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Worried about my young dog.

hunnybunny
April 20th, 2009, 02:01 PM
Can anyone help with my dogs symtoms please.
He is a large breed neutered male,16mths old,since he was about 4mths old he has been very stiff in all his legs especially after exercise, he is also very lethergic for a young dog, i suspect HD but my vet says his hips feel okay, i have got him booked in for x,rays nxt week that hopefully will show up the problem, if its not HD i.m wondering what else it could be:confused: he does suffer with allergies and is on antibiotics a lot and steroids, i.m wondering if this could be all linked and immune system related, i am so worried about him.
Any advice appreciated thanks

ventilate
April 20th, 2009, 02:26 PM
does your dog drink a lot of water? you may want to measure how much is drank in 24 hrs. Is it stiffness or more weakness? If your dog is on a lot of steroids sometimes it can cause Iatrogenic cushing. The symptoms are the same as reg cushings an unquenchable thirst, they drink and drink. My dog is a giant breed she is a giant schnauzer and was drinking 2 gallons per day and peed every bit of that out. They eat anything ( most do) If your vet does a urine test, the urine specific gravity on a cush dog is usually low, not concentrated, the urine is hardly colored and dos not usually smell as it is so dilute.
The cure for Iatrogenic cushings is to wean off the steroids, unlike reg pituitary or adrenal cushings there is a cure for it.
Just another thought since you said "Lots of steroids"

hunnybunny
April 20th, 2009, 02:54 PM
Thankyou for your reply ventilate
no he doesn.t drink lots of water imo, he is more stiff than weak i think and walks a bit like he is drunk, i have owned dogs before but never encountered this kind thing before, the steroid is medrone v and hes on 8mg every other day, when we try to reduce it his skin condition flares back up, my vet said its the kind of steroid that should help if its joints/arithritis. x ps he also has a poor appetiate.

Mat&Murph
April 20th, 2009, 03:20 PM
HAs the vet done anyu blood work or anything like that??? Might even look into getting his back xrayed. I have 2 giant breeds and They drink tons!!! and pee it out. I am concerned that your furbaby isn't eating that well. Another concern to bring up to the vet. Good Luck :grouphug:

hunnybunny
April 20th, 2009, 04:27 PM
Thankyou mat +murph.
I meant to add having spine+chest done at same time as well as hips, yes my vet knows about his poor appitite, soz can,t spell.
I xpect bloods will be nxt if nothing shows up.
I am very concerned too as my gut says this is serious.x

diandpat
April 20th, 2009, 05:01 PM
So sorry to hear your baby is not well...it can be very frustrating trying to get to the bottom of things. I admire your perseverance. :thumbs up

Just curious what they feel he is allergic to? What food do you feed him?

Long term antibiotics and steroids can certainly cause there share of problems too...hope you get some answers soon.

hunnybunny
April 20th, 2009, 05:29 PM
Thankyou for your reply Diandpat.
I have had a 'rast' test done and yogi is allergic to
dust mites
beef/all red meats/cereals/dairy
plastic/wool
molds/pollens
I feed him jwb hypoallengic complete
I do my best to manage his allergies, as soon as we try to reduce his meds he gets real bad flare ups.

hunnybunny
April 20th, 2009, 05:39 PM
Thankyou diandpat.
I feed jwb hypoallengic complete
I have had a 'rast' test done and yogi tested positive for
dust mites/plastic/wool
beef/includes all red meats
cereals/dairy
mold/pollens
I manage his allergies best i can lol my house has never been so clean/no chemical cleaners of course lol no perfume either for me
When we try to reduce the steroids it all flares up again.

hunnybunny
April 20th, 2009, 05:43 PM
OOOPS posted same thing twice new to this:o

pbpatti
April 20th, 2009, 05:58 PM
Sorry you are having so much trouble, with all of those allergy's it must be hard to find a food that he will eat and enjoy and not bother him. Not to mention what lind of blankies he can have.:rolleyes: I hope that your vet finds out soon what is wrong. pbp

pbpatti
April 20th, 2009, 06:16 PM
hunnybunny, check out the coconut oil thread, I am giving it to Sasha my Choc Lab, for dry skin trouble, there is a post that will lead you to a site with more uses, one thing it mentioned was it is good for allergys... pbp

TeriM
April 20th, 2009, 07:57 PM
Has your vet ruled out panosteitis? Here are a few links for you ...

http://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm?c=2+1561&aid=466

http://workingdogs.com/doc0049.htm

http://leerburg.com/pano.htm

TeriM
April 20th, 2009, 07:59 PM
I would also consider switching him (if your situation allows) to a raw food diet or a home cooked diet in an attempt to help boost his immune system. Supplementing with Salmon Oils and local (from your area) honey might also help in treatment of his allergies.

cell
April 20th, 2009, 09:05 PM
Has your vet ruled out panosteitis? Here are a few links for you ...

http://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm?c=2+1561&aid=466

http://workingdogs.com/doc0049.htm

http://leerburg.com/pano.htm

I was thinking it was possible a growth plate issue as well from how the condition was described (I didn't know there was a medical term for the issue so thanks for the info:thumbs up) There seems to be a lot of other issues stacking up against such a young dog, I would also recommend looking a alternative diets which will hopefully solve the issues. Hopefully the vet gives a clean bill of physical health and some options to improve your dogs physical condition.

