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I'm getting a little scared.

Akira
April 9th, 2008, 02:21 PM
I'll begin with how we came to have our new pup.

My husband and I were at the dog park and there was an adorable little guy there. So we started talking to the person who had him there who happend to not be the owner of the dog. This woman told us that the people who owned him were leaving him outside because he was peeing and pooing in the house. (This dog is around 10 weeks old) She told us they gave him no attention, he had not ONE single toy. She then said to us how she wished she could take him home but she couldnt have a puppy cause of work. So my husband got this crazy idea and said "We'll take him!:D". So she contacted the owners they said they didnt want him and we could have him. He had a dollar store leash and collar that was broken, no treats, and the crappiest food you can buy. When we got him home we starting noticeing signs of abuse, you moved to quickly he would cowar, whenever he peed or pooed on the floor when you go to grab him and put him outside he would run away and wimper. Hes very agressive, I have twice had him growl and snap at me.

Yesterday, I took him to the vet, he had 2 large bumps on his nose and its crooked. The vet said it could have been from abuse, it could have been from him running into a wall. Either way i was not happy to hear this.

I'm sorry if this is alot to read but i figure i should tell you all the situation.

So the pup (Adam, formerly known as "knuckles") and my dog akira play lots, but he gets very rough, hes still very young and cant do much to her but he growls very loud and when you try to get him to stop he trys to bite you.

Today I tried 3 times to push him away and tell him no, but he tried to bite me each time. So i put him on his back and said no, a little more firm and yet he still tried to bite me and get back at attacking akira.

He is the sweetest thing, all he ever wants to do is give you kisses. Hes had a very rough start in life and im just wondreing what are some ways to get his agression under control?

Hes great at the dog park, hes great to new people, although he seems a little afraid of large men. He barks at people sometimes, but then wags his tail. He seems a little confused lol. But i just really want to get him out if these habits while hes young and the stuff i know to do is not working he is much different then Akira was as a puppy.

Any suggestions? im very worried he could grow up to be a dog that will bite.

I must add, we have no idea what his mix is. There is definately lab.
When i brought him to the vet, i didnt mention a word about pit bull (althought he very much so has a pitbull/bull terrier kind of head shape) the vet said to me i dont see any pitbull. I found it a little odd she would say it out of no where.

Anyways, im beginning to babble. So please anyone, let me know what you think i can do.

clm
April 9th, 2008, 02:34 PM
I would either get a trainer to come to the house, or get him enroled in puppy classes. Poor little guy has had a rough start, it's wonderful you've adopted him.

Cindy

Elizabeth Ann
April 9th, 2008, 02:39 PM
I think a trainer at the house would be better.

badger
April 9th, 2008, 02:54 PM
This is so sad :sad: but with a very happy ending. Thank you a million times for taking him away from what was clearly doggy hell.
Things can only get better.

Elizabeth Ann
April 9th, 2008, 03:04 PM
He is so young and trainable (is that a word?) that with a good personal ob. trainer and then great social puppy class your little guy can turn in a dream dog.

(Even after time once he has warmed up to you the snaping will stop - it did with my Tonka)

Akira
April 9th, 2008, 03:23 PM
Any recommendations on obedience trainers that come to your house?
I had contacted one once before but i ended up not needing to get a trainer for Akira. You paid $350 and they would come whenever you needed them to fix a problem for the duration of the dogs life. I cannot remember this places name for the life of me, any idea? Cause it sounded like a pretty good deal.

rainbow
April 9th, 2008, 03:26 PM
I agree with everyone.....obedience classes asap. :thumbs up

And, thanks for rescuing the poor boy from the :loser: owner.

I sure hope they don't decide to get another dog. :fingerscr

Elizabeth Ann
April 9th, 2008, 03:29 PM
Any recommendations on obedience trainers that come to your house?
I had contacted one once before but i ended up not needing to get a trainer for Akira. You paid $350 and they would come whenever you needed them to fix a problem for the duration of the dogs life. I cannot remember this places name for the life of me, any idea? Cause it sounded like a pretty good deal.

