Pets.ca - Pet forum for dogs cats and humans 

-->

Rescues.....

minimomma
July 6th, 2008, 01:11 PM
Sorry about this.. not sure how to delete this thread...... thanks for your responses and I hope all of you enjoy your furbabies.

Take care

ancientgirl
July 6th, 2008, 01:19 PM
What beautiful furry's you have. Thank goodness you were able to rescue both of them.

Lukka'sma
July 6th, 2008, 01:26 PM
That dog is gorgeous:lovestruck: and of course your mini is a doll.:D
I will never be able to comprehend how someone could neglect or abuse an animal for any reason. As heartbreaking as it is to know it is happening somewhere right now, it is just as heartwarming to know people like you are taking these animals into your home and changing their lives for the better, and showing them love for perhaps the first time ever.

angeldogs
July 6th, 2008, 01:57 PM
Gorgeous dog and so is the mini.Your daughter sounds like a real sweety.

ancientgirl
July 6th, 2008, 02:07 PM
minimomma, I haven't gone one an actual vacation or long weekend since I brought my pets into my life. I love being with them, and when I'm not with them I feel like there is a part of me missing. I think unless you are ready to make some sacrifies in your life you should not bring an animal into your life.

You are a wonderful person not only for taking these guys into your home, but inspiring such compassion in your daughter.

Dracko
July 6th, 2008, 02:54 PM
I have to say that not going on vacation is a major reason my ex and I broke up. (Well, 2nd to the fact he was a jerk.) I didn't want to board Dracko at a kennel (tried once and he freaked) and be away from my cats. He disagreed.

One time I agreed to go to the States for 5 days to apease him. In order not to have to kennel anyone I paid my nephew $800 (his weekly wage at the time) to come and babysit my furry ones. My ex didn't know this, of course and thought he had the week off and was doing us a favor.

I've been single now for a year and a half and will never, ever put myself in the position of having to be separated from my animals because I feel pressured. Being single is much better. :thumbs up

ancientgirl
July 6th, 2008, 03:57 PM
:sorry::offtopic:

Dracko I'm with you. The last time I was even considering going away for a long weekend, I had someone scheduled to stay with my gang, but was so panicked at being away from them and not seeing them for 3 days I canceled. I don't regret doing it, as I spent a very nice long weekend with my favorite kitties. Besides, who needs to waste all that money anyway.

mona_b
July 6th, 2008, 04:10 PM
They are adorable.........:cloud9:


I would loose my sanity if I didn't go on vaccation.I've been going away every year for 15 years before I moved here.It was my ex who didn't want me to go.Fine,whatever.He has been my ex for 2 years now....:D..I went away last year and was away in Cozumel in May.The ex had the cats,and Tron went to my dads.Tron is used to it and is great at my dads.The cats were pretty good.Didn't seem to miss me at all...:sad:

hazelrunpack
July 6th, 2008, 10:27 PM
Am I missing something here? :confused:

Chaser
July 6th, 2008, 11:06 PM
Am I missing something here? :confused:

I second that....:confused:

minimomma
July 6th, 2008, 11:15 PM
I guess maybe I should explain.

I responded on a different thread about a cat I am trying to rehabilitate ( bare with spelling) I may have to put this cat down due to the fact he is really aggresive. The answer would be May.... I am doing everything I can. I was told I should just release him in the back of my property and hope for the best.

I rescue as many critters as I can... But in reality you can't save them all. I said this statement and was made to feel really bad. This poster made a reference to people on hear maxing out their credit cards for their furbabies. This poster made assumptions about how I am without knowing who I am. I know this is a forum and the internet. But I am passionate about animals and for those that get to know me.. realize this. Everyone has a right to opinions but to make one feel bad for decisions that need to be made. Is wrong in my books. It is unfortunate that my family has had to make tough decisions in regards to putting animals down. We only due this for the animals sake. It is never about money.. If it was about money.. I wouldn't be rescuing critters because I am always in the red... LOL..

I joined this forum to give advice.. get advice.. based on some of these posts this person judged me. I don't judge others and being new I felt that maybe I deserved a couple of questions not the response I received. except people who abuse animals and kids...

Hope this post makes sense...

Lukka'sma
July 6th, 2008, 11:41 PM
OK, so I have been away at work since about 2pm today. What on earth has happened on this thread to cause all this commotion. I truly hope that nobody said anything derogatory about your rescues minimomma. I hope you stay around and whatever happened passes over and you can put it behind you.

FancyAppy
July 7th, 2008, 12:46 AM
I am so sorry I missed your photos and commentary about your rescues. I was esp. interested in anything you had to share about your mini rescues. Hope you will repost. Rescuing is not easy work .You are a very special person to care enough to help those who need it.

chico2
July 7th, 2008, 07:31 AM
Minimomma,I was soo looking forward to seeing your rescues:sad:.
I looked at your wonderful site,but only had time to look at the kitties,you are a wonderful photographer.
Sometimes people jump to conclusions,but we all know especially if you are involved in rescue,for some animals euthanazia(sp?)is the most humane solution.
Please repost your pics:fingerscr

Love4himies
July 7th, 2008, 07:48 AM
I must have missed something this weekend, have been so busy.

minimomma
July 7th, 2008, 10:42 AM
Thank you everyone,

I guess I get so frustrated with people. I am so passionate in what I do ( sometimes too passionate as I have ended up in trouble with cops- just my mouth to certain animal abusers)

I hate when people judge me when I have to put an animal down. It is the toughest decisions I have to make. It is never easy but it is always in the animals best interests. When individuals question this- I feel like saying then you guys do it-- because I am tired of saying goodbye to animals that have suffered at the hands of humans. Or when people think that you don't do enough or spend enough just because they can sit behind a computer and judge ( I am not saying it on this forum- but on others as well) I always tell people- walk a day in my shoes....... I guess what keeps me going is the furbabies that I can turn around.. it makes up for the ones that I have to say goodbye too.. I will post more when I get home- I am at work right now-

Lukka'sma
July 7th, 2008, 11:39 AM
I am glad to see your still posting. I don't believe that you joined the wrong forum at all. Looking forward to many more pictures of your extended family:)

Love4himies
July 7th, 2008, 11:42 AM
I wouldn't want to be making the decision to have to put down an animal, it would break my heart, so I don't envy you.

