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Why Rescues Do What We Do...

cassiek
January 15th, 2010, 08:36 PM
After a few of the posts I have read on here lately, and some of my own personal experiences, I'd like to provide some input into why rescues do what we do.

I volunteer at a rescue in Lethbridge and often deal with individuals who are upset over various aspects of how the rescue is run. I won't go into details, but it includes people being upset over our adoption prices (at $190.00 its MORE than reasonable as that includes spay/neuter and vaccines), why we won't adopt out a certain dog/cat to you, why we don't adopt out animals to be "outdoor" pets, why we require a fenced yard etc.

Please put yourself in our shoes. We deal with the aftermath of generally horrifying and incredibly cruel experiences inflicted on animals by our own kind on a DAILY basis. We take in animals that have been dumped on the streets left to die. We take in animals simply because "the dog grew up and is too big", "I'm pregnant", "I have no time", "the dog eats too much", and my personal favorite "the dog keeps having puppies!"... etc. etc. 99% of the dogs people surrender has nothing to do with the dog and everything to do with the owner's irresponsibility.

We see animals that have suffered such cruelty, you start to lose faith everyday in mankind that we regularly impose such suffering on another species. You wonder how these innocent victims will ever, ever trust a human being again and not be haunted the rest of their lives (thankfully, unlike our own species, animals have this wonderful ability of pushing their terrible past deep deep down and learning to love life again).

Please remember that all that we do is because we love the animals and that everything we do is FOR the animals NOT necessarily what the HUMANS want. It CANNOT be about what the humans want, it HAS to be what is in the BEST interest of the animals.

Remember that our adoption prices barely, barely cover our expenses. People complain over $190.00... how will you ever afford food, yearly vaccines, etc.? And NO we just "don't want to get rid of the dog". It blows my mind people complain about this, when they have no problem going to Petland buying a unsterilized puppymill mutt, and have no problem spending thousands.

We want to place these animals in their FOREVER homes therefore YES we are picky where they go! Could we honestly be anything but?? We know these animals in and out, and while we may not know their history, we know if they will be a good match for your home so DON'T take it personally if we suggest another animal instead or refuse the adoption. These animals have NO voice, we MUST be the voice for them!

Thank you.

Chaser
January 15th, 2010, 09:42 PM
Very well said. :thumbs up

I think that, sadly, a lot of people see rescue dogs the same way they see used cars and therefore think they should be "cheap".

Frenchy
January 15th, 2010, 10:10 PM
everything we do is FOR the animals NOT necessarily what the HUMANS want.

love your post , very well said :thumbs up

oh and ... I can't believe people would complain about $190 adoption fee ! Here it's $300 and + and I still think it's "cheap" considering what rescues pay to get these dogs vet care.

rainbow
January 16th, 2010, 01:34 AM
Great post cassiek. :thumbs up

cassiek
January 16th, 2010, 10:18 AM
Thanks guys :2huggers:

I think what sparked this is this past Thursday evening on my shift I dealt with a woman over the phone who was one of these individuals... gasped at the adoption fee, was upset I wouldn't adopt to her because the dog would be outside, had no dog run etc. And it really upset me :(

Personally, I think our $190.00 adoption fee is ridiculously cheap (It's $150 for cats). The average price around Lethbridge to have a female spayed and vaccinated costs over $400... I honestly can not believe someone would actually complain about this price! And it shocks me to my soul that people believe we just want to "get rid" of these animals and complain they are not free! :wall: :yell: :frustrated:

I know people often become frustrated with our process of an adoption (which yes, we require references, a homecheck etc) but we have to be a voice for these animals and do what is right for them... I don't care how upset or angry the person is (which the lady was - oi!). All animals deserve the best quality of life and we are going to make sure they get it! :cloud9:

babydoll101
January 16th, 2010, 10:30 AM
Oh this is such a great post and oh so true. Thanks so much for opening people's eyes and making us see what it is all about.

DoubleRR
January 16th, 2010, 10:31 AM
Wonderful post--I SO agree it is hard to imagine anyone would object to such a low fee for what they get--a neutered animal, up to date on shots and healthy, with all the information on how that animal appears to respond to various stimuli such as small animals, other dogs, kids. Good grief, that is a package deal beyond compare!!! I cannot work with the public and pets together. After years of dog and horse work, I found myself dreaming of ways to sweep the earth of their owners. So, I work in retail and keep the two separate for my own stability.:)
Kudos to you. If I lived closer, I would certainly help with the rehab end....just not the prospective owners.

Love4himies
January 16th, 2010, 11:27 AM
Thank you for posting that, cassiek. I agree, when in rescue or animal control, it is very easy to become pessimistic of the human race due to what is seen on a regular basis. :(


I do know that a lot of rescues have the requirement for a fenced in yard when adopting out a dog and I don't understand why. I wonder how many wonderful owners who would love to adopt from a rescue but are turned down because they don't have a fence, especially those who live in the country and have too big of a yard to fence. I have also heard many complaints from people who have been turned down by rescues due to this, so they go to byb's and pet stores.

Could you please elaborate WHY it is a requirement so people understand where the rescues are coming from? I know 4 dog owners in my country subdivision who are wonderful dog owners, but don't have a fence.

Golden Girls
January 16th, 2010, 11:54 AM
Great post Cassiek :thumbs up

I do know that a lot of rescues have the requirement for a fenced in yard when adopting out a dog and I don't understand why. I wonder how many wonderful owners who would love to adopt from a rescue but are turned down because they don't have a fence, especially those who live in the country and have too big of a yard to fence. I have also heard many complaints from people who have been turned down by rescues due to this, so they go to byb's and pet stores.

