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Dog meat off the menu during Beijing Olympics

ancientgirl
July 11th, 2008, 08:33 AM
I'm going to hurl http://img106.imageshack.us/img106/3876/sick3qx.gif

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Dog meat off the menu during Beijing Olympics

1 hour, 50 minutes ago

BEIJING - Canine cuisine is being sent to the doghouse during next month's Beijing Olympic Games.


Dog meat has been struck from the menus of officially designated Olympic restaurants, and Beijing tourism officials are telling other outlets to discourage consumers from ordering dishes made from dogs, the official Xinhua News Agency reported Friday.

Waiters and waitresses should "patiently" suggest other options to diners who order dog, it said, quoting city tourism bureau Vice Director Xiong Yumei.

Dog, known in Chinese as "xiangrou," or "fragrant meat," is eaten by some Chinese for its purported health-giving qualities.

Beijing isn't the first Olympic host to slap a ban on the dish.

South Korea banned dog meat during the 1988 Seoul Olympics by invoking a law prohibiting the sale of "foods deemed unsightly." After the Olympics, the ban was not strictly enforced.

Dog meat is also eaten in some other Asian countries, including Vietnam, the Philippines and Laos.

marko
July 11th, 2008, 08:53 AM
I'm not sure I see the connection.

Dogs are eaten in certain parts of the world and IMO that in itself is not a good reason to boycott all things Chinese.

We as humans seem very selective about which animals are disgusting to eat and which are not.

I think it's pretty hypocritical to take a popular food off the menu or discouraging eating it just for the sake of not offending tourists. It's not my custom to eat dog meat or any other meat for that matter but the Chinese have been eating dog for thousands of years. That's their custom and it is not in and of itself 'wrong' just because we as North American pet lovers feel it's distasteful. :2cents:

ancientgirl
July 11th, 2008, 09:15 AM
Sorry, but I just find it horrifying. There are plenty of things eaten by Latin Americans which I find just as distasteful. There are plenty of other things to eat. I know for a fact there are plenty of people in my home country that eat cats and enjoy them fully, and this is something I recently found out much to my dismay. I see a lot wrong with that. Not just because my pets are cats, to me eating a cat or a dog is like eating someone you know. Maybe that's extreme thinking on my part but it's what I believe. :2cents:

My boycotting things Chinese isn't just because of what they choose to eat. It's a little bit of many things that have been going on with their human rights violations and other things. I won't discuss that here because this isn't the place to do that.

Jim Hall
July 11th, 2008, 09:22 AM
two points i try to not buy chineses for thier horrible human rights abuses and enviornmental inadaquecies

and the reason third world countries eat what we consider pets is that its cheap food a cow costs a lot of money and a dog, goat, cat etc is a lot cheaper to raise

I happen to think that it's a crime to hold the olympics thier as I did when they held them in russia But Money talks

marko
July 11th, 2008, 09:30 AM
I changed the thread title to reflect the story in the body of the post.

Thx
Marko

ancientgirl
July 11th, 2008, 09:35 AM
Okay Marko, thanks.

14+kitties
July 11th, 2008, 10:01 AM
This is why the Olympics are being boycotted in MY house this year. And it's a shame because I love watching the athletes "go for the gold".

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-528694/Olympics-clean-Chinese-style-Inside-Beijings-shocking-death-camp-cats.html

http://network.bestfriends.org/international/news/9191.html

http://www.actionagainstpoisoning.com/page299/dogmassacrestarts.html

I personally think it's horrific! I understand that their culture eats dogs and cats and has for years. Just like our culture eats beef and pork. In fact it's an ongoing joke (one I hate) that Chinese food is made of cats. I understand it but don't agree with it.
However, you would think that there are other, more humane ways to "get rid of their unwanted animals". Not mass slaying or being sent to "death camps". It was stopped due to the huge outcry from other countries. Too bad it got as far as it did.

As for not buying anything Chinese. That's kind of hard seeing as most everything has at least parts of it made in China. Just my :2cents:

ancientgirl
July 11th, 2008, 10:19 AM
14K, it is hard not buying anything made in China, but lately I've found myself looking at the bottom of everything I buy to see what the sticker says. I've put a lot of things back lately too.

