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Haha...I made the paper...well kind of!

krdahmer
February 4th, 2011, 09:39 AM
The bold part was me! :laughing: My dad caught it in the paper today and told me...I talked with Ms.Wing when she was campaigning door to door last fall! She saw my incase of emergency sign for 7 cats and talked to me about them and what she had planned if she was elected...nice to know she's following through! :thumbs up

Local NewsHome News Local News Cat-limit bylaw under review by city Cat-limit bylaw under review by city
By ALISON LANGLEY , REVIEW STAFF WRITER
Updated 2 hours ago


Amending the city's bylaw that restricts the number of cats a person can own would be welcome news to the Niagara Falls Humane Society.

"I think it's definitely an idea worth exploring," said Jay Descroches, manager of the Chippawa Parkway shelter.

There are usually more than 100 cats at the shelter and dozens of others available at various adoption outlets across the city.

According to animal control officials, the feline population explosion comes down to irresponsible pet ownership, with far too many people not having their animals spayed or neutered.

Currently, the city bylaw limits the number of felines to three per household.

Coun. Janice Wing made a motion at council in January to have staff develop a report on the possibility of increasing that number.

Ironically, Wing was a member of the city's cat control committee that helped to draft the original bylaw back in 1989.

She had a change of heart, however, after hearing from constituents during the fall municipal campaign.

"I came across one lady who had seven cats," she said.

"She said they were all spayed or neutered, they all see the vet regularly and that she takes very good care of them.""

I thought, in cases where people are making the investment of their time, money and energy in doing this and we have cages at the shelter overflowing with cats, why wouldn't we extend the number?"


Wing said allowing people to have more than three cats would alleviate the strain on local shelters.

"We're looking at doing all we can to deal with the overwhelming number of unwanted and feral cats in the city and this may be one more tool to help us do that," she said.

According to the Canadian Federation of Humane Societies, the average female cat can produce three litters a year, averaging four to six kittens per litter.

In seven years, one female cat and her offspring can theoretically produce 420,000 cats.

If the city's report suggests it would be beneficial to increase the limit, Wing said she would ask for public meetings to be held to receive input from the public.

"I'm hoping there's ample opportunity for the public to express either their support or concern," she said.

City clerk Dean Iorfida expects the report to be prepared by the spring.

While Wing's focus is on cats, she said the same amendment could also apply to dogs, which are also limited to three per household.

"If the dogs are spayed or neutered, then there wouldn't be a problem."

alangley@nfreview.com

Melinda
February 4th, 2011, 09:48 AM
way to go!!! good for you for speaking out.

Love4himies
February 4th, 2011, 10:06 AM
Yay :thumbs up. It's not the number of pets, but how well they are taken care of that is the issue. :thumbs up (you're not in trouble for having more than 3 are you?)

14+kitties
February 4th, 2011, 10:10 AM
You rock girlfriend!!!! :grouphug: I am very proud of you for changing the mind of one person. That's all it takes sometimes. WTG!!! :grouphug:

hedgiemama
February 4th, 2011, 10:36 AM
Way to go! hopefully they will raise the limit! the number shouldnt matter, just how well they are taken care of !


(you're not in trouble for having more than 3 are you?)

I was wondering the same thing :o

14+kitties
February 4th, 2011, 10:46 AM
It would be very interesting to know how many people actually stick to only three. My guess would be not many. This whole area of Southern Ontario has a huge cat overpopulation.

They are/were trying to impose a limit in my area too. Don't see that going down well. So many don't take responsibility for the ones they have. :( At one point I heard 2 per household, 10 if you lived on a farm. Not very realistic at all. They obviously don't know their constituents very well if they think farmers would care about how many cats they have. The only thing a "law" like that would do would be to increase the number of cats being drowned or shot. Very intelligent. :wall: Seriously, I wish sometimes these people who have the power to make changes would actually spend some time out in the field seeing how bad the problem really is.

krdahmer
February 4th, 2011, 11:26 AM
As far as I know no, I'm not... I have also talked to the HS personnel at adoptathons...and even they say they only enforce that by-law if the pets are not being cared for, which is certainly not the case here! :D Truthfully I don't think the number of pets matters one iota, I think they need more man power to keep tabs on those that do have pets and make sure they are all taken care of. They need to encourage more to get involved, and speak out if they see pets not being taken care of.... and more would if they thought that something might actually get done about it.

