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Kidney Disease, Kidney Failure and CRF??

Winston
June 24th, 2010, 04:23 PM
I have been trying to wrap my head around Bombers illness and am getting confused!

Is CRF the same as kidney disease/kidney failure? are they treated the same way?

Cindy

sugarcatmom
June 24th, 2010, 04:34 PM
CRF - Chronic Renal Failure (which should really be called Chronic Renal Insufficiency because it isn't technically "failure" until you have total shutdown) is a progressive disease of the kidneys. So yes, it's the same thing, although there can be many different causes.

Winston
June 24th, 2010, 04:48 PM
Thanks SCM! I got the figures from wellness canned and their protein levels are double what Bomber should be having according to the vet? I still have to look at more brands but it doesnt seem to be too popular other than at the vets?

sugarcatmom
June 24th, 2010, 07:40 PM
Some of the Wellness flavours (chicken, turkey) are great for kidney cats. Remember, it's not about the protein, it's about the phosphorus. Cats need protein! Please don't be influenced by the misinformation from your vet on what Bomber should be eating. A protein-deficient diet like the prescription renal diets that the vets just automatically hand out like robots can actually do more harm than good.

Winston
June 24th, 2010, 08:41 PM
So you dont think I need to adjust his food? He eats all the varieties of DVP NB except fish...they dont like it at all...most of them range at 10% and under? I have tried the crap at the vets before that is 6% and they wont even try it.....

I hate to say it but 3 days no pee! I found a spot where I never realised he was going in the basement...boy do I have my work cut out for me! Its a whole wall of shelving that goes across about 30 feet..under the shelves there is a piece of carpet the size of the shelf....well he pee'd all over the where the shelf starts and the carpet ends! so we have to empty all of the shelves and then pull out the carpet and put everything back...

My little bugger! He is still sleeping alot.:(

They wanted me to bring him back in for a urine check just before he finishes the clavamox so I think I am going to take the opportunity and take him to the cat clinic nearby that specializes in just cats...I just hate to take him somewhere new in the middle of a situation but it has to be done for Bomber's sake. I really think the current vet should have dealt with this alot different.

growler~GateKeeper
June 25th, 2010, 01:36 AM
Is CRF the same as kidney disease/kidney failure? are they treated the same way?

All different names for the same thing.

So you dont think I need to adjust his food? He eats all the varieties of DVP NB except fish...they dont like it at all...most of them range at 10% and under? I have tried the crap at the vets before that is 6% and they wont even try it.....

This is one problem with the vet kidney food, they lower the protein level too far with the thinking that low protein is so very important but many cats do not find it appetizing. It doesn't matter how low the phosphorus level is on a food if the cat won't eat it.

Protein

http://www.felinecrf.org/nutritional...ts.htm#protein
A healthy cat needs around 30% of its calorie intake to be protein, and since cats are obligate carnivores (which means that they need to eat meat in order to survive), virtually all of that must be animal protein. Protein contains essential amino acids which are necessary for maintaining muscle, but it also creates a large amount of waste, which is processed by the kidneys in the form of urea (BUN). Since urea/BUN levels tend to rise in a CRF cat because the kidneys are working less effectively, many vets recommend a diet low in protein so as to minimise the levels of urea/BUN which are produced.

However, there is a lot of controversy about how useful low protein diets are for CRF cats, and when they should be introduced. Many vets recommend a low protein diet immediately; but this is not necessarily a good move. Cats need a relatively high amount of protein in their diets, compared to say, dogs or humans; and if protein is reduced too early, it can cause weight loss, raised liver enzymes, and may in some cases contribute to the development of anaemia. This is particularly true of those CRF cats who leak protein in their urine (proteinuria), leading to low protein levels in the blood. Having said that, the low protein prescription diets claim to have sufficient protein for cats at all stages of CRF.

Low protein diets are also of concern for cats with metabolic acidosis, because studies of rats and humans with renal failure show that "acidosis may limit the ability of patients to adapt to dietary protein restrictions" (Nutrition and renal function in cats and dogs: acid-base, electrolytes and renal failure (1999) Polzin DJ, Osbourne CA, James K Supplement to Compendium on Continuing Education for the Practising Veterinarian 21 11(K)).

It is not yet certain whether acidosis also affects cats in this way, but it seems reasonable to suspect that it does, given the cat's relatively high requirement for protein.

Wellness has Turkey, Chicken and Beef & Chicken which have good numbers all under 1.2% dm phos

Chris21711
June 25th, 2010, 11:37 AM
Sending out good vibes for Bomber Winston...with the help of Growler and SCM you know you are both in good hands :thumbs up

Winston
June 25th, 2010, 11:43 AM
Thanks Chris! but I honestly think its just too overwhelming! I cant wrap my head around all this stuff! maybe I am just dumb! :(

Chris21711
June 25th, 2010, 11:52 AM
Nah, you ain't dumb Winston....I can't wrap my head around it either....I would follow Growler's and SCM's advice regarding diet etc blindfolded though.....Vet's as a rule don't go into such deep research on just one thing....It is like you or I going to a GP or a Specialist.

aslan
June 25th, 2010, 11:56 AM
Winston i know nothing about CRF or any of that stuff. I did want to send my :goodvibes: along with the others to Bomber..and second Chris's comment on SCM and Growler's advice.. i would take their help any day of the week.:thumbs up

Winston
June 25th, 2010, 01:05 PM
Oh no doubt! I take the advice I just dont understand it! :D

Thanks Aslan!