I don't know what's in the links you posted but I gather it's pictures that will horrify me. I can't look at those. It's sad to see how people treat innocent little animals. I get that some countries are hungry and as Jim said, it's an inexpensive meat, I totally get that. But I can still disagree with it.

want4rain
July 11th, 2008, 11:37 AM
listen, we eat another cultures religious icon. we have no room to judge on cats and dogs. frankly i find pigs to be far more intelligent than dogs anyway. what do you base this on??? puppies are cuter than piglets?? i just can not fathom....

they have been eating cats and dogs longer than we have been on this continent. about the only folks who have room to complain are vegetarians. the only animals who should be unquestionably banned from human consumption are primates because of their evolutionary relations.

-ashley

Dingo
July 11th, 2008, 11:42 AM
I just knew this thread would bring the racists out of the woodwork.

Frenchy
July 11th, 2008, 11:46 AM
That's their custom and it is not in and of itself 'wrong' just because we as North American pet lovers feel it's distasteful. :2cents:

Marko , I'm sure you would feel otherwise if you had seen what I've seen. Someone (years ago) from 20/20 hide a cam and went undercover. They showed , on tv , cats and dogs in big cages , they hang them and knife them from top to bottom and skin them while the cats and dogs are still alive. The sounds they make , the suffering before they finally die from the loss of blood ....

yes it is wrong !!!!

Chaser
July 11th, 2008, 11:49 AM
I am personally boycotting the Olympics and TRY to avoid products in China in general because of my feelings about the human rights abuses perpetuated by their government.

As much as I, and all other members here, love animals and hate the thought of dogs being eaten, we need to be very careful of what we say about this topic. We are talking about the culture of a lot of people and some comments on here are getting racist IMO.

Yes, I find it upsetting that some people eat dogs.....but some people believe cows are sacred and likely find it just as upsetting that North Americans eat them.

Dingo
July 11th, 2008, 11:53 AM
, I'm sure you would feel otherwise if you had seen what I've seen. Someone (years ago) from 20/20 hide a cam and went undercover. They showed , on tv , cats and dogs in big cages , they hang them and knife them from top to bottom and skin them while the cats and dogs are still alive. The sounds they make , the suffering before they finally die from the loss of blood ....

And I'm sure most of us have seen similar videos of the way other food animals are treated. That some people fail to treat food animals humanely doesn't mean that eating dogs is particularly evil.

Love4himies
July 11th, 2008, 11:54 AM
I feel it is their right to eat what they find fit to eat and I don't think they should change their culture for visitors. I commend them for trying not to offend the visitors. Some cultures don't eat pork, should we take pork off the menu to accommodate them?

As for the products they produce, I really think they are not the best quality and would prefer to purchase item manufactured in North America, but those are becoming few and far between.

Frenchy
July 11th, 2008, 11:54 AM
And I'm sure most of us have seen similar videos of the way other food animals are treated. That some people fail to treat food animals humanely doesn't mean that eating dogs is particularly evil.


gimme a break :rolleyes: so that's it then , you're coming here only to complain about our posts ? :rolleyes:

Frenchy
July 11th, 2008, 11:56 AM
oh and by the way , all you guys that are all for China , what about child slavery ? That's ok too then , it's ok for them , and other countries , not here but ok elsewhere ? And about human rights ? That's ok if they don't have any over there right ? :rolleyes:

ancientgirl
July 11th, 2008, 11:59 AM
gimme a break :rolleyes: so that's it then , you're coming here only to complain about our posts ? :rolleyes:

I see I'm not the only one who was thinking the same thing.

katherine93
July 11th, 2008, 12:02 PM
oh and by the way , all you guys that are all for China , what about child slavery ? That's ok too then , it's ok for them , and other countries , not here but ok elsewhere ? And about human rights ? That's ok if they don't have any over there right ? :rolleyes:

Very well said frenchy!.. Any of you that have said you agree with what china is doing, better not say their is anything wrong with child slavery, What a fuss that would be:rolleyes:

I Dont think anyone should eat dog, cat, or anyother companion animals.I Wouldnt ever eat duck, because i keep them as pets, And all i would be able to picture would be my little ducks waddling around inside my mouth -yuck-
DO you agree that they should be taking animals out of thwere own homes and killing them for meat? DO you agree that in Beijing, you cannot keep a dog in your house more than 35 inches at the shoulder or it will be killed for meat? In supporting the right to eat dogs, your supporting the right to take peoples pets for food, even if the owners do not want to give them up .

