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Dead Grass from Dog Urine

Dee-O-Gee
April 10th, 2009, 05:08 PM
I'm not sure if this is in the right forum :shrug:

Gryphon always pees in the exact spot all year round. It's about 10' x 5" in area. He has a wide open range to urinate however, he chooses this particular locale over the rest of the yard.

We have tried to turn soil, rope off, re-plant grass seed and while the later part of summer/early fall looks great, every spring we have to tackle this particular area.

So my question is...does anyone know if there is something that we should be laying down on the grass yet harmless for Gryphon or if it's some kind of chemical inbalance with his urine? I attached a couple of pictures below for your kind review.

Hubby and I are thinking....Oh Great! Here we go again! :frustrated:

50625

50626

Any suggestions or answers would be greatly appreciated and well received :lightbulb:

want4rain
April 10th, 2009, 07:14 PM
you think you can put a sprinkler on the area???

-ash

Dee-O-Gee
April 10th, 2009, 07:47 PM
you think you can put a sprinkler on the area???

-ash


Well the sad thing is want4rain is, that this picture was just taken this afternoon! We've had plenty of unpleasant wet weather and what has happened in the past is that this particular spot soon becomes a blob of muck :sad:

Cathy1
April 10th, 2009, 08:23 PM
My lawn is like that too, I have 2 dogs that use the same area. Every year I always go out when we have a good day and rake it to loosen the dead grass and I usually find the green grass coming up underneath and I also sprinkle extra grass seed down mixed with soil.

Winston
April 10th, 2009, 08:23 PM
Rake it up and start again..I found as Winston got older it his urine wasnt as strong I guess and the spots were alot less. I say over seed the area. You can cover it with burlap so that the grass isnt as harmed as it would be walking on it. Or you could put a walkway in with some slate or rocks? easy to hose down!

Dee-O-Gee
April 10th, 2009, 08:50 PM
My lawn is like that too, I have 2 dogs that use the same area. Every year I always go out when we have a good day and rake it to loosen the dead grass and I usually find the green grass coming up underneath and I also sprinkle extra grass seed down mixed with soil.

I raked today however I haven't laid down extra grass seed yet. Wouldn't that (over seeding) make the grass to thick?

Rake it up and start again..I found as Winston got older it his urine wasnt as strong I guess and the spots were alot less. I say over seed the area. You can cover it with burlap so that the grass isnt as harmed as it would be walking on it. Or you could put a walkway in with some slate or rocks? easy to hose down!

Humph...never thought about burlap? We almost considered a walkway but this particular spot is on a down slope towards the rest of our backyard. Maybe over seeding and protecting with burlap? :lightbulb:

Cathy1
April 10th, 2009, 09:42 PM
I raked today however I haven't laid down extra grass seed yet. Wouldn't that (over seeding) make the grass to thick?

I haven't had any problem with the grass being too thick. If I didn't seed, it would be nothing but dirt or mud in that area.

hazelrunpack
April 10th, 2009, 11:57 PM
The problem is that urine is so basic that it burns out the grass. Sometimes, if you add lime to your grass, it helps neutralize the urine. It looks like Gryphon is really hittin' that spot pretty exclusively, though...so you might have to give up on the grass entirely. Have you ever thought about outlining the area in timber, digging away some of the thatch, lining it with landscaper's cloth (lets the liquid through but won't allow mud up) and filling it with rock? If you one-and-two-inch stone, you don't twist your ankles when you walk on it. And you can hose the area off it gets too stinky. :shrug:

Only problem is that if Gryphon will only pee on grass, and is put off by the rocks, he'll just pick a new place to pee. :o

Dee-O-Gee
April 11th, 2009, 12:15 AM
The problem is that urine is so basic that it burns out the grass. Sometimes, if you add lime to your grass, it helps neutralize the urine. It looks like Gryphon is really hittin' that spot pretty exclusively, though...so you might have to give up on the grass entirely. Have you ever thought about outlining the area in timber, digging away some of the thatch, lining it with landscaper's cloth (lets the liquid through but won't allow mud up) and filling it with rock? If you one-and-two-inch stone, you don't twist your ankles when you walk on it. And you can hose the area off it gets too stinky. :shrug:

Only problem is that if Gryphon will only pee on grass, and is put off by the rocks, he'll just pick a new place to pee. :o

Every year, we've tried the lime and never worked :shrug:

I think I have a visual on the timber lining--not a bad idea Hazel :lightbulb:

Gryphon is a plain and simple pee'r. If this spot ended up covered in rocks, he would never know the difference. :D When we let him out, he leaps from the step onto this area and just gets the job done :thumbs up He's a simple boy :crazy:

hazelrunpack
April 11th, 2009, 12:36 AM
I love a man with a simple and straightforward character! :laughing:

Just make sure you test him with the size of rock you intend to use, first...in case he turns out to be a rock chewer. We brought in 1-inch, 2-inch, 4-inch and 6-inch samples and put them on a coffee table. The two smallest disappeared almost immediately in the mouths of dogs....the 4-inch one got carried off a few minutes later. So we settled for 6-inch rock as the one least able to be eaten. :D

want4rain
April 11th, 2009, 08:05 PM
mulch would prevent splash back. worked well for us anyway.

my only other thought is for you to water it once a day to dilute his pee on the ground though that might breed some grass diseases.

-ash

Dee-O-Gee
April 11th, 2009, 08:26 PM
Thanks for all the suggestions forum friends :thumbs up

Hubby wants to keep it grass for now. So after showing him everyone's wonderfull suggestions, we may very well apply a good raking, re-seed, try the burlap covering and give it plenty of water :D

Hopefully we won't have to resort to re-digging it all up AGAIN :wall: :yell:

breeze
April 11th, 2009, 08:31 PM
what about raking, then putting in low growing thyme (living grass) I have read that it is very hardy to dog pee, and it smells great if the dogs roll around in it.

Dee-O-Gee
April 11th, 2009, 08:33 PM
what about raking, then putting in low growing thyme (living grass) I have read that it is very hardy to dog pee, and it smells great if the dogs roll around in it.

Wow now that's a thought, I'll have to look into thyme. Does it actually look like grass breeze?

breeze
April 11th, 2009, 08:43 PM
Wow now that's a thought, I'll have to look into thyme. Does it actually look like grass breeze?


it's very compact, great for high traffic areas..

I used it between stepping stones looks great, smells great. does not need cutting as often

does it look like real grass, depends on how good your eyes are :D I guess it could like a patch of weeds :o

Dee-O-Gee
April 11th, 2009, 08:57 PM
it's very compact, great for high traffic areas..

I used it between stepping stones looks great, smells great. does not need cutting as often

does it look like real grass, depends on how good your eyes are :D I guess it could like a patch of weeds :o

I was just googling low growing thyme. I may plant some this around the step (kinda bordering the step). There's a little pee damage around this step but the thyme might be an attractive alternative then dead grass. :thumbs up

breeze
April 11th, 2009, 09:07 PM
just make sure that it is the "LOW" growing kind not the regular kind..

Dee-O-Gee
April 11th, 2009, 09:10 PM
just make sure that it is the "LOW" growing kind not the regular kind..

I'll make sure it's low :thumbs up Besides, if hubby saw it was too long--he'd take the weed wacker to it :frustrated:

breeze
April 11th, 2009, 09:17 PM
I'll make sure it's low :thumbs up Besides, if hubby saw it was too long--he'd take the weed wacker to it :frustrated:

it still needs cutting but not as often. when you cut it the scent is to die for :lovestruck: I usually use scissors near the stepping stones


o and pictures are a must lol

Dee-O-Gee
April 11th, 2009, 09:23 PM
it still needs cutting but not as often. when you cut it the scent is to die for :lovestruck: I usually use scissors near the stepping stones


o and pictures are a must lol

Well I have already established the "before" pictures so once this project gets underway, I'll do some aftershots :thumbs up

Although with it being so close to Gryphons pee---I probably won't use it for cooking :yuck:

breeze
April 11th, 2009, 09:30 PM
Although with it being so close to Gryphons pee---I probably won't use it for cooking :yuck:


:laughing::laughing: I think you should plant some in another place if you want to use it for cooking :D

I don't know if you can use the low one for cooking never looked into that.. hmmmmmmmmmm maybe not if your walking on it either :laughing::D

yup saw the before, now just need the during and after ones..:D:thumbs up

Dee-O-Gee
April 11th, 2009, 09:36 PM
:laughing::laughing: I think you should plant some in another place if you want to use it for cooking :D

I don't know if you can use the low one for cooking never looked into that.. hmmmmmmmmmm maybe not if your walking on it either :laughing::D

yup saw the before, now just need the during and after ones..:D:thumbs up

I use to have thyme in my vegetable garden but it never took. I do have Terragon that grows like a weed along with chives, garlic and oregano. Nothing better than home grown tomatoes soaked in olive oil, garlic and oregano then placed on a bed of garlic bread. :cloud9:

Winston
April 11th, 2009, 10:03 PM
Only use the burlap to get the seebdlings going...once a fair amount have sprouted I would remove it! lots of water..The thyme sounds like a wonderful idea and I was thinking clover! clover is really tough!

Oh and after pics are a must! I wouldnt try rocks or gravel for winston cause her would just move to another spot on the grass! :laughing:

Dee-O-Gee
April 11th, 2009, 10:07 PM
Only use the burlap to get the seebdlings going...once a fair amount have sprouted I would remove it! lots of water..The thyme sounds like a wonderful idea and I was thinking clover! clover is really tough!

Oh and after pics are a must! I wouldnt try rocks or gravel for winston cause her would just move to another spot on the grass! :laughing:

Hi Winston -- So after we seed and cover the area in burlap--do I water right over the burlap everyday? :shrug:

I think I may have a special spot for the thyme and already told hubby what I was going to do :thumbs up

With Gryphon being so simple....he would just up-root every single rock and find them all new homes scattered all over my yard:frustrated:

Winston
April 11th, 2009, 10:13 PM
yep! just water right over it! and once it get growing fairly decent I would keep seeding and seeding until its nice and think. What I do to make it easy for seeding is getting a pail mixed with my soil and I add my seed to the soil and then spread it out...keeps it from blowing in the wind! :thumbs up

I forgot to mention that I have heard you could by pills that help with the urine burns on the grass. I have also tried those patch kits they sell and they are also a waste of money!

They say if you keeo the grass nice and thick it keeps the weeds out! Careful buying cheap seed cause it will likely be full of weeds. I like a Kentucky Bluegrass but its really hard to find a back that is 100% K Blue..

Cindy

Dee-O-Gee
April 11th, 2009, 10:32 PM
yep! just water right over it! and once it get growing fairly decent I would keep seeding and seeding until its nice and think. What I do to make it easy for seeding is getting a pail mixed with my soil and I add my seed to the soil and then spread it out...keeps it from blowing in the wind! :thumbs up

I forgot to mention that I have heard you could by pills that help with the urine burns on the grass. I have also tried those patch kits they sell and they are also a waste of money!

They say if you keeo the grass nice and thick it keeps the weeds out! Careful buying cheap seed cause it will likely be full of weeds. I like a Kentucky Bluegrass but its really hard to find a back that is 100% K Blue..

Cindy

We also tried those patch kit things and that was a total waste of time & money :frustrated:

Well I think its gonna be the seeding, re-seeding, seeding etc., :wall: I like the idea of adding the seed to the soil then spreading it :lightbulb:

Hoping for a nice Easter Sunday tomorrow to get out there and prep it up! :fingerscr:fingerscr

MajorsMom
April 12th, 2009, 09:00 AM
Just a thought, I have a book for 101 uses for vinegar, and it suggest putting a couple of tbsps of vinegar in the water. However they suggest you start gradually with a tsp 1 wk, then 2tsp, then a tbsp etc... This balances out the acidity in the urine and saves the grass. I also heard that only female urine burns the grass. But this time of year it's hard to tell if it's actuallty dead too. You could try thatching the grass, and it may come back. We had to thatch everyyear when roxy was alive (rest in peace), and generally aside from isolated little spots that were her ALL time favorite, the grass came back. Hope this helps.

