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To Whip or Not?

Shaykeija
May 1st, 2011, 10:44 PM
Got a question for you horsey people. I got in a heated discussion tonight with a newbie horse owner. I guess their horse charged them so they decided to get a whip. Went back into the paddock and showed their horse who was boss.:eek: I am thinking, this horse is now getting a beating and has no clue why? Why would anyone use a whip? Other then the wow factor of the crack sound it makes, I see no use for one. A long time ago I saw an abused horse with whip scars all over it. Poor thing. Thoughts?

hedgiemama
May 1st, 2011, 10:53 PM
I definitely dont think that what the person did was right. Although i can see a use for in riding, to get the horse to move forward or something along the line,although i dont personally use one when i ride as i only do some pleasure. But going out and whipping the horse after the fact just doesnt seem right with me.

luckypenny
May 1st, 2011, 10:55 PM
Love your poll options :laughing:.

Have your friends even read a book on horses...like do they know anything at all about them? Poor horse :(.

rainbow
May 1st, 2011, 11:57 PM
OMG, that is horrendous :eek: .....wth is wrong with people? :(

I imagine it would be the same type of person that would beat their kids. :wall:


Oh, and I loved your poll options as well :D .....so I voted for the whipping in a leather bar but I would use whipping cream too. :laughing:

Gail P
May 2nd, 2011, 12:03 AM
What Hedgiemama said. I've had horses since 1986 and rode for about 8 years before that. (ok, now I'm admitting my age :eek:) Crops, dressage whips, lunge whips, buggy whips...all have their place and proper use.

Some never even touch the horse eg. a lunge whip is cracked to encourage forward movement while lunging (working a horse in a circle on a long line) and just changing body position and the position of the lunge whip is also a signal to the horse to reverse. Some just lightly touch the horse to signal a specific cue (ie. dressage)

None should ever be used to go out and punish a horse and teach him/her who's boss as you've described.

ETA: a charging horse is dangerous and does need a lesson in manners, but not that way. If a whip were to be involved is should be already in hand, prepared to be used if the horse is acting dangerously. It would have to be applied immediately to be connected to the undesirable behaviour and should be a quick correction, not used in anger after the fact. The truth is, most newbie horse owners do not have the experience to deal with that kind of behaviour and should be seeking help if the horse is dangerous.

Goldfields
May 2nd, 2011, 12:25 AM
I don't know so much, Gail. I still have the scar on my arm from a bite from a big pony that used to charge people and bite them. Not the only horse I have seen like it, another was a palomino hack that was a terrorist in the stables at our big Royal shows, wanting to bite everyone who walked past, while another was a racehorse. Now, how are you , any of you, going to stop a determined and nasty horse? If those people walk into the paddock in 5 minutes time and that horse attacks again, what should they do? I mean after they pick themselves up or make it let go of them? Oh, just remembered another one, a galloway mare that had the staff at the stud I worked at scared stiff of her. One person would feed her carrots while another bolted over to her shelter shed and put the feed in, they were too scared to just feed her normally. These horses have no respect whatsoever once they start meaning to do harm. BUT, seeing that Erykah is talking about a newbie owner, my first question must be did the horse really charge them, or instead canter up wanting to be fed, or seeking some attention? If so, and they hit or startled it for that, then I'd like to take the whip to them,. not the horse.

Gail P
May 2nd, 2011, 12:45 AM
I don't know so much, Gail. I still have the scar on my arm from a bite from a big pony that used to charge people and bite them. Not the only horse I have seen like it, another was a palomino hack that was a terrorist in the stables at our big Royal shows, wanting to bite everyone who walked past, while another was a racehorse. Now, how are you , any of you, going to stop a determined and nasty horse? If those people walk into the paddock in 5 minutes time and that horse attacks again, what should they do? I mean after they pick themselves up or make it let go of them? Oh, just remembered another one, a galloway mare that had the staff at the stud I worked at scared stiff of her. One person would feed her carrots while another bolted over to her shelter shed and put the feed in, they were too scared to just feed her normally. These horses have no respect whatsoever once they start meaning to do harm. BUT, seeing that Erykah is talking about a newbie owner, my first question must be did the horse really charge them, or instead canter up wanting to be fed, or seeking some attention? If so, and they hit or startled it for that, then I'd like to take the whip to them,. not the horse.