Dingo
July 11th, 2008, 12:13 PM
gimme a break so that's it then , you're coming here only to complain about our posts ?

Oh I'm so sorry. I had no idea that the purpose of this forum was for everyone to mindlessly agree with whatever's posted.

Just as I said repeatedly in the horse meat thread, it makes no sense to divide animals according to "those it's ok to eat" and "those it's not ok to eat." Even your arguments about companion species doesn't fly, since dogs haven't been considered as companion species in some of the places where they're eaten.

Also? Comparing eating dog meat to child slavery is laughably hyperbolic, and logically fallacious. It's easy to explain why everyone should be entitled to the same human rights regardless of culture. It's also easy to explain why all animals should be treated humanely.

It's one thing to state a personal revulsion for eating certain animals (I'm not too eager to eat any insect, for example), but to claim that eating one species is somehow barbaric while not objecting to the eating of another is often based on knee-jerk racism (as we've seen from several posters in this thread) and cultural imperialism, not logic or reason.

John Feffer has written a brilliant article covering some of the arguments that came up during the World Cup in Korea:


The Politics of Dog
When globalization and culinary practice clash.

By John Feffer
Issue Date: 6.3.02

The line dividing acceptable from unacceptable meat is sometimes a fine one. While vegetarians naturally reject meat of all kinds, the rest of America maintains some form of double standard -- chicken but not crow, beef but not horse, venison but not reindeer, lamb but not mutton, legs and wings and rumps but not hearts or lungs or tongues. Some Americans are adventurous meat eaters who will cross the line and enthusiastically tuck into possum, ostrich, or alligator. One line in America, however, is inviolable. Anonymous livestock and wildlife are fair game, but pets are a different matter, and dog in particular remains the most potent meat taboo. Whenever I mention to my friends that I have eaten -- and enjoyed -- dog stew, they look at me with the sort of horror reserved for hangmen and white supremacists.

Such knee-jerk revulsion has taken a more organized form as animal-rights groups have focused their attention on one particular outpost of dog eating: Korea. Since she first challenged this subspecialty of Korean cuisine in 1988, French actress Brigitte Bardot is the celebrity most associated with the global campaign. Her allies have filled the Internet with reports that smack of "yellow peril," boasting such titles as "Korea: The Sadistic Country" and "Korea's Cruel Cuisine." Recently, these Web sites have promoted the e-rumor that Koreans are raising meaty St. Bernards for their stews, a double taboo for Westerners -- not mere dog stew but dogs-that-drool stew. Activists are challenging the very act (meat is murder), the animals targeted (a form of fratricide), the methods of slaughter (not a pretty sight), and the purported spread of the custom to the United States (where it is difficult to separate fact from urban myth).

The controversy has attracted a fair share of journalists, who have indulged their Orientalist biases by depicting Koreans in almost cannibalistic terms. This coverage has come in both highbrow (National Public Radio) and lowbrow (Fox) varieties. Of the all the media weighing in on the subject, however, perhaps only William Saletan in Slate has looked at the issue with any degree of impartiality. As the 2002 World Cup (which will take place in both Japan and South Korea in May and June) approaches journalists looking for "color" will likely be delivering many more dog stories stripped of cultural and political context.

From all the brouhaha, you might expect dog-soup restaurants on every corner in Korea. But dog meat is not, in fact, especially easy to find. While dog is usually listed as the fourth most popular meat in Korea after beef, pork, and chicken, the government banned sales of all "foods deemed unsightly" during the 1988 Olympics in Seoul so as not to give foreigners the wrong impression of Korean culture. Although some legislators are trying to overturn the ban and regulate the industry -- an eminently sensible approach that should satisfy diners and activists alike -- the government is unlikely to change the law with the World Cup around the corner.

Because dog meat is technically illegal in Korea, you'll never find it on a menu per se. Instead, you have to keep a keen eye out for what is called poshintang, or "tonic soup." Particularly popular in the summer, during the dog days of the Chinese calendar between July 19 and August 18, poshintang is alleged to make men more "vital." Even putting a drop of the soup on your foot is supposed to make you stronger. Dog soup tends to attract men of a certain age, the same ones lapping up Viagra the world over.