Could you please elaborate WHY it is a requirement so people understand where the rescues are coming from? I know 4 dog owners in my country subdivision who are wonderful dog owners, but don't have a fence.I agree and I'd like to even go further by saying having a fence yard some may not even get walked :shrug: which I feel it's as important for exercise as is it for stimulation and socialization.

Personally I prefer to know they will be walked over a fenced yard :2cents:

ownedbycats
January 16th, 2010, 01:22 PM
We don't have a fenced yard. We take our dog out several times a day on leash for bathroom breaks, we have a park down the street where she goes for walks on leash, and a dog park we try to visit at least once a week for runs off leash. We would be refused by rescues, but our dog is healthy, up-to-date on her shots, and fed decent quality food. If a rescue won't give someone like my family a dog, the only other alternatives to rescues are the backyard breeders and pet stores. If someone like us is willing to put in the work required for a dog, we either have to live without a dog, or encourage backyard breeders if we want a dog and all rescues start applying the no fence, no dog rule.

cassiek
January 16th, 2010, 01:34 PM
Golden Girls and Love4himies,

You both raise valid points, and on a personal note I strongly agree with you. I live on a farm myself and own three dogs, and have no fenced yard per se, although I do have a dog run just for my own sanity (I am right on a major highway and my dogs do not have the experience or the training to stay off of it, so I use the run to put them in when I want them to spend time outside but can't be out there with them).

Our rule about a fenced in yard is not a hard and fast rule and we have and would adopt a dog out to a home where there isn't a fenced in yard depending on the situation (i.e. the dog itself, the owner's dedication etc.). We are always willing to work with people! :thumbs up

The main reason why we would prefer to see a fenced in yard is because we are frequently taking in dogs that have been tied up outside and break free where they are then hit by a vehicle, go missing, etc. It also helps prevent other dog's (and people) from coming into contact with the dog.

Of course requiring potential owners to have a fenced in yard does not ensure responsible behaviour on the owner's part; however we are trying to do the best we can to ensure the dog is placed in a safe environment. We can not always monitor the animal's care after they leave our facility, but by recommending a fenced in yard, we try to ensure this. But again, we are always willing to work with individuals and would most certainly pick someone who appeared to be a very responsible, dedicated, mature owner that did not have a yard to someone who did have a fenced in yard but thought that was an adequate alternative to proper exercise!!

We understand that just because someone owns a fenced in yard does not make them a good dog owner by any means, which is why it is just one of many, many factors we look at on the adoption application and certainly not the be all end all!

A fenced in yard is also ideal for doing work with a dog off-leash in a (hopefully) safe and secure area. The fence if anything provides protection and has nothing to do with exercise!

On a personal note, I know for my own sanity living both at places that had fenced in yards and those that do not, its much, much easier to have a fenced in yard. That being said it is NOT an alternative to properly exercising your dog!

Our rescue and many others are run 100% on volunteers. We have a great team and many dedicated people, but we are still low on funds and trying to save more animals than we really have the manpower, time, or money to. We try to have some general requirements to save time. Obviously its not the best solution. Still, we try to be very accomodating and would not refuse someone entirely on one requirement they may not meet. Usually potential owners we turn down are for multiple reasons (i.e. are a poor match for the dog breed they are interested in AND don't believe in spaying/neutering AND want an outside dog etc etc.)

In fact, one of my co-workers adopted a dog from the shelter a few months ago and did not have a fenced in yard. But they were able to get a small dog run, we knew they would give her sufficient exercise, so we had no problem approving the adoption!

I hope this helps clarify any misunderstandings! If you have any other q's please PM me!

cassiek
January 16th, 2010, 01:47 PM
I would also like to add that it is best to always, always talk with the rescue group if in doubt about anything! In my own personal experience, working with many rescues, very rarely are there any rules that are set in stone (besides the spay/netuer one for obvious reasons!) and it is always best to ask, as rescue groups are *generally* very accomodating. Like many of you, the people who volunteer and run these groups are very knowledgable on many aspects of animal care, behaviour etc. and understand that something technical such as a fenced in yard does not make the individual or family a good owner(s), which is why we look at several factors when deciding to adopt out an animal, not just one!

I would also like to add that BYB and pet stores are NOT the only option people have. Let's not forget about our reputable breeders. Although they are few and far between and yes, like rescues, require some screening, their interests and goals are similar to ours: placing the animal in the best possible forever home. While they cost more than the BYB (but not usually more than pet store puppies which are very, very overpriced), dogs/cats from reputable breeders are usually worth the price. They come with a health guarntee, have been careful selected for temperment and genetics, are raised in a loving homes with both the puppies and the bitchs/studs quality of life in mind, and come with a spay/neuter contract.

IMO, anyone who does any kind of research before purchasing a dog or cat (and you don't need to dig deep) will soon be educated on the benefits of getting a puppy or kitten from a reputable breeder compared to a BYB or pet store.

cassiek
January 16th, 2010, 01:52 PM
On a final note, when we have a dog surrendered to us, we require the owner to provide us with as much information as possible, including where they received the animal from. They are never from a reputable breeder and always from a BYB or pet store for a few reasons.

One being that reputable breeders always want to place their pups/kittens in a forever home. They themselves have invested a lot of money, time, energy, and work into these puppies/kittens and want to place them in the best possible home. Usually their animals are already sold before they are even born! They pre-screen applicants and have been known to refuse a certain puppy or kitten because the applicant is not suitable or will mesh with this particular puppy/kitten's personality. Whereas a BYB or a pet store will give whatever animal to whatever person as long as they have the $$.

