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-   -   Go! Natural Grain Free (http://www.pets.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=37730)

KimandAutumn March 14th, 2007 09:24 AM

Go! Natural Grain Free
 
For those of you feeding this just wondering what sort of results you are getting with it and if you're pleased with the food?

Prin March 14th, 2007 03:33 PM

I haven't tried it... It's so new...:o

rainbow March 14th, 2007 03:51 PM

I just checked the other day and it's still not available here. It's coming with their next shipment though. :)

geisha March 14th, 2007 04:05 PM

I just bought a sample bag today from G & E Pharmacy in Edmonton. Geisha has the regular Go! Chicken & Veggie. Cheers!!!

KimandAutumn March 14th, 2007 05:06 PM

Go! Natural Grain Free
 
ahh that's interesting. What prompted my question was that I saw it in Global Pets in Red Deer last night.

Mocha's mum March 14th, 2007 09:16 PM

I haven't tried the grain free yet. We're still working on the Salmon and Oatmeal. I really want to try the grain free though...I think Pet Planet here sells it....I'll have to double check the site again.

rainbow March 15th, 2007 04:11 PM

I've heard that it has quite a few protein sources which I'm not fond of. I couldn't find it on their website. Does anyone know what they all are?

KimandAutumn March 15th, 2007 04:23 PM

ingredients
 
INGREDIENTS

Chicken Meal, Chicken, Turkey, Turkey Meal, Potato, Chicken Fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols (vit. E), Herring Meal, Peas, Tomato Pomace, Natural Flavour, Salmon, Duck, Salmon Meal, Duck Meal, Salmon Oil, Whole Dried Egg, Flax Seed Oil, Brewer’s Yeast, Pea Fibre, Potassium Chloride, Calcium Carbonate, Taurine, Choline Chloride, Chicory Root Extract, Mannanoligosaccharides, Pumpkin, Apples, Carrots, Bananas, Blueberries, Cranberries, Lentil Beans, Broccoli, Spinach, Cottage Cheese, Alfalfa Sprouts, Protease, Lipase, Garlic, Lactobacillus Acidophilus, Lactobacillus Casei, Enterococcus Faecium, Bifido-bacterium Thermophilum, Vitamins (vit. E, vit. C, niacin, inositol, vit. A, thiamine mononitrate, d-calcium pantothenate, pyridoxine hydrochloride, riboflavin, vit. K, beta-carotene, vit. D3, folic acid, biotin, vit. B12), Minerals (zinc proteinate, copper sulfate, copper proteinate, manganese proteinate, manganous oxide, calcium iodate, sodium selenite), Ascorbyl-polyphosphate, Yucca Schidigera Extract, Dried Rosemary

rainbow March 15th, 2007 06:21 PM

Well it's really only chicken and turkey as the salmon and duck are further down the list. I wonder why they have to add tomato pomace? :rolleyes: :frustrated:

KimandAutumn March 15th, 2007 06:45 PM

tomato pomace
 
what exactly is this.. a stool firmer or does it have another purpose...?

Spirit March 15th, 2007 06:48 PM

Tomato pumice (the bi-products of processed tomatoes) is high in antioxidents (though undefined, I believe). It's also a source of vital minerals.

My basic understanding is that it's not much different from EVO at all. The ingredients read slightly differently, but when you work the math, the end results come out very similar.

Prin March 16th, 2007 12:36 AM

Tomato pomace is a by-product. If it was really in there for the amino acids or whatever they always claim (usually lycopene), they'd put the whole tomato in there (like Innova does), but they don't, so it's just a cheap stool hardener. :shrug: Take out all the juice and leave behind the skins, which are likely to have pesticide residue on them, not matter how much they deny that, and there you have pomace...