Even with disrespectful or nasty horses, using a whip of any kind to beat them after the fact isn't going to teach them anything. Other options? in the case of a horse hanging it's head out of a stall and biting anyone that walks past, instead of having an open doorway have one with bars to the horse can't hang it's head out. No more biting passer-bys. Out in an open field or paddock...if a horse is that bad, I wouldn't enter without carrying a buggy whip or lunge whip to use to make the horse keep it's distance. I used to board a horse that seemed to like rushing past me when my hands were full carrying feed buckets or bales of hay. And he'd encourage another one to do it too...the pair of them would rush up behind me, split and run one on each side of me bucking and kicking. Lucky I didn't get my head taken off. I simply started carrying a buggy whip when going out to feed and they respected my space. If necessary for my own safety I would not have hesitated to use it but these weren't mean horses, they were just acting stupid so just carrying it was enough. One of those horses can be quite pushy and I've tapped the whip on his chest to make him back up out of my space...I've also use it to rub and scratch them while they're eating so they learn that it isn't something to be scared of, merely respected when carried a certain way.

As you said, it's about respect, or lack of it. Respect doesn't just happen, it has to be taught. Beating doesn't garner respect, only fear.

dustybird
May 2nd, 2011, 01:07 AM
What this person did is wrong. First of all I don't believe in beating any animal, but by the time they attempted to correct what he/she did (if they read him correctly) was too late. He/she has no idea what they did wrong, all the horse will learn here is to fear his owner/people.

I don't know a lot about horses although I did a lot of riding when I was younger and reallllly miss it. Miss everything about it, I think I even miss the grooming and getting ready for a ride more than the actual riding part.

I remember two horses from my lesson days in particular. One was a grump that liked to bite and kick anyone that tried to groom him and get him ready for a ride. He was quick and somehow managed to kick his front legs out to the side to get you. People would always have a crop in hand when they would go near him, ready to give him a smack....no wonder he was grumpy, people were mean. Well one day it was my turn to ride him and get him ready, I did what I always did, went in blind as if I knew nothing about him. I would quietly talk to him, let him sniff me and always kept a hand on him so he new where I was. It went well, got him out of his stall and into the cross ties. He started to get a little on guard so my mom who always came with me, stood infront of him and gently talked to him, while stroking his face and rubbing his ears. He became so relxed he looked as if he were about to fall asleep. We had a great ride and when we were done and getting him ready to go back to his stall he was nice and relaxed.

A little love, tender hand and patience goes a long way.

Another horse was owned by two young girls who smacked him around all the time. If he was fidgity when putting the bridle on, they smacked him(he then hated being bridled), smacked him for all sorts of stupid things. It got so he would hide in the back of his stall and wouldn't look at you when you went it...guess he was waiting to get smacked for breathing. I did my usual thing. They happend to be there and told me to be "careful, he's mean". Umm no your mean, I had no problem getting him ready, putting his bridle on which he hated was a breeze. Again I am no expert in anyway with horses, I just feel that being kind and paying attention to their body language goes a long way. I loved that horse and was lucky enough to get ride him almost every time I had a lesson.

I have had a few good painful bites from horses over the years, been stepped on, thrown off and almost trampled. I have to say all of it was my own fault, when I would look back to why these things happend, well I just wasn't paying attention. I am sure that there are a few horses out there that can be a jerk and try to show everyone how big they are, but I am sure there are ways to deal with it without beating the crap out of them. Whips/crops have their place like menitoned but they are tools and need to be use in a proper humane manner.

Again I don't know a lot, just from what I have seen first hand and experienced.

Gee I sure miss being around horses, they are just so amazing. Sorry this was so long, in a rambling on mood.

Tundra_Queen
May 2nd, 2011, 01:10 AM
I think whipping a horse in anger is cruel and barbric! The horse doesn't know why it is being whipped and it would scare them with no point. If that is the way the person treats the horse, the person shouldn't own a horse and never be allowed to own one again!

I have seen riding crops used at the Royal Winter Fair and it was when a horse refused a jump a couple of times. The crop was used on the horse's rump with proper handling also, to teach it it is ok to get over the jump. It was not done in anger and did not strike the horse hard.