I think you will find, minimomma that members on this board are also very compassionate about animals as you are and sometimes feelings get things heated up. Many do rescues and fostering and give up all extras in life to give to their furbabies and those in need, and by extras I mean as little as a well deserved meal out in a restaurant so their latest rescue can get to a vet.

Stick around and you will soon learn how :crazy: we are about our babies.

krdahmer
July 7th, 2008, 12:13 PM
Well welcome and I did miss all the snaffu here so, I'll just say that all of us here love love love animals, and never want to see any suffer. For me, putting a cat down because it is aggressive (if there is more to it, health reasons etc, might be different but you only mentioned aggression) is just not seen as necessary for those of us who deal with ferals ourselves. I personally had to do a S/N and release because a momma feral I took in was just beyond rehabilitating. IMO, these cats should at least be put back out where they were and be given the chance to have life.

Having said that, it is just my opinion, and I know that not everyone agrees. Here we often have healthy 'discussions' about issues just like this, and although they sometimes get heated, it is only because we are all so passionate about the welfare of animals in our own ways. No one here would ever belittle or devalue the wonderful work any rescuer does. So please don't be so quick to leave... we'd love to learn more about what you do. Talk our ears off, give us the whole story, you may find that someone here has a trick or two you haven't tried! I know that since joining this forum I have learned so much, that I am definitely a better furmomma for it!

So welcome... :D

Frenchy
July 7th, 2008, 12:17 PM
I responded on a different thread about a cat I am trying to rehabilitate

wow , you're pretty good as making everyone think you're the victim here. You forgot to mention that you posted these comments in someone's else thread , someone who's trying to save a cat that's been hit by a car , you posted to her that , since the cat hissed at her , it should get put down. You hurted this rescue person's feelings , this person lives to rescue cats and has done more than many people . You also posted in another thread being for horses slaughter ... so yes , you can have your own opinions , but quit the victim attitude !

clm
July 7th, 2008, 12:23 PM
Thanks for clearing that up Frenchy, I didn't see the posts that all the fuss was about, they had been deleted.

Cindy

Frenchy
July 7th, 2008, 12:29 PM
Thanks for clearing that up Frenchy, I didn't see the posts that all the fuss was about, they had been deleted.

Cindy

exactly , everything was deleted.

I don't have anything against you minimomma , but when you post your opinions , others can reply to you , this is a public forum.

Nobody was rude or impolite with you , even if you say that's how it happened. If someone should me offended , it's not you , it's 14+kitties. Your posts were very hurtful to her.

mona_b
July 7th, 2008, 12:47 PM
And the poster was only asking a question as to how long should they keep an eye on this cat as they have never dealt with a cat that got hit.Any one else would have walked away from this cat,she didn't.

Hmmmmm,well I guess I better put Casper down.As he has been an attacker(out of the blue)since he was a kitten.Oh yeah,he bites,but he also LOCKS on to your hand and doesn't let go till you pry it open.Then 5 mins later he's ALL over you....:rolleyes:

Oh yeah,he was also born deaf(white with blue eyes)

10-1 if anyone had adopted him first,they would have brought him right back.
And I actually had people ask if I was returning him.

Could you give this up??

minimomma
July 7th, 2008, 12:53 PM
First and formost.. I have never suggested to the poster that she should put her cat down. The only advice I gave was with internal bleeding it is tricky in cats.

I mentioned my cat jake had aggression issues. She asked me what I was going to do. I simply said that I may have to put him down if I can not fix the problem.

She then said their are alternatives. I responded as to what- giving him to the SPCA to be put down.

She then suggested that I live on an acreage to release him to the back of my property. I was never RUDE- that is not my personality. She then quoted how memeber max out credit cards- which insinuates ( can't spell) that I am not doing what it takes.

Then she responded that she will not reply to my posts based on my beliefs. Which is fine. I responded to her post. After thought I deleted my posts. I would never suggest to just put an animal down.

First and formost.

This cat is not ferel. He came to me from a lady that had to go into the hospital to live out her last days. I took this cat on in hopes of fostering it and finding a good home with the help of some other people. This cat literally shreded my husbands arms. To the point I wanted to take him to the ER. At this point- I thought the cat was scared. I quarantened him in my house. His behavior has gotten worse. He will fly at you across the room he has torn my leg to shreds. To the point that I have to use industrial gloves and wear layers of clothing. THis is not a fearful cat. This is an aggresive cat. He is now in a dog kennel and it quite aggressive. In order for a vet to examine him. He has to have a tranq gun used on him. I was explaining to the poster that I will not release an animal out in the field in hopes he will survived. If the poster asked questions I would explain, but no I got put off as I am not doing enough and because their may be a chance that I have to put him down if I am not successful was not good enough. I will not release a cat into the wild like this. I have small children. He does not run from you. I am in the progressive of trying different things. If someone asked then I would answer. But I was judged. So I am not playing the VICTIM. I made a decision based on my passion. Playing the VICTIM would be pitty me.. as in this post is turning out to be.

2nd I love peoples opinions even though they do differ from mine. I have learned alot from other forums for this matter. However, a healthy discussion is good. Questions and answers are good. But to suggest that one has not done enough. Is not good. I have different beliefs then lots of people. Vice versa.. this is what makes the world go round. I don't judge people on their beliefs but yet because I have to maybe put a cat down.

This is the statement that was based on the posts.

" not everyone animal can be saved" This is a true statement. The poster then replied with I was wrong in her words.Made statements that individuals max their credit cards out for animals. I can give you a list of my financial burdens- loans- ect the debt I have ( which is all personal) to save critters. No one asked but assumed.

minimomma
July 7th, 2008, 12:54 PM
Okay.. for those that want to make fun- of my attacker. I will ship him to you at my cost. I hope that you can help this poor kitty out. Because I have 9 cats.. I feed over 20 ferel cats and he is not like anything I have even encountered

Love4himies
July 7th, 2008, 12:58 PM
Oh mona_b your Casper is stunning!! :cloud9:

Snowball was the same way, very random attacks but he was my special soul mate and I can't think of him without crying I miss him so much, and he would attack anybody who cornered him outside. I would never once thought he should be put down due to his attacks, I tried to learn to predict them and try to defend myself. Some people thought I was crazy.

I missed all the posts too, they were deleted before I logged on.