Another reason why we never get animals from reputable breeders is because the breeder enforces and demands that if the owner takes the pet home and is unable to keep them for any reason they MUST be returned to the breeder, to avoid them from ending up in shelters.

Just thought I would add this interesting tidbit.

Golden Girls
January 16th, 2010, 01:56 PM
Cassiek my response wasn't directed at you or your rescue :o I believe everyone ought to be able to run their rescue however they chose :angel: The rescue I volunteer for does have the "yard rule" which is her business I just happen to not agree which is fine :shrug: If ever I run my own rescue I'd probably have the rule "no yards allowed" :evil: I say this and only because too often people just let their dogs outback instead of walking them.

Macomom
January 16th, 2010, 02:03 PM
Just like the conversation about the fenced in yard, I have been turned down by rescues for having children.
I would like to add that it is an unconditional NO. It was not dependent on my children, parenting philosophies, home environment etc. There was also not an opportunity to give personal references for the rescue work I do on behalf of other organizations.
To be quite honest, I find this offensive.
I can understand liability, and would be willing to sign a waiver. I am simply excluded because I have children.

cassiek
January 16th, 2010, 02:05 PM
Golden Girls,

Hey, no worries! :D Just wanted to share some of my own personal experiences! To be honest it was all triggered by an incident I had last Thursday evening where I dealt with a lady who wanted to adopt one of our puppies but didn't believe in spaying/neutering, wanted an outdoors dog, was not knowledgable about the breed, and didn't have a fenced in enclosure of any type. It was a combination of factors that lead me to say "No!", actually "Hell No!" Haha!

I just started this thread because I wanted to get the message out there that while I know it can be a frustrating process at times, we have to do what is best for the animals in all cases! We have seen some pretty horrifying and cruel acts inflicted on these animals. I actually had a man who came in with his white, deaf, senior cat and said if we didn't take the cat, he would dump it out on the streets to starve and die, and then show up at the shelter not a month later looking to adopt a dog!! Another "Hell, hell no!!"! :laughing:

And like you, there are certain aspects of this rescue I work with that I would do differently, but hey we are all in it for the same reasons: because we care for animals and want to put them in the best possible homes!

cassiek
January 16th, 2010, 02:12 PM
And Macomom, I am truly saddened by your experiences with rescues! It's unforunate these rescues act this way and give all rescues a bad name!

The rescue I volunteer at loves children! Of course we want information about them such as ages, what their responsibilities will be with the pet, etc. but we would never discriminate based soley on the reason that the applicant had children! The only reason I could think of why we would have some concern is if there was a home where the children and the particular dog may present some challenges. We just want to make sure that it would be an ideal match! For example a family that had older teenage children wanting to adopt a chihuaha... we may suggest a different breed that would better match the families energy, activities, lifestyle etc. But if their lifestyle was a good match, then we would by all means approve the adoption! :lovestruck:

Golden Girls
January 16th, 2010, 02:13 PM
Just like the conversation about the fenced in yard, I have been turned down by rescues for having children.
I would like to add that it is an unconditional NO. It was not dependent on my children, parenting philosophies, home environment etc. There was also not an opportunity to give personal references for the rescue work I do on behalf of other organizations.
To be quite honest, I find this offensive.
I can understand liability, and would be willing to sign a waiver. I am simply excluded because I have children.I can understand how this would be very offensive

Macomom
January 16th, 2010, 02:18 PM
Thanks cassiek for starting this thread. The rescues I work with don't have this No children rule, or children over 12 etc- so I don't really get it.
I can understand a no idiots rule...:lightbulb:, but I don't get the no kids.
My kids are great, as I have mentioned in the past they are not left unsupervised with our dogs. When our dogs and children interact, our children are compassionate, assertive and loving. My boys are better with dogs than most adults.
Too bad- I have a full house right now, but lots of love to give in the future.

Oh, and I love big breed/giant breed dogs, which can be hard to place. I like rotties, mastiffs, bulldogs, cane corsos etx...

luckypenny
January 16th, 2010, 03:22 PM
In regards to a fenced yard...it's important for me to know, amongst other details, when trying to make the right match. Fencing or not, yard or not, some ppl tend to trust their dogs off leash without knowing if they are reliable. I won't take the chance if I have a foster with a high prey drive, has fear issues, chases moving objects, etc. That being said, most of my fosters have been adopted to homes without fenced yards. It really depends on the individual dog and the individual family. Same goes for families with children.

Personally, I feel one of the most important criteria is if the family intends to attend puppy/training classes, or have educated themselves on raising a dog, especially if they have little to no experience. We've been fortunate enough that most of our adopters had registered for classes even before the adoption was finalized. Imo, preparation is key to a successful adoption.

Love4himies
January 16th, 2010, 05:17 PM
Great post Cassiek :thumbs up

I agree and I'd like to even go further by saying having a fence yard some may not even get walked :shrug: which I feel it's as important for exercise as is it for stimulation and socialization.

Personally I prefer to know they will be walked over a fenced yard :2cents:

Exactly my thoughts. Dogs need the stimulation of a walk as well as the exercise.

Love4himies
January 16th, 2010, 05:20 PM
In regards to a fenced yard...it's important for me to know, amongst other details, when trying to make the right match. Fencing or not, yard or not, some ppl tend to trust their dogs off leash without knowing if they are reliable. I won't take the chance if I have a foster with a high prey drive, has fear issues, chases moving objects, etc. That being said, most of my fosters have been adopted to homes without fenced yards. It really depends on the individual dog and the individual family. Same goes for families with children.

