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Mother Moving her Kittens...

kitty2008
October 20th, 2008, 12:00 AM
Hello all,

I am the proud grandfather to a litter of 3 beautiful kittens. I'm just having a difference of opinion with the mother as to where she should keep this kittens. Before and during her pregnancy, she had her area in the laundry room which is where I assumed she would give birth. Unfortunately, on the night, she chose to give birth under the sofa. So I moved the kittens into their mother's box in the laundry room, and had the carpet steam cleaned to remove the birthing mess (did I mention that I rent and while pets are allowed, ruining the carpet isn't).

This has worked for the past 3 weeks but yesterday I noticed the mom moving the kittens back under the sofa. Now I've done my research and understand mostly why she would be moving her litter, I'd just rather have them on the tiles instead of on the carpet I just had steam cleaned.

My main concerns are keeping the carpet clean. For the moment I've constructed a slightly larger shelter, which she doesn't mind, and placed it beside the sofa which is sitting flat on the ground since I took its legs off. I haven't really noticed if the kittens are urinating/defecating. If they are, I really don't know where it is going. For now, should I give into my cat and let her keep her litter under the sofa on the carpet? I know that newborn kittens have a transition period where they don't really know how to use the litter box. Should I confine them to the laundry room and just let them out for a while each day?

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Love4himies
October 20th, 2008, 06:29 AM
Just wondering if you rescued this girl while she was pregnant or did you allow her to breed?

Momma wants her kittens where she wants them, if she is moving them, it is because she doesn't feel the current place is acceptable. She needs a quiet, secure place that is in a low traffic area, preferable a spare room that is closed off to any other household pets.

At three weeks momma is licking the kittens bums to stimulate them to go to the bathroom. Soon they will be going on their own and they don't come litter trained so beware of that. It takes a couple of days for them to learn where to go. BTW, DO NOT use clumping litter, you will find the kittens will eat the litter and clumping litter will cause blockages and possible death.

Melinda
October 20th, 2008, 08:06 AM
she seems to want them "under" something, could you construct a box with a cover? more like a shelter to her?........when you take mom in to get spayed maybe the vet will check over the kittens for you at the same time, are you keeping the kittens or finding good forever homes for them?

ownedbycats
October 20th, 2008, 10:11 AM
there might be way you can let mama cat have her way and still protect the carpet. we just took in a pregnant stray a while ago, and she wanted her kittens where she wanted them, and no one could change her mind. (fortunetely she picked mostly-convenient for the humans spots). Maybe put something like a tarp down to cover the rug under the couch? You can sometimes get cheap vinyl tableclothes at the dollar store, we used those to protect the carpet in our kittens' corner under the stairs from spilled food and litter. You have to layer them, because kittens' claws are sharp and they like to pull at them, and you will porbably have to replace them, though by that time they should be litter trained.

bendyfoot
October 20th, 2008, 11:03 AM
We had a momma cat in our house once, and although they had a lovely setup in a bedroom upstairs, she insisted on moving them to a dank, dark corner of the basement for several weeks...every attempt to relocate them was thwarted for at least a few weeks. :shrug: No help, really, but I understand.

kitty2008
October 20th, 2008, 06:15 PM
she seems to want them "under" something, could you construct a box with a cover? more like a shelter to her?........when you take mom in to get spayed maybe the vet will check over the kittens for you at the same time, are you keeping the kittens or finding good forever homes for them?

I never said anything about getting my cat spayed.

kitty2008
October 20th, 2008, 06:17 PM
Just wondering if you rescued this girl while she was pregnant or did you allow her to breed?

Momma wants her kittens where she wants them, if she is moving them, it is because she doesn't feel the current place is acceptable. She needs a quiet, secure place that is in a low traffic area, preferable a spare room that is closed off to any other household pets.

At three weeks momma is licking the kittens bums to stimulate them to go to the bathroom. Soon they will be going on their own and they don't come litter trained so beware of that. It takes a couple of days for them to learn where to go. BTW, DO NOT use clumping litter, you will find the kittens will eat the litter and clumping litter will cause blockages and possible death.

No I allowed her to breed, I got her when she about 8 or 9 weeks old. The weird thing is that she has taken her litter from a secure low traffic area; to a loud, well lit, high traffic area (under the couch in the living room).

