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SCM,Growler,Rocky test-results..

chico2
July 14th, 2009, 01:52 PM
Rocky spent a couple of hours at the vet yesterday,had a thourough exam and tests.
I was worried about his eyes,but no problem with his eyes.:thumbs up
Kidneys are fine,teeth are fine.:thumbs up
However his liver-count is elevated,their normal acceptable high is 55 and Rocky was at 88.
His thyroid was also high,could be because I gave him his pill an hour before he was tested,but we don't know.
The vet suggested another 1/2 pill in the middle of the day and have him retested in 3 months,if his thyroid-count is good,his liver will be fine,I was told:confused:

Next problem,Rockys constant diarreha(sp?),vet suggested the Hills canned food,but Rocky does not eat it...so that's a no.
Is there anything other than the Slippery Elm or Baby squash,that has fiber in it for Rocky,any food other than Hill's.????
I would really appreciate some ideas:cat:
He is now on Wellness canned..
PS,he could have irritable bowel-syndrome...

sugarcatmom
July 14th, 2009, 04:48 PM
To help out the liver, I'm wondering if supplementing with some SAMe and/or milk thistle (silybin) might be a good idea. Nutramax labs (http://nutramaxanimalhealth.com/Products/liver-health-pet-supplements.aspx) makes a few products that you can ask your vet about if the liver enzymes remain elevated.

As for the ongoing poop issue, you could try adding the smallest pinch (not more than an 1/8th to 1/4 of a tsp) of psyllium husk to his wet food, along with an extra couple tsps of water. If that doesn't work after 2 days, I don't think lack of fiber is the issue and I would discontinue it. Sometimes fiber can actually further irritate an already irritated bowel, so you do have to be cautious. In those cases, a simple, single (maybe even novel) protein, plant-free raw diet can be hugely beneficial, but I know that might not be so easy to implement. I wish I had more answers for you. Have you tried probiotics or digestive enzymes before?

growler~GateKeeper
July 14th, 2009, 11:38 PM
However his liver-count is elevated,their normal acceptable high is 55 and Rocky was at 88.
His thyroid was also high,could be because I gave him his pill an hour before he was tested,but we don't know.
The vet suggested another 1/2 pill in the middle of the day and have him retested in 3 months,if his thyroid-count is good,his liver will be fine,I was told:confused:

As per http://drlouisemurray.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=37&Itemid=29

The excessive thyroid hormone produced by the adenoma is harmful to the cat, causing an increased metabolism and health problems such as weight loss, heart damage, high blood pressure, anxiety, kidney damage, and elevated liver enzymes.

methimazole can cause low white blood cells, anemia (low red blood cells), low platelet cells (the cells that help the blood to clot), or elevated liver enzymes.

Both the high T4 count and the use of Tapazole can cause an elevation in the Liver enzymes in some cats, but if that was elevated as a result of the meds given 1 hr prior to testing then when he is retested and the meds not given directly prior if the T4 is lower, the liver enzymes will be lower.

Did Rocky have the diarreah before switching to Wellness? or did it start when he started the Tapazole? Vomiting is a common side effect of tapazole but diarreah isn't mentioned anywhere, though it is possible :shrug:

hazelrunpack
July 15th, 2009, 04:46 AM
Just wanted to send some :goodvibes: for Rocky and a :grouphug: for you, chico. I hope he's better soon!

chico2
July 15th, 2009, 07:17 AM
Thank's for your reply,Rocky is not doing great,physically he seems fine,but there were some strange happenings in the litter-boxes from over night.
Watery vomit on the floor,with grainy remnants of food.

To be honest,I don't remember when the runny poop started,probably about 1 yr ago,the vet knows about it,it could be from the Wellness:confused:
This morning I added SEB,to his food and he would not eat it,just like before.
I opened another can of Wellness and he ate.
Maybe I should look in to another type of food,it is definitely worth a try,Pet-Connection here in Oakville sells only hollistic foods...any suggestions??

