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StaceyB August 1st, 2005 04:33 PM

Last year I grew tomatoes from plant in my front garden. I decided to leave the plants in ground over the winter to keep the soil from washing away. In the spring I removed all the old plants and disposed of them to replant new plants this year. Since the area was not the best for producing tomatoes, I decided not to plant them in this garden spot. I set them up out back this year where there was more sun. I decided to plant a couple of tropicals in the space instead. I noticed today just outside the rock bordered garden several tomato plants growing, one already with flowers.
Has this ever happened to any of you where you have tomato plants grow in the area where the previous years plants were growing.

Luba August 1st, 2005 05:10 PM

Get lost, really?

Wow is it directly in the sun and did you have any containers/lean on the soil over winter..this is very interesting. Ottawa is so cold in the winter.

melanie August 1st, 2005 05:15 PM

all it would take is for one of last years tomatos to fall on the ground and the seed to be released, i find when you grow tomatos in any spot you will probably get them comin up for years, especially if its a big patch...their good self seeders really...

remember tomatos love acid, so find your best acidic spot and go for it, if your soil is basic and not acidic try growing them in pots or polystyrene boxes, that way you can create your soil conditions and the seed wont spread....

another thing i saw recently was using a bag of potting mix, and plant the tomato plant drictly into the potting mix, tie up at top nad pop out in the sun, and this way you can move it around too so you dont killl grass.... i am going to try this style this year as were renters and its too hard to grow in a garden you dont own...

Luba August 1st, 2005 05:17 PM

But we're talking Canadian winters here Mel

That still holds true my botanically knowledgable genius friend?

melanie August 1st, 2005 05:45 PM

genius, why i certainly am a self declared, lol...

oh yeah forgot that, so the ground freezes there does it, i wonder if the seed has good protection and dormancy????

hey do your bulbs survive the winter alone or do you cover them???

StaceyB August 1st, 2005 06:18 PM

There are about 5 plants growing so far, the sun is not very good in this spot but it is not the worst. I know you can plant by seed but you always buy them here and the seeds are usually started inside and then transplanted outside. I have never heard of tomatoes growing the following year. I think if anything they would be cherry tomatoes. If this was a regular thing everyone would be doing it, never heard of anyone. Yes, we do cover the bulbs. It is very, very cold here in the winter.

melanie August 1st, 2005 10:37 PM

yeah i only grow cherries and they seem to alway reseed, but then it dont get THAT :eek: cold here....

i think your jsut really lucky then :D

Luba August 1st, 2005 10:46 PM

They could be genetically modified EWWEWEEWE

Or alien tomato's

NOT coming to your house for a salad LMHO!! :crazy:

Prin August 1st, 2005 11:00 PM

Genetically modified doesn't have to be a bad thing you know. (end of biology student interruption....) :D

melanie August 2nd, 2005 01:09 AM

oh prin, go on and chuck a spanner in the works why dontcha :D your so funny :D

and genetic modification may not harm humans but it is nasty stuff for the natural environment and the evolution of food crop plants, so there nah nah nah nah na na :p :p :p and you probably dont agree (bloody bio students), oh well, nah nah nah anyway :p :D :p

Prin August 2nd, 2005 01:31 AM

LOL Mel- :p My issue is with the definition of genetic engineering. Sure if you put fish DNA in a tomato plant, you're messing with nature, but crossing two tomato plants in the lab is also engineering, and that to me is not as big a deal as putting non-tomato DNA in there. Big strawberries are considered GMO too. To me as long as it's plants helping plants, it's ok, but animals boosting plants gets fishy... :p See, I have reasons. :p Nanner nanner nanner :p Biology students rock! Well, not really, but we suffer enough to deserve [I]some[/I]thing... :cool:

Luba August 2nd, 2005 10:30 AM

Research GMO and you'll find out it is a horrible thing.

:D Won't support it and hope to never have to.

Prin August 2nd, 2005 01:10 PM

I learn about it every day I am in school. I will probably end up in a lab DOING it later on. What I am trying to say is GMO is a term that is used for such a wide variety of things, some of which are safe and have been proven to be safe. Any corn you eat is GMO. Basically any food you get off of a farm has been altered in some way. You say you don't want any part in it, but it's all around you. We've been altering foods since the beginning of agriculture.