Also thanks about the litter tip!

babymomma
October 20th, 2008, 06:24 PM
No I allowed her to breed, I got her when she about 8 or 9 weeks old.

:wall::wall: Bad thing to say on the forum.. Im just going to keep my comments out of this one:wall::yell::frustrated:

happycats
October 20th, 2008, 06:34 PM
I never said anything about getting my cat spayed.

Why wouldn't you get her spayed? Do you have any idea how many cats get euthanized every day, month year !!
Look at those cute little kittens long and hard, then say good bye, and you should say "sorry" because the sad fact is, at least 2 (probably all) will be dumped or Euthanized before they are 5!

14+kitties
October 20th, 2008, 07:06 PM
This person has obviously come here to cause problems. Most people know, or should know by reading our posted rules, that this is a VERY PRO SPAY/NEUTER board. Answering back that they allowed the cat to breed is just, IMO, rude.

Please do not drag this post on by continuing to post answers.

kitty2008
October 20th, 2008, 08:05 PM
:wall::wall: Bad thing to say on the forum.. Im just going to keep my comments out of this one:wall::yell::frustrated:

Why wouldn't you get her spayed? Do you have any idea how many cats get euthanized every day, month year !!
Look at those cute little kittens long and hard, then say good bye, and you should say "sorry" because the sad fact is, at least 2 (probably all) will be dumped or Euthanized before they are 5!

This person has obviously come here to cause problems. Most people know, or should know by reading our posted rules, that this is a VERY PRO SPAY/NEUTER board. Answering back that they allowed the cat to breed is just, IMO, rude.

Please do not drag this post on by continuing to post answers.

Wow, talk about Ready-Fire-Aim! I DID NOT SAY I WASN'T GOING TO GET MY CAT SPAYED! To be honest I've been doing my research on the matter and to be honest...there is a lack of research on it. My mentality is that I wouldn't do anything to my cat that I wouldn't do to my own child. Now how many people here can say that they had their children's reproductive capabilities removed? This is a Canadian site. Does anyone remember the mentality of the Saskatchewan Provincial Government a few decades ago in regards to mentally handicapped children? They had these poor children sterilized against their will to prevent the burden of their offspring. Sound inhumane? Sound familiar?

The fact is I have yet to find a recent PUBLISHED, PEER REVIEWED JOURNAL ARTICLE (the minimum Health Canada requires to even apply for a human treatment) that supports the claim that there is no adverse effects to cat sterilization (both physical and psychological). All there seems to be is anecdotal evidence provided by vets and other pet owners.

To be honest I think it is practical to get my cat spayed. In my own defense I am going by the most recent legitimate research which states that a female cat should be allowed to produce at least 1 litter before being spayed (reduces female cancers by 80%!!!!!). As I said, I have planned to keep all the kittens and care for them myself. At the moment I'm just having moral issues with deciding to get her spayed. Luckily I have around 2 weeks to make my mind up. I do really appreciate all your help in my time of need so far...but I am disappointed that instead of providing me with facts, you all decided to flame me.

Just to set the record straight:
happycats: I am keeping ALL THE KITTENS. So your point is moot. Please don't assume my intentions before you flame me.

14+kittens: No I didn't come here to cause problems. YOUR IMMATURITY is the cause of your problem. Since this is a pro sterilization board, which I do appreciate, how about you get off your high horse for a minute and provide me with facts to ease my conscious?

Jim Hall
October 20th, 2008, 08:05 PM
i dis agree and wish y all wouldnt dump on the op
it kitty is asking for advice whatever her reasons pro spay means only pro spay? isnt it better to be nice ?

NO one has to reply if they dont feel the need to but save teh rant for somewhere else



ANYWAY kitty try lay down a lot of cheap sheets

let her keep them where she wants and let her wean them you will see elimination and hopefully cath a kitten in the act and be able to set her in the box usually kjits are pretty quik learners you havent mentioned a vet visit but of course that would be in order good luck and really do think about getting mommma spayed you know thare are way too many criitters around that need your loving.

aslan
October 20th, 2008, 08:12 PM
First off there were some suggestions made to you about how to deal with your situation.

secondly, how dare you... you say you deliberately got your cat pregnant on a pro spay and neuter forum, then mouth off at a woman who at last count has over 30 cats that she has foot the bill to spay/neuter, feed, provide shelter to, because someone deliberately didn't get their cat spayed/neutered.

