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separation anxiety

Little Leah
June 23rd, 2009, 10:15 PM
I try putting in my dog at night last night, and a few nights before. I even left her at my parents place. My dad didn't listen to any reason whatsoever so I decided to take her back here in my apartment. She seems to be very happy, but she does not want to admit defeat it seems. She is a pug mix. She seems to actually enjoy the crate but she doesn't enjoy being away from me. I left her in there while I was away in the living room, still after half an hour she is whining her eyes out and it sounded also like a monkey screeching. Everything else she is sooooooooooooooooooooooo well behaved in, but this one thing it worries me a bit. My friend beforehand had stuffed her in her jacket EVERYWHERE she went, and then me not knowing took her off her hands and now I got a pup who can't stop whining because she wants to be around me. This will grow to be a huge issue as I am going back into college in the winter or fall depending on the program I am entering. I don't want ot have to worry if she is terrorizing the place or scratching on doors and causing a huge ruckus. Sorry for the long letter just thought I should explain my situation in a bit more detail.
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EndOfFashion
June 23rd, 2009, 10:55 PM
How old is the Pug mix? What is it mixed with? Pugs are notorious for being "velcro dogs" - they are very attached to their people and want to be with them all the time. It doesn't help that your friend used to take it with her everywhere.

What we learned with our Pug is that you basically can't give in. He would cry and whine whenever left alone, but of course we had to go to work so after a few weeks he learned it did no good and now he's fine. If you Google separation anxiety, you can find a lot of good tips - like DO NOT make a big deal of leaving the house or coming back home. In fact, it's good practice to ignore your dog for about 10 mins before leaving and 10 mins after coming home. He will stress about you being away if you make it seem like a big event. Our vet actually had a lot of information about separation anxiety (she even had an information package with some tips) so it's definitely worth asking your vet about it.

Anyway, your dog may not have full-blown separation anxiety. We were sure Milo had it, but other indicators include eliminating in the house when left alone, being destructive (or even self-destructive) when left alone, etc. Does your dog exhibit any of these behaviours when you leave, or does it just cry?

Little Leah
June 24th, 2009, 06:19 AM
No, all she does is just kinda dig away at her pillow up front and whine non stop. Last night I admitted defeat as I wanted to get some sleep >.<. She just wants to be around people as all. I don't think it's full blown, but at the same time it may be. I never dealt with a dog with separation anxiety this bad before. My dog beforehand had it slightly, but he was ok after a week. She's 6 months right now. I was using the method of leaving a clock ticking in front of her face, she seemed to want to sleep as she was yawning. I also tried being as relaxed as possible, but at the same time it was 1 in the morning and I was almost at wits end. As much as I may love this dog, I just can't decide on what to do now. She was ok at my parents place, only probably because they let her have free reign, when I said to them leave her alone in her crate to cry it out. She cries non stop, how she can I don't know. I am thinking of when I go next to my vet of asking what to do, what she thinks is best.
Thanks for the ideas.

EndOfFashion
June 24th, 2009, 08:48 AM
It doesn't sound like full-blown SA - our Milo was exactly the same. He was also 6 months when we got him, and he also came from a friend. He would literally scream when left in his crate, we were sure he had separation anxiety. But we learned that many puppies that have never been crated will cry like that when put in their crate - in most cases it's normal. We almost gave up, because we didn't want the other tenants to complain - he was REALLY loud.

Pugs are notoriously difficult to crate train. We gave up trying to crate train him; instead, we potty trained him by keeping him confined to the kitchen. He would still whine at the baby gate but it wasn't as bad. Could you try that? The other thing that really seemed to help was - when he was reliably housebroken - letting him have almost free rein of the apartment. That way he had the company of our cat. I'm not recommending that you get another pet right now - exhaust all other options first - but I'm just saying that in my experience, having our cat around comforted Milo.

Forgot to ask - are you using a wire crate or a plastic kennel crate? Sometimes dogs feel more comfortable in the plastic ones because they feel more den-like.

Little Leah
June 24th, 2009, 09:15 AM
Were using a wire crate, I was thinking it might be too big for her. As I said she is good in every other area except being left alone. Potty training isn't too hard for her, it's the fact we leave her alone.