Luba August 2nd, 2005 01:31 PM

I eat organic non GMO produce Prin I don't buy from the regular grocery stores. My corn is non GMO as are the fruits, veggies and grains I purchase.

GM'ing our environment to have super veggies, fruits and grains can lead to disaster.

I'll give you an example of GMO wheat overtaking the non GMO wheat and contaminating it through wind carried seeds.

Should some disease some insect, some natural disaster wipe out the GMO wheat which they are trying to spread throughout the world, we would be all face starvation.

GMO is NOT good!

Prin August 2nd, 2005 01:46 PM

You're missing my point. ALL the veggies you eat ARE GMO. The corn of our ancesters was a max of 10cm long. None of our corn is like that today. Why? Because we modified it either by cross-pollenating it or in a lab. BOTH are GMO. GMO is not only in the lab, its everywhere. NO veggies or fruits we eat nearly resemble the original types. Everything has been at the very least crossed to make it bigger, tastier, or stronger. NOTHING you eat has not has anything done, unless it grows naturally- like wild strawberries. You see how tiny they are? If farms tried to harvest those to feed a population, they never would be able to.

EVERYTHING we eat has been modified, organic or not.

Luba August 2nd, 2005 02:53 PM

There is a difference between ancient grain crossing and chemically genetically modifying plants as you know Prin.

I didn't miss your point at all my friend :D I understand what you mean but the type of modification done now is much different then what any farmer would have done as a pioneer!

StaceyB August 2nd, 2005 03:03 PM

I don't think I have heard of a plant being chemically changed. Could you give an example. I know that they cross pollonate and recently I heard that they are modifying certain dna between species.

Jazz&Cricket August 2nd, 2005 03:11 PM

I know that my aunt on Manitoulin Island had some cherry tomatoes re-seed themselves...they were tasty too :)

StaceyB August 2nd, 2005 03:13 PM

Great, I will look forward to them.

Luba August 2nd, 2005 03:41 PM

Sure Stacey, I'm no expert but I'll share what I do know.

Herbicide toxins for example are spliced into the DNA of a variety of crops. Having said that the plants start producing the chemical themselves, and inturn you injest it. There is a potato, produced by Monsanto that is currently registered as a pesticide. I can't remember the name of it though but I'm sure a search on google could turn it up.

The herbicide toxins are present in every gene in these crops they cannot be cooked, washed, peeled off by any means. This is even worse then spraying the herbicide on the plants as the dosage is multiple times higher this way.

This effects not only the crops but the entire food chain. It's a very interesting topic that I've become more concerned about over the past 4/5 years.

melanie August 2nd, 2005 05:36 PM

oh prin, lol lol your too funny, god you make me laugh chic, yoru georgous my friend and im so glad we have ppl like you in the world :angel: that goes for the rest of yas too :angel:

now although i dont agree i think you should work in that industry prin, jsut because its worth lots of money and i would love for you to get a great paying job and have it all like you should and deserve :D so its not an enviro reason, but jsut personal desire , lol..... im so bad :D

um, ok how do i say this, ethnobotany and ethnopharmacology are a great interest of mine and a fascinating topic. ethnobothany is the study of bush food, um how do i say it so you will understand in canadian/american, not aussie, um, oh 'wild food' sort of... but wild food or medicines that have been used by indigenous ppl throughout history.

and actually one of my major study topics in my last year at uni, my last major work i produced a 'bush food/tucker book' for a specific region, it was designed for the general public using a colr system to determine habitat type and plant locations, was fun but crap alot of hard work.....

anyways the point being that its not that sort of genetic modification, that is the type that happens over night and in a man made environment...

all modern food is derived for wild food varieties. the selection activities of humans has resultedi n the modern varieties we have today, for example the selection activities of ppl in countires such as africa has resulted in the less bitter cuecumber we have today.