There is a huge difference between a child and a cat, if a child becomes pregnant the rest of the family steps in to help support it. If an unfixed cat gets pregnant, they get taken to the shelters to either be adopted or put to sleep because there are sooooo many unwanted cats as it is. Or the next popular option, drive by someone like 14+ kitties house, pitch the cat out the window and keep driving, because IMMATURE people like her have nothing better to spend their time, money and emotions on.

It's unfortunate that you aren't getting the answers you want from the people here. Google the topic and see if that helps,.

t.pettet
October 20th, 2008, 08:17 PM
Is it not best to just sometimes IGNORE, IGNORE, rather than try to educate someone who can't be?

happycats
October 20th, 2008, 08:20 PM
hmmmm I DID NOT SAY I WASN'T GOING TO GET MY CAT SPAYED!
I never said anything about getting my cat spayed.


UMMMMMMM now you deny you posted this ??

and what about this My main concerns are keeping the carpet clean your worried about your freakin carpets, more then your cat and kittens!!

I haven't really noticed if the kittens are urinating/defecating


If you did ANY freakin research at all you would know where the waste was going!!


I hope to god you "research" spay/neuter better then you did breeding!!

Isn't the fact that millions of cats getting euthanized every year enough for you not to bring any more in the world??

If not there are many many post on here about the pros and cons of spay/neuter.////PLEASE get educated!

aslan
October 20th, 2008, 08:22 PM
lol, i personally like how he mouthed off at you that you should read before flaming, 'cause he's keeping the Kittens, like he already said' then realized he didn't say it and had to edit his post.:laughing:

happycats
October 20th, 2008, 08:27 PM
lol, i personally like how he mouthed off at you that you should read before flaming, 'cause he's keeping the Kittens, like he already said' then realized he didn't say it and had to edit his post.:laughing:


LOL!!

Is it not best to just sometimes IGNORE, IGNORE, rather than try to educate someone who can't be?

I believe everyone is capable of being educated:)

Frenchy
October 20th, 2008, 08:29 PM
14+kittens: No I didn't come here to cause problems. YOUR IMMATURITY is the cause of your problem. Since this is a pro sterilization board, which I do appreciate, how about you get off your high horse for a minute and provide me with facts to ease my conscious?

14+ ? Immature ? You may like to know that this woman has saved I don't know how many stray cats and had them all spayed and neutered to stop the overpopulation , with her own money.

Now you want facts ? You can spend a day or 2 at a high kill shelter and see how many cats are being put down because there's just too many , why ? Because people allow them to breed.

As for your original question , I would let the mom cat bring her kitties wherever she wants to.

happycats
October 20th, 2008, 08:41 PM
My mentality is that I wouldn't do anything to my cat that I wouldn't do to my own child. Now how many people here can say that they had their children's reproductive capabilities removed?


Ummmmmm Apples and Oranges!!! Cats are dependant on you for life (about 20 years) and so are all it's kittens . My child will be educated, and independant, and totally able to support a family when the child is grown up and ready!! Besides we don't euthanize unwanted babies.

luckypenny
October 20th, 2008, 08:43 PM
In my own defense I am going by the most recent legitimate research which states that a female cat should be allowed to produce at least 1 litter before being spayed (reduces female cancers by 80%!!!!!). As I said, I have planned to keep all the kittens and care for them myself. At the moment I'm just having moral issues with deciding to get her spayed.

What concerns me about these statements is if, let's say, 3 of the kittens are females, are they going to be allowed to have a litter of kittens each as well :shrug:? And then their female kittens :eek:? How many are you willing to keep?

As for your original question, the plastic table cloth covered with an old comforter or towels sounds like a good idea. You could always clean your carpet again.

aslan
October 20th, 2008, 08:45 PM
What concerns me about these statements is if, let's say, 3 of the kittens are females, are they going to be allowed to have a litter of kittens each as well :shrug:? And then their female kittens :eek:? How many are you willing to keep?

As for your original question, the plastic table cloth covered with an old comforter or towels sounds like a good idea. You could always clean your carpet again.

concerns me more is if he's against neutering and spaying, what if one of the 3 kittens is male.

luckypenny
October 20th, 2008, 09:13 PM
Onster summed it up pretty well, imo.

