when her time come. This is so sad to read and your dog will have all of our pets waiting for her at the Rainbow bridge.

Rgeurts January 16th, 2013 06:22 PM

I'm so sorry you are dealing with this... cancer is a horrible disease :(

As far as table scraps, I'm not sure exactly what they mean. It would completely depend on the scraps. One thing with cancer is you want to avoid carbs/sugars and kibble. Regardless of what most vets say, kibble is far from ideal for any dog, let alone a dog with cancer. The cancer cells feed on carbs/sugars, so to minimize this, fresh "people" food is best. This is a link to a dog cancer forum that I found extremely helpful for our boy:

[url]www.dogcancercare.com[/url]

There are a few rules to follow when taking care of a cancer dog. One is filtered water. Tap water is never "great" for dogs, but for cancer dogs, it's very bad. They are already battling and the impurities/chemicals (and even parasites) can be very bad for a compromised immune system. Another thing is to have a good cancer supplement like K9 Immunity.

As for food, what I feed my babies is NRG. It's a dehydrated grain free food (NRG Maxim) and has no added/synthetic supplements. All the nutrition comes from the food sources. You want to keep everything as natural and chemical free as possible. If you have a [B]good[/B] holistic vet in your area, I would highly recommend seeing him/her. They can really extend the life of your cancer baby as well as greatly improving the quality of life by boosting the immune system. Obviously surgery/excision and chemo aren't an option at this point. All you can really do is try to keep the quality of life high and follow the things above to help slow the growth of the tumors. Please, take the time to browse the cancer forum. It really did help me immensely when Thorin was diagnosed. The people there are very suportive, and have really good tips for taking care of your furbaby :lovestruck:

I hope you get much more time with your sweet Yorkie :cloud9: :lovestruck:

Robyn

Barkingdog January 16th, 2013 06:38 PM

[QUOTE=Rgeurts;1052261]I'm so sorry you are dealing with this... cancer is a horrible disease :(

As far as table scraps, I'm not sure exactly what they mean. It would completely depend on the scraps. One thing with cancer is you want to avoid carbs/sugars and kibble. Regardless of what most vets say, kibble is far from ideal for any dog, let alone a dog with cancer. The cancer cells feed on carbs/sugars, so to minimize this, fresh "people" food is best. This is a link to a dog cancer forum that I found extremely helpful for our boy:

[url]www.dogcancercare.com[/url]

There are a few rules to follow when taking care of a cancer dog. One is filtered water. Tap water is never "great" for dogs, but for cancer dogs, it's very bad. They are already battling and the impurities/chemicals (and even parasites) can be very bad for a compromised immune system. Another thing is to have a good cancer supplement like K9 Immunity.

As for food, what I feed my babies is NRG. It's a dehydrated grain free food (NRG Maxim) and has no added/synthetic supplements. All the nutrition comes from the food sources. You want to keep everything as natural and chemical free as possible. If you have a [B]good[/B] holistic vet in your area, I would highly recommend seeing him/her. They can really extend the life of your cancer baby as well as greatly improving the quality of life by boosting the immune system. Obviously surgery/excision and chemo aren't an option at this point. All you can really do is try to keep the quality of life high and follow the things above to help slow the growth of the tumors. Please, take the time to browse the cancer forum. It really did help me immensely when Thorin was diagnosed. The people there are very suportive, and have really good tips for taking care of your furbaby :lovestruck:

I hope you get much more time with your sweet Yorkie :cloud9: :lovestruck:

Robyn[/QUOTE]

I feel diffence about this , I feel that when a person or pet is dying they should be able eat any food that want. I had a client that wanted chocolate candy for her lunch and I was going to let have some but the daughter in law said "no" as it was not a healthy meal. My client had her healthy meal and dies of old age a week later and her box of chocolate when uneaten.

Jull January 17th, 2013 03:44 PM

[QUOTE=Barkingdog;1052263]I feel diffence about this , I feel that when a person or pet is dying they should be able eat any food that want. I had a client that wanted chocolate candy for her lunch and I was going to let have some but the daughter in law said "no" as it was not a healthy meal. My client had her healthy meal and dies of old age a week later and her box of chocolate when uneaten.[/QUOTE]

I agree... for both pets and people.