Love4himies
July 7th, 2008, 01:06 PM
Did you get a chance to talk to the lady about this cat? If it true aggession, it would have attacked her too, would it not? It would be nice to have spoken to the cat's vet too.

mona_b
July 7th, 2008, 01:12 PM
Thank you L4H..He's our special boy.;)

Awwww snowball....:sad:

I was wondering the same L4H...

If the cat never attacked the owner,and is now,then this cat is VERY stressed being away from his mommy.:sad:

ancientgirl
July 7th, 2008, 01:12 PM
mona_b wow, what a face Casper has. :lovestruck:

minimomma, I'm assuming you've tried medicating this cat? I currently have a semi-feral stray living with me and have her quarantined in my kitchen. I give her Prozac daily. It takes a good 2 to 3 weeks to even begin seeing results, and I'm on my second week. I had to stop while I changed from topical to pills, which I crush and put in her food.

She's not used to other cats, and when I had her indoors last year she was very aggressive towards my cats. She still spits and swats at them when she sees them at the little screen door I have separating them but she's not as bad as she was last year, and the vet assured me in time once the medication gets into her system more she will become more calm and happier.

I don't know if that's an option for you, but just thought I'd put it out there.

Chris21711
July 7th, 2008, 01:12 PM
Okay.. for those that want to make fun- of my attacker. I will ship him to you at my cost. I hope that you can help this poor kitty out. Because I have 9 cats.. I feed over 20 ferel cats and he is not like anything I have even encountered

I haven't noticed anyone making FUN of this poor cat. I think that things are getting a tad blown out of proportion here.

Mona_b - Stunning :thumbs up

minimomma
July 7th, 2008, 01:14 PM
I have been trying to get past history. Several of us have been trying.

The nurses at the hospital are the ones that were trying to rescue this cat. This lady is in pallative care. Her case worker feels that she will not be able to respond to this. Believe me when we have tried.

He is supposed to be neutered and micro chipped. He has been handled. 3 vets have advised to put this cat down. My own vet thinks that maybe something is wrong with him mentally. She is coming to my place to tranq him and see what we can do. I do not make these decisions lightly at all.

To those that want to make fun. Please feel free to take this cat and do something different. TO change his kitty litter box- I have to take a water gun and spray him to go into a cat kennel. He has attacked me through leather work gloves. I sit with him 2 hours a day. Talking to him. When the vet comes out- I am going to try some anti- anxiety drugs as suggested by a very good cat expert.

I can not release him into my property and hope for the best. I have 2 small children and children that come visit me. I will not live with the guilt if he were to attack them. I have brought cats to be in the same room as him. To see if they will help ease anything. He litterally flys in his kennel. Snorts.. hisses and trys to attack him.

mona_b
July 7th, 2008, 01:23 PM
When the vet comes out- I am going to try some anti- anxiety drugs as suggested by a very good cat expert.

So you haven't tried everything...

Sooooo,instead of saying you might have to put him down,you should have said you will try meds on him first....Just my :2cents:

Thank you guys....;)

ancientgirl,I'm so glad you went the meds root.There are times when we don't want to use it.BUT if there is a chance that it will help,why not.

minimomma
July 7th, 2008, 01:23 PM
What has all this got to do with me being pro horse slaughter. If you read my posts in regards to this.


Everyone has different opinions on things and views but again judged.

I am not trying to offend anyone or be rude but please take a step outside of the box and look at things a little different.

New poster comes on- Likes the site- then because of that posters views on certain subjects is judged by certain posters. I may be way off base but this is my perspective on things. If you want to know things ask questions. I am a straight shooter with nothing to hide. You want to see my financials- hey go right ahead.

minimomma
July 7th, 2008, 01:26 PM
Nope haven't tried anything. nothing at all.. nope...

Did I once say I was putting him down tomorrow. Let me refresh some memories. WORST CASE sceniro- I may have to. ALSO, if my vet is coming out- I am trying different stuff.

clm
July 7th, 2008, 01:28 PM
Since I'm wading in here and not sure really what ground has been covered, I think you will find that this cat would relax a great deal if released on your property with proper outdoor accommodation he can use. A shed with an opening into a little snug nest for him, or we have little houses we've made for the strays around here to keep dry and warm in winter. Sounds to me like he's a very stressed kitty. I doubt that he would attack kids if released outside, likely would run away from them. I would also be sure that my children and any children that came to visit are told to leave the cat alone. Just my opinion, and I've had loads of experience with wild cats. I would try this instead of putting the cat down, it sounds like the way things have gone so far, he's so stressed it may take a very long time if ever for him to calm down around indoors.
The hardest part will be catching him to take him for his rabies shots every 3 years. By then he may have come around enough to come to you very gladly, but will turn into a fighter as soon as you get him to the vet. Lots of sweatshirts and long leather gloves will be needed for that. ;)


Cindy

minimomma
July 7th, 2008, 01:32 PM
Thanks CLM for your reply and ancient girl ( i hope that is)

Right now- putting him outside is not an option. I don't know if I could risk this at this moment. I want to absolutley sure that he will just run away. If I knew he would. I have no problems with this sceniro. But if he were to be a danger to any other rescues and my children. I couldn't do it.

ancientgirl
July 7th, 2008, 01:37 PM
ancientgirl,I'm so glad you went the meds root.There are times when we don't want to use it.BUT if there is a chance that it will help,why not.

Mona, I had her inside last December. In that time, she would literally foam at the mouth whenever any of my others would come near her gate. It was all stress and anxiety on her part. I mistakenly let her out of confinement after about 2 weeks. In the few days she was loose with the others, she peed all over the place and attacked my recently spayed kitten, who I had to take in on an emergency to have her stitches repaired.

She ran away from me one day, just got past me while I had the door open. About a month ago, I spoke to my vet and asked if there was anything I could give her. She suggested Prozac. I tried a topical in her ear for about 2 weeks but had to stop because I was also putting eye drops in her eye and she got to where she just would not let me touch her. So I had to stop and had to wait a week until I could get a hold of her vet to get pills. I'm starting now from scratch and she's been on the pills for almost 2 weeks.

My vet told me one of the other vets in the practice has used it in the past with excellent results. I'll have to keep her on them for 6 months, maybe more but then I can ween her off. I hope by that time she will have integrated into the rest of the group.

