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A small update on Czarina.

ancientgirl
July 12th, 2008, 04:39 PM
This morning when I went into the kitchen Czarina kept following me. I got the impression she might want to go out so after I put everyone's food out I left the screen open slightly and she went out. She walked around the living room for a bit then went upstairs. She got into the closet and sat in the corner for a few minutes. Vlad managed to go in and sit about a foot away from her. They eyed each other for a few seconds and Czarina started hissing. Vlad wanted to play so he lifted his paw towards her but I guess she saw it as an aggressive motion on his part so she swatted at him. I had the spray bottle so I hit some spray in her direction.

She then came out of the closet and came downstairs. She passed Maks and Kiska and hissed at them a few times and went back into the kitchen. Oksana had been sitting at the window sill the entire time. Apparently Little Miss wasn't in the mood to check out the new girl.

I went to my dad's house for a couple of hours and when I came back she wanted out again. So seeing she wanted out I left the screen open again. She did the same thing. Came out into the living room walked around then went under the orange chairs. Maks and Vlad got close to her but she just hissed and swatted.

After a few minutes she came from under the chair and started walking towards the kitchen. On the way Kiska started to follow her and she stopped to hiss and swat at Kiska, and started to lunge towards her but luckily when I clapped my hands and said NO she kept on her way to the kitchen.

I've had her inside for a month. I started giving her Prozac in topical form for about 2 weeks, then had to stop when she wouldn't let me near her ears. After having her off of it for a week I got a prescription for pills and she's been on the pills for about 2 weeks. According to the vet the medication takes between 2 to 3 weeks to begin having results. I'm hoping to see her less anxious soon and especially hoping she will at least stop swatting and lunging at the others.

I'd love to allow her to spend more time outside the kitchen, but I can't trust her right now with the others. Even if I'm hear watching I'm afraid I won't be able to turn my back for a second. I don't want anybody hurt. I don't believe the others would do anything to her. They are curious about her and not at all aggressive. Vlad sits in front of the screen and sticks his paw in to touch her. Even after she hisses and swats at him he still keeps doing it. But, I know they would try to defend themselves if she tried to go for them so that's what I'm trying to avoid for everyone.

I'm crossing my fingers to see a little more progress in the next few weeks. :fingerscr

krdahmer
July 12th, 2008, 04:45 PM
I have no doubt you will... the prozac should start really making a difference any time now. (Was on it myself after I got fired and it took a good 4-5 weeks before I really got some relief.) :fingerscr That Vlad is making some headway on befriending the new girl (he's too cute extending the paw of friendship!):lovestruck:!

chico2
July 12th, 2008, 04:53 PM
Ancient,it sounds all good and normal to me,once Tzarina realizes the others are no threat,everything will be fine.
I am certain you'll succeed this time around:thumbs up

14+kitties
July 12th, 2008, 04:56 PM
I would take every little bit as progress. She is feeling more comfortable walking around obviously. That's great!
You have to remember when she was outside she had to probably fight for what she wanted. Or at least put on a good show. That might be all it is, a show. Then again, there may be a few scuffles before things settle. You may have to allow them to happen.
I know you are afraid that someone will get seriously hurt. I don't know. She is listening to you when you clap your hands and raise your voice. Just make sure you keep that spray bottle near you. But make it just a spray please, not the whole bottle. :rolleyes: I've heard of someone, a neighbour, using whole glasses of water on a cat repeatedly lately and then wondering why it's nasty. Well DUH! I know you have more sense than that.
Remember girl.... baby steps. Tiny baby steps. She has come a long long way in a little more than a month. :thumbs up

ancientgirl
July 12th, 2008, 05:01 PM
I have no doubt you will... the prozac should start really making a difference any time now. (Was on it myself after I got fired and it took a good 4-5 weeks before I really got some relief.) :fingerscr That Vlad is making some headway on befriending the new girl (he's too cute extending the paw of friendship!):lovestruck:!

Vlad is just a sweetheart. He's such a little Ambassador. I hope the Prozac starts to kick in soon too. I know when she comes out she must be stressed. The others start to follow her and she becomes afraid. I wish she knew they just are curious and won't hurt her.