Personally, I feel one of the most important criteria is if the family intends to attend puppy/training classes, or have educated themselves on raising a dog, especially if they have little to no experience. We've been fortunate enough that most of our adopters had registered for classes even before the adoption was finalized. Imo, preparation is key to a successful adoption.


Thanks LP, that certainly makes sense.

cassiek
January 16th, 2010, 06:52 PM
MM, I am still appalled (to say the least) that a rescue would turn you down based on the fact that you have children! How would they ever manage to adopt out dogs if they excluded all families with children? I can appreciate and understand if the dog would be better in a house without children or, like what I said before, if the family and the pet are not a good match, but just based on the fact that you have children... wow. :wall:

All rescues are run differently, so I can only speak for the one I work with, but that just seems wrong to me. How many wonderful homes are they missing placing dogs in?

I started this thread just to raise some awareness of how rescues *should and in most cases do* operate. Alot of the public I have found seem shocked that we don't give the animals away, have expectations, charge an adoption fee, etc. and I just wanted to bring some awareness to this issue. Some of these dogs have been in several homes in their lifetimes and have suffered terrible abuse, and so it is our goal to place them in their forever homes and give them the life they deserve!

Macomom
January 16th, 2010, 07:24 PM
Cassiek,

Sorry, don't mean to be a Debbie Downer. Some rescues limit children under 9, 12 or teenage.
I have read a few quotes that is for legal/insurance purposes.
I am not aware of insurance liabilities with adoption. Maybe someone with more experience could expand on this..

shibamom
January 16th, 2010, 09:06 PM
It's too bad about the kids. We are hoping to adopt a Shiba from a rescue anytime between now and next year, but I'm 6 months pregnant and I think we'll be rejected. I put in the applications anyways. That's too bad if it doesn't work, we have a really good home for one (a Shiba "brother" and I'm a stay at home mom!).

ownedbycats
January 17th, 2010, 07:59 AM
I think my post came out scrambled (it was close to bedtime). I wasn't necessarily criticizing, I sincerely wanted to know what other options would be available if the no fence no dog policy was non-negotiable. Sometimes due to by-laws, or space issues it isn't possible to put up new fences. Thanks for clearing that up :)

Golden Girls
January 17th, 2010, 08:57 AM
From the rescue point of view one of their concerns may be they fear that the dog would end up being tied out back if you don't have a fenced in yard :shrug: Other times it might be because that particular dog is an escape artist or is very fearful especially considering the ordeal they are going through after being dumped, abandonned or surrendered hence the fence rule.

Another scenerio could be that partcular dog was sent to the pound because of an addition in the family and they no longer have the time to care for him/her or a sudden allergy developed or it was said the dog snarled or was aggressive toward their child - so many reasons why dogs are given up so
whatever the reason that dog is their MAIN priority as it should be and it's their responsibility to make sure it's a perfect match as best as they can.

More then not it's probably a case by case sorta thing re fence or children :shrug:

People dont necessary need to go to a pet store or byb if refused, there's enough pounds, shelters & SPCA's they could adopt from.

BrownEyedGirl
January 18th, 2010, 01:57 PM
Thank you so much for what you do! Appreciate your input and thoughts. We were screened before adopting our girl and I didn't give it a second thought, I believe the rescue organizations also want to make sure an animal won't be brought back to the shelter, thus the rigorous screening. I know they came out to see out place before we got to take Izzy home w/us.

cassiek
January 19th, 2010, 12:42 AM
You said it perfectly, Golden_Girls! :thumbs up

And I do personally think sometimes we are very picky, however on the same hand some of these dogs have been through multiple owners before coming to us, so it really is our sole goal to place them in the best homes possible with the limited funds, manpower, and time that we have.

And that's also right that there are TONS of rescues, shelters, SPCA's etc (just look at petfinder!!) so if someone is refused an adoption on a dog or cat because they don't have a fenced in yard, children, etc. and the rescue is not willing to work with you, there are so many groups out there you are sure to have one that will be able to accomodate you and work with your situation!!

buddingartist
January 21st, 2010, 03:13 PM
Very good thread thank you.

Just a few words about breeders. We found our 2 Westies through a breeder whose name had been given to us by a friend of a friend... and came highly recommended.

When I called and enquired about a male, she said she had only one left and would release him when he turned 10 weeks old. When we showed up at her place, we went into shock to say the least.

She wouldn't let us in her house, went and got 2 dogs (male and female) out of a barn and we just about died when we say Buddy (the male). He had severe mange, emaciated, covered in bleeding sores, one of his ear burnt (by the heather in the barn&?%%&&*).

Our girl Cleo was cute as a button but one scared little puppy. It turned out that on our first visit to the vet, she had a hairline hip facture and a heart murmur. We suspect that she may have been sold, abused (probably by a male) and returned because every time hubby came close to her, she would just crouch and pee. It took her 2 months to go to my husband and now she is daddy's little girl and has him wrap around her little paw.

By then, hubby and I are p.....ssed off, emotional and just can't leave those animals behind. The woman asked us $1400 for both which she considered a bargain and which we considered a ransom. We paid the money and got the heck out of there with our new babies. They are now 9 1/2 years, have had a lot of health problems however, have been absolute joys in our lives.

I reported that breeder however, I am sure nothing was done about it as we were informed that we had taken the >last evidence> and that she appeared to be small scale breeder when they had bigger ones to tackle and lack of staff.

