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-   -   soft palate mass (http://www.pets.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=82502)

SuperWanda October 17th, 2012 08:04 AM

soft palate mass
 
I wanted to ask if anyone else has experienced a soft palate mass. Our 12 year old husky X had an endoscope yesterday to reveal a soft palate mass that was very inflamed. It was difficult to determine how extensive it was with all the swelling and so needle biopsies were taken through the roof of the mouth and should get results in 5 days. X-rays showed some pneumonia in the left lung as well. The mass is on the left side so probably related. Our dog is not breathing well, especially at night. Her nose sounds stuffy but she is eating well and on antibiotics now. We were hoping that this was just a simple polyp that could be easily removed but are so sad to learn it is likely a tumor. We hope to learn in the next few days if there are any treatment options? If anyone has experience or advice about this I am just trying to learn more.

hazelrunpack October 17th, 2012 09:14 AM

No experience or advice, SuperWanda, but I did want to send along some :goodvibes: for your girl. :grouphug:

SuperWanda October 19th, 2012 06:46 PM

Thank you hazelrunpack,

After everything she went through with the tick disease I was hoping her senior years would be free of any major ailments. Still no results back on the needle biopsy. I've started giving her krill oil and turmeric to see if that will reduce the inflammation and help her breathing. She is on doxycycline to address the pneumonia and has stopped wheezing so that has helped but the mass makes her breathing very noisy and she doesn't sleep very well. I don't think she is in pain because she seems happy - still plays with her toys and goes on walks but gets winded easily. She must also feel pressure where the mass is as it is the size of a golf ball.

hazelrunpack October 19th, 2012 07:16 PM

Aw, poor girl. :( Still praying! :goodvibes:

MaxaLisa October 19th, 2012 09:34 PM

Well crap, I am so very sorry, this makes my heart sink :(

In any cancer dog with a history of tick disease, i would treat aggressively with doxy, since there seems to be a relationship between chronic underlying infection and cancer. PLUS, doxy itself has a couple of different anti-cancer properties.

There is a weak connection between the lyme vaccine and certain tumors. Weak in the sense it was mentioned by a vet at a teaching university and then I could never track any details after that.

Anyway, this dog: [url]http://cinnamondog.com/[/url] had a tumor similar to what you are describing, I think. Sander the Sheltie did suffer from lyme vaccine damage. No definitive proof they are related, but speculation.

Regardless of cause though, Sander was treated holistically and lived with that mouth tumor for many many years and died of old age (liver). If you have quetions, you can email via that site.

I like tumeric a lot, but there are a couple curcumin products that might be better absorbed. I'm a big fan of IP6 (enzymatic therapy, cell forte brand). Proteolytic enzymes too, like wobenzym or the like.

This really really sucks.

SuperWanda October 21st, 2012 09:36 PM

Thank you hazelrunpack and MaxaLisa,

Glad to see some familiar forum dwellers still here!

Hopefully we will know more about what kind of tumor this is soon. She has never had a lyme vaccine so no correlation there and she hasn't been vaccinated at all since she was sick with the anaplasmosis.

I am giving turmeric capsules which contain 95% curcumin. 300mg twice a day. Have no idea if it will help? I don't think it will hurt. It comforts me to know that a dog like Sander can survive with cancer to the age of 15. I'll have to look at the enzyme therapy you suggested Maxalisa, I'm not familiar with them.

The other thing that is bugging her is itchy female bits which started before the antibiotics. I have anti-bacterial, antifungal cream but it drives her crazy and she licks herself until it is red. Her vulva is slightly inverted. Her urine was tested and no infection so I think it is just external infection and I am having trouble getting that under control. Worried that the antibiotic will make matters worse so she is taking probiotics as well. Poor girl!

Thanks for your kind words, I will keep you posted.

growler~GateKeeper October 22nd, 2012 12:17 AM

No advice at all just wanted to send along some hugs for you both, I've been following your struggles with Timber's ailments :grouphug:

Rgeurts October 22nd, 2012 09:23 AM

[QUOTE=SuperWanda;1047872]I wanted to ask if anyone else has experienced a soft palate mass. Our 12 year old husky X had an endoscope yesterday to reveal a soft palate mass that was very inflamed. It was difficult to determine how extensive it was with all the swelling and so needle biopsies were taken through the roof of the mouth and should get results in 5 days. X-rays showed some pneumonia in the left lung as well. The mass is on the left side so probably related. Our dog is not breathing well, especially at night. Her nose sounds stuffy but she is eating well and on antibiotics now. We were hoping that this was just a simple polyp that could be easily removed but are so sad to learn it is likely a tumor. We hope to learn in the next few days if there are any treatment options? If anyone has experience or advice about this I am just trying to learn more.[/QUOTE]