I should mention,he also had his 3 yr Rabies shot,I told the vet I don't want Rocky to have any other shots,probably for the rest of his life,since he's had all the shots every year his whole life,the vet was ok with that.

I know usually,the tests should be done about 6 hours after medication,not less than an hour like I did:yell:
I now spread out the meds,I pill 6:30am,1/2 pill 12:30pm and 1 at 6:pm.
I will not wait 3 months until he's retested,but like to try a different food first.
He is not lethargic,seems his regular self,he just finished all his food(without Slippery Elm)hopefully he'll keep it down:pray:
He has always been drinking a lot of water,maybe a little extra right now,he is not Diabetic.

ancientgirl
July 15th, 2009, 07:33 AM
Chico, have you tried Innova EVO? My gang are currently on that. They eat the cat & kitten formula, which has chicken and turkey, and tomorrow I am supposed to pick up a case of the venison I ordered, to see if they like it.

Maybe a change in food will help Rocky:shrug:

I've also been looking into Instinct Plus. According to the information on their website, all you need to do is just add fresh raw meat. I don't know if that would be of help.

chico2
July 15th, 2009, 07:38 AM
My regular store(Rens Pet-Depot)does not sell Innova EVO,but I am sure the other store does,I will pick some up tomorrow.
None of my guys will eat anything raw:yell:
Thank's AG.
I never connected Rockys runny poop with the Wellness,the other cats are doing fine on it,I always thought it was because of the Tapazole.???

ancientgirl
July 15th, 2009, 07:47 AM
Yeah, I can only find Innova in either a higher end pet food store or one here that sells more holistic foods. I actually get it from them cheaper than the Wellness sells for at Petco.

If you have a look at the instinct site, even though they recommend the meat be raw, they do state that you can try cooking the food as well and then gradually cook it less and less. :shrug: I'm considering this, but I think the cost of the raw meat might be over my budget at the moment. But, it's an option I'm considering when my finances improve a bit.

chico2
July 15th, 2009, 07:55 AM
AG,I have a store up the street that sells everything hollistic for Pets,hopefully EVO comes in pate-type,they do not eat chunks or slices.

ancientgirl
July 15th, 2009, 08:01 AM
AG,I have a store up the street that sells everything hollistic for Pets,hopefully EVO comes in pate-type,they do not eat chunks or slices.

Yes, it is pate type. I've tried so far 3 flavors on my gang. Beef, which they so-so liked. The regular turkey and chicken, (which seems less firm than the cat and kitten chicken turkey that they currently eat), which they did not like. I think it might have been the texture. I am going to see if they like the venison, and that I'll be getting tomorrow. I assume that is also pate type.

Love4himies
July 15th, 2009, 08:12 AM
Yeah, I can only find Innova in either a higher end pet food store or one here that sells more holistic foods. I actually get it from them cheaper than the Wellness sells for at Petco.

If you have a look at the instinct site, even though they recommend the meat be raw, they do state that you can try cooking the food as well and then gradually cook it less and less. :shrug: I'm considering this, but I think the cost of the raw meat might be over my budget at the moment. But, it's an option I'm considering when my finances improve a bit.

Actually you may be surprised, feeding raw (homemade mind you) is much, much cheaper than Wellness or Instinct - .50 per 5.5 oz versus 2.39-2.69 per can of Instinct.

ancientgirl
July 15th, 2009, 08:35 AM
Actually you may be surprised, feeding raw (homemade mind you) is much, much cheaper than Wellness or Instinct - .50 per 5.5 oz versus 2.39-2.69 per can of Instinct.