So $190. is a real bargain to pay for a furry friend that will love you unconditionally.

Thank God for people like you who work in those rescues. I wouldn't have the heart to watch all those animals suffer and deprived nor the patience to have to deals with idiots who have no respect for animals.

Bless you for the work you do

Golden Girls
January 21st, 2010, 04:35 PM
I can't believe people complain about an adoption fee of $190 :eek: Alot of fundraising hey :angel2: Guess those one's aren't looking to rescue probably just want a lower fee then a pet store and are clueless as to the amount of team work, effort and money it takes to just rescue that one never mind all the others :headslap:

How horrible She wouldn't let us in her house, went and got 2 dogs (male and female) out of a barn and we just about died when we say Buddy (the male). He had severe mange, emaciated, covered in bleeding sores, one of his ear burnt (by the heather in the barn&?%%&&*).
The woman asked us $1400 for both which she considered a bargainTo this byb it was a bargain. She assumed you were going to make money selling off their puppies like she did :sick: world we live in. Thank you for getting these two out of there.

marko
January 21st, 2010, 05:11 PM
Thanks for posting this cassiek:highfive:

I think the reason some people gasp at the price was nailed by chaser.

It's perception, used/secondhand/problem dog = cheap dog. Or dog on death row = free dog.

It's truly sad that dogs are objectified in this way and it's a very difficult problem that requires tactful education to some people that will never listen.
If you can't afford 190.00 dollars for a fixed dog...maybe a dog is not for you.
Long-term you will likely struggle to keep up with the dog's basic needs. The dog's basic needs were NOT taken care of by its previous owner...that's why it's in a shelter/rescue.

Although there are always exceptions, I have no problem with stricter requirements for adopters. These dogs have been returned, often based on the ignorance or laziness/justadog attitude of the former owner. Rescues need to be sure that the potential new owners will be forever owners..
:2cents: - Thx - Marko

14+kitties
January 21st, 2010, 05:19 PM
Just wanted to add it's the same with cats except more so. No one wants to pay even a measly $50 for one. That is what I charge and they get a kitten/cat that has been health checked, needled and s/n. :wall: I am only small scale on my own. I know the rescue I work with in TO charges $175 for the same.

cassiek
January 21st, 2010, 08:28 PM
Buddingartist, thank you so much for saving your two babies... they needed an angel just like you and your hubby to save them from such a terrible situation. Unfortunately, more often than not, these are the conditions far too many dogs are born into. I truly feel the worst for the bitch, while at least the pups usually get to leave after 8 weeks and *hopefully* go into a decent home, the bitch is left in usually horrid conditions to have one litter after another with no regards to her health or welfare. :(

I often think that if these people who truly can not understand what we do and why we feel the way we do, should spend a week with us, having to see the terrible and disgusting abuse these animals endure including not only physical but the psychological aspect as well. Guaranteed they would walk away with a better appreciation for what we do. You can not see these terribly cruel acts these animals endure and what they have been through, and not feel somewhat bitter towards people!! It forces us to be picky about where these pets are placed. We are their voice and their advocate.

As for the $190.00 adoption fee... I don't have time to deal with people who think thats too expensive. That barely, barely covers our cost... they are s/n, vaccinated, health checked and guaranteed, plus we have to cover all the expenses while they remain in our care. Most importantly, you get an animal that will love you unconditionally for life and only asks for you to do the same back. Animals truly are selfless.

When I adopted my girl Brynn I paid not only the $190.00 fee, but also gave them another $110.00 just because. And you raise such a valid point, Marko, if people can not afford a measly $190.00 adoption fee, how will they afford food, vaccines etc. nevermind if their pet needs surgery or serious vet care.

Anyways, I am off to go volunteer. :thumbs up I also want to add as much as we get people who complain and don't understand what we are trying to accomplish, we get many many members of the public who want to save an animals life and truly appreciate what we do! :D

buddingartist
January 22nd, 2010, 01:14 PM
To this byb it was a bargain. She assumed you were going to make money selling off their puppies like she did world we live in. Thank you for getting these two out of there.

Believe it or not, the breeder &?%&&she had us sign documents that we would have spayed and neutered. In addition we have had, on a couple of occasions, people who gave us proper hell for having done what we did telling us that we encouraged this kind of breeder and that they rely on suckers like us to make their money. They do have a point and I understand what they are saying however, we just would not, could not leave them there.


PS: I don't know what byb means however, I have my own word in my mind and it wouldn't pass censore.

Frenchy
January 22nd, 2010, 07:50 PM
PS: I don't know what byb means however, I have my own word in my mind and it wouldn't pass censore.

BYB = back yard breeder. But sounds like your own words might be good too :p

wenchy
January 24th, 2010, 03:06 PM
I'd just like to add a personal experience with rescues.
Last fall we lost our 12 yr old. That dog was my heart and soul. We'd adopted him at 5 from the pound. He was the child we'll never have. We grieve each day.

Months after his passing we thought perhaps we'd like to adopt a large senior ( or two ). We are a financially secure couple in our 30s with very flexible work schedules so a senior with health ailments , blind, deaf etc was completely fine. We live in a condo right beside ( can see it out the window ) a giant dog park and adjacent to that miles long ravine.

We were refused by almost all rescues. Those who did approve us mostly wanted us to take puppies-2/yos. We were asked for everything from employer references ( ridiculous ) to agreeing to 3 week long behaviorial evaluations to never hearing back from a rescue upon approval for a dog. Finally we'd had enough. Better half found a 5 y/o who'd come in as a stray at the pound and today she sleeps like a log on her king sized bed after a 2 hr hike.