Many years ago I had a cocker spaniel, beautiful girl, she had cancer for many years, and I remember she wouldn't eat anything that was not cooked by my mother (as in our family meals), no matter how good a food could have been, if my mom didn't prepare the meal she wouldn't eat it.

:lovestruck:

Barkingdog January 17th, 2013 04:17 PM

[QUOTE=Jull;1052290]I agree... for both pets and people.

Many years ago I had a cocker spaniel, beautiful girl, she had cancer for many years, and I remember she wouldn't eat anything that was not cooked by my mother (as in our family meals), no matter how good a food could have been, if my mom didn't prepare the meal she wouldn't eat it.

:lovestruck:[/QUOTE]

That is so touching , your dog really loved your mom. And she must be a great cook!

Rgeurts January 17th, 2013 04:25 PM

[B][/B][QUOTE=Barkingdog;1052263]I feel diffence about this , I feel that when a person or pet is dying they should be able eat any food that want. I had a client that wanted chocolate candy for her lunch and I was going to let have some but the daughter in law said "no" as it was not a healthy meal. My client had her healthy meal and dies of old age a week later and her box of chocolate when uneaten.[/QUOTE]

You're entitled to feel however you want about it. However, if you want to extend the life of your furbaby by slowing the growth of the cancer, it has nothing to do with personal opinion and everything to do with health and nutrition. If the pet is at the stage where you're going to send them over the bridge, then by all means, spoil them rotten before saying goodbye. But the OP was asking for input on things he/she could do to help his/her baby. :)

[B]"I just want to make sure I am doing all I can for the rest of her life to make her comfortable. I read somewhere that giving her table food is good for kidney failure, I only have given her chicken breast that I boiled. What food should I be feeding her? Stay with the c/d? I know she needs more water in her food..Please if anyone has any suggestions as to what I should make sure her diet is each day I am all ears."[/B]

Obviously he/she is asking what they can do to help make sure this baby is getting the good nutrition it needs, which leads me to think they are not at the end yet.

razorace January 18th, 2013 09:37 AM

You are all such great people !!
 
I am thankful for all your input..My little yorkie who's name is Kaysie, is still very active that if she see's the cat outside she will give chase to her...poor miss kitty can't exscape even a morning chase..lol The vet did call us back and told us Kaysie's heart is enlarged quite a bit..her kidneys are working at best at 25% she said she had 2 values that were extreamly high and that was the reason for no surgery on her draining tumor on her breast..I keep a doggie diaper wrapped around her, she does lay around alot but also every time that door opens to out side she is wanting out..So for her to be a 15yr old yorkie I think she is doing pretty well. Robyn all your info was very helpful and I really appreciate you taking the time to help me..We live in a small town and have just the regular vets around here..no specialist.. We have well water, and we have 2 whole house filters on the line, I am hoping me giving her that water has not been the problem, no vet has ever told me not to..I can buy the nursery water for babies at walmart if you think necessary, or I can boil our water before giving to them, I can buy distilled if need be..The food she loves the most is those little cesar dinners..the beef flavor ones...She is still on the prescription diet of c/d and I give her Nutro for seniors in the small pieces for small dogs..Maybe 2x a week she will eat some dry ..She is mostly wanting the cesar meals and I still boil chicken breast the boneless and give her small amounts at a time for her treats..I guess that is why she is going out so often to get the treat on her return trip in :) So I am hoping I am doing enough for her, she is 10lbs and she has never been real big eater..She knows she will get what ever she wants and whatever I am eating if she will eat it..lol I think the tumor is going down some since it has started draining so much...To bad there is others growning just as fast..But each day is a blessing with her, and as long as she is getting around as good as she is and not in pain we will spoil her even more..(if she will let us) She knows I am the one who changes her dressing and gives the pills and she is keeping her distance from me.. little stinker..Thank you all again I really enjoy hearing from you all even though I cry my eyes out reading all these...You are all just amazing..Hugs to you all and thank you all again and again.. :angel2:

