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rescues and breeders.

allymack
January 5th, 2009, 04:57 PM
so i have been thinking alot lately about where i got enzo from. as much as i know he wasnt a BYB dog ( i know this because he is a registered nova scotian breeder, i know there could always be an exception) i still feel like i should have adopted. i do feel really really bad about not adopting. i really dog love enzo, but i jst cant help think what if i adopted instead, what kind of dog would i have gotten, and everything like that. i wish i had adopted, but i love enzo, either way i would have been happy with my pup and given him a loving home for life.

Has anybody else ever thought they should have adopted and not bought from a breeder.

i guess this makes me sound sort of like an un devoted owner, which i dont want it to, just something i think about..

lUvMyLaB<3
January 5th, 2009, 05:10 PM
feel guilty every single day about puppies.. DO BOTH!! haha I wanted a lab for years and years a real lab.. like a real lab not the tall skinny ones.. so I got one after searching and searching for a breeder and I love her more than anything I have a rescue too now and always have. had many rescues and only a few breeder ones.. I luv em all!

Ford Girl
January 5th, 2009, 05:11 PM
I feel the same way ally, we got Dazy from a byb, before I really knew anything about them, and now I look back and think I could have, should have adopted. I joined this site after the fact and realized what we had done.

What makes me feel better (if this makes sense) is that Dazy has had her share of illnesses and extreme behavior that most people wouldnt have worked thru or on, and she would have ended up in a shelter or worse!! Not to mention her extreme high energy. She was an aweful puppy, and cost us tones in medical care over the last 2 years, and had she gone to a family with kids or a an owner without the time - she wouldnt have lived this long. If that makes any sense?? So, she's lucky to have come home with us, and we have learnt so much since then.

My next dog will be a rescue, and it wont be a puppy LOL!!, Im thinking an older golden who needs a good home. Or maybe two, or three...lol!!

allymack
January 5th, 2009, 05:17 PM
atleast i amnot the only one who feels bad about it, it makes me feel a bit better. i suppose enzo could have ended up on a farm which he liked more then living in a house in the city, he also could have ended up in a house where he gets no exercise, but i am sure he is pretty happy where he is now, he gets a good run at the field every day, usually with atleast one other dog, he might not get as much excercse as he wants, but he is happy. the next dog i get will definately be a rescue! prehaps another border collie :D

Love4himies
January 5th, 2009, 05:24 PM
Puddles was adopted from a byb, not a bad one as her momma was spoiled rotten and the only cat in the house. Her father was a grand champ though. I think the only reason her sire's owners allowed him to breed with her momma was because Puddles' breeders are very wealthy and well known in Edmonton. I didn't know any better at that time. I am now a Shelter/Rescue snob and will only adopt older pets.

Snowball, Jasper and Sweet Pea were adopted from Humane Societies/SPCA

MommaKat
January 5th, 2009, 05:56 PM
My Cats are rescues. We bought Maggie when she was 2 from a couple who just couldn't handle her. I would have liked to have gone to a shelter but I think she needed us ;) .

I wanted my second dog to be from a rescue but do to some circumstances I got her from a relative. I feel bad but Hubby and I are going to be sponsoring a dog on petfinder AND at least Sparks will live a life of kongs,training and snuggles instead of going to someone who maybe wanted to breed her :frustrated: Our next pet for sure though will be from a rescue. You don't sound un-devoted at all :grouphug:

Luvmypitgirls
January 5th, 2009, 06:50 PM
I got my male Rottie Kato from a byb, but given the conditions he was being subjected to, I couldn't leave him there, so I feel very much that I rescued him.
My only regret was that I couldn't take his brother as well, I still feel guilty about having to choose one over the other.

bendyfoot
January 5th, 2009, 07:00 PM
I have to say, I personally don't think there's anything wrong with getting a dog from an ethical, responsible, registered breeder of purebred dogs. Other than rescue/adoption I think it's actually a great way to get a good family pet AND support the health and welfare of dog breeds. That said, I have to admit that I haven't personally been too overwhelmingly impressed by some breeders. I've been snooping around for a GSD breeder and haven't come across too many breeding programs that don't have oversized dogs, or dogs without extreme angulation, or who incorporate white coats into the breeding program or...well you get the picture.