L4H, sorry for the confusion. I was talking about this: Instincts cat food- feline future (http://www.felinefuture.com/?page_id=26) It has everything already in it, you mix it and just add the meat. I just don't feel comfortable trying to add the right kind of organ meat at the proper amount. I'd be too afraid I was doing it wrong. This product has it all done for you.

chico2
July 15th, 2009, 03:23 PM
Seeing i have a supply of Wellness,I 'll just buy small cans for Rocky,if it comes in small cans, and keep feeding Chico and Vinnie Wellness.
Today Rocky was fine,spent several hours with us outside,he sleeps a little,plays with Vinne,watches for the birds at the feeders.
But I am sure,by tomorrow morning,the boxes will have several piles of runny poop again:sad:

ancientgirl
July 15th, 2009, 05:45 PM
I've only seen the EVO in the large and the 5 oz. I know however, they do have the small cans in the regular Innova. But I don't think those are grain free.

sugarcatmom
July 15th, 2009, 07:44 PM
This morning I added SEB,to his food and he would not eat it,just like before.


How much SEB are you adding? I would start with no more than 1/8th of a tsp or 1/8th of a capsule, and mix it well into something Rocky really likes. My guy goes nuts for plain chicken baby food, and because it's pretty stinky he doesn't usually smell whatever supplements I add (or else he just doesn't care because he loves the baby food so much). If you can do that 2-4 times a day, the SEB might still be helpful. You might be able to gradually increase the SEB to 1/4 tsp 4x/day, but I wouldn't give Rocky more than that.

Winston
July 15th, 2009, 09:01 PM
Chico have you ever tried Dick Van Pattens NAtural Balance Cat food? You can get it at Ryans and I think pet valu but pretty sure most places carry it. Anyway I dont know if yourecall the trouble I had introducing the wet food with Tabitha but I tried this brand and for the longest time she would only eat the venison and green pea....it is the pate type and the only type she will even consider giving a sniff too! Now she is eating about 4 of the different flavors and liking it!

My point was that she had really runny and terrible poops and now they are formed and much harder than ever before...and I really think it is because of the wet food change! They had kibble and only kibble for 11 yrs?? I didnt know any different?? :sad:

Maybe try a can next time you go out?

http://www.naturalbalanceinc.com/catformulas/NB_CatCanned.html

Good Luck!

growler~GateKeeper
July 15th, 2009, 09:17 PM
To be honest,I don't remember when the runny poop started,probably about 1 yr ago,the vet knows about it,it could be from the Wellness:confused:

I never connected Rockys runny poop with the Wellness,the other cats are doing fine on it,I always thought it was because of the Tapazole.???

It is possible the diarreah is from the Tapazole but I'm also thinking the Wellness might be a little too rich for Rocky :shrug:, if you do switch his food & he still has diarreah then you know it's from the Tapazole and not the food. I would start with the Nature's Variety Instinct line.

chico2
July 16th, 2009, 07:16 AM
Wow,thank you everyone,those are so many choices:confused:
I was happy when I switched them from Fancy Feast to Wellness and they ate it,back to square one:cat:

SCM,I gave Rocky probably more than 1/2 capsule,no wonder he did not like his food.:mad:
I will buy some different cans of food for him(as suggested here),see if there is any improvement,if not I'll try the baby-food and the SEB,in small amounts over the course of the day.

Today,there was no Diarreah in the boxes,on the day of his vet-visit and yesterday morning,it just squirted out of him:sad:worse than normal.
I am sure he still has it,just not as violent as those 2 days.

He is very,very upset at the vet,but this time he took blood out of his leg and kept the 3 in-house cats away from him,as I asked,so it went ok.
The only other needle he got was his Rabies-shot..

My vet says it's probably not the Tapazole,but in my Cat-Book,it says it can be one of the side-effects.:confused:

I'm so glad I have this Forum,hopefully you do not get fed up with my problems with Rocky:pawprint:

ancientgirl
July 16th, 2009, 07:49 AM
I'm so glad I have this Forum,hopefully you do not get fed up with my problems with Rocky:pawprint:

Aww, Chico, I love Rocky as if he was my own. I'm sure everyone else does too.