DoubleRR
April 20th, 2009, 09:49 PM
James Wellbeloved is a good brand of food, altho a little low in protein for my liking. I sure hope you can rule out anything major with hips and spine while managing to find an alternative reason for his stiffness. As far as the steroid use, I am not a fan, for humans or animals, and I hope you can find what else he may be allergic to or missing in his diet, so you can wean him off them. Best of luck!

corky/max
April 21st, 2009, 01:53 AM
Can anyone help with my dogs symtoms please.
He is a large breed neutered male,16mths old,since he was about 4mths old he has been very stiff in all his legs especially after exercise, he is also very lethergic for a young dog, i suspect HD but my vet says his hips feel okay, i have got him booked in for x,rays nxt week that hopefully will show up the problem, if its not HD i.m wondering what else it could be:confused: he does suffer with allergies and is on antibiotics a lot and steroids, i.m wondering if this could be all linked and immune system related, i am so worried about him.
Any advice appreciated thanks

Your dog is a German Shepard--right? If so, please go to my profile page, click on statistics, then find all posts (by me). Find post I did dated Feb 8,2009. The problem talked about here is not the one you have--but would like you to click on the web address given here--follow the instructions for when you get in there and also find other posts I did on German Shepards and why they need digestive enzymes--and ignore about yogurt--I just read that you would have to feed way too much in order to get enough to do any good--instead get the pill (capsule) for this supplement. Your dog needs to also be on probiotics because of all that medication--antibiotics!! I hope you can find all the info. I mentioned--I know it is confusing--for me too! Let me know how you do. And I'm wondering if some of the problem you are having is because of the too many medications--could be dangerous!:sad::goodvibes:

hunnybunny
April 21st, 2009, 11:23 AM
Thanks TeriM,i was thinking 'pano' too, my vet doesn,t seem to thinkso, but if it is it will show on x.rays [thanks for the links]
I did originally feed BARF but was advised to change to a lower protein food due to rapid growth of my breed of dog, i do use salmon oil
Thanks Double RR, as i said above i was told to change to a lower protein food hence the jwb.
Thanks corky and max , my dog is a northern inuit, i.m off to check your GSD posts

hunnybunny
April 21st, 2009, 12:03 PM
Thanks corky/max lots of helpful advice there thanks for your links, will keep you posted .x

rainbow
April 21st, 2009, 08:00 PM
Why were you advised to feed him a lower protein kibble? If it is because he is a large breed that is just a myth. It is the calcium and especially the phosphorus content in the food that matters.

Check out this thread ....

http://www.pets.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=48372&highlight=high+protein+myths

rainbow
April 21st, 2009, 08:02 PM
also, the information at www.dogaware.com is excellent. Scroll down to where it says

High-Protein Diets
Contrary to many myths and popular beliefs, there is no harm in feeding a high-protein diet to dogs of any age, including puppies

and you can read the rest of the info.

kandy
April 22nd, 2009, 07:00 PM
Pano should come and go - it isn't a constant stiffness. IMO it doesn't sound like pano. My dog was misdiagnosed with Pano, so I did a lot of research on the condition. The stiffness could be a sign of pain - and although your vet says his hips feel fine, there could be issues there that a physical examination is not going to find. Or at least a physical exam by a general practice vet anyway. My vet told me that my very young newf limped because of pano for more than a year. When I finally decided I needed a second opinion, I took her to an orthopedic vet in a veterinary teaching hospital and they found that she had a ruptured ACL. They confirmed the diagnosis through the xrays that my normal vet took. My normal vet didn't even catch the condition on the xrays - the ortho vets said that unless a vet had specialized ortho training, they likely wouldn't spot it. My newfie girl has a bone deformity that allowed the ACL to tear over time until it finally ruptured, there was no specific injury to her leg.

Based on the multiple health issues, I would also have to wonder if it's some kind of immune related problem. I would agree with the decision to have xrays done though - if there is a skeletal problem, it will show up. I would also recommend a visit to a neurologist if the xrays don't define the problem for you. If there is a vet teaching hospital anywhere near you, I would take him there. He would have a team of vets and students 'brainstorming' on his problems and unlike a normal vet, your dog would never be left unsupervised.