pattymac
February 4th, 2011, 03:48 PM
Cool!! The way I see it, is most wouldn't even know I have 4 cats! They're all indoor, spayed and neutered. The only time anyone would know is when I take kitty litter to the dumpster! If we get a bigger place with a better yard, I'd love to put up an outdoor run for them though.

ferret29
February 9th, 2011, 09:16 AM
Quick note, lets keep in mind that Wing also stood in support of a cat rescue that was up on numerous criminal counts for neglect (later convicted on these counts). Felt they should be able to keep almost 200 cats in a school portable where many were ill. In court records so can discuss. Also she along with council directed staff to ignore the 3 dog limit for farming areas a few years ago and if they had enforced it the recent finding of a puppy mill would not of occurred since the city was informed of this place and bylaws claimed they were investigating. Info can be found on the cities web site about it. This along with at least 5 other places they were informed about but also did nothing. Enforcing the limit would have helped shut them down. She pushed for no kill and now that it is not cost effective because she sits on the board has backtracked to the system that was in place before. Stood a few years ago in front of the shelter in protest of a dog ordered euthanized by the courts after non compliance of a court order which was the result of the dog mauling two teens but now that money is an issue for these cats at the shelter a change in policy occurs? Something wrong with this picture.
Raise the limit is fine but to me it appears its just to put in writing a law they do not enforce anyway. Is there ways to make it work, sure is but not without an organization willing to followup and enforce issues of neglect when your next door neighbor has 75 cats roaming at large even if they are fixed.

BenMax
February 9th, 2011, 09:21 AM
Hoarding is a completely different issue and topic. Hoarding is something that is a human condition and regardless if there is a limitation or not to how many animals a house hold is allowed..the instances of hoarding will still remain. Changing the limitation will not have any ill effect on a population as a whole...but it will make a difference to the cats that benefit in loving homes that provide proper care.

ferret29
February 9th, 2011, 12:54 PM
Hoarding is a completely different issue and topic. Hoarding is something that is a human condition and regardless if there is a limitation or not to how many animals a house hold is allowed..the instances of hoarding will still remain. Changing the limitation will not have any ill effect on a population as a whole...but it will make a difference to the cats that benefit in loving homes that provide proper care.

You are right. My point more being first it is from my experience only being done for political gain. Second, the limit is not enforced in the Falls anyway and that if you are going to have someone speak out for it they should be better informed and not hypocritical. Raising the limit with the claim more cats will get adopted is silliness in a City where it is not enforced so how could this increase it? 90% of the city I am sure does not even know there is a limit. Change the laws there to protect the ones there, ENFORCE IT, start by changing the bylaw to allow for registration of cats and work at getting the ones back home that are lost. 2-3% are claimed. Start there, improve that and then work at increasing limits. Do not create an opening to allow a flawed system to just get even worse. She and others created a no kill policy with little or no knowledge on what was going to happen and now after a financial strain on NFHS they change their policy back?
My long writing for a short point, fix the current problems before you add to them then have to chase your tail around fixing them and have the people who are changing them fully educated in what they are doing because if not in the end the animals we are trying to protect WILL suffer as a result of these same peoples misguided changes.

14+kitties
February 9th, 2011, 01:07 PM
ferret - Do you work in an animal shelter or deal with animal welfare in the area? I'd be interested in knowing the number of stray dogs reclaimed. If you don't want to post in open forum let me know. I will pm you and you can reply. Thanks. :thumbs up

BenMax
February 9th, 2011, 01:41 PM
You are right. My point more being first it is from my experience only being done for political gain. Second, the limit is not enforced in the Falls anyway and that if you are going to have someone speak out for it they should be better informed and not hypocritical. Raising the limit with the claim more cats will get adopted is silliness in a City where it is not enforced so how could this increase it? 90% of the city I am sure does not even know there is a limit. Change the laws there to protect the ones there, ENFORCE IT, start by changing the bylaw to allow for registration of cats and work at getting the ones back home that are lost. 2-3% are claimed. Start there, improve that and then work at increasing limits. Do not create an opening to allow a flawed system to just get even worse. She and others created a no kill policy with little or no knowledge on what was going to happen and now after a financial strain on NFHS they change their policy back?
My long writing for a short point, fix the current problems before you add to them then have to chase your tail around fixing them and have the people who are changing them fully educated in what they are doing because if not in the end the animals we are trying to protect WILL suffer as a result of these same peoples misguided changes.