But why are most fingers pointing at Korea? Dog is eaten in China, Taiwan, Burma, Indonesia, Laos, Vietnam, Ghana, and the Congo, and by various indigenous peoples and desperately hungry Arctic explorers. Among the dog recipes in Calvin Schwabe's landmark cookbook Unmentionable Cuisine, not a single one comes from Korea. In literature, the "dogeaters" in Jessica Hagedorn's novel of the same name come from the Philippines while the dog narrator Almost Soup in Louise Erdrich's The Antelope Wife is rescued from a pot on a Dakota reservation. Yet even before the World Cup brought increased attention to Korea, poshintang launched a thousand Internet diatribes, many of them American.

One reason is the relative obscurity of Korean food in the United States. There are Chinese restaurants in virtually every neighborhood from Gainesville to Anchorage. Japanese sushi can be found in the food courts of malls in landlocked states. Korean food may well be the next wave after Thai or Vietnamese, but for the time being it remains too "ethnic" for most Americans. It uses too many unusual ingredients, such as acorns, bracken, organ meats, bellflower roots, mung beans, dried fish, and pine needles. It is too spicy: Gochujang, hot red-pepper paste, has not yet caught on in a market that prefers jalapeņo or Scotch bonnet. And ultimately Korean food is too pungent. Americans are so wary of the strong odor of Korean pickled cabbage (kimchi) that the Korean corporation Doosan is developing an odorless variety for the U.S. market. The pervasive American scorn for this pungency has prompted many Koreans to adopt an apologetic tone. My partner once sat down for dinner with Korean Americans in Detroit and ordered one of her favorite dishes, toenjang chigae, a fermented stew. Her hosts were shocked and delighted. "We never order that dish when we eat out here in America for fear of offending other diners," they told her.

Other ethnic groups have experienced the same problem. At the turn of the twentieth century, when Italians were not yet considered "white," their food was shunned for its liberal use of garlic and strong cheeses. Jewish and African-American preferences for certain parts of animals (pigs' feet, derma, chitlins) were derided as backwards, often by status-conscious Jews and blacks. It took a century before Chinese-Americans became established enough for Chinese food to wend its way into the culinary mainstream. Indeed, it was once far more common for urban mythologizers to claim that Chinatown boasted no strays.

Criticism of people, particularly of new immigrants, often masquerades as criticism of cuisine. Bardot is notorious for her xenophobic attitudes and her support of French far-right politician Jean-Marie Le Pen. As Frank Wu writes in his new book Yellow, the French actress "connects mistreatment of animals with an influx of non-Western peoples." Bardot could not be more transparent about her feelings. "A cultured country does not allow its people to eat dogs," she has said.

The prejudice is not simply cultural. Animal-rights activists are also suggesting that an industrialized country does not allow its people to eat dogs. The complaints against Korean dog eating began in earnest when the Olympics came to Korea, signaling its arrival on the international stage (just as the 1964 Tokyo Olympics heralded the new Japan). In 1996, scrutiny of Korea's dog-eating practices intensified when the country joined the Organization of Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD), the richest two dozen countries in the world. Membership in the charmed circle of industrialized nations requires adherence to standard economic practices. Are there cultural expectations that accompany membership as well, just as certain country clubs that finally accept Jews or African-Americans still expect the new members to comport themselves according to Waspish rules of decorum? Laos and Burma are not yet in the OECD club, so no one has bothered to launch any campaigns against their dog-eating practices.

Globalization has made diverse cuisines more available, especially in high-end markets. Tapas, rooibos, bacalao, tagines, mole, and adobo are circling the world as the barriers to food migration are falling. But not all foods are equal, and certain culinary practices among industrialized countries are on the wane. Consumption of whale meat in Japan has fallen precipitously since the Second World War. Cat, which was once eaten in parts of Spain, can no longer be found on the menu there. Smoked dog ham and dried dog meat were once popular in Switzerland but no longer. In globalization-speak, this might be called "harmonization": Difference is tolerated only within certain parameters.