Some V8 for you, some left over pomace for your dog. :shrug:

Or as eagle pack puts it:
[QUOTE]The Pomace contains concentrated Lycopene, considered one of today’s premier antioxidants. Antioxidant benefits of Lycopene are improved with heat during the cooking process. Tomato Pomace is an excellent amino acid source. Used correctly it is an ideal fiber source. With its many benefits it is not a filler.

Some people talk about the value of using whole foods, in this case the entire tomato. There is no value in having tomato juice in pet food. There is a lot of value in having Tomato Pomace[/QUOTE]

How's that for the hard sell?

IMO, a by-product is a by-product. it's cheap because we've taken all the good stuff out of it, and we don't use it for ourselves, so we give it to the dogs. :shrug:

Prin March 16th, 2007 12:42 AM

As for it being the same as Evo, not quite...

GO!: Chicken Meal, Chicken, Turkey, Turkey Meal, Potato, Chicken Fat

Evo: Turkey Chicken Turkey Meal Chicken Meal Potatoes Herring Meal Chicken Fat

The bulk of a food is made up of the ingredients found before the first fat. That being the case, Evo is better. And being that the rest is nearly insignificant, Go! certainly puts a ton of potential allergens in there for nothing. Your dog gets a hint of the protein, say, of salmon, so the exposure is there, but the nutrition gained from it is next to nothing.

Evo is better, IMO.:shrug:

technodoll March 16th, 2007 08:57 AM

[QUOTE]GO!: Chicken Meal, Chicken, Turkey, Turkey Meal, Potato, Chicken Fat

Evo: Turkey Chicken Turkey Meal Chicken Meal Potatoes Herring Meal Chicken Fat [/QUOTE]

hmmm not sure there, prin... the 1st ingredient in the Go! formula is chicken meal, while in Evo it is Turkey in wet form... so going by logic of "first dry ingredient is the more prevalent in the overall recipe" I would say Go! has more meat, by weight... unless the "herring meal" in the Evo makes a significant contribution to the meat protein factor.

in any case... both are superior formulas (judging by ingredients) and it's about time petfood companies start feeding our carnivores with meat, not grains! :highfive:

Spirit March 16th, 2007 12:25 PM

[QUOTE=technodoll;391586]hmmm not sure there, prin... the 1st ingredient in the Go! formula is chicken meal, while in Evo it is Turkey in wet form... so going by logic of "first dry ingredient is the more prevalent in the overall recipe" I would say Go! has more meat, by weight... unless the "herring meal" in the Evo makes a significant contribution to the meat protein factor.[/QUOTE]

Exactly. Laws require the labels to read as weight from uncooked or unproccessed foods.

The main ingredient in Go! is chicken meal, whereas the meal product in EVO is listed as third (the first two being chicken and turkey). But this doesn't neccessarily mean EVO is a lower quality food. The "meat" (whole food source) would be chicken/turkey, and the lesser would be the "meal". So since the "chicken" is made up of mostly water (70-75%), it makes sense that it's listed first. However, since the cooking process evaporates the water, the actual weight of the chicken lessens and becomes lower on the ingredient list (bumping up the meal product). It takes 5lbs of chicken meat, to make 1lb of chicken meal.

If you take the guaranteed analasis of the protein and moisture and break them both down (both 42% protein and 10% moisture), the result is exactly the same (both foods read 46% protein from dry matter), but the key again is in the protien's digestibility (how the dog proccess it) and not the number itself. So when meal is listed as the first ingredient, that's where it really counts.

technodoll March 16th, 2007 12:30 PM

they're doing this to drive us mad, MAAAAAD i tell you! :D

Spirit March 16th, 2007 12:35 PM

[QUOTE=technodoll;391668]they're doing this to drive us mad, MAAAAAD i tell you! :D[/QUOTE]

LOL! Don't even GET me started on citric acid... As a preservative? Or in tomatoes, apples, oranges, etc...

Edit: I can't find anything online... I'm pretty sure that Innova doesn't use chelated minerals in their foods (Go! does, but I don't think the grain free does). If someone has a bag of Innova laying around (adult, evo, puppy... any of them), would you mind checking for me please?