Hi SuperWanda! I'm sorry you're having more issues with beautiful Timber. I don't have any advice on this particular tumor, but I do know what you're going through. Thorin's tumor was in his lung. We drove him down to Washington and had it removed, then went through a couple rounds of Chemo and another surgery to remove a couple of masses from the back of his neck/shoulder area. We had him for a little over a year after the diagnosis (he was 12, so he lived a pretty long life for a Malamute). People always ask why we would put him through chemo, and my answer is easy... we loved him. I hope and pray that Timbers is benign. But if not, please consider all your options and do some research. A lot of people rule chemo out at the first mention of it, and I was one of those... until our vet explained how it works in dogs. I don't regret anything we did for Thorin. It gave us more than a year with our sweet baby. If you have questions on the chemo, please ask :grouphug:

Robyn

SuperWanda October 22nd, 2012 11:08 AM

Thank you growler and rgeurts,

It is nice to have support here when you are feeling down.

I'm sorry about Thorin Rgeurts. Yes, 12 is a very good age for a dog that size. There is a malamute here that we often see on our walks and he is 9 but really slowing down. His owner mentioned that he hopes he makes it to 10. I hope he does! Timber has more siberian but she is not a pure breed. They say for a siberian the lifespan is between 12 and 15.

I just want both our dogs to have happy senior years. I'm one of those people who always likes to try and prevent things and have been especially watchful so it is hard to feel that I didn't catch this sooner. I always thought Timber would have more trouble because she has always struggled with allergies, arthritis and the tick disease didn't help. I think she generally has a lower immune system than our other dog who is two years older.

As long as they happy and not in pain we will do our best to carry on. It is hard to imagine my life without them though.

SuperWanda October 27th, 2012 04:56 PM

We got our results today. The cancer is a basil carcinoma. It is in the nasal area and is glandular in origin so they were calling it a nasoadenocarcinoma. It is on the left side and x-rays showed something in the left lung. They did flush some fluid into the lung to see if they could get any cells but there were none. It could be some pnuemonia or cancer that has spread to the lung but they are not 100% certain. The doxycycline has really helped I think. At this point she is not wheezing and can eat and drink without making terrible sounds. She is also sleeping better so I think some of the inflammation has subsided. At this point, she just has what sounds like a stuffy nose.

We could travel to take her for radiation but the odds of that doing much were pretty low. Chemotherapy is another option but I think that sounded even less likely to improve the situation.

We can think about those options but for right now our main goal is continue with a good diet and add in the supplements and vitamins I think might help.

Right now she is still happy so I am thankful for that. She doesn't appear to be in any pain and has bursts of energy where she grabs all her toys and howls at us to play.

It's just hard to think about this type of thing in her nose. Not the kind of cancer I would have ever imagined one of my dogs to get.

hazelrunpack October 27th, 2012 05:38 PM

:grouphug:

pbpatti October 28th, 2012 11:51 AM

So sorry that Timber has cancer. :cry::pray::grouphug:

MaxaLisa October 28th, 2012 05:07 PM

Well, crap. I am so sorry!

The two things that would be the top at my list, for anything remotely related to any type of adenocarcinoma (sp?), would be enzymatic therapy's cell forte IP6 (aggressive dose would probably be two, twice a day, away from food), and sytemic enzymes like wobenzym, fibrozyme, vitalzyme, etc.

Here is my cancer sticky: [url]http://germanshepherdhome.net/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/32998/Cancer#Post32998[/url]

I hope for many happy days remaining for your pack (hug)

SuperWanda October 29th, 2012 02:06 PM

Thanks for the hugs hazelrunpack and pbpatti. I will pass them on to Timber.

Thanks for the link MaxaLisa, I am just in the process of figuring out what to give her. I actually came across a blog online. About an 8 year old lab named Lucy with the same cancer. The owner had a list of all supplements and her dog went into remission so it is possible that something miraculous can occur. No harm in trying.

hazelrunpack October 29th, 2012 06:27 PM

:fingerscr :goodvibes:

MaxaLisa October 30th, 2012 09:50 AM

SW, I figured it would take some time to regroup.

Would you mind passing along the link to that blog, either here or pm? I try to keep up on these things, unfortunately, too much of it around :(

SuperWanda October 31st, 2012 09:19 AM

Sure, the blog is found here:
[url]http://dognasalcancertreatmentforlucy.blogspot.ca/[/url]

I picked up some IP6. Couldn't find the cell forte brand but they had natural factors brand which looked similar: [url]http://www.naturalfactors.com/products/detail/4518/dr-murrayand39s-ip6-and38-inositol[/url]

I gave her 500mg this morning. A book I have said to give on an empty stomach so I mixed the contents of the capsule in a little water and used a syringe to squirt it in her mouth.