There are, however, some who positively enthrall me with their love for, devotion to, and knowledge of their chosen breed, and who want nothing more than to produce the absolute best possible examples of the breed, both from a physical and behavioural point of view, and in keeping with the original "intent" or "job" of the breed. These people don't make any money off their pups, they are "friends of the family" for as long as one of their dogs are in your life, dogs are very carefully, sparingly and selectively bred, and the health and happiness of their dogs are their primary concern.

I can't see anything wrong with promoting THAT kind of breeder. If more people chose to get dogs from responsible breeders, rather than BYBs or even half-@ssed registered breeders, then maybe there would be fewer unwanted, unheathly, homeless dogs.

lUvMyLaB<3
January 5th, 2009, 07:12 PM
Yes bendyfoot:) I know also that when I finally decided it was time to get my dream dog, found many aweful breeders. SOOooOO MANY that said they had 'purebred' parents.. drives me up the tree, see you CANNOT say that UNLESS you have papers, but say it they do... there was a couple that did have registered dogs but NO showing or training period, just two registerd dogs having puppies... I saw enough labs that were WAY too tall for the breed standard.. I was amazingly lucky that a great lab family had a litter of puppies they had 13!! and lucky for me there was 2 girls that were not reserved so I had to travel a long way to get her but we have had her for 6 years! there are so many people out there breeding for the wrong reasons and the worst part is that they see nothing wrong with it!!!! I have had many dogs and almost all have been rescues but I had always wanted a yellow lab.. So I did it! I also have my baby he is a little shih tzu lhasa and he is awesome So you love rescues and breeder bred ones just the same, just make sure it is a really good one. HAHA funny thing too, is some of the BYB had labs for sale for the same price i paid for mine, and I got CKC papers, shots, insurance, microchip, guaruntee, support, ect..ect.. and their dogs were beeeeeauuuutiful! (aren't they all though...)

Spatx
January 5th, 2009, 09:47 PM
I originally wanted to get my next dog from a rescue, and had been looking into it, even contacted some rescues... but didn't have much luck finding a puppy/young female Border Collie who was a match for me. When the opportunity to get Nova from a breeder arose, I fell in love with her and decided to go the breeder route for the first time... and probably the last. I still often feel guilty I didn't get a rescue, and still find myself browsing dogs in need of homes on PetFinder, despite knowing I cannot get more dogs at this point in time. Although now that I have a BC, I find myself looking at even more BC's, plus so many other breeds that I love as well, along with lots of 'heinz '57' unknown mixes.. (If I had my way I'd probably have 10 rescued dogs and an acreage and spend all my time doing dogsports!)

I would never go back on my decision to get Nova, as she is exactly what I was hoping for, and I love her dearly. I'm happy that both my first dog Lucky, and Cody, were rescues. All my pet rats have come from rehomes/shelters/etc. So even though I sometimes feel guilt for going the route I did, I ended up with a puppy that fit with my family, existing dog, and lifestyle, plus so much more. She's going to be an amazing agility dog one day, and hopefully at anything she tries. Cody is also going to be a great flyball dog, he loves agility, camping, and our walks.. albeit he took a lot more work, and years of socializing to get to this point, but it makes the journey all that more precious and rewarding.