EndOfFashion
June 24th, 2009, 09:31 AM
Can I ask why you're crating her? If she's housebroken, could you confine her to a room (like the kitchen) instead? I realize that she'll probably still cry when you're gone (Milo would cry if he was kept in the kitchen and we were in the next room!), but I found he would calm down quicker if he wasn't crated...

All I can say is - perseverance. If you're using a wire crate, maybe try draping a towel or blanket over it so it feels more enclosed. But just remember, every time you give in and comfort her or let her out of her crate when she's crying, you're reinforcing her behaviour - and it will be that much harder to deal with in the future. :eek:

BTW, did you get her used to her crate before shutting her in it? Would she go in it willingly if the door was left open? It might help to get her to really like her crate - with the door open - before crating her. i.e. give her really special treats in the crate, create positive associations...

Also - have you posted any pics yet? I would love to see photos of your little Pug mix! (I'm a sucker for Pugs).

Little Leah
June 24th, 2009, 09:49 AM
Yeah I tried doing that, I left it closed but unlatched for a few minutes and comforted her. I am trying the leaving method. I just left her in her crate for the 10 minute trial. I do have pictures I just have to upload them, the uploader seems to be taking a while.

EndOfFashion
June 24th, 2009, 09:56 AM
Is she okay for the 10 mins? Because if she is, then you're already doing great! You'll just have to keep steadily increasing the amount of time you leave her in her crate.

Definitely talk to your vet about it, she/he may have some good tips, and should be able to tell you whether or not it's SA. And definitely upload some pics when you have a chance - the people on pets.ca are crazy for pics.

Little Leah
June 24th, 2009, 10:07 AM
Yeah, she whined a lot less when I put her in for the ten minute interval, still cried though a bit myself.

EndOfFashion
June 24th, 2009, 10:24 AM
lol you cried? Why? Don't feel bad about it!

If she's doing well in the 10 minute intervals, just keep increasing them (like maybe 5 minutes more or so). Don't go to the next "level" until she's totally fine at 10 mins, 15 mins, etc. After the 10 mins is up, only let her out if she is not whining. You're already doing a lot better than we could do with Milo, lol. I promise, she will eventually get used to being alone!

Little Leah
June 24th, 2009, 10:26 AM
I am so glad she is a good little learner. She already knows fetch learned it the first day we brought her to my parents place. She knows sit stay needs a bit of work, I wanna teach her to dance on her hind legs cause she can stand on them for a long period of time heh. Oh yeah and we also did put a blanket over top. I still let her out when she was crying. She seems to be getting more relaxed the more I try and put her in there. It's a nice little den, I'd enjoy sleeping in there if I was a dog myself heh. She is such a doll.

muggsmom
June 24th, 2009, 11:19 AM
Some suggestions:


Feed her in her crate.

Everytime you give her a treat, throw it in the crate so she has to go in to get it. Same with toys.

Put something in there with your odour on it.

NEVER give her any attention while she is whining.

DO NOT let her out while she is whining. Even if you catch her between whines to let her out, does that make sense. She has to be silent when you open the door.

Make sure she has gone to the bathroom before you put her in.

Muggs had severe SA, and it took me months to crate train him, but we did it. Now he goes in no problem.

Good luck!

EndOfFashion
June 24th, 2009, 11:19 AM
Sounds like she's adjusting well :thumbs up It's normal for young dogs to feel anxious about being left alone in a new place - that may be all it is. After Milo got used to being left alone, we left him with my family for one night so we could go out. He cried something awful, even though he was fine being left alone at our place. :shrug: Maybe it's a Pug thing, lol. Good luck with everything and keep up updated!

Little Leah
June 24th, 2009, 11:34 AM
Thanks guys for all the ideas. I am gonna give them all a try, and keep trying and trying and trying :).

Frenchy
June 24th, 2009, 02:07 PM
What's best for a dog with separation anxiety is to get plenty of exercise in the morning before you leave. And to leave them something that will occupy them for a while. Like a frozen stuffed kong (I put peanut butter in mine and let it in the freezer overnight) I give it to Nelly before I leave for work.

Nelly is a great dane who has separation anxiety. She has destroy things in the house before ,,, well actually destroyed parts of the house too :eek: :laughing:

she would be ok for a while and then will start the destruction again ... all depends on the stress in our household I guess. :shrug:

good luck with your girl ! You can do it !