Wondered if you have heard of AHCC (Active hexose correlated compound?) It was pointed out to me at the health food store. It is an oligosaccharide derived from mushroom grown in rice bran. This is the brand I was looking at:
[url]http://nutritionplus.com/store/product/742/AOR-AHCC-500mg.-30-VEGETARIAN-CAPSULES/[/url]

hazelrunpack October 31st, 2012 02:03 PM

Thanks for the blog link, SuperWanda.

SuperWanda October 31st, 2012 08:32 PM

No problem. There is sure a long list of supplements she is using for her dog on that blog. I don't think I could try all of that myself but am just picking a few I feel comfortable with.

So far I have the coenzyme q10, IP6, medicinal mushroom blend, curcumin, fish oil. I also think I should add vit. C. I don't know, there are just so many different things you can try and I certainly don't want to give anything or a combination of things that could be harmful.

I have heard the IP6 can lower iron levels so one I guess you have to be careful with. So much information out there! :eek:

MaxaLisa November 1st, 2012 05:40 AM

Thanks Super Wanda, I found the post with links to all the info too:
[url]http://dognasalcancertreatmentforlucy.blogspot.com/p/tippner-protocol-for-dog-cancer-in.html[/url]

That I a lot of tuff, but I guess every successful protocol I've ever seen uually ha a lot of "stuff"

As for the IP6, it will pull iron from the liver and the organs. My dad has been on it since 2009 and I can say that it hasn't caued him to be anemic. As a cancer patient, he gets his blood counts checked every 3-4 months, but I'd make sure you feed iron rich foods. I do think he may be slightly iron deficient, but for his cancer (mets to the liver now in remission), right now, I'm afraid to up his iron. Natural Factors is a good brand, so it should be okay. I couldn't pull the link up right now though. Dose for active cancer in humans is 8 per day. Dad, during his chemo took 2, twice a day, and in remission is either taking 1 or 2, can't remember. I would go less than two right now for Timber, and until you get her on a stable protocol, I would consider 4, in divided dosages, initially, to give it a good chance to work, since it may have traveled to the lungs already :(

Mushroom products are good and I would recommend one as part of the protocol. I don't know of anyone that has used the ACHH, but have heard good things about it. I have this I my cancer sticky also as options, products my holistic vet used:
Two good mushroom Products:
Power Mushrooms, made by Health Concerns
Mycoplex-7 by Gourmet Mushrooms Inc, not as well tolerated as the Power Mushrooms for sensitive individuals, but a more complete mushroom formula.

In the blog she mentions Yunnan Bia Yao, which I would recommend too. It can be used regularly, or only when there is bleeding, so good to have on hand. I know someone in canada was having a hard time finding a source though.

I may have mentioned this, but my "s" key sticks, so sorry for all the words that have the missing "s"!

SuperWanda November 1st, 2012 09:04 AM

Thanks MaxaLisa,

I hope your Dad continues to recover. Do you think the IP6 helped him or is is hard to tell between that and the chemotherapy and other meds. So glad he is doing well and in remission.

Timber has had no bleeding so am thankful for that. She did have that one bloody nose after being given metacam at the beginning of her ordeal with the anaplasmosis. I am now curious if she had the tumor at that time or not. I guess we'll never know.

MaxaLisa November 1st, 2012 09:56 AM

Dad had colon cancer with two good sized mets to the liver. They said they couldn't operate, but dad got them to agree to, but on the condition that the chemo shrank the mets in the liver (the colon had already been operated on, the liver stuff was later).

Dad is against pills and meds, so I knew I only might be able to pick one supplement. After some intensive googling :) , I picked IP6 becaue it had some research behind it, could be used with chemo, and I could find a number positive anecdotes on the web, and it was also part of Sander the dog's protocol.

What IP6 does is change cancer cells so that they can die, like normal cells can. After 3 rounds of chemo, both mets had shrank - one a lot, unfortunately, the other not so much. However, they operated on the liver, and both mets were over 95% dead, free of cancer cells. I am confident that the IP6 allowed those cells to die. Each time he stops the IP6, his cancer marker goes up a notch, so he ha learned that that is one thing he needs to stay on. The only other thing he was on was selenium, which he started a couple decades ago after he topped smoking. He did up from 1/2 a multivitamin to a whole multivitamin per day ;) This hit him in his late seventies, o all in all, he is doing well (though the chemo and anesthesia from surgery did induce Parkinsons :( )

Anyway, the only thing about IP6 is that it will also increase any autoimmune reaction in the body, as most all of thee supplements will, since they are gearing up the immune system. For that reason, I was never able to use them for my dogs when they got sick.