Ancient,it sounds all good and normal to me,once Tzarina realizes the others are no threat,everything will be fine.
I am certain you'll succeed this time around:thumbs up

I've GOT to succeed this time around. I can't fail. She's got nowhere else to go if I can't make this work and she deserves to have a home. I sometimes wonder if it was fate for me to find her. I wasn't supposed to even move here. When I was looking for an apartment I asked my friend if his was rented and he said yes. I'd given up hope of moving but then after about a month my friend calls me out of he blue and said his renter was leaving. I saw Czarina after I'd only been here a few days. She was under a bush she never ever sat under after that day. :)

ancientgirl
July 12th, 2008, 05:07 PM
But make it just a spray please, not the whole bottle. :rolleyes: I've heard of someone, a neighbour, using whole glasses of water on a cat repeatedly lately and then wondering why it's nasty. Well DUH! I know you have more sense than that.


:laughing: Worry not my dear, it's just a bottle. Geez, an entire glass of water? I'd be angry too!

Yeah, I have to see these things as progress. I also keep telling myself it's only been a month and she's been outside for over 3 years. Slow progress is better than no progress.

Chris21711
July 12th, 2008, 05:59 PM
I think that she is doing great AG. I don't find her behaviour abnormal. It's not like she has gone into a home with one other cat, but four, that is quite a difference. It's all good AG :thumbs up

ancientgirl
July 12th, 2008, 06:30 PM
Chris, it's true. It can't be easy for her. It would be different if maybe it were even just two more, but four is like an army coming at her.

Chris21711
July 12th, 2008, 06:54 PM
Take a deep breath and all will be good. Before you know it you will be wondering why you fretted so much AG.

ancientgirl
July 12th, 2008, 06:55 PM
I'm going to hold ykou to that Chris:D

Dracko
July 12th, 2008, 08:05 PM
I think this is great news. She might never be overly friendly with the others but if she can co-exist and learn they won't hurt her that will be good.

Years ago when I had Teddy and Bean I adopted Mochie (she is 15 now). They never, ever ended up being buddies with her. Bean hated her being too close. Teddy would occasionally lick Mochie but then sort of realize what he was doing and run away. He was not aggressive with her but Bean was. In the almost 10 years I had the 3 of them together (Ted/Bean were put down when they were 18) they tolerated one another. They all learned where they place was and didn't fight. Well Bean would hiss like Czarina if Mochie got too close but didn't full out attack or anything like that.

She might never be buddies like the others are. Much like how Oksana has her own personality and tends to keep to herself, Czarina will show you what she likes/needs. The simple fact she isn't freaking to get outside ever second is amazing to me and says a lot. As long as she knows she has a "safe place" she'll explore and then go back there.

ancientgirl
July 12th, 2008, 08:30 PM
I think this is great news. She might never be overly friendly with the others but if she can co-exist and learn they won't hurt her that will be good.

Years ago when I had Teddy and Bean I adopted Mochie (she is 15 now). They never, ever ended up being buddies with her. Bean hated her being too close. Teddy would occasionally lick Mochie but then sort of realize what he was doing and run away. He was not aggressive with her but Bean was. In the almost 10 years I had the 3 of them together (Ted/Bean were put down when they were 18) they tolerated one another. They all learned where they place was and didn't fight. Well Bean would hiss like Czarina if Mochie got too close but didn't full out attack or anything like that.

She might never be buddies like the others are. Much like how Oksana has her own personality and tends to keep to herself, Czarina will show you what she likes/needs. The simple fact she isn't freaking to get outside ever second is amazing to me and says a lot. As long as she knows she has a "safe place" she'll explore and then go back there.

Dracko, thank you for sharing that. I'm becoming more aware the more you and the others with multiple kitties give their stories that there's always hissing of some kind. I can live with her hissing.

Oksana is very much a loner and is fine doing her own thing, but she does hang out with the others now and then. She knows she is loved and we have our own little special routine in the mornings. Just like I have a special little routine with the others. I'm sure I'll develop the same with Czarina so that she feels she has her place.

When she walked around she did sit on the windowsill for a few seconds and looked out, so I wonder if she longed for the great outdoors.

There are plenty of spots for everybody. I know Oksana likes to sometimes sleep in my closet as does Vlad. I knew where each of them sleeps in there too. Maks and Kiska have their own places out in the living room too. I hope Czarina also finds a spot.