EndOfFashion
June 24th, 2009, 02:23 PM
Exercise does do wonders! Poop her out before you leave. As for the kong - we used to leave Milo a frozen kong stuffed with peanut butter, but as soon as he could sense we were leaving, it lay there completely forgotten. However, it is definitely a help once you're gone, to keep her distracted - especially if she's in her crate.

Little Leah
June 24th, 2009, 03:52 PM
FREEZE THE KONG why didn't I think of that one? i got a free one yesterday from the vet and my bf and me bought one to boot. So we can put both in stuff it with peanut butter and freeze it. That may peak her interest. I mean when I give it to her before going out she goes insane with it.

Little Leah
June 24th, 2009, 04:51 PM
If anyone does want to see photos of little leah you can add me to msn, it should be on here on the side.

dullmau
June 28th, 2009, 11:18 AM
one of my dogs is a terminator for everything at home so i head for a crate training. It's very effective and she seems to feel safe and warm at her crate.

For most of time, she've only spent her time in a crate when eating and sleeping and i take her out when i go out for work. But in the next couple of weeks i may not be able to stay with her during day time and i don't know if it's alright to put her in a crate for the whole day till i come back at night.

Any advice on this?

Little Leah
June 30th, 2009, 01:00 PM
After reading numerous posts, it seems to me that you should do what I plan on doing and get a kitten the same age as your dog, just so they can grow up together. I called my dad up but instead my mom ahd said jsut get a kitten, get it neutered, make sure it's a male because from what I heard female cats can be very territorial. That way you won't have to worry about ever leaving it alone. Make sure to put the litter and food somewhere only the cat can put it, not high up jsut out of reach of your dog. get a tabby their quite inexpensive.

EndOfFashion
June 30th, 2009, 04:00 PM
Think long and hard before getting a kitten...maybe you should try giving it some more time for things to work out. It may or may not help your dog's separation anxiety to get a kitten. We believe it helped our dog to have the cat around, but we don't know for sure if it was a result of our efforts to work on his SA or not. In fact, we didn't get our cat for that reason (actually, we had the cat first!). Also, if you plan on going this route, you definitely do not have to get a kitten. Our cat is 4 years old - he came from a shelter (he was 3 years old when we got Milo, who was 6 months). Consider giving an older cat a chance, good shelters/rescues will be able to tell you which ones get along well with dogs. It might be better to get an adult, stable cat to help your dog calm down instead of a frisky kitten.

Has your Pug mix ever been exposed to cats? Pugs generally get along really well with other species of animals, but if your dog is mixed with a terrier or something, it may not go so well. Could you maybe introduce her to a friend's cat or something to test the waters?

hunnybunny
June 30th, 2009, 04:01 PM
My dog suffers SA but i knew this was the case in generel with the breed, i have tried everything , he even won,t stay calm with familly who he has known since a puppy , the last time we tried , he nearly went threw the window !!! i do think some dogs are more prone to 'true' SA and it can be a nightmare.
Hope you can help your dog with his , a friend of mine who has a pug had awful probs and ended up getting another dog for company and her dog was then ok .
Mine would prob settle with another dog i.m not sure, but can,t afford to get another dog anyway.
Good luck with your dog :thumbs up, sorry i couldn,t have been more helpful .

Little Leah
June 30th, 2009, 05:34 PM
well I came to notice it isn't full blown sa at all, but rather she is just being a puppy and wants attention, lots of it. every time i leave her she whines, any other time when people are around she's like gimme attention NOW. she has been around my cat once, she was quite hyper around him at my parents place but they got along fine at night when i brought her over there. she slept with him just fine. i am looking around on kijiji now seeing around. making sure most definitely the cat i get is declawed and fixed, they can be territorial if there not fixed or declawed i heard. thanks for the warning, i may have them separated at first just in case to be safe.

EndOfFashion
June 30th, 2009, 07:49 PM
Yeah, that's what I thought! It's easy to mistake it for SA because the dog sounds so pitiful - we made the same mistake with Milo. It's definitely a puppy thing, she may grow out of it. But hopefully the cat will bring her some comfort.