Sorry, didn't mean to TJ

clm
July 7th, 2008, 01:39 PM
Well I hope it works out for you. I'd hate to see this poor cat put down, yes I know he's aggressive, and I understand you worrying about him running away, and while I know you've meant nothing but the best for him, this whole thing has caused him so much stress, he needs some space where he's not feeling vulnerable, and a small cage isn't going to do it for him.
Maybe a large outdoor kennel like they use in catteries for keeping Toms sometimes. I mean very large, like 10X12, 12X14, some branches to climb, a nice warm house to sleep in. Just remember it'll need wire on top as well, cats can jump pretty high. ;). Just a thought.

Cindy

mona_b
July 7th, 2008, 01:41 PM
Nope haven't tried anything. nothing at all.. nope...

Ummmmmm,you haven't tried any meds cause you already stated that when the vets comes,you are going to try some ani anxiety meds.So no,you haven't tried everything......yet.

No one said anything about you putting him down right away.

Now this is just a question.Why is it so hard to get info about this cat?This woman doesn't have family?Who released this cat or should I say took this cat from this woman?

mona_b
July 7th, 2008, 01:43 PM
Well your doing a great job ancientgirl.:thumbs up

Keep up the good work..;)

Love4himies
July 7th, 2008, 01:43 PM
You couldn't release this guy if he has been an indoor only kitty, that may lead to a very slow death.

I hope you come up with an answer. Too bad you didn't have any info from the previous owner.

minimomma
July 7th, 2008, 01:47 PM
This woman is dying. This cat was in a home and the nurses and the case worker were trying to give this woman her last wish. She knows that she her cat is going to a foster home. She is getting worse and worse. If she had any family, we would know about it.

The case worker is informed about Jakes progress.

Yes he is really stressed out and I will try everything but I always look at worse case sceniors( can't spell) He is in a very large dog crate right now. We moved him from my bathroom. THat I had to put high locks on because my kids don't understand why they can't see the kitty and help the kitty as they have in the past with my rescues.

My vet has been out several of times and has looked at the cats reaction ( she was out for some other critters. We were hoping he was going to settle down due to stress. This is why she is going to bring her tranq gun, to take blood tests, to see if anything is medically wrong as well. I am sorry that I get my back up against the wall.... I am just frustrated.

ancientgirl
July 7th, 2008, 01:56 PM
minimomma, I understand your frustration, but in times like this we have to look at things from the cats perspective. I've got 5. 4 that are together in the apartment and one stray I'm trying to integrate. The 4 are very friendly, and one in particular loves when I have company. But if someone goes into my apartment, like the maintenance guy, and I'm not there, he'll get downright nasty and hissy. To the point where if you get too close he will attack, something he doesn't do normally. But he's seeing this person invading his territory and his mom isn't home.

Your guy has lived with his owner for a long time. An owner that loved him and took care of him. His world is now upside down. He was taken from his home to be with his owner to then be taken to another home and put in the care of strange people he's never seen before. He's like a fish out of water and his only form of expression is to fight for his survival. He no doubt sees everyone who comes towards him as an enemy.

He's also in a cage smaller than what he's used to. I know you said it's not possible, but I think a room of his own or as clm suggested, some sort of kennel type area with a little enclosure. Right now I think he might just want to be alone to work out what is going on.

Little by little you could bring him food and talk to him and he can get used to you.

Medication can also help calm him down. Prozac works on cats just like it does on people.

I think space would be a good thing for him. A place he can walk, run or climb in. Where he can get away from strange people and feel safe.

When I sit with my girl she sits on my lap and purrs, but there are moments when she swats or hisses at me, and now and then she'll try to nip at me. When she does that I get up and leave. I'll walk in there a few minutes later and she'll be all fine. I have to realize she's gone through major changes but little by little it will work out.

I hope you can use some of the advice given to you here to help your guy.

minimomma
July 7th, 2008, 02:12 PM
Thank you,

He was in my bathroom downstairs- quite a big room for a long time with places to hide. Well he would hide and then fly out and attack you as you are feeding him. It was suggested to try him in a smaller space which we are doing.

Thank you for your suggestions- I am not giving up- will see what the vet has to say this week and the test results.

Love4himies
July 7th, 2008, 02:17 PM
I think ancientgirl makes very good points. I would like to add that if his previous owners were slowly getting sick, then the cat may have sensed this, causing him to be even more scared.

chico2
July 7th, 2008, 05:11 PM
Minimomma,I know how dangerous a crazed,stressed out cat can be,it's not only hissing and swatting,but a real fly at you teeth bared attack.
It was my own Rocky,whom I love very much,several people asked"is this cat still alive?"
He's attacked me 4 times,where I needed hospital-care.
But he had a reason for his behavior,now I've learned to look out and make sure,he is not again in a situation where he attacks.
Could I live with a cat who is always dangerous,no,I don't think so.
A crazed cat can do very serious damage..
In this case,this poor cat probably lived indoors with one lady,he has lost his home and the person he trusts.
Is he an older cat??
In my case with Rocky,I think the way I behaved in the situation made things worse,although it is very difficult to stay calm when a cat has his teeth dug in to your ankle.
I would give this cat a chance to learn to trust you,if it takes meds,so be it,if he will take it:fingerscr
There might be something medically wrong with him too,he might be in pain,or someone might have hurt him,who knows what he went through before his owner ended up in hospital.
I don't think that letting him out to fend for himself is a humane solution,I know,not any of my cats would not survive out there very long.
I know my opinion goes against most peoples,but if this cat does not respond to any treatment after some time trying,is a danger to everyone,maybe the only humane thing to do is to give him peace.

minimomma
July 7th, 2008, 09:14 PM
Minimomma,I know how dangerous a crazed,stressed out cat can be,it's not only hissing and swatting,but a real fly at you teeth bared attack.
It was my own Rocky,whom I love very much,several people asked"is this cat still alive?"
He's attacked me 4 times,where I needed hospital-care.
But he had a reason for his behavior,now I've learned to look out and make sure,he is not again in a situation where he attacks.
Could I live with a cat who is always dangerous,no,I don't think so.
A crazed cat can do very serious damage..
In this case,this poor cat probably lived indoors with one lady,he has lost his home and the person he trusts.
Is he an older cat??
In my case with Rocky,I think the way I behaved in the situation made things worse,although it is very difficult to stay calm when a cat has his teeth dug in to your ankle.
I would give this cat a chance to learn to trust you,if it takes meds,so be it,if he will take it:fingerscr
There might be something medically wrong with him too,he might be in pain,or someone might have hurt him,who knows what he went through before his owner ended up in hospital.
I don't think that letting him out to fend for himself is a humane solution,I know,not any of my cats would not survive out there very long.
I know my opinion goes against most peoples,but if this cat does not respond to any treatment after some time trying,is a danger to everyone,maybe the only humane thing to do is to give him peace.