What pisses me off is all these people...talking about the moral dilemna faced when they have to take out the cats reproductive organs....for some reason it just makes me want to scream.. morals eh...well ummm HELLO what about the ethics of all the cats that are being euthanised every day. ... its basically alll about measuring where the greater good lies...sooo even if poor kitty cat misses his manly parts , weighing that against the thousands of poor kitty cats that are missing their actual lives..it doesnt take a genius to realize that ethically one has to neuter or spay.

14+kitties
October 20th, 2008, 09:17 PM
kitty2008 - yes, I agree, I was a little rude. I apologize. Maybe it's because we have had far too many people come on this site and make statements like "I never said anything about spaying my cat?" This one was one of my personal favourites....

http://www.pets.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=56140&highlight=cat+pregnant

Saying that...... most cats move their kittens from a place we feel is safe to a different place because they do not feel their kittens are safe. She moved them to a place where she felt they would be the safest. :shrug: '

May I recommend a book to you? It's called "THE COMPLETE CAT CARE MANUAL" BY Dr. Andrew Edney. It is great reading and will answer a lot of your questions.

I would also like to help you a little with your other research.
I Googled.......
Is it better to let a cat have a litter before spaying her?
and it came up with 36,000 replies. I am adding a few of them for your reading enjoyment.
Again, I apologize for my earlier rudeness.

http://www.americanpartnershipforpets.org/appspayneuteranswers.html

Isn't it better to let my female have one litter first?

Medical evidence suggests that the opposite is true. In fact, evidence shows that females spayed before their first estrus or "heat" period (which occurs around 5-6 months of age) tend to be healthier.

http://www.querycat.com/faq/176a5440d58c4a3e5e7e999cedafd51f

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080225074300AAIIzvX

http://cats.about.com/od/catcare/Cat_Care.htm

http://www.parmashelter.org/adoption/advice/spay_neuter.htm

http://members.optusnet.com.au/glevum/persianandexotics/comand.html


Aslan and Frenchy - thanks for sticking up for me. :grouphug:

kathryn
October 20th, 2008, 09:29 PM
Cat's do what they want. That's really all there is too it :shrug: While they are intelligent, they are still not capable of thinking on the exact same level as we are. They think differently.

kitty2008
October 21st, 2008, 05:48 AM
First off there were some suggestions made to you about how to deal with your situation.

I know there were some constructive suggestions made, and I thanked those people. There is also a lot of people here who attack me and assume a lot.

secondly, how dare you... you say you deliberately got your cat pregnant on a pro spay and neuter forum, then mouth off at a woman who at last count has over 30 cats that she has foot the bill to spay/neuter, feed, provide shelter to, because someone deliberately didn't get their cat spayed/neutered.

How dare you make such assumptions and put words in my mouth. All I'm looking for is information. All I'm getting is a lot of judgmental people releasing their frustration on me. Unfortunately, this forum is also a good source of information. So I have to weed through you trolls to get to the good stuff.

There is a huge difference between a child and a cat, if a child becomes pregnant the rest of the family steps in to help support it. If an unfixed cat gets pregnant, they get taken to the shelters to either be adopted or put to sleep because there are sooooo many unwanted cats as it is. Or the next popular option, drive by someone like 14+ kitties house, pitch the cat out the window and keep driving, because IMMATURE people like her have nothing better to spend their time, money and emotions on.

According to the research (education is a powerful thing, you should try it sometime), there is nothing wrong with neutering a male. The research I've been able to find in regards to females so far is...inconsistent at best. Plus, why do you insist on jumping to conclusions? I don't have 14+ cats yet and am nowhere near that situation yet so please calm down.

It's unfortunate that you aren't getting the answers you want from the people here. Google the topic and see if that helps,.

Yeah...google brought me here.

kitty2008
October 21st, 2008, 05:50 AM
Is it not best to just sometimes IGNORE, IGNORE, rather than try to educate someone who can't be?

I'm asking to be educated. I'd prefer to have facts rather than people just telling me what do to without a reasonable explanation.

kitty2008
October 21st, 2008, 06:02 AM
hmmmm I DID NOT SAY I WASN'T GOING TO GET MY CAT SPAYED!