On the other side - there is a gorgeous 2 y/o shep at the pound. We have a female also so cannot take her BUT I've been emailing and calling various breed / dog rescues as I am willing to pay the cost of bailing her out ( she'd come spayed with shots etc ) and I get NO reply. ONE rescue was very kind to cross post her elsewhere but that's it.

Apologies for the rant/vent. I respect the dog rescues for their intentions, the kindness and caring but the rescues are missing out on a lot of potentially wonderful homes with their over the top assessments. just my two cents.

Golden Girls
January 26th, 2010, 10:22 AM
Thanks for posting this cassiek:highfive:

I think the reason some people gasp at the price was nailed by chaser.

It's perception, used/secondhand/problem dog = cheap dog. Or dog on death row = free dog.

It's truly sad that dogs are objectified in this way and it's a very difficult problem that requires tactful education to some people that will never listen.
If you can't afford 190.00 dollars for a fixed dog...maybe a dog is not for you.
Long-term you will likely struggle to keep up with the dog's basic needs. The dog's basic needs were NOT taken care of by its previous owner...that's why it's in a shelter/rescue.

Although there are always exceptions, I have no problem with stricter requirements for adopters. These dogs have been returned, often based on the ignorance or laziness/justadog attitude of the former owner. Rescues need to be sure that the potential new owners will be forever owners..
:2cents: - Thx - MarkoRight, risky pets :( Well the people who are truly in it to rescue then they wouldn't have a problem I agree

Melinda
January 26th, 2010, 10:55 AM
I'm glad a lot of rescues bend the rules about a fenced in yard, I tried to foster a dog from a rescue and was refused because I had no fenced yard, my own dog is walked 3 miles daily, outside fetch/training sessions and another walk at night. The dog I wanted to foster went to a home with a fenced in yard alright.....and is never walked on a leash........, why do people figure a fenced yard equals a walk? all new sights, different people/pets to meet, learning proper leash manners etc.

Love4himies
January 26th, 2010, 11:19 AM
I'm glad a lot of rescues bend the rules about a fenced in yard, I tried to foster a dog from a rescue and was refused because I had no fenced yard, my own dog is walked 3 miles daily, outside fetch/training sessions and another walk at night. The dog I wanted to foster went to a home with a fenced in yard alright.....and is never walked on a leash........, why do people figure a fenced yard equals a walk? all new sights, different people/pets to meet, learning proper leash manners etc.

Thank you for posting that.

I just don't think a fenced in yard = a good owner and should not be a consideration when a rescue is reading an adoption application. What is more important, IMO, is that an owner is scrutinized more if the dog does have a "running" issue, such as previous experience with harder to handle dogs, attitude on obedience classes, etc.

Whether a rescue adopts out when there are small children in the home should depend upon the owner's experience and the dog itself, not a blanket rule.

luckypenny
January 27th, 2010, 06:42 AM
...why do people figure a fenced yard equals a walk? all new sights, different people/pets to meet, learning proper leash manners etc.

You're absolutely right. This is exactly why adoption decisions should really be made on a case by case basis.

Just to give you an idea as to our latest experience...out of the three foster puppies we have, one is going to a couple in an apartment (who are also planning children in the next few years), one to a family with children between 7-17 years and a thoroughly fenced in yard, and one to a couple in a house with no fenced in yard. We made our decisions not by where the puppies would live, but by how they would live.

Golden Girls
January 27th, 2010, 10:53 AM
You're absolutely right. This is exactly why adoption decisions should really be made on a case by case basis.

Just to give you an idea as to our latest experience...out of the three foster puppies we have, one is going to a couple in an apartment (who are also planning children in the next few years), one to a family with children between 7-17 years and a thoroughly fenced in yard, and one to a couple in a house with no fenced in yard. We made our decisions not by where the puppies would live, but by how they would live.Awesome LP, wtg!

We had an adoptor who drove down from Toronto on Sunday, met a match but only had a partial fence, together with the rescue it was agreed this high energy dog needed a fenced in not in exchange of walks but to be able to run off energy inbetween the outtings so what did this couple do - they offered to go built it and is coming back on Saturday to adopt, so great :highfive:

Wendy I'm sorry for your loss :( and your experiences with rescues. Did any of them give you a reason for not adopting to you? It's wonderful you didn't give up and rescued another in need from the pound, she sounds like she's living like a queen :thumbs up

Any updates on the two yr old GSD you were willing to pull and surrender to a rescue?

Golden Girls
January 27th, 2010, 11:06 AM
my own dog is walked 3 miles daily, outside fetch/training sessions and another walk at nightBeing the reason Brina is so content, happy and socialled :) Why do you think I brought Sushi on my last visit I knew he'd LUV Brina and vice versa not to mention he'd live an awesome doggie life, full of kids to play with too - sure you can't hide him in your pocket during daycare hours :cloud9: he only bites & growls at other dominant males :p tooo cute :cloud9:

babymomma
January 27th, 2010, 05:06 PM
I for one hate the no fence, no dog rule.. I dont have a fence and we do pretty darn good. I also have a dog that has a very high prey drive put has stopped mid-chase of a rabbit because i said "stay"..
Would I let a dog offleash that I didnt trust? Heck NO. I wouldnt let a dog i didnt trust off leash in a fenced in area either. Dogs find ways to escape fences way too often for my liking. Personally, I would never let my dog outside unsupervised anyways. Fence or no fence.

