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Buzz collar brings results

blaster1985
March 25th, 2009, 02:58 AM
We had escalating barking issues with our Coonhound this past winter and were at our wits end in correcting them. She became increasingly aggressive in the yard and on walks, to the point where I had to walk her at "off" hours and change streets when encountering another dog coming at us. We finally decided to try a shock collar, reluctantly. I must say the results were immediate: two barks at a passing dog and we haven't heard a peep out of her since. I only put it on her when she is in the yard or on a walk. The behavior is much more relaxed, but I'm wondering now, if it's because she is afraid to do anything, she might receive a buzz. Understand that she was going ballistic in the yard whenever someone walked by, alone or with a dog; on the walk was very dominant; pulling and looking for other dogs to bark at. I guess the balance will have to swing in the other direction for a while, but I much prefer a dog in control with a collar than the alternative. What is your experience with this method? Agree or disagree?

angeldogs
March 25th, 2009, 05:10 AM
I did the bark collar for awhile and even moving it around like your supposed to it started seeing red spots from it and stopped using right away.my boy barks at anything that walks,rides by the house.or on the side of the street.people pulling into their driveways.i taught him the windows were my space and it was working well.sometimes i have to get the squirt bottle out.

BenMax
March 25th, 2009, 08:33 AM
I disagree with this type of collar. My advice - put the collar on and buzz yourself. If you are reluctant to even try it on you or your kids - then why do this to the dog?

Training and discipline. This is definately a commitment and not an instant easy fix but it will help in the long run. You want your dog always well adjusted and social don't you?

kandy
March 25th, 2009, 06:02 PM
IMO the shock collars work because the dog is afraid of the pain - and discontinues a behavior that causes the pain (negative reinforcement). However, I don't think it does a thing to actually correct the cause of the behavior, and may escalate the dogs stress level, leading to other behavior problems.

blaster1985
March 25th, 2009, 06:47 PM
I agree that the collar was a drastic, albeit, last resort. The situation was intolerable and we may have had to reconsider her future with us. I want to have a life that doesn't revolve around my pet to the exclusion of everything else. I couldn't leave her in the fenced in yard unattended; we had to tie her up, still at 30ft hardly too restrictive; couldn't have anyone come in the house without restraining her; couln't walk her without her going ballistic at every dog we see and in this small town, there are tons of dogs. I realise that this hasn't corrected the behavior, only inhibited it, but something had to be done and now. She hasn't barked since it was put on, so don't get the impression that she is in pain or it's cruel. It works for now; I just walked her all through town, without incident; the alternative is to just stay home.

Bailey_
March 25th, 2009, 07:21 PM
Blaster ; I understand that frustration in a situation like this, concern about her welfare and others, has brought you to this choice. It's hard, and I think many people are brought to this point with their dogs.

But can I ask you - what other things had you tried BEFORE this collar? Did you consult a behavioralist?
Aggression always stems from something - frustration, fear, insecurity, etc. A proffesional trainer would be able to help you identify and work through these issues without having to resort to such extreme means.
Coonhounds are a very vocal breed - what may have started as her communicating to you or other dogs, could've easily escalated into a form of leash aggression. A proffesional would help you know how to look for this behavior before it even starts, how to handle it when it happens, and what to do before and after.

I always tell my clients: Just because something is available for us as owners, does not make it right.

Would we use a whip or a cattle prod on our children? Hopefully not! I honestly feel the same about shock collars - unneccessary and cruel. Unfortunatley, petstores are more interested in selling quantity rather than instructing owners how to properly go about fixing a behavioral problem.

I highly reccomend seeking someone out in your area that can come to your house, meet you and your dog, and help you both work through this - without the collar.

Keep us posted!

Stacer
March 25th, 2009, 08:17 PM
What about those collars that spray citronella when the dog barks? It's still negative reinforcement, but at least it's not painful.

Dee-O-Gee
March 25th, 2009, 09:49 PM
Correct me if I'm wrong Blaster1985 but the shock collar also has a "beep" as opposed to being shocked?

After a few corrections with the shock, a dog will HEAR the beeping ramifications and immediately deter from his misbehaviour.

I think a BEEP is much better than being tied up to a steel chain running around in circles :shrug:

blaster1985
March 26th, 2009, 02:35 AM
Yes,it does emit a signal and again, I want to stress that it took one instance for her to get it; it's not like she is being shocked every day all the time. She is manageable, where before she was out of control.

Agility dogs
March 26th, 2009, 08:55 AM
My sister has a Redbone Coonhound. We walk our dogs out behind her place which is a big Valley that goes for miles. We had to stop taking the Redbone as he would get on a scent and take off. She got a remote shock collar for him, beeped it once and gave him a low shock and he has never tried to take off since and she has never had to do more than beep him if he got his nose down and looked like he would like to take off. She does not even put it on him any more. Which is worse, using a shock collar for a few days and being able to take the dog out for a good run or leaving him locked in the yard never able to get out and run with the other dogs. I do not believe in using a shock collar for regular dog training like recalls, sit, etc. as there are far better ways to train but in this instance it was the only way to get his attention from a distance. Now he is such a happy dog, able to run free with the other dogs and ignores the scent of deer which could cause his death if he was caught running them.

brianna079
March 26th, 2009, 09:59 AM
I have 2 dobermans. our first will be 2 years old in May, and our second just turned 1 in January.

the first was taken to puppy school, and then we did basic 1 & 2 training with him. he was an absolute jewel. we were living in an appartment in Montreal (although we had beautiful trails and a parc to play in). he learned quickly, and was always willing to please us.

we then moved to the country, and got the second doberman. we had a lot of problems with the second one, he would do anything to get a rise out of us, as well as some serious medical problems which made us having to delay taking him for some well needed obedience classes.

well, after an unfortunate intussuption and surgery, our younger doberman has flourished. he is super obediant, he still tries to get a rise out of us, but hes more of a clown than anything.

on the other hand, our jewel of a doberman (the older one), has now lost any sense he ever had. we live on a relativly quiet road and can go for walks off the leash. he takes off, jumps on the neighbors balcony, and tries to get up to look into the windows at her dogs. he also takes off into the forest, or meets up with our other neighbors dog, who is notorious for taking off for hours at a time.

i too have been reluctantly contemplating that type of training collar. we have not decided for sure on it, but we have wonderful space to play freely with our dogs, trails too, and i spend the whole time yelling for him to come back to me...if he actually hasnt taken off on me - it has become more and more unpleasant to go out hand have fun with him. i am also always worried about him getting hurt.

just thought i would share my thoughts about the subject...

luckypenny
March 26th, 2009, 10:45 AM
Now that you have some control over your dog, it would be the perfect time to learn about de-sensitizing her to the things that set her off.

If you can, try to pick up copies of AGGRESSION IN DOGS - PRACTICAL MANAGEMENT, PREVENTION & BEHAVIOUR MODIFICATION by Brenda Aloff and CAUTIOUS CANINE & FEISTY FIDO - HELP FOR THE LEASH AGGRESSIVE DOG
both by Patricia McConnell. If you can't find them at your book store, you'll find them here: www.dogwise.com .

We found aversive techniques quickly made our aggressive dog even more aggressive. It only took several corrections before I realized that she was associating what she focussed on with the correction itself, rather than her behavior with the correction. It may have temporarily stopped the unwanted behavior but did nothing to correct her fear/aggressiveness towards others.

Positive association techniques, re-direction, de-sensitizing exercises, and basic training is what will teach your dog to make up her mind on her own....and give her alternative tools to deal with stressors.

Good luck :fingerscr.

Blackdog22
March 26th, 2009, 11:00 AM
I agree 100%, very well said.
With many many dogs, the pain of the correction is correlated directly with the object they are reacting to.

While I feel shock collars do have a place in some dog training, they should ONLY be used by experienced, reputable proffesionals. I do not feel that there is any justification for a novice to use such a training collar on a dog, no reason whatsoever!

I find it to be kind of lazy to be honest. Sure other methods and training may take more time, patience and dedication, but in the long run it is worth taking the time to build trust and do things properly. That being said, everyone is entiltled to an opinion, who's to say who is right or wrong?

downtowntrainer
March 28th, 2009, 06:30 PM
We had escalating barking issues with our Coonhound this past winter and were at our wits end in correcting them. She became increasingly aggressive in the yard and on walks, to the point where I had to walk her at "off" hours and change streets when encountering another dog coming at us. We finally decided to try a shock collar, reluctantly. I must say the results were immediate: two barks at a passing dog and we haven't heard a peep out of her since. I only put it on her when she is in the yard or on a walk. The behavior is much more relaxed, but I'm wondering now, if it's because she is afraid to do anything, she might receive a buzz. Understand that she was going ballistic in the yard whenever someone walked by, alone or with a dog; on the walk was very dominant; pulling and looking for other dogs to bark at. I guess the balance will have to swing in the other direction for a while, but I much prefer a dog in control with a collar than the alternative. What is your experience with this method? Agree or disagree?

It sounds like you are managing, not training. There is a huge difference between the two.

E-collars can be a great tool for training provided they are in the right hands.

Many of you here shoot down e-collars for very valid reason. However it is not the e-collar itself that is harsh it is how many people use it. IMO allowing a dog to choke itself (regardless of collar type) is just as inhumane as tuning up the shock collar and pressing continuous.

I have used e-collar, but I do not use it as a form of punishment. Furthermore I do not use it to dwell on what the dog is doing wrong, but rather use this tool as a way to show the dog to do the right thing. Oh and CONTRAST to me is what makes training work. I would rather show the dog how to do the right thing then have to correct him for doing the wrong thing. I use praise as the contrast to the correction.

So I do not believe in just pressing the button (I agree it is a lazy way of training) and expecting obedience. I personally lay the foundation with a leash and collar and then introduce the e-collar. WHY? Because some dogs do not deal well with confrontational training so leash-collar corrections are not necessarily the most effective way of handling such dogs. But they are useful to begin with to show the dog the correct action.

Also there are those handlers who are not physically capable of correcting their dogs. For example, I know of a trainer with really bad arthritis who switched over to mainly using e-collar to train. However this person has a highly detailed method, because afterall is a dog the only performs when the collar is on truly trained?

Gucci
April 3rd, 2009, 12:41 AM
My fiance wanted to get a shock collar for our Chiuahua almost immediately after we adopted him. He is just a baby at 8 weeks old, but he barks and whines incessantly, especially at night. After reading this, I will definately NOT get a shock collar for him, but train him. If it becomes too harsh of a situation, I'd hire a professional trainer.

blaster1985
April 4th, 2009, 05:03 PM
I know many of you were not in agreement with my use of a shock collar on my dog and I agree with you. I am pleased to say that I have a trainer coming over next Saturday to work with my dog; Barkbusters seem to have some sensible methods that we will put to good use and hopefully we will permanently retire the collar. I' ll post a full report after the lesson for those interested.