Because the French define and continue to refine haute cuisine, their unusual eating habits do not receive equivalent scrutiny. Not only is France famous for its escargots and grenouilles, but its menu also features lamproie, oursins, and aitances (lamprey, sea urchin gonads, and fish sperm). As the self-proclaimed center of the culinary world, the French have the cultural strength to resist any attempts to homogenize their tastes. The world, after all, travels to Paris to learn how to cook (ā la cordon bleu) and how to eat (ā la Michelin). If the French ate dog meat as readily as they eat horse meat, Korea would not be the target of so much hostility.

So it all boils down to snobbery. Poshintang is not haute cuisine. Even in Korea, where a bowl is quite expensive, dog soup exists at the margins, associated with older traditions, both culinary and medical. In its postwar struggle to make a place for itself at the global table, Korea has left poshintang behind. Countryside culture is popular in Seoul, with restaurants serving makkoli (rice liquor) and country-style pancakes, but it is a carefully sanitized version of the countryside, not unlike Cracker Barrel's appropriation of down-home cooking in the United States. The poshintang restaurants, unregulated and unrepentant, provide a glimpse of an older Korea that has somehow managed to survive Japanese colonialism, World War II, the Korean War, several dictatorships, and the latest wave of globalization sweeping Korean culture. I ate poshintang in a small restaurant on a tiny side street in Seoul. Around the corner, on the main thoroughfare, young Koreans favored Dunkin' Donuts, Japanese fast food, and Korean hamburger and pizza joints, all considerably hipper by Seoul standards than something associated with Chinese medicine and questionable slaughtering standards. In the long run, poshintang's greatest enemy is not Brigitte Bardot but Colonel Sanders.

The Korean response to the controversy is instructive. Many Koreans, even those who wouldn't touch the stuff, defend dog soup against the onslaught of Westernization: It may not be good soup, but it is our soup. (Much of the anger expressed on the Internet is in Korean, but you can get the flavor of it at www.noorung.org). In the United States, meanwhile, Korean Americans have objected to media depictions of Koreans as somehow animalistic. They believe that there is plenty enough in Korean cuisine, from beef barbecue (bulgogi) to mixed vegetables and rice (bibimbap), to define identity without resorting to a defense of this minority preference, which is decidedly not part of Korean-American culture.

Both Koreans and Korean Americans, whatever their personal feelings about poshintang, came together recently to achieve a common goal: elicit an apology from Jay Leno. When judges at the Salt Lake City Olympics disqualified Korean speed skater Kim Dong-sung in the 1,500-meter final and awarded American Apolo Anton Ohno the gold medal, Leno joked on The Tonight Show that the disappointed Korean might have kicked his dog, then eaten it. Korean Americans were not happy with this feeble witticism. "We wanted to be productive and take a restrained approach," said Songbae Lee, Washington director of the Korean American Coalition. "We wanted to educate Jay Leno about the Asian-American community." Prominent Korean Americans participated in a conference call in which Leno said that he wouldn't have told the joke if he could have predicted the reaction of the Korean American community.

Another, more combative strategy is also afoot. The MCIC Group -- a Philadelphia law firm that is also heading up class-action lawsuits in cases involving Japanese slave labor during World War II and the U.S. Army killings of civilians at Nogun-ri in the Korean War -- is demanding an apology and monetary damages from Leno and NBC. According to MCIC attorney Justin Kim, more than 50,000 Koreans have signed on as plaintiffs in the libel suit. Outsiders who think Koreans thin-skinned don't understand han and Korean history. Han is a difficult-to-translate Korean word that means, roughly, a deeply felt sense of injustice. Koreans feel han about their divided peninsula or the experience of Japanese colonialism. Racist broadsides against poshintang bring up feelings of han in much the same way that the epithet "garlic-stinking" might enrage a certain generation of Italian-Americans.

But the eating of dog has always been a serious matter, even before Leno and Bardot entered the picture. According to scholar Frederick Simoons, author of the classic Eat Not This Flesh, the people of the Egyptian city Cynopolis long ago fought a civil war against their neighbors from Oxyrhynchus. Cynopolians, as you might guess from their name, worshipped dogs. Their neighbors ate them. Let's hope that the current standoff between those who do and do not eat poshintang, between Leno and the 50,000 plaintiffs, between Koreans struggling to preserve their identity and a globalized world intent on harmonization, stops short of out-and-out conflict. In the best of all possible worlds, we should be able to have our dogs and occasionally eat them, too.

katherine93
July 11th, 2008, 12:19 PM
Also? Comparing eating dog meat to child slavery is laughably hyperbolic, and logically fallacious. It's easy to explain why everyone should be entitled to the same human rights regardless of culture. It's also easy to explain why all animals should be treated humanely.