MajorsMom
April 12th, 2009, 09:12 AM
Just another thought:lightbulb: I wrote my last response and then went out the front of the house for a smoke and looked at my own grass :rolleyes: it looks very much like yours :laughing: as it does every year, and no animals pee out there! The reason our grass looks like this pretty much over the entire acre and a half is becuase this town is basically built on sand, so my other thought to you is that maybe just MAYBE the PH balance in your soil is not high enough or too high, and watering with some miracle grow might help!:shrug:

Dee-O-Gee
April 12th, 2009, 04:39 PM
Just a thought, I have a book for 101 uses for vinegar, and it suggest putting a couple of tbsps of vinegar in the water. However they suggest you start gradually with a tsp 1 wk, then 2tsp, then a tbsp etc... This balances out the acidity in the urine and saves the grass. I also heard that only female urine burns the grass. But this time of year it's hard to tell if it's actuallty dead too. You could try thatching the grass, and it may come back. We had to thatch everyyear when roxy was alive (rest in peace), and generally aside from isolated little spots that were her ALL time favorite, the grass came back. Hope this helps.

WOW vinegar---go figure :shrug: I wonder if it would be safe to mix the vinegar with miracle grow in the same container while watering - humph?

Just another thought:lightbulb: I wrote my last response and then went out the front of the house for a smoke and looked at my own grass :rolleyes: it looks very much like yours :laughing: as it does every year, and no animals pee out there! The reason our grass looks like this pretty much over the entire acre and a half is becuase this town is basically built on sand, so my other thought to you is that maybe just MAYBE the PH balance in your soil is not high enough or too high, and watering with some miracle grow might help!:shrug:

I have a soil testing kit that I always use in my rose beds. I think I will sample the soil in this area to see what it comes up with before adding vinegar or more lime :lightbulb:

Thanks MajorsMom and everyone else at that for these great ideas--it has really helped with tackling this area and will post after shots if all turns out well. :)

MajorsMom
April 12th, 2009, 07:56 PM
The vinegar actually goes in the dogs water to control the acidity and stop the grass from turning yellow:shrug: Vinegar on your grass will kill your grass as it is a natural weed killer when sprayed directly your weeds.

Dee-O-Gee
April 12th, 2009, 10:41 PM
The vinegar actually goes in the dogs water to control the acidity and stop the grass from turning yellow:shrug: Vinegar on your grass will kill your grass as it is a natural weed killer when sprayed directly your weeds.

Oooohhhhh! I was confused :confused::confused:

I thought the vinegar was sprayed onto the grass-- I'm such a :loser:

So Gryphon drinks the vinegar? Wouldn't that have some kind of affect on the acid in his stomach?

Dee-O-Gee
April 12th, 2009, 10:45 PM
I think I would be a little concerned mixing vinegar in with fresh drinking water :shrug:

MajorsMom
April 13th, 2009, 06:42 AM
Actually it's gradually supposed to be worked up to a tbsp or 2 depending on the size of the water dish. I don't think that heavily diluted would affect his stomache, but it's suppose to control the acid in the urine :shrug: it's just what is says in my vinegar book, you could always check with a vet to make sure it's safe. I know ppl that drink vinegar (apple cider tho) :yuck: to reduce their cholesterol, and blood pressure and apparently it works, they don't have to take meds! :shrug:

hazelrunpack
April 13th, 2009, 08:33 AM
I have a friend who uses apple cider vinegar for her GERD. Works great but tastes really bad :yuck: Dogs don't seem to mind it, though. However, since it's so dilute in the water, I'd really not expect it to have much effect on the urine. So if it works, you for sure have to let us know, klm!

Dog urine has high pH, which makes it a base. It also contains nitrogen, which is a plant nutrient. So if you can bring the pH down to 7 (neutral), which is what I'm thinking the vinegar (an acid) is supposed to do, and eliminate other sources of nitrogen to Gryphon's 'pee place' :D (for instance, if you fertilize the rest of the lawn, don't fertilize that spot), you might be able to coax some sort of ground cover there, especially if you can find a way to keep it well watered without creating mud.