Rgeurts January 18th, 2013 02:04 PM

[QUOTE=razorace;1052343]I am thankful for all your input..My little yorkie who's name is Kaysie, is still very active that if she see's the cat outside she will give chase to her...poor miss kitty can't exscape even a morning chase..lol The vet did call us back and told us Kaysie's heart is enlarged quite a bit..her kidneys are working at best at 25% she said she had 2 values that were extreamly high and that was the reason for no surgery on her draining tumor on her breast..I keep a doggie diaper wrapped around her, she does lay around alot but also every time that door opens to out side she is wanting out..So for her to be a 15yr old yorkie I think she is doing pretty well. Robyn all your info was very helpful and I really appreciate you taking the time to help me..We live in a small town and have just the regular vets around here..no specialist.. We have well water, and we have 2 whole house filters on the line, I am hoping me giving her that water has not been the problem, no vet has ever told me not to..I can buy the nursery water for babies at walmart if you think necessary, or I can boil our water before giving to them, I can buy distilled if need be..The food she loves the most is those little cesar dinners..the beef flavor ones...She is still on the prescription diet of c/d and I give her Nutro for seniors in the small pieces for small dogs..Maybe 2x a week she will eat some dry ..She is mostly wanting the cesar meals and I still boil chicken breast the boneless and give her small amounts at a time for her treats..I guess that is why she is going out so often to get the treat on her return trip in :) So I am hoping I am doing enough for her, she is 10lbs and she has never been real big eater..She knows she will get what ever she wants and whatever I am eating if she will eat it..lol I think the tumor is going down some since it has started draining so much...To bad there is others growning just as fast..But each day is a blessing with her, and as long as she is getting around as good as she is and not in pain we will spoil her even more..(if she will let us) She knows I am the one who changes her dressing and gives the pills and she is keeping her distance from me.. little stinker..Thank you all again I really enjoy hearing from you all even though I cry my eyes out reading all these...You are all just amazing..Hugs to you all and thank you all again and again.. :angel2:[/QUOTE]

Hi :)
It's good to see she is still active and has interest in chasing the kitty (poor kitty though :laughing:)! It doesn't sound like she's at the end. Obviously, there is no chance of curing her cancer, as with most pets that get it. But as I mentioned before, there are many things you can do to help slow the growth and give her a little more time :cloud9:

If you have 2 whole house filters, that should be just fine! Filtered water is perfectly acceptable :)

As for the food, there are several homemade diets tailored to animals with cancer. The c/d, imo, is horrid food. The first ingredient is ground corn and has no nutritional value whatsoever. It may be ok for helping with the kidney issues and stones, but it's definitely not good for cancer. Corn has a high carb and sugar content, which feeds the growth of the tumors. The carbs in this food is 47.9% which is way too high, and the fact that they are all "garbage" carbs makes it that much worse. I'm not one of those people who are totally against grains. There are some excellent grains that have a lot of nutritional value, and some of the cancer diets even use them, such as quality oats and barley, which are high in iron. Fortunately for me, I haven't had to deal with kidney issues (just bladder stones), so I don't know that these diets would be appropriate for renal failure. I'll post a couple of cancer diet recipes and maybe someone who has dealt with kidney failure will look it over and make sure it's ok :)

This is a great diet and the lady who posted this has a blog on her cancer baby with a more info and variation on the diet as her dog became quite picky:

[B]Morning Meal
1 cup of cooked chopped Chicken or Turkey
1 cup of steamed pureed mixed green vegetables
1 cooked scrambled egg
1/4 cup cooked chopped liver
2 tablespoons raw chopped parsley
1/2 clove chopped raw garlic
1 tablespoon raw chopped ginger
1 Pet Tab multi vitamin
1 Garlic Pill
2 Vitamin C (1000 mg total)
1 Vitamin E (400 IU)
1 Thorne Vet Immugen
1 CoQ10
1 Milk Thistle
1 L-Arginine
1 Ashwagandha
1 Reishi Mushroom
1 Bromelain
1 Resveratol
1 Selenium
1 L-Glutamine
1 Teaspoon Essiac Tea