Thank you for your response. Jake is supposed to be 3 yrs old. He is supposed to be neutered. ( can't get close enough to tell for sure- even when he is flying through the air)

I came home from work today and he seems to be getting worse. I can't even open the bedroom door without him freaking out in the dog kennel. I was hoping to let him go in the bedroom to give him more space and more hiding places. I picked up some stuff from petsmart. The aroma is supposed to calm cats. It does not seem to be helping. I am starting to think this is more of a medical problem, then just stress and being scared. As in the past he will not hide- just attack. I will wait to see what the vet has to say when she comes this week.

ancientgirl
July 7th, 2008, 09:19 PM
I'm not sure what it is you got at the pet store, but Feliway is a product that helps cats by giving off those "feel good" pheremones. The only thing is, it takes a little while for it to start working if you actually get the diffuser. There is a spray that is supposed to work faster. You can spray it around the area Jake is in, around his cage. You can also try putting some Rescue Remedy in his food, and maybe that will help as well.

minimomma
July 7th, 2008, 09:24 PM
The product I got is a spray product like feliway. It was from Petsmart... I picked the most expensive. I sprayed it about 3 hours ago. It says to spray every couple of hours.. So I am going to try this for the next little while. Where would I get the rescue remedy?

Thanks in advance

catlady999
July 7th, 2008, 11:50 PM
Since I'm wading in here and not sure really what ground has been covered, I think you will find that this cat would relax a great deal if released on your property with proper outdoor accommodation he can use. A shed with an opening into a little snug nest for him, or we have little houses we've made for the strays around here to keep dry and warm in winter. Sounds to me like he's a very stressed kitty. I doubt that he would attack kids if released outside, likely would run away from them. I would also be sure that my children and any children that came to visit are told to leave the cat alone. Just my opinion, and I've had loads of experience with wild cats. I would try this instead of putting the cat down, it sounds like the way things have gone so far, he's so stressed it may take a very long time if ever for him to calm down around indoors.
The hardest part will be catching him to take him for his rabies shots every 3 years. By then he may have come around enough to come to you very gladly, but will turn into a fighter as soon as you get him to the vet. Lots of sweatshirts and long leather gloves will be needed for that. ;)


Cindy

The OP has repeatedly said that this is NOT a feral cat. Yes, Feral cats run away; they don't normally attack. The OP has a right to be worried about her kids. An aggressive tame cat does NOT behave the same as a feral cat.

People (not Cindy) have also said "you haven't tried everthing" and "you shouldn't kill him."
All I see from the OP is we are TRYING (present tense - ongoing effort) and she MIGHT have to euthanize him. MIGHT (possibly, at some point in the future.) She is planning on trying drugs. She has explained things thoroughly.

This can't be an easy situation. Maybe you should cut her a break.

Some people have said "my cat bites sometimes, but then is fine." Yes - key words here - SOMETIMES. The lovely white cat whose picture was posted is not nasty ALL the time - just SOMEtimes. That may be something called "petting aggresssion" which IS fairly easy to manage once you know the signs. Ditto for stalking aggression. Those are fairly easy to work around.

From the description of this cat, he is aggressive ALL the time. This seems to be what people are not understanding. A cat that tries to rip your arm off when you are feeding it is in a totally different category. There IS such a thing as a dangerous animal.Just because it's a 10-14 pound cat doesn't mean that it's not a danger.

There is also the distinct possibility, judging from the behaviour, that the cat has some sort of brain damage. A tumor on the amygdala, for example, would cause uncontrollable aggression, and there is NOTHING that can be done about it. I'm not saying that is the case. I'm saying it's a possibility.

I think that if people actually READ the specifics of this case, you would understand what is going on here - the cat is NOT a feral. The cat is NOT simply scared. The cat is NOT nice "some of the time."


I am NOT pushing to have the cat euthanized. The OP has already said she is looking into drugs. But if they don't work, then she might be out of options.

This poor woman has obviously been trying to help the cat and I think people should stop being so judgmental. When the cat is in your house flying at you, then you get to decide.

catlady999
July 7th, 2008, 11:59 PM
Minimomma,I know how dangerous a crazed,stressed out cat can be,it's not only hissing and swatting,but a real fly at you teeth bared attack.
It was my own Rocky,whom I love very much,several people asked"is this cat still alive?"
He's attacked me 4 times,where I needed hospital-care.
But he had a reason for his behavior,now I've learned to look out and make sure,he is not again in a situation where he attacks.
Could I live with a cat who is always dangerous,no,I don't think so.
A crazed cat can do very serious damage..
In this case,this poor cat probably lived indoors with one lady,he has lost his home and the person he trusts.
Is he an older cat??
In my case with Rocky,I think the way I behaved in the situation made things worse,although it is very difficult to stay calm when a cat has his teeth dug in to your ankle.
I would give this cat a chance to learn to trust you,if it takes meds,so be it,if he will take it:fingerscr
There might be something medically wrong with him too,he might be in pain,or someone might have hurt him,who knows what he went through before his owner ended up in hospital.
I don't think that letting him out to fend for himself is a humane solution,I know,not any of my cats would not survive out there very long.
I know my opinion goes against most peoples,but if this cat does not respond to any treatment after some time trying,is a danger to everyone,maybe the only humane thing to do is to give him peace.

Now, that's what I call an open-minded response - presents experience, gives ideas, allows for other possibilities, recognizes the physical threat, understands that not every animal can be saved. Basically, covers the whole spectrum. My faith in the possibility of civil behaviour on forums is partially restored. Thankyou, Chico.

mona_b
July 8th, 2008, 12:16 AM
How was this cat when you got him?How was he where he was currently after taken out of the home and placed where he was?Have the caretakers of this women able to tell you how the cat was?Are they scratched apart from this cat?Was the owner?Did the cat have free run of the owners place?