I'll check again at work later today, but the website doesn't say. Thanks. :)

Prin March 16th, 2007 12:59 PM

[QUOTE=Innova website]The minerals Natura uses are chelated, providing three to ten times greater assimilation than common minerals. [/QUOTE]



IMO, it doesn't matter what order the wet and dry are in because they still make up the bulk of the food. :shrug: If it's wet turkey followed by potato, then yeah, but it's wet meat followed by dry meat.:shrug:

technodoll March 16th, 2007 01:12 PM

these are all "wet" potatoes too, right? i guess that's good cuz dried potatoes weigh nothing... so chances are it's not a huge ingredient in the overall food, eh? now... do they wash and peel the spuds or is everything thrown in there, skins and eyes and all? :confused: i've always wondered that...

same with "apples" and such.. whole apples wtih core, seeds, insects and all? are they washed of pesticides? :confused:

Spirit March 16th, 2007 01:18 PM

Evo has one up as the herring meal is also within the first 5 ingredients, but I'd much rather have a food where the main source is right up front and not masked by water weight (which eventually gets lost in processing anyway).

If the meat is 70% water, the remaining would leave us at only 30% after proccessing. The meals are usually around 50-70%, so it doesn't matter how low they are on the list. If you add the total with the first ingredient being the meat, more often than not, it would still be lower than if the meal source was right up front. (As an example) You could have 100lbs of wet protein as your first ingredient (chicken), and only 10lbs of dry (chicken meal) as your second ingredient. So when the water evaporates from your "meat product", where does that leave you? If the main source was the meal product, it wouldn't matter either way because they're listed by weights prior to cooking, and if the weight of the meal is heavier, it wouldn't matter how much water is in the meat.

Unless we know exactly what the weight of the chicken/turkey is in EVO, as compared to the chicken/turkey MEAL is (as listed as the third and fourth ingredient), there's no way to know what's left after proccessing. But one thing we do know as fact (not opinion), is that the weight before processing, is lower in the meal.

Spirit March 16th, 2007 01:20 PM

[QUOTE=technodoll;391701]these are all "wet" potatoes too, right? i guess that's good cuz dried potatoes weigh nothing... so chances are it's not a huge ingredient in the overall food, eh? now... do they wash and peel the spuds or is everything thrown in there, skins and eyes and all? :confused: i've always wondered that...

same with "apples" and such.. whole apples wtih core, seeds, insects and all? are they washed of pesticides? :confused:[/QUOTE]

I can't answer that question, but in the case of "meat products", this can sometimes mean "roadkill" (literally) in lower quality foods. Gross. :yuck:

Prin March 16th, 2007 01:37 PM

Put it this way, the fat is 22% in Evo. So to be simple, whatever comes before the fat makes up a higher % of the food than 22%. And the high protein content leads me to believe that the herring meal is significant enough to balance out the poultry and boost the numbers. Herring is 48% protein when dried, which turkey and chicken are between 30 and 40% when dried.

Spirit March 16th, 2007 01:52 PM

Doesn't matter. It still doesn't tell me what percentage of the herring makes up the total bulk of the food. And since it's after the potatoes, we already know that it's less.

The meat matter is higher than the meal matter. How much higher is the question, and how much lower on the list is reads is another contributing factor.

And since you mentioned the fat content, if you want to calculate the total fat percentage (based on 22% fat and 10% moisture), the result would be 24%. Go! grain free (label reads 20%), the result would be 22%.

For a 60lb active dog, the feeding guide for evo reads at 2 2/3c. For Go!, it reads 2.5. So right there it's telling us that Go! requires a slightly less daily feeding amount, to obtain the same level of nutrition. Again, with the meal product being right up front, this leaves me with no guessing games. It also tells me that the meal product is EVO is lower than that of in Go!, but not much lower at all since the feeding requirements are very close.