But didnt you agree that its in their cultre and they shouldnt change that? Well, Child slavery is in their cultre also, so why stop that?
A chinese man from around here beats his wife until She cannot see out of her own two eyes, But he gets away with it because it is 'in his cultre'. So why should he stop that?

Dingo
July 11th, 2008, 12:25 PM
First of all, your comments are veering dangerously close to racism. Second, I've already explained why those are different things. And third, as I've explained umpteen times, meat is meat is meat. The only thing that matters is whether the animal is treated humanely.

katherine93
July 11th, 2008, 12:31 PM
1 question- Are you asian Dingo?

Dingo
July 11th, 2008, 12:34 PM
Why do you ask? Because you think only an Asian person wouldn't be horrified by the thought of people eating dog meat?

If you read the Wikipedia article on dog meat, you'll discover that dogs have been or are still eaten all over the world, including:

Alaska
Siberia
Greenland
Canada
America
China
Tibet
Taiwan
Korea
India
Indonesia
Nigeria
France
Germany
Mexico
The Philippines
Tahiti
Hawaii
Other Polynesian islands
Switzerland
Vietnam

And that's an incomplete list.

katherine93
July 11th, 2008, 12:39 PM
No, smart A*s .. I was simply going to apologize if i had offended you.. But now , i dont think im sorry at all..

Chaser
July 11th, 2008, 12:39 PM
That is enough! Loving animals is no excuse for being racist. Period. This discussion is absolutely shameful. You can criticize a government, or a practice, but not a people. This is a public forum and nobody should be talking like this on it. Keep it to yourself.

Dingo
July 11th, 2008, 12:45 PM
I was simply going to apologize if i had offended you.. But now , i dont think im sorry at all..

I'm offended by racism no matter who it's directed at.

And while we're on the subject, you may be interested in perusing this list of animals people eat:


Beef (bovines):
American Bison
Carabao
Cattle
Veal (calves)
Yak

Canids: Dog
Fox
Wolf
Coyote

Felines:
Cat

Equines:
Horse
Donkey
Zebra

Lagomorphs:
Hare
Pika
Rabbit

Marsupials:
Kangaroo
Opossum
Wallaby

Ovis (sheep):
Lamb
Domestic Sheep
Bighorn sheep
Caprae (goats)
Domestic Goat
Ibex
Wild goat
Barbary Sheep
Dall Sheep
Mountain Goat

Suidae (swine):
Domestic pig
Peccary (Javelina)
Wild boar
Red River Hog
Bushpig

Venison (Cervidae):
Caribou (reindeer)
Deer
Moose
Antelope
Giraffe
Red deer

Primates:
Gorilla
Orangutan
Chimpanzee
Bonobo
Monkey

Rodents:
Beaver
Guinea pig
Capybara
Muskrat
Rat
Squirrel
Greater Cane Rat ("Grasscutter")
Paca (Agouti or tepezcuintle)

Cetaceans:
Whale
Dolphin

Pinnipeds:
Walrus
Earless seal
Eared seal

Other mammals:
Bear
Elephant
Raccoon
Rhinoceros
Weasel
Camel

Poultry (birds):
Chicken
Duck
Goose
Turkey

Game birds:
Dove
New World quail
Ostrich
Emu
Guineafowl
Pheasant
Grouse
Partridge
Crow
Quail
Pigeon
Woodcock
Ptarmigan

Reptiles:
Turtle
Lizard
Snake
Iguana
Crocodile
Alligator

Amphibians:
Frog
Salamander
Toad

Fish:
Anchovy
Basa
Bass
Catfish
Carp
Cod
Crappie
Eel
Flounder
Fugu (Tetraodontidae, Blow fish, Puffer fish)
Grouper
Haddock
Halibut
Herring
Kingfish
Mackerel
Mahi Mahi
Marlin
Orange Roughy
Perch
Pike
Pollock
Salmon
Sardine
Shark
Snapper
Sole
Swordfish
Tilapia
Trout
Tuna
Walleye

Echinoderms:
Chilean sea urchin

Insects:
Grasshoppers
Chapulines
Ants
Escamoles
Bees
Cockroaches
Beetles
True bugs
Jumiles

Larvae:
Grubs
Caterpillars
Maguey worm

Crustaceans:
Crab
Crayfish
Lobster
Prawn
Shrimp
Other arthropods
Spiders
Scorpions

Mollusks:
Abalone
Clam
Conch
Loco
Mussel
Oyster
Scallop
Snail (also see escargots)

Cephalopods:
Cuttlefish
Octopus
Squid

katherine93
July 11th, 2008, 12:47 PM
I'm offended by racism no matter who it's directed at.