I have also seen a rider use a crop on a horse out of anger and hit it several times and I was thoroughly disgusted with the rider! He should of been charged with cruelty IMHO

Gail is right for a horse that likes to nip or bite..have an upper door with bars on it to stop that happening.

rainbow
May 2nd, 2011, 01:19 AM
These horses have no respect whatsoever once they start meaning to do harm. BUT, seeing that Erykah is talking about a newbie owner, my first question must be did the horse really charge them, or instead canter up wanting to be fed, or seeking some attention? If so, and they hit or startled it for that, then I'd like to take the whip to them,. not the horse.

It's Shaykeija that posted about the newbie owner, not Erykah. :confused:

Erykah does have horses though so she should have some insight to share with us as well. :thumbs up

I still think it is horrendous and unnecessary though. :(

reanne
May 2nd, 2011, 02:34 AM
As said above, what this newbie horse owner did was inappropriate, and cruel to the horse. The poor horse would have no idea what he was being punished for, and punishment is not appropriate anyway. He is probably more high strung and more likely to charge now, after being attacked like that. :( I feel sorry for him.

Goldfields
May 2nd, 2011, 03:09 AM
A lot is being assumed here, what did they do with the whip, Shay, flog him within an inch of his life or just protect themselves by warning him by waving it at him? Or did they use a sensible approach as Gail suggested?

Goldfields
May 2nd, 2011, 04:00 AM
Gail, it may be that the owner was sensible enough to be just venturing into the paddock armed for action the second time and wouldn't have done a thing if it behaved. It is what I would have done. When teaching horses anything you finish on a good note, and the horse knowing that it has chased you out of the paddock is NOT a good note. Not enough is known, I mean is this a real dirty horse or was it playing? Are the owners as sensible as you with your buggy whip, or monsters?
BTW, the palomino was used more as an example of a mean natured horse, of course he could have his top door shut, bars etc. but it still mightn't stop him from charging you in the paddock at home and wanting a piece of you. He was no sweeter there. I just think people need to be in a paddock faced with a horse that couldn't care less whether it plows into you, combined maybe with ears flat back and wanting to bite, before they can judge what they would do. I dare say a lot wouldn't go back in the paddock. LOL. Some might decide to sell the horse, but to do this owner credit, they are trying to get him to see he can't be the boss.
Dustybird, at one of the racing stables I worked at I was given the bad boy of the stables to look after, in fact when the boss was warning me about him, the horse bit him. I got on fine sweet talking him, but this has little to do with one that is loose in a paddock, wanting to chase you out. They're free to do as they please.

erykah1310
May 2nd, 2011, 08:07 AM
Well to go in after the fact is completely pointless honestly. HOWEVER, I have got after my horses (mostly Miss Fe) for charging at me before. I didn't haul off with a lunge whip and beat her but 4 days ago when I was going in to feed them and she turned on her haunches and followed through with a few swift kicks I reached for the nearest stick I could as I went in closer. Sure enough she kicked out at me again and I cracked her on the rear with the stick, she stopped.
I do not accept a horse spinning their rear at me one bit as it is extremely rude and disrespectful, add to that kicking out and you bet your bottom I'm going to get after that horse. A horse can kill you easily and one that has no respect needs to get some.

If I hadn't had a stick close by I would have got out of there and went back in with the crop no questions asked and had she spun around and kicked out again you bet your bottom I would have used it.

Now, if I had to leave and return with something, and she did not do it, I would never start whipping for nothing. I would however take her out and lunge her a bit to see what her deal is. Usually if they start acting up like that for "nothing" putting them on a lunge line and making them work and do transitions and switching directions a lot ect would either get some reaction out of them if they're miserable or get the respect back.
If you move them the way you want to ( walk- trot- lope- trot- stop- change direction- trot ( as my horses are all trained that what ever you were doing to before a stop is what you continue to do when given the cue to move in a different direction) ect it is making you higher on the heirarchy, horses respect the "boss mare" of the herd but even the "boss Mare" needs to respect humans and not move us in the manner they would another horse.