About the cat though - I see you live in Hamilton. You should go over to the Hamilton-Burlington SPCA. They have sooo many cats there. They share the building with the Hamilton Animal Services; there are so many unwanted cats in Hamilton that the HAS have to put a number of cats to sleep three times a week. Or you can check out Toronto Cat Rescue - they rescue cats from Hamilton Animal Services, and can drive the cat right to your house. These are some of the cats at Hamilton Animal Services:

http://www.petfinder.com/shelterSearch/shelterSearch.cgi?animal=&breed=&age=&size=&specialNeeds=&declawedPets=&children=&status=&id=&internal=&contact=&name=&shelterid=ON112&sort=&preview=1

The ones marked "urgent" are on the list to be euthanized. There are SO many kittens there. I don't mean to give you a sob story - ultimately it's up to you where you get a cat - but you would be doing a greater deed by rescuing one of these cats instead of supporting a potential backyard breeder on Kijiji.

It's a really good idea to make sure the cat is fixed! A rescue would take care of that for you. As for the declawed thing - it's not true that un-declawed cats are territorial. Our cat isn't declawed and we have no issues. Actually I've heard that declawed cats can be more aggressive and more prone to biting because you've basically removed their natural defense (to scratch). But that's something you should double-check. I do believe some cats come into rescue already declawed, so that's something you could like into, too.

Definitely separate them at first. It's best to make the introductions very slow, just in case. You can find a lot of great tips online about introducing a cat to your dog. But it's great that your dog did well with your parents' cat! That sounds like a good sign :thumbs up Well, good luck with the search. And definitely keep us updated!

Little Leah
June 30th, 2009, 08:29 PM
Thankies again for all the tips. I am not sure how she is gonna react to a new kitten. I may end up adapting one from the spca. I'll definately keep ya guys updated on how she ish doing, and will be doing with the new cat/kitten.

ownedbycats
July 1st, 2009, 09:00 AM
Little Leah, please think very carefully about getting a cat declawed. Declawing is very cruel. Cats use their claws the way you would use your fingers, to hold things and pick things up. Claws grow constantly, so it isn't a matter of just taking off a claw they actually amputate the cat's equivalent of knuckles. Not having a means of defense can make some cats very scared, causing them to bite. As well, if the surgery goes wrong, it can do something to the nerves in the foot so the cat is in constant pain for the rest of it's life, guaranteeing it won't be good company for anyone. Would you feel like playing and cuddling if you were in constant pain?
Our family has three cats and a puppy. One cat had grown up with a dog, one we don't know about, and the third had never seen a dog in his life before we got Sunshine. None of our cats have been declawed. Despite the fact that they will occasionally swat Sunshine (Misty swats anytime the puppy comes too close) they do it without injuring her because they retract their claws. I've gotten in between the cat and the dog when this happens and although the smack hurts, it invovles no claws. Tell the shelter or wherever you get your cat that you have a dog. Introduce the two there and see what happens. A warning swat or two to let your dog know the cat won't be bullied isn't the end of the friendship, it is just setting limits. A grown cat may do better with a rambunctious puppy than a kitten, who is more likely to get hurt.

Little Leah
July 1st, 2009, 05:12 PM
My cat Jasper got declawed and he seemed fine. They only cut off the bone if they do it wrong. All they do is clip the nail off, not the bone. It's a common misconception. I looked into it. A lot of people are just very misinformed. Well my parents now gave me an idea of a shock collar. It's the most humane device ever made in this generation.
When my dog will bark it will send a mild shock to their system, nothing bad. My dad said like you know when you get a shock when you touch metal it's like that. So every time they start barking their tail off it sends a mild shock to their system. I contacted a kill shelter just yesterday and am waiting on a call right now to finalize everything. It seems this lady has a flood in her house right now and isn't calling to finalize.
So my final decision is that I am gonna get the shock collar. Luckily I can get one free from someone I know :). So no worries about that. Go to your vet, your vet should say it's a common procedure for cats to be declawed, especially if their going to be indoors. It's only dangerous if you decide to let them out and then they'd be left entirely defenseless against their pray.

Frenchy
July 1st, 2009, 05:21 PM
So my final decision is that I am gonna get the shock collar.

shock collar for a dog with anxiety ???? you'll only make things worse ! holy crap !


Go to your vet, your vet should say it's a common procedure for cats to be declawed, especially if their going to be indoors. It's only dangerous if you decide to let them out and then they'd be left entirely defenseless against their pray.

