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Canidae Formula & Manufacturer Changed

rainbow
July 3rd, 2008, 01:55 AM
I read on another forum that Canidae has changed it's formulas. I don't know what the changes are but will post them when I find out. I just thought I would post the announcement in case those of you that feed it have dogs with allergies that could be a concern.

Also they are supposedly now getting Diamond to make their food. :sad:

SolaMio
July 3rd, 2008, 05:50 AM
Oh no :sad:
I've been a Canidae fan.. I don't know much about Diamond, rainbow- is this one of the large companies?

Sabine
July 3rd, 2008, 06:16 AM
On their website they describe the new formulas: ***click me*** (http://www.canidae.com/new-formulas.html)

Chaser
July 3rd, 2008, 12:24 PM
Thanks for the heads-up rainbow! I love how you're always on top of thos stuff :thumbs up I think the changes look to be mainly positive. I like the increased lamb meal...but don't really appreciate rice bran showing up as 6th on the list as added filler. It's hard to say....everything still seems okay, and they're maintaining that their ingredients are still human-grade, and still no wheat, corn, soy etc. But I can't help but feel suspicious of it because any other dog food re-formulations have historically seemed to me to result in lower-quality. :shrug:

I'm switching Chase to Wellness right now so I suppose it doesn't matter much for him, but I have been pushing to try and get my in-laws dog Heidi on to it. Oh well, even the new formula far surpasses Pro Plan Senior IMO, so it would still be an improvement!

rainbow
July 3rd, 2008, 02:08 PM
Oh no :sad:
I've been a Canidae fan.. I don't know much about Diamond, rainbow- is this one of the large companies?

Yes, Diamond is a large company. Not only do they have their own brands but manufacture for other pet food companies as well. Here is a list of different brands and their manufacturers....

http://www.thepetfoodlist.com/petfoods_pg1.htm

Also Diamond has been involved in several recalls....the biggest, I believe, was in 2005 with the kibble tainted with aflatoxin.


On their website they describe the new formulas: ***click me*** (http://www.canidae.com/new-formulas.html)

Thanks for posting the link, Sabine. :thumbs up

rainbow
July 3rd, 2008, 02:14 PM
I think the changes look to be mainly positive. I like the increased lamb meal...but don't really appreciate rice bran showing up as 6th on the list as added filler. It's hard to say....everything still seems okay, and they're maintaining that their ingredients are still human-grade, and still no wheat, corn, soy etc. But I can't help but feel suspicious of it because any other dog food re-formulations have historically seemed to me to result in lower-quality. :shrug:



Yeah, but also the addition of barley may be a concern to some because of the gluten. Their old formulas were gluten free so the new formula is going to affect a lot of dogs who can't tolerate gluten. :sad:

I don't think there is anything wrong with barley as long as it agrees with your dog. ;)

rainbow
July 3rd, 2008, 02:20 PM
This is what the dog food project website has to say about the Canidae formula changes....

Upcoming changes to Canidae formulations
Admin | June 30, 2008 3:56 pm
I wanted to give a heads up to dog owners feeding Canidae products about a few details that the makers of this product aren't telling you in their sales pitch for their changed formulas:

Under the new formulation, Canidae dry foods will no longer be gluten free, due to the addition of barley. If you know that your dog is gluten intolerant, start shopping around for a different food.

Even if your dog doesn't have problems with gluten (not all do, and many foods do contain high-gluten grains like barley), the change in formulation to include rice bran and peas may contribute to gas and digestive upset. Dogs who aren't particularly sensitive may not have any problems at all, others will get over it within a few days of transitioning, but again, for individuals with a delicate digestive system, expect that they may no longer tolerate the product.

Millet is generally well tolerated, but again, it doesn't work for every dog.

"Diversifying" ingredients may sound catchy, and Canidae certainly has made an effort to put a positive spin on it in their statement, but please remember that not all dogs do well on foods that include a wide variety of items.

Also note that "Herring Meal" will be replaced by generic "Ocean Fish Meal", meaning the company reserves the possibility to use different fish from batch to batch without having to change the ingredient list. This has not been addressed in their statement at all.

Whether these changes are indeed an improvement, as Canidae claims, is for you to decide - after observing how it affects your dog.