When lunging a horse and it is moving around me disrespectfully ( ie, dropping shoulders in or turning rear in) they do get a "nip" in an appropriate location (hip or shoulder, same places horses bite each other so they would understand what I'm saying) to move that part of the body away from me.
Proper use of a whip or crop can not do any more damage than what horses do to each other. When Miss Fe ( who is the herd leader here) is unhappy with how one of the others are positioned near her or feels threatened by them in some way she full out hauls off and kicks or reaches in and bites, and I mean hard.
So, if Fe is showing me disrespect I too will use the same type method she does to move her.

Have to go work the polls today so will continue my thoughts on this later tonight (Get out and vote canada)

Goldfields
May 2nd, 2011, 09:20 AM
Very well explained, erykah. Sort of like the tactics we used when handling stabled weanlings here, and down on a big stud I worked at. Take in a stick and whenever it shows you the rump, a (gentle)tap it to make it go forward, leave it alone and sweet talk it when it faces you. For an outright kick, sure, I agree, a good crack to make them think again. My husband's hackney gelding(gone to God) once turned (on the lunge) and kicked him so hard in the chest that it dropped him, and the guy who found him unconscious said he was a dreadful colour. He's probably lucky to be alive. Dangerous animals due to all that weight and strength. Even being flattened by one hitting you hard is bad enough, without a bite. Had a TB filly, a 2 year old, spook at something, get behind me, then leap straight into my back as I was leading her. Wow! But, maybe that is better than being hit from the front. Less chance then to break your fall, not that I did have any time to break that fall come to think of it. LOL..

erykah1310
May 3rd, 2011, 12:01 AM
I will say though, you can tell a testy horse more information with your body language and accuracy of your "discussion" with them at appropriate times than just cracking at them with a whip.
This is for your testy or moody horse.

One who is doing dangerous things and could severely injure me or others will be dealt with quickly and in an appropriate manner. For the most part proper technique and reprimand for lets say kicking out, you can stop the behaviour before it becomes a problem.

Horses will test you at any chance to see where you are on their heirarchy.

Sure love and gentleness goes a long way, however it also could easily make you appear lower than your horse, resulting in dangerous riding, dangerous handling and far too many chances for your horse to not have faith in you in strange situations.

If I'm hacking out on a trail alone with Fe, I want her to know I am making the descisions on what is safe to pass and what is not. I do not want her seeing a tree that gives her grief and turning and bolting home through the bush and over uneven ground because she does not 'trust' my judgement over her own on said tree.
If she seems uneasy about something on the trail that will not hurt her and I push her forward I want her to trust I will not let something happen to her.

The lead horse in a herd protects their herd and will either move them from danger or stay put to show it is not something that they need to worry about, when I am on a horses back or walking beside them I want them to know if something worries them but not me, it is perfectly safe to continue on past it with out reacting as I am the lead horse in this herd now.

People with little horse experience can quickly and easily ruin a good horse, especially when trying to communicate with them with extremes on either side of the horse handling spectrum ( old school harsh or natural soft horsemanship)
Let a horse get away with the same thing too many times and it becomes habbit, basic rules I learned when taking my ground work training (round penning ect)
Horses are creatures of habit so when a horse decides to challenge you in a round pen for example, they will frequently do so in the exact same spot each and every time. To get them through it, you increase the push forward just prior to that spot and watch them closely for signs that they are about to do what ever it is they are doing each time.
If you let them do it over an over for days on end and not correct it, expect it to get worse, and it doesn't get any better once you are on their back.

It is hard to explain, especially to positive only pet people, but on the same note it is hard to explain to someone who is old school harsh that they do not need to be as well.
Each horse is different, and each situation is different from horse to horse, you better have a good game plan when deciding to work with horses and a good understanding of what you are doing prior to doing it.
There is no shame in admitting you dont know anything and wanting to learn. All the knowledge I have learned in the past 4 years of horse ownership did not come easily or cheap. It was class after class, seminars, time spent with other people with horses and watching and asking questions and taking from their methods things I was willing to do or not do but always keeping what I said I did not want to do in the back of my mind for those "just incase" situations.

newbie horse people should not be unattended because they own a horse and will figure it out, too much room for error on the communication front.