Of course your vet will say this ! They are making money of declawing cats. But you know what ? Some vets are now refusing to do it , you know why ? Because it is inhumane !!!

Little Leah
July 1st, 2009, 06:06 PM
My vet did it and my cat was perfectly fine just fine. He is happy, content, and romping around teasing my dog. He still isn't completely defenseless. I saw him kill a fly even after he got declawed. It isn't inhumane. Some vet's that do do it screw it up and yes get the bone, but they just clip their nails. Look on wikipedia it will say it's a humane way of saving your furniture. I have decided to get the shock collar as it is humane, totally and completely humane. Dear lord I bite my nails, one time my whole nail came off back when I had a real bad biting nail problem, that's besides the fact. They no don't come back, but my cat's just fine. He's always upstairs just purring away on my parents bed and happy.

Little Leah
July 1st, 2009, 06:13 PM
I guess their wrong there too. I read it up, and their all just horror stories that yes are true. But statistics mean nothing most of the time. You have to go to your vet and ask them the good part of declawing ie your furniture will be saved and you don`t have to have them using a pole or have them claw at you. From what i know there are no behavioural problems which I just read, my cat can be quite cuddly, and just doesn`t like being in new places like any other cat.

luckypenny
July 1st, 2009, 07:04 PM
Yeah, she whined a lot less when I put her in for the ten minute interval, still cried though a bit myself.

You may actually be making her worse if she's feeding off your own anxiety. Dogs can easily pick up our vibes and, if you're stressing about leaving her alone, you can bet she's feeling it.

They only cut off the bone if they do it wrong. All they do is clip the nail off, not the bone. It's a common misconception.

No, simply clipping the nail off is a misconception. What would your thoughts be if your parents amputated your fingers at the knuckles to solve your nail chewing habit?

When my dog will bark it will send a mild shock to their system, nothing bad. My dad said like you know when you get a shock when you touch metal it's like that. So every time they start barking their tail off it sends a mild shock to their system.

There's another misconception. Try wrapping it around your neck and have someone else activate it....let us know if it feels like a static shock. If your boyfriend left your home and you asked him to stay a bit longer, would you appreciate it if he came back in and slapped you? Why on earth would you use such punishment on a 6 month old pup who's behaving like....well, like a 6 month old pup :wall:?

shock collar for a dog with anxiety ???? you'll only make things worse ! holy crap !

Seems like, after all the useful advice the OP received, she's simply looking for the easiest way to deal with any issues rather than thinking of future consequences.

JennieV
July 1st, 2009, 10:07 PM
LP, I totally agree with you.

Little Leah, whatever you choose to do, please consider the fact that people on this site have been "around the block" quite a few times. LP for example, she fosters very difficult dogs, dogs who otherwise would probably just get put to sleep. If there was a "humane shortcut" - believe me, she would be the one to know.

Frenchy is another person, who has a lot of experience in the matter, having fostered many dogs and cats.

I think that you should take a real close look at your sources and see how YOU would like if certain things were done to you. The collar is not that great, and some dogs develop even worse problems by having been exposed to it. As far as de-clawing a cat..Well..To me, my cat's health and well-being is worth more than a sofa. Also, it could be dealt with using scratching posts and clipping their nails. I clip Max's nails regularly and never had a problem.

Most of the time in life, the right way is neither easy nor short.

aslan
July 2nd, 2009, 05:33 AM
I guess their wrong there too. I read it up, and their all just horror stories that yes are true. But statistics mean nothing most of the time. You have to go to your vet and ask them the good part of declawing ie your furniture will be saved and you don`t have to have them using a pole or have them claw at you. From what i know there are no behavioural problems which I just read, my cat can be quite cuddly, and just doesn`t like being in new places like any other cat.

I wouldn't rely to strongly on advice given to you by a vet. These are the same people who try and ram Hill's and science diet down your throat, foods manufactured from euthenized animals, road kill etc. A vet if ethical will recommend against de-clawing. They are educated in the physical ailments of pets, not nutrition, or for that fact pain tolerance. As for the shock collar. put it on and yell, then yell again, and hmmm once more for good measure. You will notice the shock increases each time.