Something to allow the cancer cells to die, something to stop them from creating new food sources (blood vessels - doxy actually does this, it is anti-cancer and is used ometimes exactly for this reason, as well as other supplements), and something to actually attack the cancer by bossting the right cells in the immune system, might be the three things you want to work towards. I don't know if I forgot anything.

SuperWanda November 2nd, 2012 01:50 PM

Thanks MaxaLisa,

Your Dad sure has been through a lot. That must have been stressful on you both. You hear about so many dealing with cancer these days. I find it very unsettling. I always thought that giving my dogs a variety of foods, exercise and attention would at least keep their immunity up but cancer is obviously a complex disease and it seems we live in such a polluted world. I'm not sure if it will ever improve. It makes me sad.

MaxaLisa November 3rd, 2012 01:49 AM

I agree, we are surrounded, and it's tough to fight :(

SuperWanda November 12th, 2012 05:45 PM

I thought I would list all the supplements I am going to try if anyone happens to have an opinion. There are so many things out there so a bit overwhelming and I don't want to cause an interaction or have many side effects.

Right now I am giving:
IP6
Wild salmon oil
Curcumin plus Bromelain
Purica Immune 7 (7 mushroom extracts plus reservatrol and green tea extract)
Coenzyme Q 10
L-Glutamine
Milkthistle plus dandelion root

What I was thinking of adding:
L-Arginine
Selenium
Vitamin C (Ester C with Bioflavonoids)
Vitamin E (succinate)
N-Acetyl Cysteine (NAC)
Alpha Lipoic Acid
MSM plus Boswellian
Wheat Grass Powder
Lactoferrin

Things that I might add:
Natural Factors Anti-viral formula (echinaceae, licorice root, astragalus, reishi, lomatium) in rotation with Purica Immune 7 (mushroom)

Things that I am not sure if I should add (seemed to have more side effects):
Ashwagandha
Artemisinin

SuperWanda November 13th, 2012 07:53 AM

Forgot to mention that the vet suggested 14 days on, 14 days off cycles with the doxycycline or to see how long we could go without it by watching her symptoms. She is now 14 days off so not sure whether to put her back on. She is not any worse so that is good but I wouldn't want to risk anything by not giving it.

MaxaLisa November 25th, 2012 09:09 PM

So sorry I've been MIA!! I got slammed at work and everything else. When I looked the other day, for some reason everything was marked as read..

Anyway, how are things going? Did you add any of those supplements? What's going on now?

The doxy, was it for the cancer? How is that going?

I have some comments on the list of possibles, but thought I would check on what's been going on first. I am hoping there is good news?

SuperWanda November 27th, 2012 04:09 PM

I believe the doxy was initially given because her x-ray showed something in the left lung, whether that was cancer or pneumonia, they were not sure. She was also wheezing at that point but after 14 days on the doxy the wheezing stopped and hasn't come back. She still has a stuffy sounding nose and makes some gagging sounds most likely due to the tumor pushing on the soft palate but overall she is no worse, has good energy and seems to be feeling happy and playful.

I don't think she is getting any worse so haven't asked for more doxy but I read that it is helpful for cancer so wasn't sure if I should give it or not.

Right now I am giving the following:
IP6 500mg twice daily
Curcumin/bromelain 300mg/150mg twice daily
Lactoferrin 250mg daily
2 Tbsp flax oil mixed with cottage cheese (Budwig diet) daily
Purica Immune 7 (mushroom with reservatrol and green tea extract) 325mg/100mg twice daily
CoQ10 50mg daily
MSM/boswellian 500mg/150 daily

Because I am not sure about everything else I kind of alternate so depending on what foods I am giving (which are usually cooked meats, steamed veggies) if I feed a lot of fish or liver which may have more selenium for example than I don't give selenium but I do add the following maybe every other day:

Wild salmon oil 1000mg
Vit E succinate 400IU
Vit C 1000mg
Alpha lipoic acid 200mg
NAC 500mg
L-glutamine 500mg
L-Arginine 500mg

I also picked up some nutritional yeast, blackstrap molasses, wheat grass powder which I throw in from time to time.

I have echinaceae and astragalus as well but thought I would try that when I finished the mushroom complex.

hazelrunpack November 27th, 2012 07:19 PM

Happy to hear she's at least holding her own, SW! :thumbs up

MaxaLisa November 29th, 2012 11:21 AM

I haven't forgotten, just slammed at work and had to pull a few near all nighters, which I don't do as well as I age! I need to get back on here with my laptop.

So glad for the response to doxy, it's amazing stuff. That pneumonia can be chronic, here's a very interesting site: [url]http://www.cpnhelp.org/chlamydia_pneumoniae_anti[/url]

I tried NAC because I wanted Max on it. I had a terrible reaction to it. Can't remember what it was though. It's supposed to be great stuff, so maybe just me.

Do you have Dressler's cancer book? I haven't read it, just curiou.


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