Evening Meal
1 cup of cooked chopped Chicken or Turkey
1 cup of steamed pureed mixed green vegetables
1/3 cup of smashed mackerel
1/4 cup cooked chopped liver
2 tablespoons raw chopped parsley
1/2 clove chopped raw garlic
1 tablespoon raw chopped ginger
1 Vitamin A (10,000 IU)
2 Vitamin C (1000 mg total)
1 Chinese Ginseng (500 mg)
1 IP-6
1 CoQ10
1 Milk Thistle
1 Thorne Vet Immugen
1 L-Arginine
1 Reishi Mushroom
1 Spirulina
1 Tumeric Curcumin
1 L-Glutamine
1 Astragalus
1 Teaspoon Essiac Tea
1 Tablespoon Lipiderm
2 Tablespoons of Yogurt (given after her dinner)

Snack: (given 2x per day in-between meals)
2 Tablespoons of cottage cheese
1 Tablespoon of Flax seed oil mixed well with the cottage cheese

Rotating Supplements: I do one week on of these and then one week off
5 drops of Echinacea 3x day
1 capsulue of Yunnan Baiyao at each meal

I have more info about it on her blog:
[url]http://doghemangiosarcoma.blogspot.ca/[/url]
[/B]

I have to run right now, I have an appointment for myself with my sweet Nookies vet :D :laughing:
He's both a DVM and TCM (Traditional Chinese Medicine) vet as well as a human holistic Dr. Never thought I'd ever say my doggie and I have the same Dr!

I'll try to find a few more recipes in some of my bookmarks!

Rgeurts January 18th, 2013 02:07 PM

Oh, one more thing... if her tumors are bleeding, she may be a bit anemic. One thing that will really help is liver. My baby was severely anemic at one point, and have to have a blood transfusion, so our holistic vet had us add liver to the diet and give him dehydrated liver as treats. Both our boys now get dehydrated liver as a daily treat. They love it! And it helps to build the blood :)

Barkingdog January 18th, 2013 02:45 PM

[url]http://pets.webmd.com/dogs/kidney-failure-in-dogs[/url]


this web site liver can be hard on dogs that have kidney failure. I think the OP should check with their vet and see if is OK to feed the dog liver.

Rgeurts January 18th, 2013 07:45 PM

[QUOTE=Barkingdog;1052358][url]http://pets.webmd.com/dogs/kidney-failure-in-dogs[/url]


this web site liver can be hard on dogs that have kidney failure. I think the OP should check with their vet and see if is OK to feed the dog liver.[/QUOTE]

Barkingdog, people should always check with their vet and never just take someones word for anything, that's a given. The reason liver may not be a good choice is because it's high in phosphorus. But if the rest of the diet is not, the liver may be acceptable and will definitely help in building the blood back up if her baby is anemic, which is exactly why I stated I would post it and someone who knows more about renal failure can look it over. There are many things to consider here, not just the kidney issues. This diet is a high fat, quality protein diet, which is great for cancer dogs. And if I remember right, high fat and small amounts of good protein (limiting organ meats) is also good for renal issues. It may be that this would be a very good diet for both issues, even if the liver needs to be excluded.

razorace January 21st, 2013 03:08 PM

[QUOTE=Rgeurts;1052354]Hi :)
It's good to see she is still active and has interest in chasing the kitty (poor kitty though :laughing:)! It doesn't sound like she's at the end. Obviously, there is no chance of curing her cancer, as with most pets that get it. But as I mentioned before, there are many things you can do to help slow the growth and give her a little more time :cloud9:

If you have 2 whole house filters, that should be just fine! Filtered water is perfectly acceptable :)

As for the food, there are several homemade diets tailored to animals with cancer. The c/d, imo, is horrid food. The first ingredient is ground corn and has no nutritional value whatsoever. It may be ok for helping with the kidney issues and stones, but it's definitely not good for cancer. Corn has a high carb and sugar content, which feeds the growth of the tumors. The carbs in this food is 47.9% which is way too high, and the fact that they are all "garbage" carbs makes it that much worse. I'm not one of those people who are totally against grains. There are some excellent grains that have a lot of nutritional value, and some of the cancer diets even use them, such as quality oats and barley, which are high in iron. Fortunately for me, I haven't had to deal with kidney issues (just bladder stones), so I don't know that these diets would be appropriate for renal failure. I'll post a couple of cancer diet recipes and maybe someone who has dealt with kidney failure will look it over and make sure it's ok :)