Goldfields
May 3rd, 2011, 12:43 AM
Again, well said. Golly, I've had horses for over 50 years now, and my husband longer - you make me feel ancient, erykah. LOL. Of course you must decide whether the horse needs gentle handling or not and also the strength of any discipline that any horse needs or can take. I'm soft on horses, for instance one showjumping fellow I worked for would put me on the horses he knew darn well would buck when fresh in from a spell (he was either scared of being bucked off or just sadistic LOL) but so sad for him, they never bucked with me. One that a guy taught to rear, only to have it go over backwards on him, rarely reared with me and then only little rears when he was impatient. So, yes, firm and kind, extra kind to those that may explode if treated badly. Horses are never born bad, we know that, someone makes them bad, and it's unfortunate if this new owner has one that is carrying a bit of a grudge or may even have been teased. Men can be boys, LOL, we know one here who'd walk up to a TB they were training and blow in its face. The horse ended up chasing him out of its yard. Serves him right. Stupid man!!

Gail, you mention a buggy whip, have you, or do you, drive harness horses?

Longblades
May 3rd, 2011, 10:48 AM
I've been charged and bitten by the charging horse. It's pretty frightening. I was way too scared to go back but it wasn't my horse so I didn't really have to. Plus, I was only about 12. How did a newbie owner end up with such a horse? Anyway, by the time the owner left and came back with a whip I'm sure the horse had no idea what it was being whipped for, if that's what happened. Next time they probably won't be able to catch that horse.

As others have said whips as aids or aid extensions are fine with me. Corrections must be issued instantaneously so the scenario presented has me voting for whipped cream. Or meringue?

erykah1310
May 3rd, 2011, 11:33 AM
Indeed they will end up with a hard to catch horse if they keep this up.
I wonder what posessed them to get a horse in the first place if this is how they are going to treat it?
Shay, is said person anywhere near the inlaws you have??? If so I will go on over there right now with my whip to correct them for what they did to their horse, if they don't know why I am cracking at them, they should no?

marko
May 3rd, 2011, 11:36 AM
I 100% appreciate your experience and logical approach here Gail_P

Whipping a horse after the fact to me sounds about as productive as rubbing a dog's nose in urine 3 hours after it took a whiz.

It will never learn a thing except not to trust....

Goldfields
May 3rd, 2011, 12:09 PM
You know, horses wouldn't stand quietly and let you 'flog' them. Out of the fight or flight reaction, flight is the most likely. If a newbie owner held a horse then hit it hard they'd get a bit of a shock. If they weren't holding it and hit it they could very well have it spin and lash out as it took off. If they succeeded either way, as Longblades said, they'll have trouble getting near enough to catch it next time, let alone hit it. Pity the OP didn't actually see what happened.

Shaykeija
May 3rd, 2011, 09:41 PM
Indeed they will end up with a hard to catch horse if they keep this up.
I wonder what posessed them to get a horse in the first place if this is how they are going to treat it?
Shay, is said person anywhere near the inlaws you have??? If so I will go on over there right now with my whip to correct them for what they did to their horse, if they don't know why I am cracking at them, they should no?

No..
further north

Gail P
May 3rd, 2011, 10:35 PM
Gail, you mention a buggy whip, have you, or do you, drive harness horses?
Not harness horses as in standardbreds. I harness broke a horse that used to be mine and I now board here. Drove him a few times but it's not something I ever did much of. The new owner sent him out for further training with Randy Bird but she's nervous of doing much by herself so he stands around eating and her cart, buggy, cutter and multiple harnesses sit around collecting dust.

The buggy I had came with a whip and my boarder has a few collected. I find the length of them to be handy when you want to carry one around just to keep a horse out of your space. Compared to a crop the horses take much more notice of it because of it's length but you don't have the dangling lash of a lunge whip.

As for me...I drive sled dogs :D No whips ;)

I 100% appreciate your experience and logical approach here Gail_P

Whipping a horse after the fact to me sounds about as productive as rubbing a dog's nose in urine 3 hours after it took a whiz.

It will never learn a thing except not to trust....

Thanks and you're right. Any corrections need to be immediate to have any effect. With dogs and horses.