So back to my original point... When you break it down, there's not much difference at all in either food. But with the meal product right up front, and the lower feeding amounts of Go!, I would sooner feed Go! than I would EVO. But again this doesn't mean that I believe Go! is a better food (even though it very well might be), this is just the conclusion that I have come to, based on the scientific facts. After all, this is what I get paid to do for a living, so I'll take the science over "opinion" any day.

The bottom line is that they're both excellent foods, and whichever food works for your dog, is the one that you should be using - no matter which one is "better". It's all personal preference, and what works best with your dog. :thumbs up

Edit: For the record, I haven't tried either as a meal, but I have used them both as treats. My dog loves them both, but I'm not 100% on the potato, so for now I'm not about to switch his regular meals. If I were though, I would try Go! - there's no real reason why though... just what I'm more comfortable with, I guess. :)

Prin March 16th, 2007 01:57 PM

[QUOTE]For a 60lb active dog, the feeding guide for evo reads at 2 2/3c. For Go!, it reads 2.5. So right there it's telling us that Go! requires a slightly less daily feeding amount, to obtain the same level of nutrition. [/QUOTE]LOL you can't use the feeding guide as any indication at all. They're all just bogus.:shrug:

With Go! natural's other foods being loaded with grains, I'm not likely to give them the benefit of the doubt when compared to Innova, whose other foods rock. :shrug:

Spirit March 16th, 2007 02:03 PM

[QUOTE=Prin;391731]LOL you can't use the feeding guide as any indication at all. They're all just bogus.:shrug: [/QUOTE]

That's not true at all. Lower quality foods require a higher feeding amount to obtain the same nutritional value as higher quality foods (which require a lower feeding amount).

The guide is merely a guide. Just because it says 2.5 cups, doesn't mean that's what you have to feed. When I brought my dog home at 8 weeks, I went from a lower quality food with a 4.5 cup/day feeding guide, to a higher quality food at a 3/4 to 1 cup feeding guide. My dog did better on that one cup than he did on the 4.5 because of food quality and better absorption of nutrition.

Right now (at 60lbs), he eats 1.5 cups/day. For me to switch to Evo or Go!, even though they both might be a better food (or they might not), would require me to feed much more than I am now (regardless).

Prinny, me thinks you need to go outside. LOL! But I've said what I have to say. I've got better things to do that sit here and banter, so I'll let you have the last word. :thumbs up :D

(Edit): I just got off the phone with my boss. Regarding Innova vs Go!'s regular adult food, I was just reminded that we get 2-4 cases of free Innova samples/week and we advertise Innova much more than we do Go! Natural. Go! Natural also doesn't give out free samples, and they do very little advertising, simply because they don't need to (they have a great reputation). We give probably 80 free samples of Innova out per week (and zero of Go!), yet Go! is by FAR our biggest seller. It doesn't mean it's better... just more popular. Of course this can be argued again if you want to compare Innova to Iams or Eukenuba (or even Vet food). They're not even in the same league, but maybe things are just different on the east coast. *shrug* :)

Prin March 16th, 2007 02:33 PM

If people feed what's written on the bag, most of the time, they'll end up with a fat dog. I, and others here in the food forum, tend to discourage people from even looking at the feeding guidelines because they're always soo off. Just do what's best for your dog, regardless of what the bag says.

Spirit March 16th, 2007 02:38 PM

Edit: Sorry all. This should've been a PM.

Prin March 16th, 2007 02:39 PM

Yeah, I'm sorry for that. :o :footinmouth:

geisha March 16th, 2007 03:16 PM

I think this is a win situation for those of us who choose to feed grain-free kibble. We have a choice. Incidentally both Orijen & Go! are made in Alberta. And that's a good thing for our pups. thumbs up :thumbs up

Prin March 16th, 2007 03:22 PM

Good point. And it's good that petcurean finally offers a different food that doesn't have the usual abundance of grains as their other foods tend to...


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