On the food, I looked on their website and see that most of their formulas contain rice, with 2 that don't - but those two have alfalfa and one of them has linseed. Your dog might be reacting to the alfalfa or the linseed. I would try a true grain free food with maybe fish as the main protein source.

I certainly hope you get some answers. Good luck and let us know what happens.

rainbow
April 22nd, 2009, 08:38 PM
I agree with kandy about feeding a grain free kibble and would recommend Orijen (http://www.orijen.ca/orijen/products/) if it is available where you are located. :thumbs up

rainbow
April 22nd, 2009, 08:44 PM
I just checked their store locator (http://www.orijen.ca/orijen/storeLocator/internationalonlinestores.aspx) and it is available at this veterinarian in Devon....

Ark Vets (Pinhoe)
Unit 3, Sandpiper Court
Harrington Lane
Exeter
Devon
EX4 8NS

Tel: 01392 469770
Website: www.arkvets-exeter.co.uk

hunnybunny
April 23rd, 2009, 06:58 AM
Thanks Rainbow, yes it was because vet said large breed of dog, your 'thread' made for interesting reading, i am going to change yogi's diet , i was thinking of doing homemade cooking, i am researching this to make sure i get the right balance, the 'orijen' looks a good food and i can get to that store so thanks for that:thumbs up

hunnybunny
April 23rd, 2009, 07:09 AM
Thanks Kandy, i.m also thinking immune related, it will be interesting to see what the x.rays show least then can get it sorted out[hopefully] my vet also didn,t think 'pano' due to the stiffness being all the time, when yogi does have a run he tends to use his front legs if you know what i mean, thats why i thought hips, i really hope can get to bottom of this, if x.rays don.t show up anything i suppose that will mean some'muscular' probs i will let you know when get the results tues:fingerscr

rainbow
April 23rd, 2009, 03:15 PM
I hope you get some answers with the results. :pray: :fingerscr :goodvibes:

And, hope the grain-free Orijen helps as well. :fingerscr :goodvibes:

kandy
April 27th, 2009, 05:12 PM
If he is 'bunny hopping' - keeping the rear legs together and hopping - then that is a classic sign of hip problems. I am thinking this is what you mean by 'he uses his front legs when running'.

I hope the xrays give you some clear answers. Good luck!

hunnybunny
April 28th, 2009, 04:40 PM
I have had yogi's x.rays results today and am devasted my poor baby has severe HD if it was a hip score it would be 150 plus he also has chronic arthritis in all four limbs and spine, i have brought him home as i couldn,t bear to have him pts tonite, he has pain meds, due to his other meds for allergies these meds don,t work well, surgery can.t be done as his hips have too much bony growths on them and his pelvic bone is about the quater size it should be, i feel sick the condition will get worse and he can only have 10 min exercise not much quality life please help is there help for him or have i done wrong in bringing him home.

Chris21711
April 28th, 2009, 04:45 PM
Hunnybunny, I am so sorry to hear of Yogi's results :sad:, I have no advice to give you unfortunately, just a big :grouphug: he is such a beautiful dog. I am sure someone will be along who can offer you some advice.

I want to add that I don't think that you have done wrong in bringing him home, I would have done the same....Let's hope that there is something that can be done to improve his condition somewhat even if it is not 100%.

hunnybunny
April 28th, 2009, 05:05 PM
Thanks Chris, i feel awful and selfish i.m looking at my yogi and he must be in pain i can.t bear it, it was all such a shock at vets i didn,t know what i was doing, i think the vet was waiting for me to pts but can i keep him like this or am i being cruel god what have i done!

chico2
April 28th, 2009, 05:17 PM
Hunnybunny,I've read the whole thread,but since I have no advice to give,did not comment.
I just want to say I am so very sorry,you obviously love your pup very much,he is beautiful.
I hope Yogi can still have a good quality of life with medication...but whatever your decision,you will make it out of your love for him:grouphug:

hazelrunpack
April 28th, 2009, 09:52 PM
hunnybunny, I'm so sorry that the xrays looked so bad :grouphug: I know how devastating the diagnosis can be.

Can you afford to take him to a veterinary teaching hospital in your area? An orthopedic specialist might be able to offer you alternative treatments...or at least a pain management plan to help Yogi maintain a better quality of life.

rainbow
April 29th, 2009, 02:46 AM
I'm very sorry to hear about Yogi. :sad: :grouphug:

I agree with Hazel and would get him checked out by an orthopedic specialist.

Good luck and keep us posted. :fingerscr :goodvibes:

hunnybunny
April 29th, 2009, 05:34 AM
Thankyou for all your advice, i am going to see how yogi goes on the meds and if he can be made comfortable .I have got to go back to vets next week to see that the meds are helping him I.m also going to check out a orthopedic specialist to see if anything can be done to help him, i was in such a panic yesterday didn,t really know what i was thinking .
Thanks again everyone x

Chris21711
April 29th, 2009, 01:24 PM
I was thinking Hunnybunny that Yogi might benefit from Hydrotherapy to help combat his arthritis and possibly acupuncture, these are just thoughts that you might want to explore.