Goldfields
May 4th, 2011, 02:22 AM
Driving horses can be scary in a buggy, for a new chum I mean, because when it turns there is nothing in front of you, much better a brake or gig. You definitely feel you have a lot less control than when you are riding them though. LOL . Shame everything is going to waste. The worse a horse misbehaves in harness the more my husband used to enjoy it, crazy man! He and I have both had them bolt in harness,(separate occassions) neither of us enjoyed that experience. LOL.
A whip held high is a good deterrant, isn't it? At a stud I worked on they had a grey stallion that was a real maniac to move when he had to serve mares, until the day the boss's young grandchild came into the driveway, waving a fishing rod he'd tied a bit of tinsel to. That horse just stopped and looked, so after that they took to having someone in front of him holding it up, while he walked(for a change) down to the mare. A bit unorthodox but whatever works I think. :)

pattymac
September 26th, 2011, 04:28 PM
I've been lucky with my horses, they were all pretty respectful of people and other than the odd head butt because the carrots weren't coming fast enough, I've never been bit, kicked or purposely dumped. Got stepped on a couple of times but that was my fault and fell off a few times but again either my horse spooked and I wasn't sitting solid and you know horse goes one way and you go the other!! Once in awhile I'd carry a crop but rarely used it, I always found I'd drop it and then have to go hunting for it after.

Horses can be pretty scary critters and a mean one would be downright dangerous. Still you know that's not an excuse for a whipping. I've gone out to bring in horses and if you happen to be carrying the good stuff then a bunch of horses coming at a run towards you can be pretty intimidating! Takes a bit of resolve to stand your ground! I also learned that they can pretty much stop on a dime and won't purposely run into you. I'm with you Erykah on the whirlling around and kicking out, that's just plain disrespect. Don't mind if they're a ways away but when they do it when you're still standing there that's majorly dangerous. In some it's just high spirits and a yahoooo we're free but sometimes not and I'd be inclined to act the same way with a good crack across the butt. I would never, ever hit a horse anywhere around it's face. My niece's old horse was a huge boy, 17 hands and sometimes he would get pushy and try to crowd you, he'd get a smack to the chest and STOP IT! Then he'd behave, but it wasn't a whipping usually just a smack to make some noise.

Goldfields
September 26th, 2011, 09:49 PM
I've been lucky with my horses, they were all pretty respectful of people and other than the odd head butt because the carrots weren't coming fast enough, I've never been bit, kicked or purposely dumped. Got stepped on a couple of times but that was my fault and fell off a few times but again either my horse spooked and I wasn't sitting solid and you know horse goes one way and you go the other!! Once in awhile I'd carry a crop but rarely used it, I always found I'd drop it and then have to go hunting for it after.

.

Gee, you must have had nice horses, pattymac. :) I have been bit, kicked, bucked off , knocked out by a horse striking me with its hoof, fallen with, fallen on when one reared over on top of me, and bolted with. All good fun, the horse riding, thrills and spills included. :D I didn't enjoy having bones broken in my foot by a racehorse stepping back onto it(I was brushing his tail), then pivotting as the boss led him out the door.

pattymac
September 27th, 2011, 01:40 AM
yup consider myself very lucky when it came to horses! I did break my arm once, like an ass I put my arm out to stop myself...duh! Slid off my pony riding bareback..she was the worst bareback, round like a barrel and a trot that was almost impossible to sit, so ya she turned a little too fast and I was on the ground.

Goldfields
September 27th, 2011, 12:50 PM
Same thing happened when I let a neighbor's child have a ride on a little bay mare. Fortunately I had told her to ask her mnother if it was okay first because same thing happened, Beauty started to trot, changed direction and the child fell off, fracturing her elbow. :eek: I did feel pretty terrible about that.

renegaderuby
October 22nd, 2011, 06:42 PM
I think to beat a horse "after" they've done something wrong is counter productive. they likely dont have any idea why they are being beaten , and beating a horse is never a good solution anyways. I believie to "correct" a horse with a slight sting of a whip "if nessecary" IMMEDITALY during bad/unwanted behavior is ok. But only if absolutly nessecary and nothing else works.
For instance my mother in law and father in law have mini horses and while not the same as large breed horses, let me tell you these little doodies can pack a whallop too. They almost kicked my mother in law to death one time..fighting over treats .
Anyways...they have a few that like to "bite" for the "fun" of it.
They dont like to "correct" them for thier behavior as they kind of treat them like "pets and baby them". (to an extent anyways).
Well I got tired of being bitten by this one paticular little mare ...and I'd tried, pinching her lip, shoving her head away, grabbing her ear, kneeing her, nothing worked. one day..I'd had enough..as OTHER than the biting , she was actually seeking attention from me...I tried all the others and she continued to bite...so she goes to bite again and I took her, held her in a headlock, and smacked her across her nose (HARD) and said "NO". I let go...she kinda shook her head...smacked her lips...went to bite me again..and I did the same thing.
She shook her head...smacked her lips...and walked away. A few mins later..she comes back over and starts rubbing her head on my arm asking for attention. I start to pet her..she goes to nibble....and then it was like "OH YEAH"..and STOPPED dead in her tracks.
She has NEVER bit me again.