BUT it was only selection for physiological features such as flowering or fruit and essentially the plant has its original DNA, a cuecumber is still the cuecumber, but it may have evolved its physiological features to suit humans or its seed distributors activities but over a very very long period of time, were talking hundreds and thousands of years, not 1 year....

but when you alter that DNA in the lab you are changing it dramaticlly in a short space fo time, not over long periods of time which is natural and evolution ahs been found in many plant and animal species. throughut history or existance... but then again you could say human intervention is evolution in a way, then my arguments stuffed right and royally, but oh well i will stick to it, yahooooo...

but for example there are GM wheat varieties being grown in australia and have for a while now. studies have shown that in certain conditions these GM plant varieties can mix with its cousin wild variety and modify it, and often not to its advantage, such as producing sterile seed in wild varieties.... so its not good,

BUT (full of them today) if where talking GM rice such as drought hardy or such for the starving in africa with added vitamin such as iron and such, i would consider it, its hard but it would be a considered action i suppose... btu then again...


Prin August 2nd, 2005 10:13 PM

That's why people say I should be in involved in it- there are so many ethical issues that arise when altering DNA. Like the vaccines in Bananas that they wanted to ship to Africa. It's only good if you eat the exact right amount of bananas...

Monsanto has WAY worse stuff going on than anybody in the media is aware of. They had one grass seed that would emit a pollen that would leave other plants sterile, such that nobody could use the seeds-- but if that ever gets out, everything, every plant around it would die.

I'm not saying altering DNA in funny ways is great, but in some ways it is. If the ethics committees that are around would actually have some sort of power, we'd get somewhere with all this a lot quicker... :)

So much to say, so little time...

Luba August 2nd, 2005 10:44 PM

Vaccinations in our foods as well. There is no end. Do you say this is ethical? to produce foods that contain these poisons? I think you meant unethical right ?

Monsanto is an evil company true that Prin! Their gmo forced farm fields to destroy many crops due to cross contamination.

Prin August 2nd, 2005 10:48 PM

No, I think plants that are engineered to produce vaccines are a horrible idea. How will you know how much to eat? How will you know how much each banana has produced? Not all will produce the same amount.

I do think that plants that are fortified with certain vitamins can be a great idea for developing countries, though. If you can get the boost of 4 apples in one, why not? We do it with power bars all the time.

Monsanto products should be banned. Too bad we're not willing to pay more for not-so-beautiful produce... :(

Luba August 3rd, 2005 11:12 AM

So with all you know Prin do you eat organic as well?

I hear the name Monsanto an immediately wanna :yuck:

Prin August 3rd, 2005 02:10 PM

I can't afford organic right now. I make what, $9000 a year? I barely can afford any veggies at all... ;) One day. I know where to get a half a cow from a family farm really cheap, but I can't afford him either right now. It's all about getting [I]enough[/I] when you're a student.

Dogastrophe August 3rd, 2005 02:17 PM

[QUOTE=StaceyB]There are about 5 plants growing so far, the sun is not very good in this spot but it is not the worst. I know you can plant by seed but you always buy them here and the seeds are usually started inside and then transplanted outside. I have never heard of tomatoes growing the following year. I think if anything they would be cherry tomatoes. If this was a regular thing everyone would be doing it, never heard of anyone. Yes, we do cover the bulbs. It is very, very cold here in the winter.[/QUOTE]

Dogastrophe steps inside quietly, looks to the right, looks to the left, and steps around the GM food debate .....

If I am remembering my botany correctly, I believe that tomato seeds require cold scarification to get them ready for germination (similiar to apple seeds). So what happened is not that strange.

.... quietly heads towards the door and steps outside into the sunlight.

StaceyB August 3rd, 2005 02:21 PM

thanks, never heard of or seen this happen before.

melanie August 3rd, 2005 04:47 PM

:D mel picks up a dog poo with her bare hands :D (oh my god shes an animal :eek: ) and throws it at the door as dogastrophe walks out, but i missed, oh well i will get it next time :D

hey $9000 thats about right, your dollar is slightly higher than ours, in australia a student gets about $11000-12000 a year at the most, but get this a person on the dole, that is unemployed welfare get about $17000 a year, how the hell does that work, a student working their butt off gets less and cnat afford vegetables and godo meat to power their brains where as a person doing nothing on welfare who dont need as good nutrition gets more, its screwed and it makes me real mad. when i finished uni there was a joke going aroudn that we were all jsut gunna go on welfare as it was a pay rise for us (most of us did too :D ) stupid system....

definatly a job in the DNA industry miss, its great money and you wil live like a queen :D

thanks for that dog, that is very interesting :D :highfive:

doggy lover August 3rd, 2005 07:04 PM

I've had that happen to me with cherry tomatoes before too.

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