Canidae All Lifestages
Old Formula: http://canidae.com/dogs/all_life_stages/dry.html
New Formula: http://canidae.com/dogs/all_life_stages/dry2.html

Canidae Platinum
Old Formula: http://canidae.com/dogs/platinum/dry.html
New Formula: http://canidae.com/dogs/platinum/dry2.html

Canidae Chicken & Rice
(Note that after the change it's no longer going to be a true "Chicken and Rice" formula, but instead a "Chicken, Rice, Barley and Peas" formula)
Old Formula: http://canidae.com/dogs/chicken-and-rice/dry.html
New Formula: http://canidae.com/dogs/chicken-and-rice/dry2.html

Canidae Lamb & Rice
New Formula: http://canidae.com/dogs/lamb-and-rice/dry.html
The old formula has already been overwritten. "Lamb and Rice" formula will now also be a misnomer - even though it's legal as far as labeling regulations go. This is the current ingredient list:


Lamb Meal, Brown Rice, Canola Oil (preserved with Mixed Tocopherols), Flax Seed, Sun cured Alfalfa Meal, Sunflower Oil, Lamb, Lecithin, Potassium Chloride, Choline Chloride, Linoleic Acid, Rosemary Extract, Sage Extract, Dried Enterococcus Faecium Fermentation Product, Dried Lactobacillus Acidophilus Fermentation Product, Dried Aspergillus Oryzae Fermentation Extract, Dried Bacillus Subtilis Fermentation Extract, Inulin (from Chicory Root), Saccharomyces Cerevisiae Fermentation Solubles, L-Lysine, Taurine, Yucca Schidigera Extract, Mixed Tocopherols (source of Vitamin E), Zinc Amino Acid Chelate, Manganese Amino Acid Chelate, Iron Amino Acid Chelate, Copper Amino Acid Chelate, Cobalt Amino Acid Chelate, Vitamin A Supplement, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Ascorbic Acid (source of Vitamin C), Niacin, Thiamine Mononitrate (Vitamin B1), Riboflavin (source of Vitamin B2), Beta Carotene, Calcium Pantothenate, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B6), Calcium Iodate, Folic Acid, D-Biotin, Organic Selenium, Dried Papaya, Dried Pineapple, Vitamin B12 Supplement

rainbow
July 3rd, 2008, 02:27 PM
I'm switching Chase to Wellness right now so I suppose it doesn't matter much for him, but I have been pushing to try and get my in-laws dog Heidi on to it. Oh well, even the new formula far surpasses Pro Plan Senior IMO, so it would still be an improvement!


Perhaps you could get them to switch to Innova (www.naturapet.com) instead. They do make their food at their own manufacturing plant. :thumbs up

I still haven't been able to find any real confirmation that Canidae did outsource their product to Diamond but it is now all over the internet that they do. I just don't understand why they would stop using their own facilities. :confused:

SolaMio
July 3rd, 2008, 02:53 PM
I'm not as concerned about the formula change after reading about it on the Canidae site, as I am about the manufacturer change. I found some discussion on this on another forum (I can provide the link if anyone is interested) and there seemed to be a lot of concern there as well. I liked Canidae not only because of the ingredients, Sola does really well on it, but also because it came from the smaller plant in California (Pied Piper I think?). I'm worried about the switch since Diamond was involved in the recent large recall. I was considering Wellness as a possibility- but I am told that it also comes from a similar large scale manufacturer. We have a fairly limited selection where I live, and the "premium" brands are pricey.
Does anyone have other recommendations for a dry food?
If you are feeding Canidae, will you continue to do so even after the formula/manufacturing change?

SolaMio
July 3rd, 2008, 02:55 PM
Thanks Rainbow :thumbs up
I will have a look at the link you posted. Maybe that will help me make a decision...:shrug:

rainbow
July 3rd, 2008, 04:16 PM
SolaMio, we don't know for sure yet if Canidae has contracted out to Diamond to manufacture their food. I received this email from them on Feb. 6/08 .....

Hello,

Canidae Pet Foods is manufactured at our new facility we own called Western Pet Food/Canidae Division which is located next to Pied Piper Mill in Hamlin, Texas. No other products other than Canidae are made at Western Pet.