UMMMMMMM now you deny you posted this ??

You see your problem is you assume too much. I didn't say I wasn't going to get my cat spayed, and I didn't say I was going to get her spayed. I was actually going to get some more useful information out of this thread and start another one about any ill effects of getting my cat spayed (they do exist which is why I have been hesitant so far). I honestly didn't expect everyone to attack.

and what about this My main concerns are keeping the carpet clean your worried about your freakin carpets, more then your cat and kittens!!

Yeah that is the most pressing issue at the moment. It is why I started this thread. It is why you opened this this thread. I cannot get my cat spayed for weeks...but my carpet can get destroyed in that time.

I haven't really noticed if the kittens are urinating/defecating


If you did ANY freakin research at all you would know where the waste was going!!

I thought that was the point of coming to this forum. For people to help out with questions...especially for beginners.


I hope to god you "research" spay/neuter better then you did breeding!!

I didn't plan for my cat to get pregnant. It happened and I will deal with it.

Isn't the fact that millions of cats getting euthanized every year enough for you not to bring any more in the world??

I love my cat and I do not want to do anything to harm her which is why I am looking for some information on this topic.

If not there are many many post on here about the pros and cons of spay/neuter.////PLEASE get educated!

I'm not looking for a debate. I'm looking for information. Please stop taking this so personally and if you can't contribute in a positive manner then please press ALT-F4...

kitty2008
October 21st, 2008, 06:05 AM
lol, i personally like how he mouthed off at you that you should read before flaming, 'cause he's keeping the Kittens, like he already said' then realized he didn't say it and had to edit his post.:laughing:

I like how this is how you waste your time. I wrote something in error and fixed it within seconds.

kitty2008
October 21st, 2008, 06:07 AM
14+ ? Immature ? You may like to know that this woman has saved I don't know how many stray cats and had them all spayed and neutered to stop the overpopulation , with her own money.

Now you want facts ? You can spend a day or 2 at a high kill shelter and see how many cats are being put down because there's just too many , why ? Because people allow them to breed.

As for your original question , I would let the mom cat bring her kitties wherever she wants to.

See I'm asking for proof...not your scare tactics. Why do the people in this thread assume I don't want to get my cat spayed? I've stated many times that that I am not anti-spaying...I just PLEASE want some information and not scare tactics!

kitty2008
October 21st, 2008, 06:17 AM
Onster summed it up pretty well, imo.

Yeah what your wrote is true for males. Nulliparous females however run the risk of MANY fatal diseases in the future.

kitty2008
October 21st, 2008, 06:29 AM
kitty2008 - yes, I agree, I was a little rude. I apologize. Maybe it's because we have had far too many people come on this site and make statements like "I never said anything about spaying my cat?" This one was one of my personal favourites....

http://www.pets.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=56140&highlight=cat+pregnant

Saying that...... most cats move their kittens from a place we feel is safe to a different place because they do not feel their kittens are safe. She moved them to a place where she felt they would be the safest. :shrug: '

May I recommend a book to you? It's called "THE COMPLETE CAT CARE MANUAL" BY Dr. Andrew Edney. It is great reading and will answer a lot of your questions.

I would also like to help you a little with your other research.
I Googled.......
Is it better to let a cat have a litter before spaying her?
and it came up with 36,000 replies. I am adding a few of them for your reading enjoyment.
Again, I apologize for my earlier rudeness.

http://www.americanpartnershipforpets.org/appspayneuteranswers.html

Isn't it better to let my female have one litter first?

Medical evidence suggests that the opposite is true. In fact, evidence shows that females spayed before their first estrus or "heat" period (which occurs around 5-6 months of age) tend to be healthier.

http://www.querycat.com/faq/176a5440d58c4a3e5e7e999cedafd51f

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080225074300AAIIzvX

http://cats.about.com/od/catcare/Cat_Care.htm

http://www.parmashelter.org/adoption/advice/spay_neuter.htm

http://members.optusnet.com.au/glevum/persianandexotics/comand.html


Aslan and Frenchy - thanks for sticking up for me. :grouphug:

I thank you very much for your time and effort 14+. I think we've gotten off to the wrong start. You see if you look in my bookmarks folder you will see most of the same sites you linked...and more. However an article I found in an issue of Nature contraindicates what I've found on the web. Personally anyone can write a web page, or get a book published...The Journal of Nature on the other hand is an independent, peer-reviewed journal.