As JennieV said, you've had two of the best foster moms on here give you advice. They have only your pets best interest at heart, they don't make any money from helping you as opposed to a vet.

bendyfoot
July 2nd, 2009, 12:13 PM
I can tell you with certainty that the only way to declaw a cat is in fact an amputation of the phalanx (bone) at the terminal (end) knuckle. You can't just "clip the nail off"...it will always regrow. The only alternate procedure I'm aware of is one where the tendon that controls the ability to unsheathe the claw is severed, for each toe. It's perhaps less invasive, but the claws do remain.

Many vets will refuse to declaw a cat, or at the very least will try to discourage the owner from doing so, while educating them on the possible repurcussions.

Learn how to trim the cat's nails yourself, get a few scratching posts, and TRAIN your cat not to scratch on inappropriate surfaces or to play roughly. Also, IMO it's not a big deal if your cat swats a dog. We have three dogs, all of whom have been swatted by at least one of our cats...it's actually an excellent way for them to learn not to tease or bother kitties, and to treat them with respect. And MOST cats exercise an incredible amount of control with their claws...they will not seriously hurt another creature unless they are truly being threatened.

As for the shock collar, well...first of all, they are most certainly NOT meant for young dogs/puppies. Period. At 6 months, you should be investing in obedience classes, socialization, and training. Although I'm a firm beleiver that most training tools have the potential to be used properly and effectively, depending on the dog and the situation, anyone resorting to a shock collar with a puppy is just plain lazy. Sorry, but I absolutely couldn't condone it.

clm
July 2nd, 2009, 02:00 PM
My vet did it and my cat was perfectly fine just fine. He is happy, content, and romping around teasing my dog. He still isn't completely defenseless. I saw him kill a fly even after he got declawed. It isn't inhumane. Some vet's that do do it screw it up and yes get the bone, but they just clip their nails. Look on wikipedia it will say it's a humane way of saving your furniture. I have decided to get the shock collar as it is humane, totally and completely humane. Dear lord I bite my nails, one time my whole nail came off back when I had a real bad biting nail problem, that's besides the fact. They no don't come back, but my cat's just fine. He's always upstairs just purring away on my parents bed and happy.

Declawing isn't just removal of the claws, it's removal of part of the toes and yes it is inhumane IMO. I've had cats all my life and have leather furniture now with 3 cats with all their claws and they've yet to damage anything. Why don't they damage anything? Because I provide them with cat trees to climb and sharpen their claws on. They're painfree and well adjusted existence means more to me than my furniture anyway, so even if they did claw something, I would look at how to provide them with what they need to sharpen their hooks instead of how to remove their hooks.

Cindy

muggsmom
July 3rd, 2009, 09:24 AM
I'm sorry, but you want to shock a puppy for being a puppy and mutilate a cat for being a cat, is that right?

Do the animal world a favour and rehome your dog and don't get a cat. Raise stuffed animals, you can't hurt them.

Little Leah
July 3rd, 2009, 06:54 PM
I got a new kitteh named Herman now. He is doing ok, just a bit of a chest cold. He is quite cute, both of them are getting along ok when he gets out from under my bed. Pictures will come soon I hope of him.

EndOfFashion
July 3rd, 2009, 09:31 PM
What colour is he (I'm assuming Herman is a he!)? Did you get him from the kill shelter you mentioned?

I hope you'll listen to all of the great posts informing you about declawing. Like I said, our cat isn't declawed - when we got our Pug, we were worried about the cat hurting him, especially because his eyes are so prominent. The shelter we adopted the cat from had us sign an agreement saying we would not declaw him, but while we were sitting in the vet's office at his first appointment we saw a pamphlet basically endorsing declawing. We were confused so we asked the vet about it, and she told us what was actually involved and how traumatic it can be - so the other members here are right in saying many vets now will refuse to declaw, or will at least inform pet owners about what a drastic and painful operation it is. And when our cat feels like he needs to "correct" Milo - which is rarely - he swats him with his claws retracted, so he doesn't scratch him.

You already said you would get the kitten fixed, I hope you stick to that :thumbs up Has your pug mix been fixed yet? I can't remember if you already mentioned it, but I remember you saying she was 6 months old...

SandraLM
July 3rd, 2009, 11:50 PM
I have the same problem with my 18 month old female spayed mini schnauzer as well with sepration anxiety. I stopped crating her after she was housetrained. But since then she has done some naughty things. So she has to be crated again.

She doesn't like me going to bed and was chewing the skirt on the couch. Or sometimes on a blanket.