I know alot of questions.Just wanting some input about the cat.You can sometimes know a cat by their surroundings.

minimomma
July 8th, 2008, 12:33 AM
The cat was staying at a nurses place. The nurses who rescued him from his home. tryed giving him gravel. I was told he was standoffish. I honestly do not know how the nurses got him in the carrier. The nurse I picked the cat up from basically told me good luck. He was fine when she left him go in their bedroom downstairs( spare bedroom) I couldn't pick him up for a couple of days due to work ect and her work. They live over an hour from us. The cat would start attacking her.....

It took my husband and myself over an hour and half to get this cat. My husbands arms were ripped to shreds. He had puncture wounds on his arms. To let you know how bad it is. My husband is an infantry soldier( a tough man who has seen alot of things) Jake ripped through leather work gloves. we wrapped him in a heavy duty blanket and put him in the kennel.

No other information as the owner is dying in the hospital. However the nurse did say the owner took better care of the cat then herself. The owner was in a wheelchair. She fell out of her wheelchair and was on the floor for 4 days. The nurses are thinking maybe that cat has been run over ect.. I know the owner has MS and something else. We have been thinking because of the severity of MS, Jake had no attention or interaction. He was well fed. The nurses said the litter boxes looked like they never have been cleaned. As far as I know he had run of the whole house. I can not give him this opportunity. This cat has been getting worse and worse. I have spoke to several of experts and people who have experience.

As catlady pointed out HE IS NOT A FEREL cat. I wish he was.

Back to the nurse. we were going to meet at the hospital. She could not get the cat as he attacked her. My husband and I did not feel this was safe for her to be trying to do this.. with not alot of experience. We drove to her house to do this. She said.. she had no idea what to do... if we didn't show up. She would have had to call ANIMAL CONTROL

To give you an idea, I would go head to head with a 1200 lbs mustang over and over again.....no problem. Jake is different. He is so aggresive and he is dangerous. He is not just a small cute kitty. He will hurt someone or something. I have no doubt in my mind.

minimomma
July 8th, 2008, 12:50 AM
If any of you would like to Volunteer and try to help this kitty out and pay for the huge vet bills that are most likely going to come out of this. Please I will sedate him and ship him to you at my expense.

Lukka'sma
July 8th, 2008, 06:26 AM
I just want to say that it sounds to me like you are in a very tough spot here. You want to provide every opportunity for this cat to go to a loving home, yet he is so dangerous that I doubt it would ever be possible. I would not want to be in your shoes and I wish you luck but it doesn't sound to me like this cat is going to be tamed.
I remember years ago at the Humane Society one cat that was left at the back door in a crate sometime during the night. It had the same type of reaction whenever the cage was approached. The cat had to be bagged daily just to clean the cage or to put food and water in. Eventually the cat was deemed unsuitable for adoption and destroyed. The wild look and actions of this cat were terrifying, I had never seen anything like it before, and I want to say that I never would have a cat like that in my house.
I think you are very brave to even attempt to tame this cat, and thank goodness that there are people like you who are willing to take the risk.
If you are successful with this cat, I commend you on your devotion to the cause, if the worse case scenario does happen, I thank you for trying everything in your power to help the cat.

Love4himies
July 8th, 2008, 07:28 AM
I hope the vet can find some reason for this aggression, but if not, I agree with Chico, you have to give him peace.

I wonder if the cat got injured during one of the "moves" and is now afraid of humans?

As I posted earlier, to let this cat free would probably lead to a very slow death for him.

clm
July 8th, 2008, 07:47 AM
I could be wrong, been known to happen, :laughing:, but I think this poor kitty who is still really young, has been through too much lately. Probably hasn't had any socialization with anyone other than the owner, and now it's whole world has been torn apart. He's scared and needs some space to calm down. Even a bathroom would be a little too small for him to feel safe if someone comes in to feed him or change his litter box, if he's feeling cornered, he'll attack. It's too bad because I think with time he'll come around, but it's not easy to give a cat that kind of space in a house. You'd almost have to give up the reck room or one of the larger bedrooms for a while. I don't blame the OP for having him put down if his behaviour doesn't change, I just think it's sad for such a young cat.

Cindy

chico2
July 8th, 2008, 08:01 AM
minimomma,I assume when you said Jack was given gravel,it's a typo(I am great for that)maybe you mean Gravol?Could it have done damage???
I also believe there is a very strong possibility Jack is in pain,maybe even braindamaged from a kick or who knows what else:shrug:
At only 3 yrs old,it's really sad,not much more than a kitten:sad:
I have Feli-Way diffusers in 2 rooms,to stop my Rocky from spraying and it works,but I buy mine on E-Bay,not available here anymore.
Pet-Smart sells Nutri-Vet,which did not work as well for spraying.
But I was told it's worked very well on behavior-problems,however it will take time,Jacks problem might be too severe.
I am hoping your vet can give you some answers:fingerscr

Another point,my cats but mostly Rocky,goes off the wall just from the sight of a carrier or cage,but you say Jack is the same if left in a room:shrug:it's a mystery,but with your rescue experiences I trust you to not give up easy.
Good Luck to poor Jack and your family:pray:

ancientgirl
July 8th, 2008, 08:44 AM
You can get Rescue Remedy at any health food store. It's a natural extract and helps in calming down. At the very least maybe putting some drops in his water might ease his anxiety a bit.

minimomma
July 8th, 2008, 10:58 AM
Thank you for all your replys.. I have not given up hope. I am pretty stuborn. I wish I could give him more room but due to safety reasons. He needs to be in this cage. Sorry it was a typo- for gravol. I was up really late and my brain was not functioning.

My vet will be out on Sunday so keep your fingers crossed.

chico2
July 8th, 2008, 02:31 PM
Mini,:fingerscrand toes crossed for the little guy:pray:
I was going to say before,anyone who has experienced a cat coming at you ears back,flying through the air all paws claws out as if he is going for the kill,knows how incredibly scary and dangerous it can be.
I sincerely hope your vet will find out,why Jack is like this:fingerscr

ancientgirl
July 8th, 2008, 03:21 PM
Chico, I have to say, I haven't experienced that fully, but now and then when I'm sitting with Czarina she'll start to growl at the others or even just look at me and growl, I get this nervous feeling in my belly. I immediately move and make her jump off of me and leave the kitchen in the hopes she realizes that's not acceptable behavior. But I can imagine the terror one must feel with a full fledged attack.

Hopefully the vet will get a better idea as to what is wrong with Jack and hopefully:fingerscr it can be treated with medication.