This is a great diet and the lady who posted this has a blog on her cancer baby with a more info and variation on the diet as her dog became quite picky:

[B]Morning Meal
1 cup of cooked chopped Chicken or Turkey
1 cup of steamed pureed mixed green vegetables
1 cooked scrambled egg
1/4 cup cooked chopped liver
2 tablespoons raw chopped parsley
1/2 clove chopped raw garlic
1 tablespoon raw chopped ginger
1 Pet Tab multi vitamin
1 Garlic Pill
2 Vitamin C (1000 mg total)
1 Vitamin E (400 IU)
1 Thorne Vet Immugen
1 CoQ10
1 Milk Thistle
1 L-Arginine
1 Ashwagandha
1 Reishi Mushroom
1 Bromelain
1 Resveratol
1 Selenium
1 L-Glutamine
1 Teaspoon Essiac Tea

Evening Meal
1 cup of cooked chopped Chicken or Turkey
1 cup of steamed pureed mixed green vegetables
1/3 cup of smashed mackerel
1/4 cup cooked chopped liver
2 tablespoons raw chopped parsley
1/2 clove chopped raw garlic
1 tablespoon raw chopped ginger
1 Vitamin A (10,000 IU)
2 Vitamin C (1000 mg total)
1 Chinese Ginseng (500 mg)
1 IP-6
1 CoQ10
1 Milk Thistle
1 Thorne Vet Immugen
1 L-Arginine
1 Reishi Mushroom
1 Spirulina
1 Tumeric Curcumin
1 L-Glutamine
1 Astragalus
1 Teaspoon Essiac Tea
1 Tablespoon Lipiderm
2 Tablespoons of Yogurt (given after her dinner)

Snack: (given 2x per day in-between meals)
2 Tablespoons of cottage cheese
1 Tablespoon of Flax seed oil mixed well with the cottage cheese

Rotating Supplements: I do one week on of these and then one week off
5 drops of Echinacea 3x day
1 capsulue of Yunnan Baiyao at each meal

I have more info about it on her blog:
[url]http://doghemangiosarcoma.blogspot.ca/[/url]
[/B]

I have to run right now, I have an appointment for myself with my sweet Nookies vet :D :laughing:
He's both a DVM and TCM (Traditional Chinese Medicine) vet as well as a human holistic Dr. Never thought I'd ever say my doggie and I have the same Dr!

I'll try to find a few more recipes in some of my bookmarks![/QUOTE]

Dear Mrs. Rgeurts,

Wow you really did alot of research for me..You dont know how much I appreciate all you have done, I did call my vet and tell her about your suggestions, she told me to come by the office and pick up this can of Purina and then some letters after it..( I have just sent my Hubby to get it for me) :thumbs up The vet also told me at this time she is more focused on the Kidney failure, She wants Kaysie to eat something rather then nothing at this point, I had mentioned to her she was not wanting to eat the c/d , I do give her boiled chicken breast but that is not enough of a balance diet for her to function now..She said she was not worried about the blood that she is losing as it is also drainage from the tumor as well as some blood ..Her main concern seems to be the kidneys. So I am boiling her water to make sure I have all impurities out. This new can dog food she is giving me will have more water in it as well.. Kaysie does seem a little more active during the day just since the tumor has been draining and decreasing in size, about the size of large egg now vs/ size of lemon or lime before, :) But thank you again for all your help and I will keep you posted as to her recovery to as good as we can hope for ..:pray: Hugs to you all who have responded and helped me with my concerns..God Bless

Rgeurts January 21st, 2013 04:46 PM

Hi there :)

So glad you posted again, and VERY glad to see she seems to be feeling a bit perkier! I hope that she continues to improve :lovestruck: :cloud9:

As for the diets, just keep in mind most vets aren't well versed in nutrition. You can probably find a very good, home cooked diet for renal issues that would be better than canned food (if you would like some help, let me know. I have a few friends who have had kidney babies and I'm sure one of them would love to give up their diet info). BUT... if you're comfortable giving it to her, and she's responding well and eating it, wonderful! I'll make sure to pop on periodically to look for updates!

Big hugs to you both, and God Bless you and your family as well :) :grouphug:


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