Also some years ago one of our Basset Hounds damaged discs in his spine and was paralysed in his back end, at the time it was impossible for us to afford the surgery without a 100% guarantee that he would gain mobility....A friend of ours who is a nurse also practices "therapeutic touch", after 4 sessions with her one day he was outside with us and I noticed his toes twitch, little by little he regained movement and after 4 months was back to his old self......I know that Yogi's case is not the same, but alternative procedures do work. I have absolute faith that she put 'Buddy' back on his feet again....I do not understand how it works, but everytime Buddy had a session with her, within the hour he would have explosive diarrhea :shrug:

kandy
April 29th, 2009, 02:34 PM
Because of the bone deformity on my newfie girl, and her surgery to repair the torn ACL, she was on a pain management routine. My son's newf has degenerative athritis in his elbows so during the coldest months of the year is also on a pain management plan.

Both of them have painkillers, one has Deramaxx, the other takes Rymidal. Both are on glucosamine/chondriton supplements. Because supplements are not regulated like prescription medications, finding a reputable source is very important. You want to make sure that your dog is actually getting the levels of g/c that the bottle claims. I started out with Cosequin, and then found that the makers of Cosequin had developed a new supplement called Dasuquin that also has MSM and ASU's which have been shown to increase the benefits of a g/c supplement.

The main things in keeping the dog comfortable is to keep them at an optimum weight - if they are even slightly overweight that increases the pressure on the bones. Moderate, but consistent, exercise. If the dog is allowed periods of non activity and then asked to exercise heavily, it will increase the inflammation and pain. Hydrotherapy is an excellent idea as it strengthens the muscles without putting any pressure on the bones. Acupressure and healing touch therapy has also been shown to improve their condition.

It's so sad when such a young dog has bone problems. There are things you can try though to see if you can improve his mobility and keep him comfortable. While you are looking at alternative medicine treatments, you might also ask about getting his allergies under control so that he wouldn't have to take the allergy meds.

Chris21711
April 29th, 2009, 02:47 PM
:offtopic: Kandy I don't know where you live, but some months ago I started using a supplement on our 15 year old Cocoa, maybe you might want to check it out http://www.recoverysa.com/ it has been quite successful in managing her stiffness of joints, in so much as walking with apparent stiffness, to running, at a pace of a 15yr old.

kandy
April 30th, 2009, 02:32 PM
Thanks for the information Chris. I've seen really good results with the Dasuquin too.

Hunnybunny - one other thing I forgot to mention is that Yogi should not be allowed to go up and down stairs, to jump on or off furniture or into or out of a car. Also, you need to make sure that he has stable footing in your home - that he won't slip on tile or laminate floors. I hope he's resting comfortably today.

hunnybunny
April 30th, 2009, 04:36 PM
Thankyou Chris and Kandy
Yogi seems comfortable today, hopefully the metacam is working:fingerscr
I have never let him do stairs, so thats not a prob, he couldn,t anyway bless him.

So its just a case of seeing how he goes.
I had a long chat with my vet and he said not a lot can be done at this stage and its just a matter of keeping him comfy ,when he can no longer do the 10 min walk it will be time to think again, not a good outlook for a young dog.
Thanks again for all your helpful advise x

chico2
April 30th, 2009, 05:25 PM
Hunnybunny:pray:Yogi will be with you for a long time yet:grouphug:

hunnybunny
May 1st, 2009, 01:41 PM
:thankyou:Thankyou Chico for those kind words.
I hope yogi will be with us a long time too x

Chris21711
May 1st, 2009, 02:58 PM
I had a long chat with my vet and he said not a lot can be done at this stage and its just a matter of keeping him comfy ,when he can no longer do the 10 min walk it will be time to think again, not a good outlook for a young dog.


Hunnybunny, a lot of Vets' are not big believers in alternative procedures, it isn't what 'they' practice - obviously it is your ultimate decision, not your Vet's what road you take with Yogi, but alternative medicines and procedures DO work......Like I said it is your call. I only wish the best for Yogi, he is stunning and loved dearly by you. I sincerely hope that he lives a long life :)

hunnybunny
May 1st, 2009, 06:48 PM
Thanks Chris:thankyou: I have just looked at your link for 'recovery sa, looks interesting have just ordered some a 350 g to start, anythings worth a try at this stage i will do any thing in my power to help my dog! can.t wait for it to arrive !, when i googled the info it did say be careful of allergy reaction as yogi is so sensitive he even had a reaction to oil of primrose when i tried it!
Fingers cross or my baby:fingerscr