[

So your trying to say you arent at all racist, towards anybody? Cause' thats a load of crap, Everybody is a little racist, i dont care who ya are.

Dingo
July 11th, 2008, 12:48 PM
Speak for yourself.

katherine93
July 11th, 2008, 12:56 PM
At least i can admit im racist. Your the one trying to play mother fricken theresa. I am a racist person to a certain extent. I know many chinese people would neverbeat there wives, or send there children off to work themselves to death, or even think about eating a dog. But for those who do beat there wives, send there children off to be 'slaves' or even eat dog, I have no compasion for, Wheather it be asians, blacks, whites, or Anyother people. In my opinion, these people are sick, disquisting human beings, that should die a painful death. Not just asians. Everybody, I dont care If your the friggen pope, I dont agree with it.

On this particualr topic, yes i was talking about the chinese culture. So sue me.

Joeyjoejoe
July 11th, 2008, 12:58 PM
I'm offended by some of the comments made.

People are quick to point out how backward the rest of the world is, but fails to realize how backwards they are to the rest of the world.

katherine93
July 11th, 2008, 01:02 PM
Sorry to offend you joejoejoe But , im a very opinionated person. Didnt try to offend anyone, Just expressing myself.

Dingo
July 11th, 2008, 01:03 PM
Sorry to disappoint you, but I'm not racist. As for you, the more you write, the more you expose your own ignorance.

Out of curiosity, are you a strict vegetarian?

katherine93
July 11th, 2008, 01:07 PM
Dingo- Yes i am, Before you start rambeling About the cows and pigs etc. Ive fought about that before and how i do not agree with it. But This particular post is about dog meat.

katherine93
July 11th, 2008, 01:08 PM
Do you have a dog dingo?

Dingo
July 11th, 2008, 01:11 PM
Yes i am, Before you start rambeling About the cows and pigs etc. Ive fought about that before and how i do not agree with it. But This particular post is about dog meat.

True, but do you wail and gnash your teeth about all forms of meat, or just meat that comes from animals you think are cute?

So do you drink milk? Eat honey? Wear leather?

And yes, I do have a dog. And yes, I'm a meat eater, but no, I'm not going to eat him. I'm not about to condemn anyone else for eating dogs, though. And yes, I love dogs and I might not actively seek out dog meat, but if someone offered me dog meat I might just try it. Wrap your head around that.

katherine93
July 11th, 2008, 01:14 PM
True, but do you wail and gnash your teeth about all forms of meat, or just meat that comes from animals you think are cute?

So do you drink milk? Eat honey? Wear leather?

All animals. I do not drink milk, eat honey, wear leather, eat eggs, wear fur etc.

katherine93
July 11th, 2008, 01:16 PM
?

And yes, I do have a dog. And yes, I'm a meat eater, but no, I'm not going to eat him. I'm not about to condemn anyone else for eating dogs, though. And yes, I love dogs and I might not actively seek out dog meat, but if someone offered me dog meat I might just try it. Wrap your head around that.

Would you like it if somebody came to your own home and took him because he was to big, or because you had another dog and they were going to use him for meat. Because that is where alot of it comes from.

Dingo
July 11th, 2008, 01:17 PM
Well good for you. It sort of removes you from the discussion, though, if you have one rationale for not eating or using any product that comes from any animal (although you still seem to think it's somehow worse for people to eat dogs than cows).

So what do you feed your animals?

Dingo
July 11th, 2008, 01:19 PM
Would you like it if somebody came to your own home and took him because he was to big, or because you had another dog and they were going to use him for meat. Because that is where alot of it comes from.