All I know is that next time I get a dog, I'll definitely be getting a rescue/shelter dog that needs a great home and lots of love and understanding :cloud9: I see nothing wrong with getting a dog from a responsible breeder, but I just know it's not the way I personally want to go next time. :)

clm
January 5th, 2009, 10:12 PM
I've never had any issues with getting our puppies from responsible breeders who truly breed for their love of the breed. Our first dog had been returned to his breeder after being with his family for only 2 months. This is certainly not the breed for everyone, they can be exhasperating dogs, stubborn, willful, yappy, a lot suffer from SA, normally rather standoffish. I know of another person who has a 6 year old who has said they would never get another one. :laughing: He loves his dog, but says you have to be a masochist to own one. :laughing:
I know of some kees with the highest obedience titles who will still jump out of a car window and pay no attention at all to their handler until they feel like it.
Did I know this before getting into this breed? Absolutely, we did loads of research into the breed, every breeder we saw regardless of if we thought they were good or not emphasised this is not the breed for the inexperienced nor the faint of heart and every breeder we got our pups from insisted they be returned to them if we ever had to part with them. Our last breeder only let us have 2 pups at the same time because we were experienced with the breed and she was still very concerned that we might be biting off more than we could chew. At times during the puppy stages, we thought she might be right. :laughing:
I love all dogs, mutts or purebreds, if I could have more than 2 dogs, I would very likely have a rescue dog along with my chosen breed, but I love this breed and will always have one. Our next Kees will be dogs returned to the breeder or retired show dogs or adults that don't fit into their breeding programs, even rescued dogs that come into their systems from time to time, will be too far past it to ever deal with raising one of these monsters from puppyhood again:laughing:. I must have a Kees in my life, for all the breeds bad points, they are the smartest, most adorable, comical and beautiful dogs IMO and will always be in my life, I will never feel guilty about getting any of my pups instead of getting a rescue dog, but I will always make donations to those who rescue and think the world of everyone involved in it.

Cindy

allymack
January 5th, 2009, 10:42 PM
Its great to read all of your views on this.

i do have to agree with buying from breeders. if they are in it for the lvoe of the breed and betterment and everything, i dont see a problem with that, i guess i just have mixed feelings about the topic right now. i agree with Spatx if i could i would have 10 more dogs and spend it all doing dog sprts with them :cloud9: i definately dont regret getting enzo at all and wouldnt trade him for the world, i just thinking getting one from a rescue is the route i shuld have taken, but i suppose we learn from our past? :o

Spatx
January 5th, 2009, 10:52 PM
Yeah, I feel much the same as you allymack :) I don't see a problem getting a dog from a responsible breeder, but I've just decided that I've learned from my past and it's not for me. I find rescues rewarding, and knowing that it's one less dog at a shelter in need of a family is always a good thing. I just can't wait until I'm in a position one day to have more than 2 dogs. Until then, I'll continue donating money and hopefully start being a foster parent again. I really miss having foster kittens around :lovestruck:

BenMax
January 6th, 2009, 07:40 AM
Never have gone to a breeder and never would no matter how ethical. I guess when you see, touch, hold and smell all those unwanted animals then you just loose the idea of buying a dog from a breeder.

My thoughts are simple. Do what you feel is right and ok for you. If you love your dog or cat then you did the right thing - no matter where you got him/her from. I try not to pass judgement but I must admit that I do have disappointments from friends when they do go to a breeder or petstore. I don't say anything to them but they know....(especially when they ask me to re-home afterwards :D).

AmericanBullMom
January 6th, 2009, 08:15 AM
I got Patrón as a Christmas present in 2007. When my dad started talking about getting me a puppy I literally BEGGED him to adopt a puppy from the shelter. But, instead, he bought Patrón as a 5 and 1/2 wk old puppy, from a HORRIBLE byb...
I still love my baby, I'd be lost without him, but I always think of how my dad could have saved the life of a shelter dog instead of promoting the bad breeding that Patró came from.
Next time, I WILL adopt a dog, I dont think I can go through another teething, chewing puppy :rolleyes:. Lol

Spatx
January 6th, 2009, 09:30 AM
Next time, I WILL adopt a dog, I dont think I can go through another teething, chewing puppy :rolleyes:. Lol

Lol, same here! Nova is a bit of a terror around the house, always getting into trouble in one sort or another. Can't trust her at all yet, and it may be another year before she gets more house freedom. Next time, I'm getting a dog that is at least a year or two old :laughing: Puppies are cute and all, but I really think I've got my share of the 'puppy experience' right now.

AmericanBullMom
January 6th, 2009, 09:33 AM
Lol, same here! Nova is a bit of a terror around the house, always getting into trouble in one sort or another. Can't trust her at all yet, and it may be another year before she gets more house freedom. Next time, I'm getting a dog that is at least a year or two old :laughing: Puppies are cute and all, but I really think I've got my share of the 'puppy experience' right now.

Amen to that! I did the "puppy" thing... and after all the socks and underwear, and destuffed stuffies.... I think I'm pretty much done with them!
I love my baby, but its amazing I didnt strangle him before he was a year old. :laughing:

clm
January 6th, 2009, 09:46 AM
Amen to that! I did the "puppy" thing... and after all the socks and underwear, and destuffed stuffies.... I think I'm pretty much done with them!
I love my baby, but its amazing I didnt strangle him before he was a year old. :laughing:

:laughing: Yes, the whole puppy thing is waaaay over rated. :laughing: I'm a slow learner though, having done it four times now. :laughing: Next dog(s) are definately going to be older, these last 2 have puppied me out. :laughing:

Cindy

bendyfoot
January 6th, 2009, 12:16 PM
Never have gone to a breeder and never would no matter how ethical. I guess when you see, touch, hold and smell all those unwanted animals then you just loose the idea of buying a dog from a breeder.

My thoughts are simple. Do what you feel is right and ok for you.

I agree with this, to a point, I don't support buying/getting pets from pet stores or from any kind of BYB.

If you love your dog or cat then you did the right thing - no matter where you got him/her from. I try not to pass judgement but I must admit that I do have disappointments from friends when they do go to a breeder or petstore. I don't say anything to them but they know....(especially when they ask me to re-home afterwards :D).


(my bolding added)...JMO but I think there's a HUGE difference between dogs found in pet stores and those purchased from conscientious breeders...:shrug:

BenMax
January 6th, 2009, 12:22 PM
(my bolding added)...JMO but I think there's a HUGE difference between dogs found in pet stores and those purchased from conscientious breeders...:shrug:

I agree with you but I would seriously perfer that they go to rescues and shelters. Ethical or not - I am disappointed..but that is just me.

bendyfoot
January 6th, 2009, 12:35 PM
:Dfair enough. It's my preference too. I just don't see it as being fundamentally WRONG to go to a responsible breeder.

BenMax
January 6th, 2009, 12:54 PM
:Dfair enough. It's my preference too. I just don't see it as being fundamentally WRONG to go to a responsible breeder.

There is nothing wrong at all with going to a responsible breeder - but when there are so many breeds waiting for a second chance I don't know why someone would go to a breeder if you are not showing. Let's not forget that breeders dogs do come into the shelters and rescues - I just moved one out on Sunday that had papers from here to there...and really what for.

bendyfoot
January 6th, 2009, 12:59 PM
IMO that's a failing of the breeder, and indicative of irresponsibility. Breeders IMO should stay in touch with their pups.

BenMax
January 6th, 2009, 01:08 PM
IMO that's a failing of the breeder, and indicative of irresponsibility. Breeders IMO should stay in touch with their pups.

But I guess the next question is for how long should a breeder track their animals? Shelters do not, and nor do most rescues.

(this is an exciting thread):thumbs up

hazelrunpack
January 6th, 2009, 01:23 PM
Nor is it possible for every pup to be tracked :shrug: The ethical breeder at least makes the effort. But no system is foolproof.

Man, BenMax, if someone I knew bought from a petstore or a BYB and then came to me later for help re-homing, I think I'd have a great deal of trouble staying civil. How do you do it?

Oh...almost forgot...I also wanted to point out that some people prefer purebreds even if they're not showing. If you need a dog to herd your sheep, you'd likely look for a breed suitable to that need, whether or not you show. :shrug:

bendyfoot
January 6th, 2009, 01:28 PM
Sigh. I guess maybe I'm too idealistic? I just think that if a breeder's only producing one or two litters a year and some go to "pet" homes, that a yearly check-in couldn't be that hard? Maybe something in the contract stipulating that the owners have to update any changes of address, etc? I guess some people won't follow contracts no matter how well they're laid out, but...sigh. I dunno.

And yeah, I'd be sooooo mad if that happened to me too, HRP. I had a coworker last year who bought not one but TWO puppies from a shady petstore in MTL (obviously a broker of puppy mills), a boxer and a pug, and couldn't handle either of them. I left to a new job before I found out what happened with them, but I wouldn't be surprised if they're not with her anymore. On top of all that, she was always talking about breeding them:wall: I did my best to educate her, but I eventually had to just tell her I didn't want to talk about it anymore.

BenMax
January 6th, 2009, 01:28 PM
Man, BenMax, if someone I knew bought from a petstore or a BYB and then came to me later for help re-homing, I think I'd have a great deal of trouble staying civil. How do you do it?

:shrug:

Hazel the only time I actually loose it is if I witness someone kicking their dog to me (which did actually happen - and he got kicked back once I had the leash :D - and of course the threat that I inflicted bodily harm on him (doube :D). I always stay calm (yes I can be) and then go into my educational mode. I also provide 'literature' upon their departure.

As for people I know - trust me - the ties are cut from there on. I will never accept nor understand that.

hazelrunpack
January 6th, 2009, 01:33 PM
I don't think a yearly checkup is bad, either. But unless you actually drove out to inspect the place, you still can't tell for sure :shrug: Email has made it easier for breeders to at least touch bases with owners of their dogs, but it's still no guarantee. Macie's brother was just rescued from starvation, and no one had a clue even though a number of people regularly had email contact with the guy.

Ford Girl
January 6th, 2009, 01:53 PM
Lol, same here! Nova is a bit of a terror around the house, always getting into trouble in one sort or another. Can't trust her at all yet, and it may be another year before she gets more house freedom. Next time, I'm getting a dog that is at least a year or two old :laughing: Puppies are cute and all, but I really think I've got my share of the 'puppy experience' right now.

Amen to that! I did the "puppy" thing... and after all the socks and underwear, and destuffed stuffies.... I think I'm pretty much done with them!
I love my baby, but its amazing I didnt strangle him before he was a year old. :laughing:

Amen to that! I'll never get another puppy again. :evil: :laughing: Cute they may be, but soooooooooo much work. :clown:

I don't think I'd buy from a breeder either, even if it was proven 100% ethical, my days at the Humane Society ensured any future dogs would be rescues. There are so many pure bred there, its amazing to me that people would spend that kinda $$$$$ and go to a breeder unless thye were going to show the dog.

luckypenny
January 6th, 2009, 02:29 PM
I dont think I can go through another teething, chewing puppy :rolleyes:. Lol

Puppies are cute and all, but I really think I've got my share of the 'puppy experience' right now.

Amen to that! I did the "puppy" thing... and after all the socks and underwear, and destuffed stuffies.... I think I'm pretty much done with them!
I love my baby, but its amazing I didnt strangle him before he was a year old. :laughing:

Yes, the whole puppy thing is waaaay over rated. :laughing: I'm a slow learner though, having done it four times now. :laughing: Next dog(s) are definately going to be older, these last 2 have puppied me out. :laughing:

Amen to that! I'll never get another puppy again. :evil: :laughing: Cute they may be, but soooooooooo much work. :clown:


:eek: You guys are giving puppies such a bad rap :yell:.

None of our puppies have ever fit any of that criteria :rolleyes:. As a matter of fact, we have Flying Firecracker...err...I mean, we have Fascinating Friendly Fanny as proof :D.

Ford Girl
January 6th, 2009, 02:34 PM
LP - you are the puppy whisperer. :) It's you that makes it look all so easy. Plus, you pups are are very well behaved, not like my devil. lol!!

luckypenny
January 6th, 2009, 02:40 PM
Oh, our pups are no different from any others :D, we're just suckers for punishment :laughing:.

They are a lot of work, something I wish more people understood before spontaneously bringing one home, from where ever. A puppy is a puppy, they're all :evil:.

:cloud9: :cloud9: :cloud9:

BenMax
January 6th, 2009, 02:48 PM
Amen to that! I'll never get another puppy again. :evil: :laughing: Cute they may be, but soooooooooo much work. :clown:

I don't think I'd buy from a breeder either, even if it was proven 100% ethical, my days at the Humane Society ensured any future dogs would be rescues. There are so many pure bred there, its amazing to me that people would spend that kinda $$$$$ and go to a breeder unless thye were going to show the dog.

Back to topic. I believe for us that have worked very closely with shelter animals we are maybe 'tainted' perhaps in the sense that we see so many. It is very difficult to see them one day and the next day they are gone....and not to a home.

Hazel - Evaluations are done at shelters and rescues. Based on the evaulations you CAN get a dog that is purebred or otherwise who fulfills a certain need or requirement that someone is looking for in a breed. If you are patient then you will get what you want without having to pay big bucks for a breed and their required traits.

Dekka
January 6th, 2009, 03:02 PM
people pay the $$ if they want a dog with health and temperment guarantees, if they want breeder support and an expert that will help with any issue just a phone call away. They don't want a byb or puppy milled purebred dog (well bred and purebred are not the same)

They may want specific traits and can't find them in a shelter dog.

You can adopt a well bred dog who for what ever reason isn't going to be bred.. For example if a dog comes back to a breeder-that dog needs a home and still comes with the benefits. Sometimes a dog will show well but have a minor issue that makes it unsuitable to be bred.. that dog will be looking for a home.

I have done all ways of adding dogs to my homes, I have adopted from shelters, and rescues, I have bred and I have bought from breeders. IMO you need to have people willing to do all of them if we want to get out of this mess.

(see my thread)

BenMax
January 6th, 2009, 03:08 PM
[QUOTE=Dekka;726366]people pay the $$ if they want a dog with health and temperment guarantees, if they want breeder support and an expert that will help with any issue just a phone call away. They don't want a byb or puppy milled purebred dog (well bred and purebred are not the same)

They may want specific traits and can't find them in a shelter dog.

QUOTE]

Point well taken Dekka. If all breeders (yes the ethical) would support their buyers then ok I agree - but they do not. (Indeed I am generalizing ..sorry).

You can find these traits in a shelter dog whether he/she is pure or not.
My Rott that was adopted from a shelter was 100% true to the breed - I could not ask for more. Indeed he obviously lacked in health - but cancer can occur in a purebred breeder dog can it not?

BMDLuver
January 6th, 2009, 03:15 PM
Oh yeah........ damn cancer is all over the Berners...... good breeders or not it's hard to genetically pinpoint........

BenMax
January 6th, 2009, 03:22 PM
BDMLuver - you have seen berners at the shelter that were owner abandoned right? Would you say that they are just as good as any berner bred by an ethical breeder? Would you say that some are true to their breed? Would you recommend someone who wants a berner to go to the SPCA? Would some of these berners have the desired traits that someone would want?

AmericanBullMom
January 6th, 2009, 03:33 PM
LIKE I said... Puppies are WONDERFUL... when they are sleeping!!

I love my puppy to pieces... But its a miracle I didnt pinch his big ol' head right off! Lol

Course I feel the same with Kittens too. I'm not predjudice! I'll take a year old kitty over a kitten ANY day!!! I've got kitten scars where Mako tried to become an anklet:eek:.... It didnt work out so well.... For me.... he, of course, thought it was GREAT FUN!:D

:sorry::offtopic: Just realized I was totally Off Topic!

hazelrunpack
January 6th, 2009, 07:31 PM
Hazel - Evaluations are done at shelters and rescues. Based on the evaulations you CAN get a dog that is purebred or otherwise who fulfills a certain need or requirement that someone is looking for in a breed. If you are patient then you will get what you want without having to pay big bucks for a breed and their required traits.

I agree. And that's what we did--we adopted purebreds that had been rescued by a breeder. We did pay a fee for all four rescues, which recompensed the breeder for some, but not all, of the expenses she incurred in the rescues.

But my point was about why someone might be interested in a pure-bred dog as opposed to a mixed breed. If, for example, you're looking for a pointing dog, you're likely going to have to go with a purebred or (possibly) a purebred cross to get the trait you're looking for. I did not mean to imply that you can't find such a dog at the shelter or with a rescue.

BMDLuver
January 6th, 2009, 07:36 PM
BDMLuver - you have seen berners at the shelter that were owner abandoned right? Would you say that they are just as good as any berner bred by an ethical breeder? Would you say that some are true to their breed? Would you recommend someone who wants a berner to go to the SPCA? Would some of these berners have the desired traits that someone would want?

I've had 100% clean xrayed dogs from the spca... it's the luck of the draw..... they all deserve a chance and I don't think that buying from a breeder guarantees everything.... of course, if you have cerf and ofa guaranteed from a breeder on 5 generations then that says something but it doesn't guarantee non cancer, never can or can't just yet...

Dekka
January 6th, 2009, 07:52 PM
I've had 100% clean xrayed dogs from the spca... it's the luck of the draw..... they all deserve a chance and I don't think that buying from a breeder guarantees everything.... of course, if you have cerf and ofa guaranteed from a breeder on 5 generations then that says something but it doesn't guarantee non cancer, never can or can't just yet...

No you can't guarantee about cancer.. but a good breeder should refund if your dog gets cancer at a young age (in a Berner say before 5) The problem with cancer is that there are so many causes. You can buy the healthiest dog but if you feed it crap, expose it to loads of second hand smoke and all sorts of chemicals the dog will chances develop cancer.

IMO if you dont' have enthusiastic breeder support then you don't have a good breeder. A good breeder should be (and should want to be) responsible for the lives they produce.

Frenchy
January 6th, 2009, 09:11 PM
2 of my dogs came from pounds , 2 from the spca (one was a mini puppy mill for a BYB , the other is from a puppy mill that was close by the spca , thank dog !) and one was dumped at 12 years old because the couple was getting a divorce and wanted to put her down. :frustrated: my 2 cats are Badger's rescues.

I never will buy from a breeder , too many cats and dogs are on death row. And I find that rescues are usually very greatfull , they know they got a second chance on life. :shrug:

BMDLuver
January 7th, 2009, 07:22 PM
No you can't guarantee about cancer.. but a good breeder should refund if your dog gets cancer at a young age (in a Berner say before 5) The problem with cancer is that there are so many causes. You can buy the healthiest dog but if you feed it crap, expose it to loads of second hand smoke and all sorts of chemicals the dog will chances develop cancer.

IMO if you dont' have enthusiastic breeder support then you don't have a good breeder. A good breeder should be (and should want to be) responsible for the lives they produce.

See, the problem is... if I am going to go with a Breeder then I want 100% guarantee that I will never lose my Berner to anything but old age.. call it nuts but I have 2 of the most expensive Berners at home right now from rescue and I know that longevity won't be there no matter what I do... I've toyed for a long time with going with a Breeder on my next one as the heartache is tough... I don't care diddly squat about money and refunding... I only care about getting a guarantee that I won't have to say to my kids.. sorry but it's time to let him/her go after only having them for a few years... that's my point.. really...... rescue is pretty much a gamble if you don't work with one who does hips elbows etc before adoption but some of us do... why.. to avoid passing on the agony to another family if we can.. one I have now is with me because no one else could handle all his problems and he still has quality of life enough to continue on.. but the kids knew when he arrived that he wouldn't have years and years... just a couple of happy ones if we can extend it that long pain free... basically, I don't think there is a right or wrong choice except to fall for the puppy in an internet ad or petshop.. then it's a whole other ball o wax..