I hated to do it.
But...she learned.
She still bites everyone else.
But she dosent bite me any longer.


I've a "little' experience with horses, although more so on a juvinile level. I barrel raced a few years on a friends mare. She was a pretty quick , and slightly tempermental thing. But found a "peppermint stick" (those soft ones) would cure most of her ill moods. :) She was called quick silver and she delighted me to no end. She was just a quarter horse, no special breeding, or ribbons. But I'd have given my left leg to have her for my own. I had one good spill into a barrel (my fault) and cracked a rib (lucky it wasnt my head)..and it scared me pretty good. I decided to "unborrow" her the next year..and then I moved out of state and stopped riding alltogether for awhile. She only "bit" me once, but it was my finger (my fault for not realising we'd got to the end of the peppermint stick) :)
Then after a few 'non riding" years
My last "riding " experince was rather funny. (or not ..depending on your humor). My father in law got a regular sized horse to keep all his mini horses company. Gypsy (oh boy that shouldve clued me in tobegin with)...was a pretty thing. but she had a look in her eye that I didnt trust all to well. Plus I hadnt been on a horse period in about six years. But..me being stubborn. I decide. I'm going to ride her.
First ride was "rather" successful. I managed to stay "on" and get her to walk around.
Second time..."not so much" ..and she decided she WAS NOT going to the back of the pasture. I decided she WAS.and the FIGHT was on.
I was determined. And so was she.
She bucked, she kicked, she threw the biggest horse fit you've ever seen, all while I'm trying to STAY ON her...and so she decided...well I'll just RUN then.
So..I was like..ok..run..but your RUNNING to the back of the pasture then.
And she did. BOY DID SHE.
So...we get to the end of the pasture. I think.."sucess...I won".
Ha..boy did she EVER get the last laugh.
She stands there panting, and I was unpreparred (and completely "green" in horse language ) as she just all of a sudden BOLTS....I did my best...but within mins I was on her side...and hit the ground and rolled. I hit so hard that my husband heard me all the way at the other end of the pasture.
It took the breath right out of me..and I knew instantly that at least one rib was cracked. (later found out at least three were for sure..OWIE)
Gypsy...stopped (eventually) and came back to see about me. (well , I'll give her points on that one). and I was determined..to get back up on her. As I learned as a child..one never lets the horse know they bested you.
I got back on her. Tears down my face, unable to breathe...barely able to hold on, praying she'd just walk. (thank god she did)..and we made it back to the barn.
I got off her.
The next passengers she had (another day), she bucked off and broke one of thier arms.
She was sold , to someone with more "horse sense, and patience" and we decided "gypsy was TOO MUCH horse " for us. She never bit, or kicked unpassengerd...but everytime someone rode her she threw a fit, bucked, bolted, ect....was just "spooky" i guess.

I also was "ran" over by a horse at age eight. totally my fault. I always fed my grandfathers horses "carrots" and and one day decided to stand in the middle of two of the studs...instead of stay behind the fence (like id been told too). I got trampled over. Had a good horse hoof bruise on my back..and scared the wits outta me. But I was "ok".
It taught me to "stay behind the fence" on the "big boys".
I also got thrown when on one of the studs, a train went by and "bud" spooked. Thankfully my grandfather was right there, and caught me before I hit the ground. He was over 20 hands high..I'd have likely cracked my neck as I was only five. I cried and didnt want to get back on. he made me. I'm so glad he did..as I've loved horses ever since.

anyways..thats my little bit of horse experince. I dont know what I'd do if I encountered a "mean" horse. Probably "run" lol