Either way I think I'm going to wait until my cat stop nursing and get her spayed.

AmericanBullMom
October 21st, 2008, 06:31 AM
Kitty2008 Its probably best that you just quit while you're ahead. you've gotten a lot of very useful information from us, and anything else you need to know you can call your vet and ask them.

Nearly EVERYONE on this forum is pro s/n... IMO unless you are a breeding for the LOVE of the breed, and you are doing it ethically you are nothing more than a BYB. YOU are one of the thousands upon thousands of misinformed "breeders" in the world helping to overpopulate the planet with unwanted pets.
I hope you NEVER have to experience a euthanization in a pet shelter because no one adopted that animal. But maybe you should.
I realize you "Never said that you werent going to spay your cat".... but it should have been done already! I also realize that you are keeping the kittens, but what happens if one gets out? and gets pregnant? are you going to keep them too? And so on...and so forth...
Just my :2cents:

Chances are this thread will be closed soon. You should probably just leave well enough alone.

Love4himies
October 21st, 2008, 06:41 AM
No I allowed her to breed, I got her when she about 8 or 9 weeks old.



I didn't plan for my cat to get pregnant. It happened and I will deal with it.

I love my cat and I do not want to do anything to harm her which is why I am looking for some information on this topic.



You allowed her in one post, but you didn't plan in another post hmmmm, what should we believe??

Anyways, you have the kittens now and they should be our priority. As I mentioned in an earlier post, the kittens will not come litter trained, they will think the litter box is a playground. I purchased a couple of kitten litter boxes and placed them where they had a tendency to "go". BTW, I foster, I don't, and have never allowed any of my cats to breed.

At 4 weeks they can start eating a watered down QUALITY canned food, Kitten Wellness canned is a great food!!!! You can find it at most quality pet food stores. It his human quality, high meat protein food, just what your kittens need for the rapid growth of their organs. If you care for your cats as your children, then please ensure they are eating quality food, not processed crap full of corn, wheat gluten, and meat byproducts:

Also, it is best to allow your kittens to milk for as long as they want, momma will slowly wean them. Do not cut them off cold turkey as this can cause health problems with momma's mammory glands.

http://www.catinfo.org/

http://www.wellnesspetfood.com/cat_wellness_can_kitten.html


BEFORE you allow any of your cats to breed again, spend some time at your local shelter and ask yourself if you really want to contribute to the overpopulation. Female cats don't have the same maternal instinct as humans so please don't compare them. Momma can be spayed when all her milk has dried up, speak to your vet, he/she will be able to advise you better.

To 14+kittens :grouphug:. if only this man knew how much you do and how much you give up, to save the strays who have been dropped off in the country :angel:.

Love4himies
October 21st, 2008, 06:45 AM
Either way I think I'm going to wait until my cat stop nursing and get her spayed.

Great!!! Trust me, you kitty will be much happier spayed, than not!

If you would like to continue with the experience of taking care of momma and kittens then you can always apply for fostering at your local shelter. It is a wonderful experience and momma's and babies do so much better in a home environment, than in a cage.

kathryn
October 21st, 2008, 07:20 AM
Kitty2008, we aren't the only ones who feel strongly about spay/neuter. Lots of people do on lots of sites. You did say "No I allowed her to breed". That's all it takes to set people off. I'm going to have to say yes, are are quick to jump at everyones throats, if you understood what we have to deal with daily, I promise you'd understand. And while I'm sure we've already left you with a bad impression, we really do have a good reason to freak out.

I live in New Jersey, which is one of the lowest kill states in the US. But even then, in just my small corner of the world, 40,000 animals where still euthanized in shelters last year. http://www.state.nj.us/health/cd/documents/animaldisp07.pdf

While many of those animals were unadoptable due to aggression or illness, it's still a sad statistic, won't you agree?