Leigh Vitalone
July 8th, 2008, 07:41 PM
I think people need to cut the OP some serious slack. She has already done more then the average person would do or put up with. She is taking a risk of endangering her family and her other animals. She still has not given up and continues to try. I don't think a person should be knocked for doing everything they can possibly thinking to save a cat. It's her time and money. It's her family's safety and sanity.

Not every animal can be saved. What matters is taking the time and having the patience and doing everything you can possible do. From reading what she has written I believe she is doing just that.

If she puts the cat down I believe it's because the cat can't be saved, not giving up.

If any one here can do better why don't you invest YOUR TIME and risk YOUR family and ship the cat to your house and work with it.

Sitetrekk
July 8th, 2008, 08:05 PM
There ARE, indeed, some animals beyond salvation. Some are genetically
predisposed to aggression.

I know of no one who can spend 24/7 for years trying to bring a cat
around who is detemined to dismember or maim anyone who comes
within reach. If the cat won't let you hold him, how can you comfort him,
reassure him, etc,...? Funds, too, are limited. There's only so far one
human being can go.

Nah, I think everything's been tried except drugs....and maybe the vet can
offer something there.

Sitetrekk

Stacer
July 8th, 2008, 09:01 PM
I've been following this kerfuffle, reading the various threads that are basically dealing with the same issue regarding this cat.

While I feel for the cat and the OP that is trying to deal with the poor creature, I find it oddly amusing that so many new members have joined in the last few days to reply to this specific topic.

In my personal opinion this entire situation has run it's course. The OP is going to do what she's going to do, and ultimately nothing that has been said here is going to change the outcome, good or bad.

Good luck, I hope you can come to a reasonable solution for this poor cat.

Frenchy
July 8th, 2008, 09:08 PM
I find it oddly amusing that so many new members have joined in the last few days to reply to this specific topic.



Same here :D

Stacer
July 8th, 2008, 09:11 PM
Same here :D

It seems like every time there is a heated topic new members come out of the woodwork to reply, then disappear never to be seen again. POOF! :confused::shrug:

Sitetrekk
July 8th, 2008, 09:28 PM
Um...nice to meet you too!! ? :thumbs up

Stacer
July 8th, 2008, 09:37 PM
Um...nice to meet you too!! ? :thumbs up

It is what it is. Every few months we get a bunch of new members trolling for trouble. While this particular topic is serious, the new members joining to reply only to this topic is suspicious.

If you're a legitimate new member that will be sticking around to be a contributing member of our community, then welcome, make a post in our introductions sub forum.

Sitetrekk
July 8th, 2008, 09:52 PM
Introduction posted. I may mostly lurk which is what I do on any forum.
Lurk and learn.....my multiple pet household keeps me too busy to do much of anything else. But it IS nice to meet you all.

Frenchy
July 8th, 2008, 10:04 PM
It is what it is. Every few months we get a bunch of new members trolling for trouble. While this particular topic is serious, the new members joining to reply only to this topic is suspicious.



And in this case , new poster , brings in friends for back up , to me , it's just to stir up some sh**. And they are going on and on about it . Which I think is totally ridiculous.

Sitetrekk
July 8th, 2008, 10:14 PM
Fine....you don't want new posters here, that's ok. I've got stuff to do anyway. I justr thought maybe this would be a good place to hang out
with other animal enthusiasts....not the friendliest place, though....so I'll
just be on my way. Bye

catlady999
July 8th, 2008, 10:19 PM
It is what it is. Every few months we get a bunch of new members trolling for trouble. While this particular topic is serious, the new members joining to reply only to this topic is suspicious.

If you're a legitimate new member that will be sticking around to be a contributing member of our community, then welcome, make a post in our introductions sub forum.

I will freely admit that I came here by referral. I have been trying to help this poor cat for over a week now, and I was very dismayed that a reputable rescuer was being beaten up. I freely admitted who I was when I came on, and I posted VERY politely - NOT a troll. Despite that, I was attacked. I also tried to help on another, unrelated thread, and was attacked. Trols don't do that.Yes, I know the rescuer from another forum. But I am not some family member or something.

A couple of other people are also here because they KNOW that minimomma is a good rescuer. We are not trolls. We are people who don't want to see a legitimate rescuer beaten up. There's a difference. We have learned over a period of many months that minimomma is one of the good guys.

Personally, I don't support people who have crappy attitudes towards animals.

Yes, on all forums people come out of the woodwork. MOST of the time, they are people who have a vested interest in the person's business, or are personal friends. Then, there are the puppy millers who come on to offer testimonials, pretending to be "satisfied customers."

But every so often, somebody is actually genuinely concerned that one of the "good guys" is being unfairly accused. I don't know minimomma personally. I am in Ontario; she is in Alberta. There is nothing "in it" for me. But the way she has been treated just for ASKING for help is disgraceful.

Some of you were more interested in attacking minimomma that anything else. What a shame.



People come to forums for all kinds of reasons. Whether or not they stay depends on how they're treated. Who CARES how three of us got here IF we are good to animals and know something? You might want to brush up on the concept "six degrees of separation."

So, although I originally came to support her, I might have stayed and contributed. But I don't need the abuse. I was just trying to help a rescuer help a frickin cat. Excuse me for trying.

Stacer
July 8th, 2008, 10:35 PM
I find it really hard to even respond to this topic appropriately because the OP deleted all of the pertinent posts at the beginning of this and other threads.

From my own observation this topic is going in circles, the same points and information are being repeated over and over again.

Good for you for being a great animal lover and coming over here to help your friend out, but from what I can tell (despite the deleted posts) is that the OP blew 14+kittie's comment (in a thread unrelated to this particular cat) out of proportion or misinterpreted it, then you show up with a long post defending her against post that wasn't meant to be malicious and it has sprung horns ever since.

OP, do what your gut tells you to do, you've obviously got the best advisor in catlady999.

catlady999
July 8th, 2008, 10:56 PM
you've obviously got the best advisor in catlady999.

Ok, now that's just snarky

TeriM
July 9th, 2008, 12:07 AM
Not sure I want to even post in this discussion but I did happen to be lurking when some of the original postings were made. I agree with others that this has been greatly blown out of proportion. 14+Kitties is a very respected and regular poster to this board and it is not that we aren't welcoming to others but that many also feel the need to protect and defend our friend as much as the new posters feel the need to protect yours.