Sincerely,
Team Canidae


If for some reason they have since outsourced to Diamond then another good food that is not as expensive as others is Innova. :)

Chaser
July 3rd, 2008, 06:47 PM
Perhaps you could get them to switch to Innova (www.naturapet.com) instead. They do make their food at their own manufacturing plant. :thumbs up :confused:

rainbow - I hadn't even thought of Innova! Good call on that ...now the challenge is convincing them to switch, but that's another story. And I didn't even make the barley = gluten connection. Thanks for posting the Dog Food Project info!

Why is it that once something is good, corporations get greedy and have to change it???? I'm glad I've already switched from Canidae or I would be feeling really stressed out about this...what worries me most is how long good quality dog food will actually be available. It seems like every company will eventually cheap out!

rainbow
July 3rd, 2008, 07:45 PM
Why is it that once something is good, corporations get greedy and have to change it???? I'm glad I've already switched from Canidae or I would be feeling really stressed out about this...what worries me most is how long good quality dog food will actually be available. It seems like every company will eventually cheap out!


That's what worries me too. :frustrated: There is still a few other companies that have their own manufacturing plants and those are the only ones that I would consider purchasing from.

Also, I have sent an email to Canidae asking them if they have contracted out to Diamond to manufacture their food. I will post their reply when I receive it. :)

SolaMio
July 3rd, 2008, 08:38 PM
Also, I have sent an email to Canidae asking them if they have contracted out to Diamond to manufacture their food. I will post their reply when I receive it. :)

I know this is obviously third-party info but there is a very similar discussion happening on another dog forum (I'm not a member, just came across it), and members have already written to the company and phoned:

http://www.lab-retriever.net/board/canidae-now-made-t7293962.html

In case anyone is interested.. I hope I'm not breaking forum etiquette by posting a link to another forum, so please don't banish me... Just more food for thought. There is a letter supposedly from Canidae explaining why they changed their manufacturer... :shrug:

rainbow
July 4th, 2008, 02:08 AM
I guess I will get the same reply to my email.

SolaMio
July 4th, 2008, 06:32 AM
I wonder if you will... I guess that will show if it's a cut and paste or not :)

Smiley14
July 5th, 2008, 07:28 PM
I actually emailed Canidae a few weeks ago to ask about this, but have been on vacation, so wasn't able to post before now! I too am not overly concerned about the ingredient change, but am NOT happy about their outsourcing to Diamond. I don't feed Canidae, but have always supported them. But now I'm not so sure. First they cut out rice to save money and now they're outsourcing to save even more. They're growing too big too fast and I am afraid things will suffer because of it.

Here is the email response I got:

Due to overwhelming customer support and increased demand on our
products, we have been faced with unique production capacity challenges.
Our growing customer support and demand has pushed for increased
capacity, therefore we have outsourced additional production from
Diamond Pet Foods. Our customers demand and deserve no less than the
highest quality safe ingredients, as well as state of the art consistent
manufacturing. Outsourcing additional production from Diamond comes not
without first carefully instating and accepting only the strictest
testing protocols, as well as mandating stringent operating procedures
to ensure the highest quality products possible at every level of
production. We are very happy with this relationship and the high
quality formulations we are able to bring to you.

Expect Excellence!
Sincerely,
Team Canidae

Chaser
July 5th, 2008, 07:43 PM
Hmmmm...that response sounds familiar. Definitely cut and paste. :frustrated: I agree with "too big too fast" Smiley14

runwiththewind
July 6th, 2008, 09:10 AM
Thanks Rainbow for the Dog Food List. Please note the date is 2007.

I noticed Dogswell doesn't mention the treats are Made in China. I don't know if their entire line is made there. I returned it after I noticed it written on the back of the package.

Ingredients are both domestic and imported. All products are safe, and raw materials are tested randomly.
Products do not contain rice protein or rice protein concentrate.
Declined to name manufacturer, but stated that their manufacturer is approved by the USDA, and have not had any problems with any recalls of their food or treats.


Also, Champion Pet Foods claim:

Own and operate their own production facilities in Morinville, Alberta, Canada

They make their own foods exclusively - their mandate is to produce world-class foods from fresh regional ingredients. That means almost all of their ingredients (over 90% for ORIJEN) are raised, fished or farmed within western Canada.

Only imported ingredients are lamb from New Zealand and rice from California - these are used in their ACANA brand foods.

They do not, and never have, had their brands produced or co-packed by any other pet food producer.

This is a recent partial statement regarding the Orijen bone fragments in some of their lots.