No, but if you're trying to claim this is what happens in China, you're just perpetuating racist misinformation. In places where people eat dogs they're raised for meat just like other animals are, not stolen from people's homes.

katherine93
July 11th, 2008, 01:22 PM
MY MOTHER, feeds my animals dog food, Which is primarily meat. I dont like them eating meat, but they are carnivorous, we can live without meat, its ALOT harder for a dog to live with out meat.

katherine93
July 11th, 2008, 01:25 PM
Oh , it isnt happening? Look at this link and maybe you'll think differantly..http://network.bestfriends.org/international/news/9191.html

My friend, it is happening.

Dingo
July 11th, 2008, 01:25 PM
But they're your animals? Just as I asked another poster in the horse meat thread, if you're so passionate about animals not being killed for food, then there are other pets you can keep, ones that aren't carnivorous. Rats, mice and horses don't eat meat. Surely it makes more sense to limit yourself to animals like those.

katherine93
July 11th, 2008, 01:32 PM
BTW- Mice and rats do eat meat.

And Im passionate about all animals, if i saw a cow that was being abused/Abandoned, or just plain and simply not being treated properly, i would welcome it with open arms to my home. Im not going to not have a dog or a cat because it is carnivouris, My life would be miserable.


So you wouldnt feel one bit bad about eating a dog that was taken from its own home and was once loved by a wonderful family, and it loved that family ewith its whole heart.



Oh and BTW- I would feed my animals a vegetarian diet if it were my decision, but at 16, its hard to support all of them on my own.

14+kitties
July 11th, 2008, 01:33 PM
Ok guys, no one is going to agree to disagree 100% of the time. Some posters are getting pretty nasty in the comments they are posting. How about we get back on track?

Dingo
July 11th, 2008, 01:34 PM
The link you posted says nothing about dogs being taken for food. If you read through the breathless hyperbole, you'll see that there are regulations for dogs in Beijing which aim at controlling extreme pet overpopulation (over 1 million pet dogs in that city alone) and the rampant rabies problem -- regulations just like we have in cities here. Some breeds are also restricted -- just as they are here. Dogs that are unlicensed or illegal are being taken -- just as they are here. Also, culling (which is to say, killing) stray dogs is a common solution that also happens guess where?

I'm not saying I agree with any of this, I'm just pointing out that these are not issues that are restricted to China. They happen all over the world, including in predominantly white countries.

Dingo
July 11th, 2008, 01:37 PM
BTW- Mice and rats do eat meat.

They can eat meat, but they don't have to. Rats and mice can survive quite happily and healthily on a vegetarian -- even vegan -- diet.

Im not going to not have a dog or a cat because it is carnivouris, My life would be miserable.

So, you condemn the killing of any animal for human consumption, but not for the making of pet foods? In other words, it's not ok for humans to eat any animal, but it's ok for humans to kill various animals to feed certain other animals that people keep as pets? How does that make any sense at all? What you're really saying is that you condone the killing of animals for your own happiness -- so that you can keep carnivorous pets. How is that any different from killing animals to feed humans?

So you wouldnt feel one bit bad about eating a dog that was taken from its own home and was once loved by a wonderful family, and it loved that family ewith its whole heart.

As I've already explained, dog meat comes from dogs that are raised to be eaten.

katherine93
July 11th, 2008, 01:39 PM
The link you posted says nothing about dogs being taken for food. If you read through the breathless hyperbole, you'll see that there are regulations for dogs in Beijing which aim at controlling extreme pet overpopulation (over 1 million pet dogs in that city alone) and the rampant rabies problem -- regulations just like we have in cities here. Some breeds are also restricted -- just as they are here. Dogs that are unlicensed or illegal are being taken -- just as they are here. Also, culling (which is to say, killing) stray dogs is a common solution that also happens guess where?

I'm not saying I agree with any of this, I'm just pointing out that these are not issues that are restricted to China. They happen all over the world, including in predominantly white countries.

so you think they just throw these dogs to one side, even though they can make some money off of it? you dont think these dogs are being sold as meat?

Dingo
July 11th, 2008, 01:45 PM
I think you grossly overestimate how common dog meat actually is.

marko
July 11th, 2008, 02:02 PM
This thread has run its course and will now be closed.

IMO this was posted in the wrong section as it contains mostly opinions so it should have posted in the on topic forum.

Thx
Marko
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