I'll see if she wants to explore a little tomorrow again. I think as long as she is open to it and wants to do it, I should let her. It seems unless she does that she'll never get used to the others or realize they won't hurt her, so the more she wants to walk around I'll just let her and watch them.

Dracko
July 13th, 2008, 03:24 AM
The hissing is completely normal. I lived with it for many years with my other ones. Mochie learned to avoid Bean. I have to admit that it is much nicer, though, to have cats that don't hiss, spit at each other now. Though my cats aren't overly cuddly with one another. Smitty and Ginkgo are. My Smitty is like your Maks...he'll cuddle with anyone. But what surprises me is my youngest (Teiya/Kinsey) are about a year old and I got them in September. They are sisters and at the shelter were cuddling away. Now...notta. You'd never know they were from the same litter. They never fight or anything but even if they are on the bed at the same time they NEVER cuddle. I find it sort of strange. And they never clean one another. They do play together, though.

Oh another thing. I adopted Ginkgo from the SPCA when she was 6 months old. I could NEVER pick her up. She would always fight to get away. 100% of the time she would do that. It took about a year but she now loves to be picked up and kissed, hugged, etc. I honestly never thought she would change.

Kinsey is one of those cats that always wants to be petted but she is nervous. She absolutely freaks if I pick her up. I've got my fingers crossed she allows me to pick her up one day. Her sister Teiya just this week! started to come and visit me when I am on the computer or in bed. I got them in September and until now she has sort of done her own thing and not seemed to need human bonding. Well, low and behold I wake up the other morning and she's cuddled to my side. :eek: I didn't dare move. Yesterday and last night she was in my bed a lot lying close to me letting me pet her tons. Just a few mins ago she came and snuggled up next to me in bed. I'm sorry to go on but my point is that it can take time. They learn to trust you and for some cats it can take a lot longer to trust and let down their guard.

Love4himies
July 13th, 2008, 08:23 AM
Sounds like it is going very well and that Czarina is settling in as normal as can be.

She is not aggressive which is great news, will make the integration much easier.

Jasper does the raising of the paw too when he first met Misty (the stray I was feeding last year), Puddles and Sweet Pea. It does let the scared cat know that he does not have aggressive intentions, but wants to play, the hiss back means, I am not ready right now, so please leave me alone.

ancientgirl
July 13th, 2008, 08:54 AM
Dracko, when I first saw and brought Maks and Kiska home they never left each others side. They were always huddled together. Now they rarely do that, only now and then. But they still play and clean each other. Oksana used to like being picked up and carried, now she hates it. Loves being petted but on her terms. I feel like they go through these periods just to confuse us.:laughing:

She's walking around in the living room now. She walked out of the screen again to explore. She even touched noses with Maks for half a second before she hissed at him:D

She stopped at the cardboard scratcher and Vlad rushed towards her. She saw it as an aggressive move so she growled and hissed at him and they began a short swatting match. She's not used to "play" fighting and I don't know if she will ever know the difference. But hopefully little by little she will stop seeing every approach as an aggressive one.

L4H, that last sentence makes sense. At least she's giving warning and not all out attacking them. The others back off too so they are also giving her space. Right now the others are playing and chasing each other. She's under the orange chair observing.

I'll let her be out as long as she wants. I'm sure she'll go back to the kitchen when she feels she's had enough of the gang.

Love4himies
July 13th, 2008, 12:21 PM
I think they are going to be getting along very shortly. Maybe I should get Sweet Pea and Puddles on Prozac too

ancientgirl
July 13th, 2008, 12:59 PM
It's taking forever for her to get the affects. I had her on it for 2 weeks using the topical, but I had to stop because she would not let me touch her ear. Then I had to wait a week before I could get the actual pills. So I had to basically start over again. It takes about 3 weeks or 4 for it to start working in their system, and she's been on the pills for about 2 weeks now. I know she's still a bit stressed and anxious, so I'm hoping for her to start feeling a little more relaxed soon.

hazelrunpack
July 13th, 2008, 03:56 PM
I have no cat experience, but it sounds like progress, AG! :thumbs up Slow progress, to be sure, but at least things seem to be moving in the right direction. :grouphug:

:offtopic: I wish I could get into your picture threads! :frustrated: s.l.o.w. connection the past few days... :o Just didn't want you to think I was ignoring your eye candy! :D

ancientgirl
July 13th, 2008, 04:55 PM
Slow progress is better than no progress. I'm happy things are at least still civil. :laughing:

Oy, I hope you can get your connection to speed up a bit. I'm going to post more tomorrow. I managed to get some really nice close-up pictures of her this afternoon!

ancientgirl
July 13th, 2008, 04:59 PM
:laughing: Okay, I just came back from the kitchen. So far today, I've caught both Maks AND now Vlad sleeping in Czarina's pyramid.