EVERY single GSD rescue ive been in contact with will NOT even discuss making an exception for the no fence rule. The only exceptions are for dogs with disabilities that leave them unable to walk or something like that or an elderly dog without much energy.
And I want to have a dog that can run next to me on bike or on roller blades and go on long hikes. A senior just wouldnt suit my lifestyle.. I would LOVE to rescue my GSD.. But righ now that seems impossible. So Ive been researching reputable breeders for when the time comes.

BenMax
January 27th, 2010, 05:18 PM
But righ now that seems impossible. So Ive been researching reputable breeders for when the time comes.

That really is too bad BabyMomma. Personally, I understand their request but I don't think it should be a 100% requirement. I think (just my thoughts of course) is that there should be an exception at times. I think that looking at the potential adopters on a one to one basis is more practical but again very time consuming perhaps.

I have a GSD foster who was an outdoor boy. I live in a 850 sq ft condo with 1 other foster little dog, Julia my min pin, and 6 cats. Are they suffering - absolutely not. Also - my GSD boy gets alot of walks, socialization and manners on leash. He is not allowed to roam free and I am with him and supervising everything. He is always safe, never left outside alone, tied up or otherwise. He is as happy as he can possibly get - and we both go for our exercise together. That's my take on this subject matter.

Macomom
January 27th, 2010, 05:28 PM
On the same note, I wanted to volunteer with a Mastiff rescue group. I was just about to start the online process when I saw...
No placement of Mastiffs with unknown histories in families with children under 12.
In rescue, how many times do you really know the history of the animal?

Back to my old gripe folks, sorry to subject you to it. I am trying to help out, but sometimes it is like :wall:.

I guess when my children become 12 they will magically morph into something I am not aware of. (If anyone has children over 12, can you share with me what is going to happen. I don't want to be caught off guard :laughing:)

babymomma
January 27th, 2010, 05:35 PM
I know benmax, It sucks.

Of course I still have alot of time and im still looking into rescues but when the time comes I dunno what I'll do if i cant find one.

I do sometimes feel that some people in rescue can be a little closed minded (I cant think of one particular experience that still makes me angry).. Of course I do also understand they have there reasons. But i feel alot more dogs would get good homes if they would be a LITTLE more openminded about some things.

I remember applying for a GSDxLab and getting turned down because A. we didnt have a fence and B. We didnt want a untrained , hyper active Animal that we did not know having full run of our house when we werent home. :eek:
The lady was appauled at the idea of a Crate..

BenMax
January 27th, 2010, 05:53 PM
On the same note, I wanted to volunteer with a Mastiff rescue group. I was just about to start the online process when I saw...
No placement of Mastiffs with unknown histories in families with children under 12.
In rescue, how many times do you really know the history of the animal?

Back to my old gripe folks, sorry to subject you to it. I am trying to help out, but sometimes it is like :wall:.

I guess when my children become 12 they will magically morph into something I am not aware of. (If anyone has children over 12, can you share with me what is going to happen. I don't want to be caught off guard :laughing:)

I can see and relate to your frustrations. What I can tell you however is not to take it personally. Rescues who deal with foster homes are really at their mercy. Many times they can interview very well and then they find out later that infact they are not as they appear. Foster homes can be very high maintenance.

Also - they try to avoid setting a dog up for failure. Dogs that have no history should never be put into homes with small/young children (in my opinion). Depending on the temperment and an evaluation done- they may or may not be put into fosters with other dogs. Cats - well I prefer not to be honest unless cat tested prior. Don't forget that owner surrender dogs that lived with cats does not necessarily mean that they are good with cats. They may be with 'their' cats, but not cats that they are unfamiliar with. Personally, I would be horrified if any of the dogs put into fosters killed their beloved cat. It recently happened to another rescue and they were devastated.

Also - don't forget the fact that rescues can be held liable. If the dog turns on someone - who do you think will be blamed? The finger will point to the rescue.

cassiek
January 30th, 2010, 02:45 AM
It certainly is frustrating to hear that rescues are missing out on potentially wonderful homes to place these animals in and I would strongly encourage anyone who finds they do run into these obstacles (i.e. rescues that don't allow dogs to go to children under 12, demand a fenced in yard etc), to keep looking! I know in my own itty bitty town of Lethbridge there are TONS of rescues, SPCA's etc. within a few hours drive - surely there is one you can find that is willng to work with you and your family! :thumbs up

If not, the next best option is to look for a reputable breeder. Of course, I'd love to see everyone adopt an animal that needs a home, but I believe a reputable breeder is the next best option. Again, you need to do your research and remember the breeder should not only be questioning you, but you questioning them i.e. how often the bitch is bred, what their interests are in the breed, do they have multiple breeds on their property that are bred, what genetic testing they have done etc. etc. etc. (this is a HUGE list). I actually have zero problems with ethical, reputable breeders granted that they ARE in fact reputable and really do have the breed's best interest at heart.

I don't necessarily agree with all the "rules" some rescues have, and think it should be on a case by case basis. Unfortunately, most of these rescues are run solely by volunteers and time, funding, labour, and rescources are usually limited at best. I find most of the "rules" defaintly do NOT ensure a responsbile owner, however rescues are doing the best with the resources they have. And unfortunately, a rescue is like every other type of organization out there... some are better than others! Some are more willing to work with families, they all have different rules in place, some are run with different goals (i.e. a SPCA and a humane society have different "roles" in the community - although of course their end goal *should be* to save as many animals as possible). I can only speak for rescues I have worked with, and they have all been very accomodating, but I can't speak for all of them... and unfortunately there are some groups out there that maybe don't do things in the best interests of the animals. I think its also really important to interview a rescue/shelter/SPCA etc. before YOU adopt an animal from them... I know being from the other side, I enjoy when people question US and ask us what their adoption fee goes to, what our goals and achievements are etc. any rescue should be willing to answer your questions!