I hope you can get this straightened out. :pray:

growler~GateKeeper
July 17th, 2009, 01:49 AM
Wow,thank you everyone,those are so many choices:confused:

Personally I would start with Nature's Variety Instinct instead of EVO simply because the EVO has a higher in fat and protein content than both Wellness & NV and the higher fat/protein content may contribute to poop related issues if the cat trouble with the richer foods.

chico2
July 17th, 2009, 07:35 AM
Growler,we are going shopping today and I'll try the Pet-Connection store,they sell everything,except junk.

Rocky is doing much better,but I still have to deal with his poop,he's no more running to the box as soon as he eats,no more vomit,but his poop is still very loose.
Could it have been the Rabies-shot or the long vet-visit that made him ill??

This morning,he finished off everyones dishes,without having to run to the bathroom.:thumbs up
What I would not give for nice firm poop:cat:
I'll let you know what happens with the new food,I'll keep Chico and Vinnie on the Wellness I have left.
Thank's AG,Growler,SCM and Winston!!

ancientgirl
July 17th, 2009, 07:37 AM
Chico, maybe it was the shot, and the stress of the vet visit.

chico2
July 17th, 2009, 07:48 AM
Maybe:shrug:
He howls all the way there,his heartbeat is always way out of whack,he is just terrified every vet-visit and this visit was almost 2 hours,with a complete check-up,bloodtests etc..
But his year-long runs has to be dealt with,hopefully the new food will do the trick,he needs fiber..wish he like yogurt:cat:

Love4himies
July 17th, 2009, 08:37 AM
Chico: The SEB works wonderfully on Jasper when he gets his now rare bouts of diarrhea. I put about 1/4 capsule (he is almost 13lbs) in his food it clears it up within the day.

Love4himies
July 17th, 2009, 08:37 AM
Maybe:shrug:
He howls all the way there,his heartbeat is always way out of whack,he is just terrified every vet-visit and this visit was almost 2 hours,with a complete check-up,bloodtests etc..
But his year-long runs has to be dealt with,hopefully the new food will do the trick,he needs fiber..wish he like yogurt:cat:

Awwww, the poor boy :sad: :cry: :grouphug:

14+kitties
July 17th, 2009, 08:52 AM
I hope Rocky continues to improve. Good luck on the food switch. My guys hated the Natural Balance. I need to find a new one too. It's not easy.
:grouphug: to you and Rocky.

chico2
July 17th, 2009, 09:24 AM
L4H,maybe it's worth another try with the SEB,I put too much in his food almost a full capsule:frustrated:What I have is Natures Way 370mg capsules.

I usually worry days before he goes to the vet,I hate to see him that scared:sad:

14+,I'll try the Natures Variety Instinct first...I think I at one time already tried the Natural Balance.

luvsmallfurries
July 18th, 2009, 09:55 AM
I'm so glad I have this Forum,hopefully you do not get fed up with my problems with Rocky:pawprint:

chico2; I can't imagine anyone getting fed up.........I personally have learned more from following some of the threads about feeding, specific symptoms of common problems.......than I ever learned from the vets.

Hoping you and Rocky get this all sorted eventually :thumbs up

ancientgirl
July 18th, 2009, 10:54 AM
L4H,maybe it's worth another try with the SEB,I put too much in his food almost a full capsule:frustrated:What I have is Natures Way 370mg capsules.

I usually worry days before he goes to the vet,I hate to see him that scared:sad:

14+,I'll try the Natures Variety Instinct first...I think I at one time already tried the Natural Balance.