It will be curious to see her reaction when she tries to go into it later and gets a whiff of both of them.

Those boys:rolleyes:

chico2
July 13th, 2008, 05:30 PM
Sorry ancient,if I don't post all that much,still very slow on the Forum,but I am still following Czarinas progress.
Wanted to read what happened with the pyramid:cat:

hazelrunpack
July 13th, 2008, 09:00 PM
Oy, I hope you can get your connection to speed up a bit. I'm going to post more tomorrow. I managed to get some really nice close-up pictures of her this afternoon!

growler sent me your threads as single posts...and I'm hoping in a few days I'll be able to open them :thumbs up We had a lot of rain in the past few days and that always fritzes up the buried phone lines. :rolleyes:

I'll have to PM growler about the close-up pics, too... :D

ancientgirl
July 13th, 2008, 09:17 PM
I think you're going to like them.:D

hazelrunpack
July 13th, 2008, 09:44 PM
Well, of course I'm gonna like 'em!!! What's not to like? I 'spect I'll love them! :thumbs up

Dracko
July 14th, 2008, 02:15 AM
How sweet that the boys went to sleep in her pyramid. :laughing:

ancientgirl
July 14th, 2008, 12:31 PM
That pyramid used to be Maks'. Well it was Vlad's first, but he never was very interested in it, of course unless Oksana was in it.

When I brought Maks and Kiska home Maks just loved it!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v516/ancientgirl/Maks/018-1.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v516/ancientgirl/Maks/036.jpg

Then when I first got Czarina in here she immediately saw it as a safe little place to be and I just let her have it when she escaped. I gave it to Miguel to put in the carrier downstairs for her. I figured, Maks had plenty of places to sleep and feel safe, but she didn't.

I have some baby powder scented kitty cologne at home. I think I'm going to begin putting some on all of them this week. That way when the weekend comes around again and I let her out for a bit maybe their scents will all be meshed so that she will relax a little more.

phoozles
July 14th, 2008, 04:13 PM
Just saw this now - wow, sounds like Czarina is coming along very nicely! Especially with her dealing with 4 other kitties, for her not to lunge after any of them sounds really good! :goodvibes: for continued success!

ancientgirl
July 14th, 2008, 04:19 PM
She did really well in the morning and early afternoon. But towards late afternoon, she started getting a little aggressive towards them and did start lunging, especially after Kiska. I've got to just keep working with her on the weekends for short periods. The medication will hopefully begin to work soon.

I can deal with her hissing at the others, but I need to see she's not going to lunge at them. I don't want anyone hurt.

The others lunge at each other, but it's in play. She doesn't understand the concept yet of playing with another kitty. I don't know if she ever will. For now though, we are making some progress. :D

Jim Hall
July 14th, 2008, 09:30 PM
give em a time out if czarina gets aggresive can you pick her up and put her back in her safe place ? i timed out manda a few times when she was gettting aggressive playing called her name picled her up and put her in the bathroom with the water on for distraction, after a few iomes she knew not to do that lol du giving her a swat once in a while didnt hurt either


I have a feelling its to early for letting the kits interact freely but you are a good judge and your the one on the scene

ancientgirl
July 15th, 2008, 08:34 AM
I can try the time out, that's a good idea. She hates being picked up so that also might be a deterrent. What I also do is, when I'm in the kitchen with her and she's on my lap, as soon as she starts to hiss and growl at the others when they get near the screen, I get up and leave. I do this in the hopes she will see that the growling leads to my leaving her alone.

I hadn't wanted to let her out, but she was really anxious to move around. I figured if she wanted to explore I'd let her. Yesterday she went back into the kitchen after she walked around for a few minutes, so she apparently wasn't in the mood to deal with the others.