Remember... we see some very horrific cases on a day by day basis sometimes. :cry: Often times, we are these animals last hope and last chance at a wonderful life. I have witnessed some terribly cruel and truly disgusting acts on animals. I would be lying if I said I didn't ever wish the same cruelty back on the person who inflicted it on the animal. :frustrated: While of course we want to see the animal become adopted, what we witness daily tends to harden us up and sometimes we may come across as being uncooperative. :sorry: Don't take it personally, and please don't let it sour your opinion of all rescues :) Sometimes you may have to go the extra mile to convince a rescue that YOU are the FOREVER home for a particular animal, but I guarantee you its worth it... and it's sometimes all a rescue needs to see before approving an adoption!

Case in point - a very good friend of mine REALLY wanted to adopt a dog from the rescue I volunteer with. They generally insist on having a fenced in yard. Her and her hubby had just moved into their home a few months prior, and realistically knew that it would be at least another year before a fence could be built. She talked in person with the woman here who coordinates dog adoptions and they came to an agreement. My friend assured her the dog would be adequately walked and exercise, and they agreed to put up a dog run for the pooch as somewhere for her to relieve herself in a secure area. Adoption = APPROVED! They may have refused the adoption based solely on just what was wrote in the application (actually they probably would have called the interested couple to see if they could come to some sort of agreement) but my friend laid out her case and it was no problem!

Kay9
January 30th, 2010, 03:00 AM
I have no dispute with whatever costs are associated with adopting rescue pets. I say amen to those who are so selfless that they make a loving home for little fur people. :lovestruck:

However, I must say that folks should distinguish between those who abuse animals and those who surrender animals for reasons that may or may not make sense to all of us. It's hardly fair to lump them in the same category, now is it?

cassiek
February 1st, 2010, 02:19 AM
Yes, we receive animals into our care under many different circumstances and situations, however in my opinion they are all usually cruel in some way or another. Some animals receive physical abuse - they are left on the streets to die, are malnourished, forced to have litter after litter, etc. and other ones come to our care and have suffered terrible psychological abuse - they have been neglected because the family had a baby and has no time, the dog "got too big" and is never exercised, etc. etc. 99.99% of the time the animals are brought into our care for reasons that have nothing to do with the animal itself, and everything to do with the owner's irresponsibility, so in that respect I put most people in the same category - irresponsible pet owners. And to be honest, the reasons never make sense, the reasons we are given for giving up a dog are usually bull****. And it is true we do get the odd dog or cat that comes into our care and the owner really is being responsible and the circumstances are different, but usually its the same ol story. Unfortunately, thats the sad reality.

Jenkinsdjtg
February 1st, 2010, 02:49 AM
ignorant people...

Jenkinsdjtg
February 1st, 2010, 03:21 AM
i need to stop writing 2 word replies..

:frustrated:

Frenchy
February 1st, 2010, 07:55 PM
the reasons we are given for giving up a dog are usually bull****. And it is true we do get the odd dog or cat that comes into our care and the owner really is being responsible and the circumstances are different, but usually its the same ol story. Unfortunately, thats the sad reality.

I totally agree with you cassiek.

Frenchy
February 1st, 2010, 07:56 PM
Also - don't forget the fact that rescues can be held liable. If the dog turns on someone - who do you think will be blamed? The finger will point to the rescue.

Ditto BenMax

rescues are being blame enough as it is .....

Kay9
February 1st, 2010, 07:59 PM
I think those of you who are closely involved in animal rescues are heroes, really. I don't know how you do it. It must be so hard, emotionally.

It really helps to hear things from your point of view.

cassiek
February 2nd, 2010, 01:33 AM
On the plus side, the number of animals being PTS has been decreasing since the 90's and I do believe that more and more awareness is being brought to the terrible reality of this situation. Every day, more and more people are looking to adopt a animal and save a life and that in itself is truly heroic! :thumbs up

we3beagles
February 15th, 2010, 02:15 AM
On the same note, I wanted to volunteer with a Mastiff rescue group. I was just about to start the online process when I saw...
No placement of Mastiffs with unknown histories in families with children under 12.
In rescue, how many times do you really know the history of the animal?

Back to my old gripe folks, sorry to subject you to it. I am trying to help out, but sometimes it is like :wall:.

I guess when my children become 12 they will magically morph into something I am not aware of. (If anyone has children over 12, can you share with me what is going to happen. I don't want to be caught off guard :laughing:)


Try to place yourself in the shoes of the rescue. No parent can constantly supervise dog and child and neither can be trusted 100% together. Imagine a child walking around with a cracker in their hand and the dog jumping up to get said cracker. The kid cries and the parent takes the dog to be put down for attacking their kid or puts them in a crate for most of the day. It has happened more than a few times and hence the policy. We will not adopt to houses where the children are toddlers.

I would never eliminate an adoptive home on the no fence rule. People who live in apartments can be the most wonderful, attentive dog owners you ever meet and it would be a real shame to reject the best home for the dog on the grounds that they can't run around outside. We have dog parks and loads of paths to walk. I just make damn good and sure that the potential guardian realizes the level of commitment they are taking on with having to take the dog outside 4 or more times a day (depends on the dog of course)for a pee and walks besides. I have adopted to some really wonderful homes that had no yard or fence.