You are correct - those were fish bones you have seen in the food. The supplier of the fresh salmon experienced some mechanical difficulties, and we were shipped some salmon that contained these pieces. Unfortunately, and it was realised too late, but a limited amount of food was made before we discovered the problem. Once we realised it, we immediately stopped using it and rejected the rest of the shipment. I personally looked through the product made and did notice some bones (much smaller than the ones in your pictures, however) and was satisfied that the extent of the bone issue was very limited, and that the bones were sufficiently small that they would not cause any concern.

Guess we still need to keep on top of the foods we are feeding our fur kids.

rainbow
July 6th, 2008, 04:39 PM
Here is the email response I got:

Due to overwhelming customer support and increased demand on our
products, we have been faced with unique production capacity challenges.
Our growing customer support and demand has pushed for increased
capacity, therefore we have outsourced additional production from
Diamond Pet Foods. Our customers demand and deserve no less than the
highest quality safe ingredients, as well as state of the art consistent
manufacturing. Outsourcing additional production from Diamond comes not
without first carefully instating and accepting only the strictest
testing protocols, as well as mandating stringent operating procedures
to ensure the highest quality products possible at every level of
production. We are very happy with this relationship and the high
quality formulations we are able to bring to you.

Expect Excellence!
Sincerely,
Team Canidae

I haven't received an answer to my email yet but probably because of the July 4 holiday and then weekend. That is, however, the same reply I read elsewhere so I expect it will be the same as the one I get. :rolleyes:

rainbow
July 6th, 2008, 04:48 PM
Thanks Rainbow for the Dog Food List. Please note the date is 2007.


The petlist website does state this on their homepage .....

The list is intended as a starting point for your own research

However, they still have not updated any information on Canidae. Perhaps they are waiting to hear form them before making any changes. :shrug:

The only website I really like is www.dogfoodproject.com as it is a great source of information and they always seem to stay on top of everything. :thumbs up

Smiley14
July 6th, 2008, 05:12 PM
I haven't received an answer to my email yet but probably because of the July 4 holiday and then weekend. That is, however, the same reply I read elsewhere so I expect it will be the same as the one I get. :rolleyes:

LOL, yeah. Pretty sad actually though!

rainbow
July 10th, 2008, 03:43 AM
Here's the reply I received from Canidae....


www.canidae.com/new-formulas.html

Dear ****,

Please click on the above link, we have updated our site to insure all your questions are answered about our newly improved formulas. Be sure to scroll all the way to the bottom of that page.

Due to overwhelming customer support and increased demand on our products, we have been faced with unique production capacity challenges. Our growing customer support and demand has pushed for increased capacity, therefore we have outsourced additional production from Diamond Pet Foods. Our customers demand and deserve no less than the highest quality safe ingredients, as well as state of the art consistent manufacturing. Outsourcing additional production from Diamond comes not without first carefully instating and accepting only the strictest testing protocols, as well as mandating stringent operating procedures to ensure the highest quality products possible at every level of production. We are very happy with this relationship and the high quality formulations we are able to bring to you. Expect Excellence!

All of our suppliers must follow strict protocols set forth by us. No single employee can be responsible for the testing of incoming ingredients. All testing and reporting must be confirmed by a second party. In addition all grains are purchased from a single supplier in low aflatoxin risk areas. Even though CANIDAE does not use corn in any of our products, we are proactive in creating testing procedures to help assure the safety of your pets. Also all CANIDAE formulas are tested during our production runs, and cleared by a supervisor, every 30 minutes to assure the safety of our line. We understand the level of trust you must have with the foods you feed your pets, and itís our responsibility and commitment to deliver!

Our quality of raw material as well as quality control has actual increased not decreased. Yes we have diversified our complex carbohydrates as rice continues to climb and high quality availability decreases. Our products are better than ever and more consistent. Yes we have cut costs on shipping rates as fuel continues to go through the roof. To ship pet food from one location is no longer cost effective. Our economy is facing some challenging times and we are being proactive in offering you the highest quality products, yet affordable enough for our consumers to purchase. We are not sure about other companies and their plans for change or their reasons in the past, however we feel we are being open and honest about our changes. We are getting many positive feed backs from our customers that are actually feeding their pets our improved formulas, who also refrain from listening to rumors or incorrect information.

We thank thank you for your comments, and hope you are able to try our products.

Sincerely,
Julie@Team Canidae