If you find something that works, let me know. In winter, the Packmembers all have their own favorite areas to pee in and it always takes us still about July to get the grass cover back to where it should be. :rolleyes:

MajorsMom
April 13th, 2009, 08:50 AM
I have a friend who uses apple cider vinegar for her GERD. Works great but tastes really bad :yuck: Dogs don't seem to mind it, though. However, since it's so dilute in the water, I'd really not expect it to have much effect on the urine. So if it works, you for sure have to let us know, klm!

Dog urine has high pH, which makes it a base. It also contains nitrogen, which is a plant nutrient. So if you can bring the pH down to 7 (neutral), which is what I'm thinking the vinegar (an acid) is supposed to do, and eliminate other sources of nitrogen to Gryphon's 'pee place' :D (for instance, if you fertilize the rest of the lawn, don't fertilize that spot), you might be able to coax some sort of ground cover there, especially if you can find a way to keep it well watered without creating mud.

If you find something that works, let me know. In winter, the Packmembers all have their own favorite areas to pee in and it always takes us still about July to get the grass cover back to where it should be. :rolleyes:

I myself just having got Major, I am waiting to see if where he goes turns yellow, but he never had yellow snow like my female! I too have had to wait sometime to get my grass back. So I'm going to fertilize Roxys :rip: favorite spots and see what happens. But where Major prefers to pee seems to be holding green :fingerscr But will keep all informed.

Dee-O-Gee
April 13th, 2009, 06:46 PM
I have a friend who uses apple cider vinegar for her GERD. Works great but tastes really bad :yuck: Dogs don't seem to mind it, though. However, since it's so dilute in the water, I'd really not expect it to have much effect on the urine. So if it works, you for sure have to let us know, klm!

Dog urine has high pH, which makes it a base. It also contains nitrogen, which is a plant nutrient. So if you can bring the pH down to 7 (neutral), which is what I'm thinking the vinegar (an acid) is supposed to do, and eliminate other sources of nitrogen to Gryphon's 'pee place' :D (for instance, if you fertilize the rest of the lawn, don't fertilize that spot), you might be able to coax some sort of ground cover there, especially if you can find a way to keep it well watered without creating mud.

If you find something that works, let me know. In winter, the Packmembers all have their own favorite areas to pee in and it always takes us still about July to get the grass cover back to where it should be. :rolleyes:

Well that kinda makes sense as fars as over amping on the nitrogen :lightbulb: Perhaps I'll bring this up with our lawn service people.

I myself just having got Major, I am waiting to see if where he goes turns yellow, but he never had yellow snow like my female! I too have had to wait sometime to get my grass back. So I'm going to fertilize Roxys :rip: favorite spots and see what happens. But where Major prefers to pee seems to be holding green :fingerscr But will keep all informed.

Well I can tell you...Gryphon's pee in snow is very yellow. Even more so then our GRD Bailey's and she was a female :sad:

All in all, I'm gonna go out and grab some soil samples and test the PH/Nitrogen levels to see what I'm dealing with first. :lightbulb:

MajorsMom
April 13th, 2009, 06:51 PM
Well that kinda makes sense as fars as over amping on the nitrogen :lightbulb: Perhaps I'll bring this up with our lawn service people.



Well I can tell you...Gryphon's pee in snow is very yellow. Even more so then our GRD Bailey's and she was a female :sad:

All in all, I'm gonna go out and grab some soil samples and test the PH/Nitrogen levels to see what I'm dealing with first. :lightbulb:

Ok hopefully that's all it is. Good luck!!:grouphug:

Dee-O-Gee
April 13th, 2009, 11:16 PM
I have a friend who uses apple cider vinegar for her GERD. Works great but tastes really bad :yuck: Dogs don't seem to mind it, though. However, since it's so dilute in the water, I'd really not expect it to have much effect on the urine. So if it works, you for sure have to let us know, klm!

Dog urine has high pH, which makes it a base. It also contains nitrogen, which is a plant nutrient. So if you can bring the pH down to 7 (neutral), which is what I'm thinking the vinegar (an acid) is supposed to do, and eliminate other sources of nitrogen to Gryphon's 'pee place' :D (for instance, if you fertilize the rest of the lawn, don't fertilize that spot), you might be able to coax some sort of ground cover there, especially if you can find a way to keep it well watered without creating mud.

If you find something that works, let me know. In winter, the Packmembers all have their own favorite areas to pee in and it always takes us still about July to get the grass cover back to where it should be. :rolleyes:

I just sampled the soil :thumbs up

Gathered it early this afternoon and mixed everything up and made the brew :D

PH level is at 6.5 which is slightly Acid
Nitrogen went way off the rictor scale :eek: We have a surplus + , + of nitrates :frustrated::frustrated:

So the vinegar would help bring down the acid and raise the PH to a 7.0 which is neutral, but I need to find out what to do with the extensive level of Nitrogen :shrug:

I guess I need to google. :sad:

hazelrunpack
April 14th, 2009, 12:51 AM
Definitely won't need to fertilize for a while, eh? :laughing: If I could think of a good marketing jingle, I'd collect the Pack's urine, dilute it, and sell it in pint bottles as a good nitrogen fertilizer! :thumbs up Only somehow I get this feeling that Dilute Dog Pee Fertilizer would not be a big seller! :laugh:

Vinegar would lower the pH, I think...as an acid, it already has a pH of less than 7. :shrug: So if the soil is already slightly acidic, lime would be a better bet to sweeten it up :thumbs up

MajorsMom
April 14th, 2009, 07:21 AM
Well I'm glad you found out it wasn't all Gryhon's :angel2: fault! ;)

I don't know much about fertilizing and neutralizing lawns, :shrug: so I'll leave that to the more knowledgable folks! :grouphug:

want4rain
April 14th, 2009, 11:15 AM
i think watering will really help reduce the nitrogen. ill ask a friend of mine (if i can hunt him down) what he thinks might also be out of wack if your nitrates are that high.

(being a fish geek, we say WATER CHANGES!! LOL!!)

-ash

Dee-O-Gee
April 14th, 2009, 06:52 PM
Well here's the game plan:

I booked Thursday & Friday off of work to work around my yard :thumbs up

I'm going to take my rain barrel out of winter storage and set it up. Fortunately, where I set it up is close to this area. I then will attach my soaker hose to the rain barrel and coil it over this spot AFTER I strap on my aerating shoes and create some plugs :lightbulb:
The neighbors see me in these shoes and they always get a chuckle 50761

My first priority though is to switch Gryphon's diet. He has had many issues (not only too much Nitrogen) with his dietary intake that it warrants a change in food.

MajorsMom
April 14th, 2009, 06:53 PM
Well here's the game plan:

I booked Thursday & Friday off of work to work around my yard :thumbs up

I'm going to take my rain barrel out of winter storage and set it up. Fortunately, where I set it up is close to this area. I then will attach my soaker hose to the rain barrel and coil it over this spot AFTER I strap on my aerating shoes and create some plugs :lightbulb:
The neighbors see me in these shoes and they always get a chuckle 50761

My first priority though is to switch Gryphon's diet. He has had many issues (not only too much Nitrogen) with his dietary intake that it warrants a change in food.

Good Luck!!!!:grouphug:

Dee-O-Gee
May 9th, 2009, 11:55 PM
Well a month has passed and here's what the patch is looking like so far...

51833

51834

It seems to have filled in nicely so far since last month. I watered the heck out of the spot and used my aerating sandals on 3 occassions. We also layed down extra seed and next week I'm gonna try a home remedy of beer, coke and ammonia :shrug:

MajorsMom
May 10th, 2009, 08:29 AM
That's funny, cuz we have a patch larger then that, and it's been under water so Major hasn't been able to pee there, and now the water had dried up the grass is a dead patch like that :shrug: I wonder if it could be something else :fingerscr