Also when I came home from running errands one day she had pulled the carpet up in front of the door so I couldn't get the door open and this was my only entrance into the house. I called my sis and she brought over a utility knife and we had to cut the carpet to get the door open. Needless to say I wasn't impressed.

14+kitties
July 4th, 2009, 07:47 AM
Declawing a cat is inhumane. Period. You have had one cat declawed. Please listen to people who have had more experience in this area. Please do some research. Read the whole article on the second site I gave you. It explains what happens when you declaw. It is a horrific operation.
Cats who are declawed can become very violent with biting. Are you then going to get rid of your cat? Saying that people with tons more experience than you have don't know what they are talking about is not a great statement to make on a website where there are a lot of people who rescue cats/dogs from bad situations.

Don't even get me started on a shock collar! :wall: Take the challenge. Put one around your neck and see how it feels. Then see if you want to subject a puppy, or even a dog, to that kind of pain.

http://www.communityconcernforcats.org/images/kitties/baddeclaw2.jpg

http://images.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://maxshouse.com/anatomy/claws/Forepaw_skeleton_%2520crop.jpg&imgrefurl=http://maxshouse.com/Truth%2520About%2520Declawing.htm&usg=__QMwKR_eGgH9k_2uwqDZMJ93nB4g=&h=385&w=251&sz=32&hl=en&start=1&tbnid=yLbGMnyqEAFjLM:&tbnh=123&tbnw=80&prev=/images%3Fq%3Ddeclawing%2Bcats%26gbv%3D2%26hl%3Den

ANIMALS ARE NOT DISPOSABLE.

Little Leah
July 4th, 2009, 08:03 AM
You guys have to understand, I know a lot about dog's. My very own sister who loves animals almost as much as me is using this shock collar on her own dog. She doesn't enjoy it, but it works. I am using a chock collar too for walks for my dog, she doesn't seem hurt by it.
Herman is grey and just has a bit of an upper respiratory infection. He is already declawed and fixed. I will read the articles, and take them into heart. But at the same time I see the cat and he seems perfectly happy to me.
Leah doesn't have full blown sa she is just wanting attention. A shock collar will just send a small shock I read it up, it's humane.
I have read several sites on both issues, and a lot of people yes think these methods are inhumane. But I did read up on them, it doesn't hurt them at all. I wouldn't do it if I knew it would hurt them a lot.
Again I know there are places that go and yes cut off the whole bone, and then the cats can't walk. But I'd rather have my furniture and not have herman wreck his claws on my wooden bed and a newer couch.
Again thank you guys for your opinions I will take them into heart.

14+kitties
July 4th, 2009, 09:56 AM
You guys have to understand, I know a lot about dog's. My very own sister who loves animals almost as much as me is using this shock collar on her own dog. She doesn't enjoy it, but it works. I am using a chock collar too for walks for my dog, she doesn't seem hurt by it.


Oh good!! Your sister has the shock collar! You can try before you buy! :thumbs up Really, try it on, bark, loudly.......
Could you explain to me what a "chock" collar is. I have never heard of one. :shrug: Guess I don't know enough about dogs.

Could you do me a favour please? Before you surrender these two beautiful souls to a shelter for behavioural issues down the road will you please come back here and see if we are in a position to adopt either one or both? :pray:

Little Leah
July 4th, 2009, 02:13 PM
NEVER EVER in A MILLION YEARS would I give away these guys. They are a new addition to our family here in this apartment. There perfectly sized and I love them wayyyyy to much. There my darling babies now.
I don't plan on ever giving them away at all. I am gonna persevere and do my best to keep them nice and healthy and happy here. :cloud9::sleepy:

t.pettet
July 4th, 2009, 07:17 PM
Poor pets:sad:

Little Leah
July 4th, 2009, 07:21 PM
what do you mean poor pets...? they love it here there happy, there doing great.......... why in the hell do people think i hate animals imensely? after just simply stating what I think is best for my animals. i love them and tehy love me.

hunnybunny
July 4th, 2009, 07:42 PM
Sorry but people have tried to give you good advice here, myself included, BUT shock collor for a puppy and declawing a cat !!!