I work with rescues in the state of Georgia. And while I'm hoping you are still reading my post, I'm aware you might have angrily skipped over it. In the Atlanta metro area alone, in about 10 (small) counties, according to 2005 statistics, they impounded 130,000 animals and euthanized over 80,000. http://www.spotsociety.org/2005helterStatsOverview.htm

Furthermore, most of these animals died in carbon monoxide gassing chambers. A horrible way to die, don't you think? Spending your last moments of a short life being shoved into a hot and smelly metal box with other animals, screaming and fighting for your life, then the hissing sound of the gas being turned on. According to my rescue friends, some shelters use other forms of poisonous gas that burn the eyes and throats of the dying animals. Other shelters are so poor, they take an old pick up truck, back it up to a brick room, turn on the truck and let the exhaust suffocate the animals inside the room http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2005/04/0411_050411_peteuthanasia_2.html


Please understand, we don't hate you. We are just upset. We are upset that more kittens are coming into this world where millions are already being killed. http://www.shelterrescue.org/id20.html

http://www.freewebs.com/ncche/index.htm


This is why we yell. (http://borntodiepets.com/index.htm)


http://www.freewebs.com/ncche/northampton.jpg
That is why we are upset.


For your original question, as I said before, 'Queens' (mom cats) will do what they want. Just make sure the kittens can't get under anything or into anything hazardous.

Thank you.

kitty2008
October 21st, 2008, 09:08 AM
You allowed her in one post, but you didn't plan in another post hmmmm, what should we believe??

If you wish to take my words out of context then you can believe anything you want.

Anyways, you have the kittens now and they should be our priority. As I mentioned in an earlier post, the kittens will not come litter trained, they will think the litter box is a playground. I purchased a couple of kitten litter boxes and placed them where they had a tendency to "go". BTW, I foster, I don't, and have never allowed any of my cats to breed.

At 4 weeks they can start eating a watered down QUALITY canned food, Kitten Wellness canned is a great food!!!! You can find it at most quality pet food stores. It his human quality, high meat protein food, just what your kittens need for the rapid growth of their organs. If you care for your cats as your children, then please ensure they are eating quality food, not processed crap full of corn, wheat gluten, and meat byproducts:

Also, it is best to allow your kittens to milk for as long as they want, momma will slowly wean them. Do not cut them off cold turkey as this can cause health problems with momma's mammory glands.

http://www.catinfo.org/

http://www.wellnesspetfood.com/cat_wellness_can_kitten.html


BEFORE you allow any of your cats to breed again, spend some time at your local shelter and ask yourself if you really want to contribute to the overpopulation. Female cats don't have the same maternal instinct as humans so please don't compare them. Momma can be spayed when all her milk has dried up, speak to your vet, he/she will be able to advise you better.

To 14+kittens :grouphug:. if only this man knew how much you do and how much you give up, to save the strays who have been dropped off in the country :angel:.

I sincerely thank you for your help and your effort. I just wish you'd get over this whole "kitten overpopulation is going to end the world" attitude. I mean cut me some slack already. I think I've explained myself enough. Let's just try to be mature shall we?

kitty2008
October 21st, 2008, 09:21 AM
Kitty2008, we aren't the only ones who feel strongly about spay/neuter. Lots of people do on lots of sites. You did say "No I allowed her to breed". That's all it takes to set people off. I'm going to have to say yes, are are quick to jump at everyones throats, if you understood what we have to deal with daily, I promise you'd understand. And while I'm sure we've already left you with a bad impression, we really do have a good reason to freak out.

I live in New Jersey, which is one of the lowest kill states in the US. But even then, in just my small corner of the world, 40,000 animals where still euthanized in shelters last year. http://www.state.nj.us/health/cd/documents/animaldisp07.pdf

While many of those animals were unadoptable due to aggression or illness, it's still a sad statistic, won't you agree?

I work with rescues in the state of Georgia. And while I'm hoping you are still reading my post, I'm aware you might have angrily skipped over it. In the Atlanta metro area alone, in about 10 (small) counties, according to 2005 statistics, they impounded 130,000 animals and euthanized over 80,000. http://www.spotsociety.org/2005helterStatsOverview.htm

Furthermore, most of these animals died in carbon monoxide gassing chambers. A horrible way to die, don't you think? Spending your last moments of a short life being shoved into a hot and smelly metal box with other animals, screaming and fighting for your life, then the hissing sound of the gas being turned on. According to my rescue friends, some shelters use other forms of poisonous gas that burn the eyes and throats of the dying animals. Other shelters are so poor, they take an old pick up truck, back it up to a brick room, turn on the truck and let the exhaust suffocate the animals inside the room http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2005/04/0411_050411_peteuthanasia_2.html


Please understand, we don't hate you. We are just upset. We are upset that more kittens are coming into this world where millions are already being killed. http://www.shelterrescue.org/id20.html

http://www.freewebs.com/ncche/index.htm


This is why we yell. (http://borntodiepets.com/index.htm)


http://www.freewebs.com/ncche/northampton.jpg
That is why we are upset.