Chico, I don't know how you feel about this, but maybe you can talk to the vet about giving you something to calm Rocky down before you take him in.:shrug: My vet prescribed 5mg of Xanax for me to give Vlad before I brought him in. The last time I took him in, I gave him the tiniest bit, less than she prescribed, about half an hour before the appointment. He was still pissed, but he was not as stressed as he usually gets and was much calmer during the exam.

rainbow
July 18th, 2009, 12:53 PM
I have no advice to offer (the experts have already given lots) but just wanted to send lots of good wishes for Rocky :fingerscr :goodvibes: as well as some hugs for you. :grouphug:

chico2
July 18th, 2009, 03:22 PM
Awww,thank you,Rocky is actually doing much better,last night he had semi-soft poop,not at all like after the vet-visit.

I've been giving him a very small amount of SEB in his food,maybe it's working:confused:
I did not have a chance to get to the Pet Connection for the Natures Variety Instinct,but will tomorrow.

Ag,a friend of mine also had to give her cat a calming med before going to the vet,but my vet does not want me to drug him before tests.

rainbow
July 18th, 2009, 03:36 PM
Glad to hear that Rocky is improving. :highfive:

It probably is the SEB that is working and I would continue to use it until his poops are good. Give the poor boy some cuddles from me :grouphug: and hope he is back to normal soon. :fingerscr :goodvibes:

chico2
July 18th, 2009, 03:41 PM
Rainbow,thank's,he never really was sickly,but the runny poop always worried me..:sad:
Today,all 3 cats were outside with us from 9am(hubby took them out)until 3 pm,so now they are all 3 completely pooped.
I will continue with the SEB,a little bit with every meal.

rainbow
July 18th, 2009, 04:01 PM
Outside for six hours .....they must be pooped with all that fresh air and checking out your gardens. :cloud9:

Hope we're getting pics. :goodvibes:

Love4himies
July 18th, 2009, 04:57 PM
Glad to hear he is doing better, I know SEB is a Godsend for Jasper and his "episodes".

chico2
July 19th, 2009, 07:42 AM
L4H,I hope I am not jinxing it,but I have not seen any runny poop in the boxes,could it be working:confused::confused::pray::fingerscr
It would be great if I did not have to change from his Wellness,he really loves it..but since he's had runny poop for such a long time,it's probably only ok when I give him SEB,the problem only masked,so I'll have to wait and see.

Rainbow,I have posted soooo many pics with my boys outside,I don't post much anymore,they would just be more of the same,but I'll try to get some different ones today.

luvsmallfurries
July 23rd, 2009, 11:59 AM
chico;

I just remembered something that might help with Rocky and the SEB. My Himalayan, Yeti, gets SEB regularly since he gets bunged up pretty badly.....I started him on some capsules I found and he HATED it.....I don't blame him, the powder was pretty bitter. :yuck:

I was in a health food store/natural supplement joint several weeks ago chatting with the cat lover behind the counter and she suggested some fresh ground SEB instead. They were selling it in small heat sealed plastic pouches, about a 1/2 cup or so, I think it was all of $7. Yeti went for that like it was catnip. It's sweeter, has a bit of a cinnamon/nutmeg scent and taste to it - sort of like the tins of pumpkin pie spice mixes, and it's much easier to control how much he gets; no more trying to pry the capsule open......

He particularly likes it in the canned pumpkin I give him every so often.....

Might be worth a shot if Rocky is not liking the SEB you're giving him now ;)

chico2
July 23rd, 2009, 03:44 PM
LSF,thank you,I'll look in to it,so far he is doing pretty good,when I just put in very little of the SEB in his food.
If the ground SEB works just as good,I'll certainly try it:cat:
I was surprised my vet had no idea what I was talking about when I mentioned SEB.:shrug:

sugarcatmom
July 23rd, 2009, 04:33 PM
I was surprised my vet had no idea what I was talking about when I mentioned SEB.:shrug:

I would have been more surprised if he had, actually. Most vets, unless they practice holistic medicine or have a keen interest in natural remedies, aren't going to be too familiar with non-pharmaceutical options. Similar to the info they get on nutrition coming from pet food companies, most of their treatment choices are influenced by Big Pharmacy. Of course, the same can be said for human medicine. :rolleyes: