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No such thing as an outdoor dog?

moontamara
July 25th, 2004, 03:35 AM
Wait a minute... I don't want to hijack someone else's thread so I'm starting a new one here, but what??? Dogs should always be indoor pets? Even dobermans? Shocked is overstating it, but I'm well, confused! What about farm dogs? They are almost always outdoors, and yet very happy, well-adjusted dogs (at least the one's my grandparents raised -- and they raised them as outdoor pets, who also protected the home by barking). They loved those dogs, even spending outrageous amounts of money to save one's life once, and letting them in if the weather was too harsh, but they were definitely outdoor dogs.

While growing up my family had outdoor dogs too, and we also let them in when the weather was too cold or too stormy or whatever... But they were great, wonderful happy dogs! We even had heated doghouses (and cat-houses) for them. My family loved dogs and cats, but it turned out a family member (me) was allergic to them, and outside they went! There were always two of each and we gave them tons of attention, and I really think they were okay.

I love having an indoor (non-allergenic poodle) dog, and that's the only kind of pet I'll probably raise for the rest of my life , so don't worry -- but I'm just genuinely confused about this.

WOODY
July 25th, 2004, 09:20 AM
You have just touched a raw nerve with some of the members on this board -I am sure.
There are those who thin dogs should not be left alone for more than a couple of hours and that dogs need constant attention from their humans etc. I do not tend to agree with this in some instances since I also had outside dogs growing up and still have one who - while she has access to the indoors and heated facilities 24/7 tends to like to curl up and snooze in the snow.
I hope the responders are gentle to you since you are a relative newbie.
Flack jackets can be bought on line...LOL
WOODY :D

Goldenmom
July 25th, 2004, 09:34 AM
I have to agree to a certain extent. Some dogs that have been raised outside, LOVE it outside and don't even want to be inside. These are usually the heavy coated ones that any kind of weather does not faze on them. Although, I think Dobermans and Rottie's are another kind that you see outside often. I enjoy going down country roads and seeing the farm dogs lying on the driveways, happy as a pig in sh**! Ask them if they want to go inside? The answer would be no, we are very happy out here in nature, watching the bunnies and squirrels go by.

On the other hand, there are dogs that are "people" dogs and need to be close to people. There is a fine line between what dogs are ok outside, and which are not.

I think in the case of the Dobie that was a problem in one of the threads, this dog is sick and unhealthy right now. He "wants" to be inside, that was made clear. I can't see keeping a dog outside that wants and needs to be close to people, for whatever reason.

I'm not a firm believer on either side of the fence. Its a case by case situation.

JMHO
Heather and her 2 Golden Girls

MBRA518
July 25th, 2004, 10:31 AM
I have to agree to a certain extent. Some dogs that have been raised outside, LOVE it outside and don't even want to be inside. These are usually the heavy coated ones that any kind of weather does not faze on them. Although, I think Dobermans and Rottie's are another kind that you see outside often. I enjoy going down country roads and seeing the farm dogs lying on the driveways, happy as a pig in sh**! Ask them if they want to go inside? The answer would be no, we are very happy out here in nature, watching the bunnies and squirrels go by.

On the other hand, there are dogs that are "people" dogs and need to be close to people. There is a fine line between what dogs are ok outside, and which are not.

I think in the case of the Dobie that was a problem in one of the threads, this dog is sick and unhealthy right now. He "wants" to be inside, that was made clear. I can't see keeping a dog outside that wants and needs to be close to people, for whatever reason.

I'm not a firm believer on either side of the fence. Its a case by case situation.

JMHO
Heather and her 2 Golden Girls

Well since that's pretty much my opinion too.... Ditto :D

Lucky Rescue
July 25th, 2004, 10:31 AM
Its a case by case situation.

Right. There's a big difference between farm dogs who work, have the company of other dogs, the freedom of the entire farm and who have their people around most of the time and a dog who is left alone in a yard night and day in the city with nothing to do and NO company at all while their owners work.

Dobermans are not outside dogs or kennel dogs. They are people loving - "velcro dogs", as Heiress said - who need to be near their owners. They are also dogs with a very sparse coat who cannot tolerate low temperatures.

My last dog had an extremely thick coat and loved to lie in the snow, but he wanted to be inside when we were because dogs are pack animals and are not solitary by nature.

MBRA518
July 25th, 2004, 11:13 AM
Right. There's a big difference between farm dogs who work, have the company of other dogs, the freedom of the entire farm and who have their people around most of the time and a dog who is left alone in a yard night and day in the city with nothing to do and NO company at all while their owners work.

I agree with you on your post - but not all farm dogs work, as in herding dogs or the like - some are just pets, and maybe watch dogs to some extent... our dogs (when I was growing up) were always outside when we were away... they seemed to like that better, but we did have 2 dogs so they were not alone and they have the entire property at their disposal and insulated dog houses, a boxer and a boxer/dob, and they were always in at night, or in bad weather. And they were both very happy and healthy dogs - the boxer lived to 14 and the other til she was 15 - both well over the life expectancy.

I think many dogs would choose to be outside on nice days - and some even on bad days but it really depends on the dog (both the breed and personality) - My rottie lived with the 2 older dogs on the farm until she was 1yr old and she would much rather lay on the couch than the grass... even when the other 2 were outside... so that's where she gets to stay - but if she wanted to be out - she would be left out in her fenced yard.

Cactus Flower
July 25th, 2004, 02:28 PM
Hmm. I tend to just let the dog decide.

My Great Dane has little interest in being outside, unless I am outside. She follows me from room to room, yes- even to the toilet :eek: . When I let her out to go potty, if I am not RIGHT THERE at the door to open it again when she is done, she cries as though someone is killing her. She wants in.

My Finnish Spitz, however, prefers to spend most of her time outside. She comes in to eat and sometimes to visit, but then goes straight to the door to be let out. If I don't let her out right away, she'll paw me and run back to the door. Often I stand at the door when she is outside, holding it open and inviting her, almost begging her at times to come in. Nope. She'll come to the door to say hello and get a pat, but she's really not interested. When I insist that she comes in to visit, she stays for the attention, but when not being actively slobbered over, she wants back out. She'll pout at the door. Paw. Whatever it takes. She LOVES cold weather and has the coat for it. She has a lovely warm house out there, but she thrives in the colder weather and lays out in it quite often. I just make sure to spend plenty of time outside visiting with her to be sure she gets equal attention, and at times I insist that she comes inside to be with the whole family, to remind her that she is part of "Us"- then I let her back out.

I would never deny a dog who wanted to live inside, nor would I deny one who is unhappy inside and wants to enjoy the outdoors.

glasslass
July 25th, 2004, 03:11 PM
I've always had small dogs which are of course indoors most of the time. With a doggie door, they go in & out quite often and like to bask in the sun on the patio. I think the problem is when the dog is kept out who wants to be inside. And "out of sight, out of mind" seems to be what happens to those dogs. Time goes by fast and people don't spend any quality time with them, sometimes even neglecting to check the water dish or make sure they are protected from the elements. Maybe their intentions are good, but their actual actions are criminal!

melanie
July 25th, 2004, 05:32 PM
i agree case by case. there is a psychological disorder we all suffer from called animorphism (i am very serious, it does exist and that is its term), put simply, it is where we project human feelings into a dogs actions, ie he is sad or depressed because little jimmy didnt want to play, but do dogs actually feel our versions of these emotions?? well no, but many a human ego says yes.
that said i think dogs do have emotion ect but i think alot of people cannot deal with their own emotions associated with leaving a creature outside or at home etc.. now i think many people forget a dogs natural environment is the wild, domesticated or not that is where the species habitat is. at the local dingo sanctuary dogs are kept in their pens outside thier whole lives, and even though offered beds and shelter the dogs often refuse to use them and sleep on the ground like they naturally would, a good indication of dog preferences.
now with my girl she is both. she like to be outside and in. i can go out for 10hrs if i wanted to and she is more than happy to hang around the back yard and i have never had a problem, when we were on the farm she would stay out all day, only in at night, but she didnt wnat to come in during the day. i think dogs need to be flexible, the first rule is not to let a dog rule your life isnt it?? arent we supposed to share our lives with the animal. :D :D good topic

glasslass
July 25th, 2004, 06:05 PM
I'm an early riser. Den-Den likes to sleep in. He'll even sometimes go to bed before us after he's gotten tired of waiting. When I work in the backyard, he'll often get bored and go inside to nap. Actually, he'd like to be able to tell US what to do and when to do it. :D

Maybe we overdo it, but yes, I do feel animals feel more emotions than people want to give them credit for. How about KoKo, the gorilla that signs, and that kitten she lost? Proof positive.

melanie
July 25th, 2004, 06:14 PM
im not saying animals dont have emotions, it is just that human ego and emotion assumes the animals feel the way we do, i feel sad, so when my dog is sad it must be the same feeling?? animals feel a miriad of emotion, i know this from experience, but i dont believe we can claim to know that emotion or feeling. eg recent scientific studies show that no two humans can ever expereince the exact same feeling, so your sadness feels different to my sadness because we are both individuals with individual brains, it is called your reality, and everyones is different. and i believe this is the same for animals.
signed the worlds biggest animorphism sufferer :D :D :D :D

Luba
July 25th, 2004, 06:25 PM
I tend to see it this way...since we made the dog a domestic it's our responsibility to shield them from harm, including elements of the outdoors (sun, cold, snow, ice, parasites, bugs and such)

I agree with a dog having freedom to run and play and explore but do not agree with a dog being outside 24 hours a day.

A dog even that enjoys the elements outside is not nearly as closely examined as one who lives indoors. A dog around us all the time, we're more likely to notice any ailments or troubles.

Thats just my opinion :D

glasslass
July 25th, 2004, 06:25 PM
You have a really good point. Altho, I tend to think our pets tend to mimic us. When Den-Den is jealous and turns his back to me, I tend to reassure him and make a fuss over him. I'm sure different things we do tend to teach them appropriate responses to feelings they experience. Dogs are so responsive to us and read our most subtle body language. They communicate to us too by their body language.

Cactus Flower
July 25th, 2004, 06:56 PM
Wow!

Melanie, you impress me.

Period.

moontamara
July 26th, 2004, 01:42 AM
Well, I can't say anyone said anything I really disagree with. I particularly liked what glassglass said about what can be wrong with outdoor pets, And "out of sight, out of mind" seems to be what happens to those dogs.

After having an indoor dog, I would never want it otherwise, but I know people who do. Actually, especially in the country in Korea, but in those cases there are always at least two dogs, and usually more.

Anyway, I don't think my question was too badly received, was it Woody?

Stewart
July 26th, 2004, 01:58 AM
:cool: Pardon me for butting in ..... Its only the dead fish that go with the flow ! .... well it made me think when i first heard it lol !

moontamara
July 26th, 2004, 04:01 AM
Stewart, did I miss something? I don't know what you're talking about.

glasslass
July 26th, 2004, 10:18 AM
:confused: :confused: I guess I missed it too! :confused: :confused: Sometimes the "flow" goes so smoothly because it goes in the right direction.

Cactus Flower
July 26th, 2004, 12:15 PM
I understand the "out of sight, out of mind" tendencies, but this is not a sign of a responsible pet owner. It's up to the owner to make sure that a pet that prefers to be outside gets the same amount of love and attention and inspection as any other dog. I do also recommend bringing them in frequently to remind them that they are "part of". I should add that my spitz is housetrained, etc, so there will never be a reason for me to prefer her outside rather than in. (Her house manners are impeccable). It's simply her own preference to be outside most of the time.

Stewart
July 26th, 2004, 12:55 PM
;) Moontamara what i meant was your right just do whatever is best for your own situation regarding the houseing of your dogs , there is no right or wrong way so long as it is not causeing the dog any undue suffering . just because some think otherwise to yourself dosentmake you wrong and them right .... hence they just go with a flow not do thier own thing !

Spoiled
July 26th, 2004, 07:14 PM
What about farm dogs? They are almost always outdoors, and yet very happy, well-adjusted dogs

I didn't read all the other posts because this thread is a bit long.

I think that some breeds love it outside, and wouldn't trade it for anything. Sled dogs, for example. Outdoor dogs get lots of attention, too. There are huge, shaggy dogs who love to be outside and wouldn't trade it for anything. It really just depends on the dog and the owner. My dog is definitly a house dog. He follows us around and trips us if we step back quickly. :D Our other dog loved it outside, and never came in the house. He didn't want to.

So I think that when there is a difference in personality, size, and coat, you would notice it and decide for yourself whether your dog would be happier inside or out.

moontamara
July 27th, 2004, 01:59 AM
Casey trips me up too! Poodles, at least toy ones, definitely fit under the indoor category! I couldn't imagine sticking him outside alone, even just for a minute! He cries if I close a door behind me with him on the other side! It's nice to feel needed :)

moontamara
July 27th, 2004, 02:00 AM
I see what you're saying, Stewart. I actually thought you meant the opposite, which confused me greatly!