Very good points Ferret29. It sounds like you have some sort of background in this and also perhaps insight. I actually do think you are on track about much that you have written. Very good for someone like me to reflect and see your point..which is well received btw.:thumbs up

ferret29
February 9th, 2011, 02:18 PM
20 years in the field. It does not make me an expert but really not much I have not seen unfortunately. As for the number of dogs claimed, it depends on the City in the region but generally it ran at about 70 to as high as 90+. This is and was my big concern about cats. Fix the claiming rate before opening up the flood gates to more animals. Yes, again unfortunately good animal owners suffer as a result of limits but until certain cities improve the current system, enforce old and new systems, not intentionally turning their head to current problems which intentionally and unintentionally supported puppy and cat mills animals will suffer. Local politicians need to look long and hard and systems that are working, enact those with some modifications to suit the area and financially support these changes. They also need to educate themselves about the issues and not make ANY change without doing so and with an open mind, not for vendettas (as done in the past), not for political gain (as done in the past) and not just to tell the people what they want to hear. Do it for what is best in the long run for the animals. Quality of life is more important to quantity. They need to look into the eyes of an neglected animal or an animal that was just hit by a car and you are holding their insides in your hand while trying to save them all as a result of their actions or lack of. Creating a no kill policy then backtracking because it is costing too much shows the lack of leadership and planning that went into its initial creation. ' Lets create something because the people want to hear the words.' It was done without any or little planning as to long term effects. The $150000 over budget could have gone to increasing claiming rates of cats or 1500 spay/neuter's for low income. Help reduce the euthanasia rate and the issues that are at the root of the problem first. Sticking 10 cats in this store and 20 in that foster home etc does nothing to solve the problem. Raising the limit will not at all solve the problem. Having Wing within a few weeks say the shelter has to change the no kill policy because of cost then say the limit needs to be raised show the illogical approach to the problem. All this does is put a bandage on a problem of too many cats in the shelter because of a policy that was never researched before hand. We will raise the limit and more people will come and adopt so our problem is solved. No it won't be, not until the root of the problem is dealt with first and they cannot or choose not to see this. Allow the people to make the decisions who have the background and knowledge. Research and then put in place solutions then stand behind them by both financially and enforcement.
Hope some of this makes a little sense :shrug:

Melinda
February 9th, 2011, 02:25 PM
it makes a whole lot of sense, welcome to the board, we need people like you here to help us all understand things a whole lot better!

14+kitties
February 9th, 2011, 02:29 PM
I asked specifically about Niagara Falls numbers seeing as that is the city that was originally being spoken about in this thread. (Sorry kr for this going so far off topic) I know pretty much what the numbers are in St. Cats. Who has the contract in Welland for animal control?
When you are proposing exactly can be done to control the cat population? This is also my main interest as dogs have more advocates than cats do. Are you talking t/n/r, low cost s/n (thought Lincoln was working on that), a major cull, licensing? I'd be interested in knowing.

ferret29
February 9th, 2011, 03:14 PM
NF was at least 70 to 90% depending on the month. I cannot speak for current figures. Welland Humane has the contact for Welland, Pelham, Wainfleet, Haldimand, Port Colborne, West Lincoln and their claim rate was varied depending on the city.
This is just a short quick post as I got to run off but will add to it tomorrow.

Cull is certainly not the solution but registration is a start along with creating bylaws to deal with roaming cats or at least enforce the ones that are there. License incentives for altered animals. Cat registration where it is free if the cat is altered and tattooed or micro-chipped. Get them home!

I will post more as I mentioned but the main issue is increasing the claiming rate which starts with education and a system that will allow people to locate their cats easier and faster along with ways that will allow shelters to locate owners.

At one point NF was using Pet Lynx to help claiming and it was working increase claiming but they stopped which was just plain dumb. An owner could find out their animal was at the shelter within hours or less of entering the shelter.
I just looked at their site and under found animals what did I find - NOTHING.
No animals have been picked up lost? This is one reason the shelter is full, animals cannot be claimed if help getting them home is limited by those who should be helping the most outside of the owner.
Dig and you will start to see the flaws in the current system. Have questions or want to help make changes, go to a Board meeting and ask to be on the agenda. They may tell you they are closed but they cannot be, they are a charity and unless dealing with in camera issues public can attend. Want to help change and make improvements, become a member and try to be nominated to sit on the Board. Go to city meetings and ask to speak, as the hard questions, ask how they are going to fix the current problems without creating more. That is where improvements can start.

Thanks for the welcome also. More later :) Any questions I can answer I will do my best.

BenMax
February 9th, 2011, 05:32 PM
Makes a heck of alot of sense. Thank you for posting. You are a valued member of this board. You know what you are talking about and this is very much appreciated.
I do not believe however that euthanasia is the answer in reducing the increasing numbers of animals in the pet population.

What Ontario is lacking BIG TIME is allowing rescues in Ontario to help out with the over population. If interested I can tell you of my involvement from the Quebec side in moving animals into rescues into other provinces (mainly Ontario) because the A/C and the shelters/pounds REFUSE to let rescues help out. As a result I am able to save hundreds of dogs and the few cats into rescues outside of my province. Ontario certainly is not helping themselves to a very important demand by their very own citizens and organizations.

Last week alone, I was able to move 7 dogs from Quebec to Ontario. There is an average of 5-10 dogs per week that I move out into respective rescue organizations into Ontario alone. So while I was rejected in my efforts to help save Ontario dogs mainly, I am able to save a few Quebec dogs. Now that certainly affects the euthanasia rate for Ontario while the shelters that cooperate here..obviously their rates are down.

My sincere apologies to the OP for thread jacking.:)

Love4himies
February 10th, 2011, 07:07 AM
20 years in the field. It does not make me an expert but really not much I have not seen unfortunately. As for the number of dogs claimed, it depends on the City in the region but generally it ran at about 70 to as high as 90+. This is and was my big concern about cats. Fix the claiming rate before opening up the flood gates to more animals. Yes, again unfortunately good animal owners suffer as a result of limits but until certain cities improve the current system, enforce old and new systems, not intentionally turning their head to current problems which intentionally and unintentionally supported puppy and cat mills animals will suffer. Local politicians need to look long and hard and systems that are working, enact those with some modifications to suit the area and financially support these changes. They also need to educate themselves about the issues and not make ANY change without doing so and with an open mind, not for vendettas (as done in the past), not for political gain (as done in the past) and not just to tell the people what they want to hear. Do it for what is best in the long run for the animals. Quality of life is more important to quantity. They need to look into the eyes of an neglected animal or an animal that was just hit by a car and you are holding their insides in your hand while trying to save them all as a result of their actions or lack of. Creating a no kill policy then backtracking because it is costing too much shows the lack of leadership and planning that went into its initial creation. ' Lets create something because the people want to hear the words.' It was done without any or little planning as to long term effects. The $150000 over budget could have gone to increasing claiming rates of cats or 1500 spay/neuter's for low income. Help reduce the euthanasia rate and the issues that are at the root of the problem first. Sticking 10 cats in this store and 20 in that foster home etc does nothing to solve the problem. Raising the limit will not at all solve the problem. Having Wing within a few weeks say the shelter has to change the no kill policy because of cost then say the limit needs to be raised show the illogical approach to the problem. All this does is put a bandage on a problem of too many cats in the shelter because of a policy that was never researched before hand. We will raise the limit and more people will come and adopt so our problem is solved. No it won't be, not until the root of the problem is dealt with first and they cannot or choose not to see this. Allow the people to make the decisions who have the background and knowledge. Research and then put in place solutions then stand behind them by both financially and enforcement.
Hope some of this makes a little sense :shrug:

Great post :thumbs up. You are the voice of reason. Unfortunately with Politicians, all they care about is re-election and to spend taxpayers money by doing what is popular, not what is proper.

14+kitties
February 10th, 2011, 07:45 AM
Unfortunately with Politicians, all they care about is re-election and to spend taxpayers money by doing what is popular, not what is proper.

Isn't that the truth? We now have one who, up to the other day, I thought was ok. Now he's baiting for votes by saying he will lower the cost of beer to $1 a bottle. :wall::wall: Who the h#!! cares!! Tell me you will find or at least help to find a solution for the strays in our area. Then I will vote for you.

krdahmer
February 10th, 2011, 12:48 PM
Haha...wow...just wanted to tell you guys I was mentioned in the paper!

I'm all about healthy debate though...I have been a supporter of registration for cats for a long time now! If they had incentives for altered kitties that would be great! (mainly cause it might not cost me an arm and a leg that way;)) I really just think it was good that the overpopulation problem got a visible forum in the paper....without it being attached to some horrible hoarding/abuse article.

and threadjack away people! this thread now has some awesome info for those who might stumble upon it! (maybe Ms. Wing herself!:fingerscr)

BenMax
February 10th, 2011, 12:49 PM
and threadjack away people! this thread now has some awesome info for those who might stumble upon it! (maybe Ms. Wing herself!:fingerscr)

You are the BESTEST!:grouphug::thumbs up

Love4himies
February 10th, 2011, 01:21 PM
and threadjack away people! this thread now has some awesome info for those who might stumble upon it! (maybe Ms. Wing herself!:fingerscr)

:thumbs up:grouphug:

Love4himies
February 10th, 2011, 01:22 PM
Isn't that the truth? We now have one who, up to the other day, I thought was ok. Now he's baiting for votes by saying he will lower the cost of beer to $1 a bottle.

Was he drunk when he said that :loser:. How can he lower the price isn't it pretty much all federal and provincial taxes????

14+kitties
February 10th, 2011, 01:26 PM
Was he drunk when he said that :loser:. How can he lower the price isn't it pretty much all federal and provincial taxes????

He is talking about running for premier in next election. Like I said, he isn't bad but that just kind of shocked me. He is all for the family, down home type. I suppose he feels he has an in with them saying that. :shrug:

14+kitties
February 10th, 2011, 01:39 PM
Cull is certainly not the solution.

Thank you for saying that. I wanted to see where you stood on it. :thumbs up I would hate to see that happen when it has been proven in other areas that t/n/r goes a long way to controlling the population. However, I figured with other animals (deer, coyote, etc) being culled when populations got out of control cats were fair game. Especially with the ever increasing opinion that cats are vermin. :(
Now - how do you propose to convince farmers/ordinary citizens that they have to fix their cats? We have so many in my area who would just as soon drown kittens, shoot cats, or just do the best they can to ignore them and let nature (coyotes) take it's course it is very tiring trying to deal with them on a regular basis. I speak to people almost daily about the problem. They feel they are helping by feeding the strays. I try to tell them thank you but unless you are willing to get them s/n you really aren't helping at all. In fact you are aiding it. It's disheartening to hear "I'd rather spend the money on clothes or on my kids." when I tell them I can give them the numbers for a couple of low cost s/n places. :wall: Sorry for the rant. :o

BenMax
February 10th, 2011, 02:19 PM
Thank you for saying that. I wanted to see where you stood on it. :thumbs up I would hate to see that happen when it has been proven in other areas that t/n/r goes a long way to controlling the population. However, I figured with other animals (deer, coyote, etc) being culled when populations got out of control cats were fair game. Especially with the ever increasing opinion that cats are vermin. :(
Now - how do you propose to convince farmers/ordinary citizens that they have to fix their cats? We have so many in my area who would just as soon drown kittens, shoot cats, or just do the best they can to ignore them and let nature (coyotes) take it's course it is very tiring trying to deal with them on a regular basis. I speak to people almost daily about the problem. They feel they are helping by feeding the strays. I try to tell them thank you but unless you are willing to get them s/n you really aren't helping at all. In fact you are aiding it. It's disheartening to hear "I'd rather spend the money on clothes or on my kids." when I tell them I can give them the numbers for a couple of low cost s/n places. :wall: Sorry for the rant. :o

There is a rescue group in Ontario that actually asked farmers if they could spay and neuter with the return of the cats of course. The farmers did not object at all, infact they were willing to even house feral cats in their barns. The rescue ensured that the farmers were good to the cats in the sense that they were fed, watered and kept well in the barn. This idea actually took care of a huge problem in this area. It even went so far as if a farmer's barn cat died, they contacted the rescue to take in a feral. Interesting concept that actually 'caught' on. This rescue I speak of takes in ferals, rehabilitates and finds homes for the kittens only. The older feral momma cats are also helped back into human society as he takes the time to rehab them as well.