You don,t deserve your pets and i feel so sorry for them:mad:

t.pettet
July 4th, 2009, 07:44 PM
If you and your sis think its acceptable to put a cat through the extremely painful (torture) of de-clawing for the sake of a piece of furniture or shock your dog into submission because of your own inadequacies in teaching the dog to heel then I feel sorry for these pets and so: "poor pets:sad:"

Shaykeija
July 4th, 2009, 07:47 PM
I tried one of those shock collars.... Son of a Biatch..they fnn hurt. I had a husky Dallas who yelled when put in his cage. After about 6 months she was fine. I would never use the shock collar on any animal. As for declawing..i would take a cat that already had it done and was in rescue, but I would never have it done. I had bunion surgery and a root canal with out painkillers would have been a walk in the park. It took me a year to walk again. And it damn well hurt also. I would not do anything to my pets that I would not do to myself. ( and yes I am spayed)(and that flipping hurt too...):frustrated::frustrated:

14+kitties
July 4th, 2009, 07:48 PM
what do you mean poor pets...? they love it here there happy, there doing great.......... why in the hell do people think i hate animals imensely? after just simply stating what I think is best for my animals. i love them and tehy love me.


Well see, you came here looking for advice. You got some terrific advise from two of our best doggie people. You also got some advice about declawing cats. And what did you do with our advice?
You have done nothing but tell everyone they are wrong. The reports on declawing are all wrong. Only bad vets "screw it up and yes get the bone." They don't know what they are talking about even though they have studied thousands of cats' reactions/problems. The reports on the downside of using the shock collar to control your pets are all wrong. You know this because your sister uses it and she has no problems...... yet. Never mind the hours and hours of corrections dog fosterers have to go through to "fix" the problems caused by the shock collars. Never mind any concrete proof you have been offered. You still tell everyone they are wrong.
We aren't saying you hate your animals. We were trying to do what you came here looking for ........ help you. :shrug: So... poor pets is right. You may be happy with the end result. They sure won't be. :sad:

Little Leah
July 4th, 2009, 09:18 PM
I have been having the worst week ever. I am freaking out on here only because people think I am one of those insensitive jag off's who don't care about animals. How dare you all. How dare you say poor animals before I even TRY IT. I put stuff on to say yes thank you for your opinions but this is what I know. I am not RUBBING IT IN. I am trying to hear different opinions on here not being forced to think being put in a crate is horrible or inhumane. Or putting a shock collar on a dog hurts. Yeah it probably stings a bit, but think about it first, they have fur on top of their skin, so again mild mild shock.
The cat today I got is HAPPY, so is my dog being here. I am a stern trainer, just like with any other dog I've had. I have been through too many trials with my pet's to have to deal with this. So therefore I will not be posting on here any more and will be deleting this account. The reason I am deleting it is because you guys have too much an option on here about cruelty and don't know when to draw a line.
I LOVE animals, and I actually plan to open up a kennel. If any of you are in canada and am near me please do not come to it as you will probably come to believe I will be cruel to your animals, and will torture them to beliefs you can't imagine by leaving them in crate's all day long not taking them for walks all day and not even clean up their poo in their crate. If that is what you believe then you people have been decieved.
I am still going to love animals regardless of the information I am informed about. I live in canada, we again have freedom as speech just as you guys do also. So there is freedom of speech and there is drawing a very thin line, and a few percentage of you have.
I again love animals and would NEVER DREAM of torturing one. So if any of you think otherwise then your the one torturing your animals yourselves by telling me this garbage you think is true! My cat has been here two whole days and is quite happy. My dog has been here for a course of a month and has made this her very own home. We are in a relaxed environment and it shall stay that way shock collar or no shock collar. My cat I have right now is declawed it has been before I got it, he is fixed.
Ok guys well I bid you all adieu. I thank you again for your opinions, but mos of you have crossed the line by calling me a cruel owner ..|.. :ca::wall:

sasha101
July 12th, 2009, 06:58 PM
Just an idea, I leave lots of toys with my dogs, and a radio set to a talking channel, this way they don't feel so alone, and the toys will keep boredom from setting in.I think its a case of them knowing that when you leave, you are going to come back, once mine got used to that fact they were fine. :-)

Ford
July 14th, 2009, 10:20 PM
To those of you who tried to offer advice, and steer the OP in a positive direction, thank you.

And to the others...once again, this thread has run its' course.

Your friendly neighbourhood mod,
Ford