For your original question, as I said before, 'Queens' (mom cats) will do what they want. Just make sure the kittens can't get under anything or into anything hazardous.

Thank you.

This goes to kathryn and everyone else who is still on this: I totally agree with you guys. Now all I need to to borrow someone's time machine so I can go back in time and make sure my cat got spayed before she got pregnant.

It must sound ridiculous but from my point of view you guys are really over-killing this whole thing. I can't even fathom what goes through your minds when your hands are on the keyboard. So unless anyone has anything USEFUL to contribute to this thread I ask that you simply keep your 2 to yourself! No more pictures...no more horror stories. Please re-read my original post and do feel free to give advice relevant to THIS topic!

I would like to thank ALL who have helped so far and any more who feel like they can :thumbs up

Love4himies
October 21st, 2008, 09:23 AM
If you wish to take my words out of context then you can believe anything you want.



I sincerely thank you for your help and your effort. I just wish you'd get over this whole "kitten overpopulation is going to end the world" attitude. I mean cut me some slack already. I think I've explained myself enough. Let's just try to be mature shall we?


I really am being as nice to you as I can, it really doesn't help to be rude. I did not take your words out of context, they are direct quotes from you.

If you really, really do care about cats, visit the shelter, it is heartbreaking.


My last bit of advice to have your momma and kittens checked out by a vet, he/she can check to ensure all is well in her uterus.

kitty2008
October 21st, 2008, 09:26 AM
I really am being as nice to you as I can, it really doesn't help to be rude. I did not take your words out of context, they are direct quotes from you.

If you really, really do care about cats, visit the shelter, it is heartbreaking.


My last bit of advice to have your momma and kittens checked out by a vet, he/she can check to ensure all is well in her uterus.

Likewise. You have to understand how hard it is for me to have so many people attack me. People on this forum have been as rude and arrogant as I can imagine outside some teenager forum. I asked for help and got abused.

About your shelter thing...I don't need to see a shelter. I don't need to see cats dying. I GET THE POINT NOW CAN YOU?

AmericanBullMom
October 21st, 2008, 09:39 AM
L4H is right... YOU are being rude now. You cam on a Pro s/n forum, search our threads and you'll see.....

JUST STOP! We've said all we can say, and have been as nice as possible... Have your cat seen by a vet, then I pray that you have ALL of them spayed and give them a wonderful life. End of Story.

aslan
October 21st, 2008, 10:53 AM
i'm not going to attack or be rude, i do have a couple quick questions. No matter if it was planned or an accident it happened. question 1. was it a male you knew and put them together or was it an outdoor kitty she hooked up with.

If it's the latter 2. was she taken to a vet after mating. unfortunately not knowing the male causes a whoooole bunch more issues. You don't know sir humpalots medical records and could have passed something to your momma thus to the kitties.

Goodluck with the little ones. I will apologize if you thought i was being rude, i on the other hand was sticking up for a wonderful woman whom i thought was being bashed.

14+kitties
October 21st, 2008, 12:14 PM
Thanks again guys for supporting me. :grouphug: You ladies are the absolute best! Unfortunately I guess until you walk a day in the shoes of.......... :shrug:

I am asking that this thread now be closed. Enough has been said.

Chris21711
October 21st, 2008, 12:20 PM
I am asking that this thread now be closed. Enough has been said.

Here, Here there is another one on the burner :wall:

babymomma
October 21st, 2008, 01:14 PM
The Op called US rude? .. Just imagine if i had said everything that was on my mind, because she would have thought alot worse. YOU my dear, are being rude as well, So maybe you , the pot, should stop calling the kettles black.

marko
October 21st, 2008, 03:24 PM
This thread has run its course and will now be closed.
Thx - Marko - Admin