That said, I unfortunately agree that not all animals can be saved :sad:. I do believe that the OP will not make this decision lightly and will do their best to exhaust every option before making that choice. I hope that some of the valuable advice mentioned here will also be carefully considered :fingerscr.

minimomma
July 9th, 2008, 12:35 AM
I guess for some closure in respect to these threads.

I came on here, my first post wasn't about Jake. I was posting about a minature horse.can't remember the posters nic..she rescued this little horse. I found this thread because I was looking for other mini horse rescuers in canada, through google. I read her thread and I was in awe and very happy because I don't come across many minature horse rescue people. Very limited.

Then I posted about my rescues... got the wrong thread- and started this thread to separate from the other thread. I was browsing other forums and saw 14 plus kitties. I did not come on this forum to cause poop. If I did that would be my first post and I wouldn't be advertising all my finances and a whole wack of personal stuff.

I am on another forum that have been very supportive of me inregards to my efforts with Jake and with other animals. I can see your point about defending. But throughout this whole situation- it wasn't about the orginal message it became about other peoples opinions. I am not starting this up again. This is not the reason for this post. I am some of you feel that an individual came on here to support me. I have never met her but she is one of the few people that I respect on the internet. She will give you advice whether you like it or not. She does not side on a side just because. So please don't bash her. She is very well informed ( not implying any of you aren't as well)

Okay so back to my point, I actually pmd 14 to say sorry if anything that was said was misunderstood. I think we both agree that things were taken out of concept. We also agree to disagree. 14 if I have not fully explained this then feel free to correct me. This is what I perceived from our little conversation.The passion that is felt in this forum may have been seen as negative but it is all about the love of animals. Now if we can just bottle that passion and make movements to change others attitudes. I firmly believe on any animal forum, people go on there because of their love of animals and because they want to see things change. Not everyone is going to agree with anyone else but that is life. I try to keep an open mind, I have learned so many things in regards to Jakes situation. Things I would never have thought of. I have tried so many things.The knowledge which I have gained is going to help my cause not only in Jakes Case but in future cases. As most of you know, I rescue all critters big and small with the exception of ( COWS- long story) and I am very grateful for places like these. Yes there are good and bad but like I have mentioned I have learned so much.

Anyways I am babling on and on.. I need to go and give some meds to my outside critters and wrestle with a few horses.

Take care and all the best...

chico2
July 9th, 2008, 07:11 AM
Minimomma,14+is one of my favorite cat-people and there are several here,who'd give there last breath to save an animal.
This whole thing has been blown way out of proportion and bickering does not help Jake.
If he knew all the attention his little life is getting,he would calm right down:cat:
I guess we've come to the end of this discussion,I wish you and Jake all the best and hope for a solution to his problems:fingerscr

Leigh Vitalone
July 9th, 2008, 07:18 AM
And in this case , new poster , brings in friends for back up , to me , it's just to stir up some sh**. And they are going on and on about it . Which I think is totally ridiculous.

Wow, I did not JUST join to support this member. The OP is on another message board I am on, but I do not know her and I rarely talk to her. I had no opinion either way and I would not have "supported" her if I felt she was wrong. I based my opinion on my feelings about the situation and what I read she is doing and trying. I have been a member of THIS forum since May I believe and lurked for a few months previously. I normally just read what is written. I have 5 dogs, 3 cats, and two rats. I thought this would be a good to share my knowledge and opinions, about my love for animals and my passion to help save them, but sadly I was wrong. You only want new members that share YOUR feelings and YOUR emotions. I appreciate being called a troll because I posted for the very first time, that was welcoming and kind. I apologize, I was not aware that we could not post if we had a difference of opinions. But now that I know I will only post if it's in agreement to everyone else.

14+kitties
July 9th, 2008, 08:00 AM
Ok guys. I have stayed out of this - for obvious reasons. I would really just like this thing done. Yesterday!
Mods, if possible, can we close this thread and other related ones and just - start over.
Thank you

Love4himies
July 9th, 2008, 08:10 AM
Ok guys. I have stayed out of this - for obvious reasons. I would really just like this thing done. Yesterday!
Mods, if possible, can we close this thread and other related ones and just - start over.
Thank you

Good idea, 14+! Plus there are two threads on this same issue.

Jake and minimomma need our help.

clm
July 9th, 2008, 08:15 AM
Ok guys. I have stayed out of this - for obvious reasons. I would really just like this thing done. Yesterday!
Mods, if possible, can we close this thread and other related ones and just - start over.
Thank you

Best idea yet.

Cindy

Lukka'sma
July 9th, 2008, 09:07 AM
I'd like to have at least one thread open so we can see what progress this cat makes, if any. One way or another there will be answers when the vet checks him over on the weekend.

Love4himies
July 9th, 2008, 09:20 AM
I'd like to have at least one thread open so we can see what progress this cat makes, if any. One way or another there will be answers when the vet checks him over on the weekend.

I think that is what 14+ was suggesting, it is time to start fresh!

luckypenny
July 9th, 2008, 10:14 AM
I only have two comments to make here, however blunt and rude they may sound.

First, this poor cat should have been thoroughly vet checked as soon as it came into rescue, and that includes blood tests if the cat was showing such signs of aggression. There's no excuse, especially when there are other animals and children in the home. If someone wants to help an animal, then do it right and all the way. Don't take the chance of prolonging it's misery.

It is what it is. Every few months we get a bunch of new members trolling for trouble. While this particular topic is serious, the new members joining to reply only to this topic is suspicious.


You're absolutely on the ball Stacer. These additional posters have come here specifically for that. As quoted from that "other" forum :rolleyes::
Go get 'em, Cure. The more commmon sense gets injected into that forum, the better off everyone will be, including the animals.
That's what you think - we just got called trolls LOL

I totally agree with you on this 14+.
Ok guys. I have stayed out of this - for obvious reasons. I would really just like this thing done. Yesterday!
Mods, if possible, can we close this thread and other related ones and just - start over.
Thank you

If anyone has some useful advice to help out this poor cat, then by all means, offer it. Otherwise, I personally don't welcome all this extra drama when it's purpose is just to rile up valued members of this site.

marko
July 9th, 2008, 10:25 AM
This thread has run its course and will now be closed.

As always - updates can be added by Pming me.

Thx,
Marko