I only know of good trainers int he Southern Ontario area. But I am sure www.canada411.ca is a good place to start.

aslan
April 9th, 2008, 03:31 PM
I thoroughly agree with the puppy classes etc, until you can arrange this tho, Try giving little man a time out when he gets all vish face. To protect yourself i might suggest oven mits so he can't break the skin. Put him in his crate or a seperate room for a little bit, just to calm down not as a punishment. akira will put him in his place where she's concerned, its you you have to stop him from nipping. he's scared and just trying to protect himself, he thinks your gonna pown on him. Once he's calm give him a little treat or cuddles and tell him he's a good boy.

Elizabeth Ann
April 9th, 2008, 03:46 PM
I don't 100% agree with putting him in his crate. A crate should be a safe place and not some where to be sent when being punished (that's just the way I feel). It might be better to put in in a puppy safe room. Like an empty spare bedroom. Some where safe where he can't get into anything while he is serving his time out.

Akira
April 9th, 2008, 04:07 PM
Ive put him in the crate, he'll settle down a bit but he also barks up quite the storm while hes in there, so it doesnt do much. Akira has to put him in his place ALL the time, which i really hate, shes very good around puppies and small dogs but shes constantly haveing to bite at his face. Sometimes it will work, but other times it just provokes him even more. Just now i split the 2 of them up cause he was getting very loud and vicious, i was petting akira and he bit her ear very hard and she cried. He wont stop, she bites him, she pins him down. he'll back away and whimper a bit then hes right back at it. He also tries to get a lock on her neck, he never can cause shes to strong for him, but he does manage to hurt her alot because she doesnt want to hurt him. Could this also be because he possible might be part pitbull?

I am loading pictures onto the computer now and im gonna post them in the pet photography, nobody can figure out what he is, im pretty sure hes lab/bull terrier. My husbands got it stuck in his head that hes definately part pitbull and could even be purbread (his fur is nothing pitbulls fur, its much more like a labs fur so im highly doubting purbread pitt)

I have too many questions today! lol what breed is my dog? how do i stop him from being agressive? what food should i give him? blah blah lol

anyways, if you guys wanna take a look and take a guess what he is id aprectiate it.

Thanks for your help! :D

ancientgirl
April 9th, 2008, 04:18 PM
It's a great thing you did for this pup. It sounds like you already have some good advice. I hope you can get this all straightened out with him. He's probably known nothing but mistreatment so he's most likely thinking all people are like that and he's got to defend himself.

Good luck!

Akira
April 9th, 2008, 04:32 PM
Pics are up!

Thanks again everyone, I feel a bit better now that I have an idea on how to get this handsom boy to be the best he can be! :D

pitgrrl
April 9th, 2008, 05:11 PM
He also tries to get a lock on her neck, he never can cause shes to strong for him, but he does manage to hurt her alot because she doesnt want to hurt him. Could this also be because he possible might be part pitbull?


I'm not sure I understand this part? I've certainly watched many a puppy of various muttly mixes and specific breeds grab onto my dog's necks and refuse to let go for just about anything :shrug:

It sounds like you have a energy filled, undersocialized, mouthy puppy. Ofcourse it's near impossible to really understand what is really happening over the internet, so the suggestion of a trainer is probably a really good one, but none of this sounds "aggressive" really.

For the mouthy-ness specifically, I found that re-directing to an appropriate toy helped much more than just correcting by itself. It still took many, many, many repetitions and reminders, but it did help a lot.

Akira
April 9th, 2008, 05:36 PM
Its agression. The vet went to pet his back and he growled and showed his teeth to her. I think he is very scared of people hurting him so hes very defensive. The way he plays is not the way an energetic puppy plays. Akira was very dominant and very hyper as a pup, but she was never this bad.

And you'd think he was undersocialized but the woman who we met at the dog park took him there every week and we've been takeing him there and hes usualy fine with the dogs there.

What i said about the pitbull thing was not a stab at pit's, i'm sorry if you took it to offense. I'm just trying to figure out why? He is SUCH a sweetheart most of the time, always giving kisses, whenever hes chewing something you tell him no and he stops. Its just an upseting thing and i guess me being upset is making me jump to conclusions. I apologize.

pitgrrl
April 9th, 2008, 09:45 PM
Oh, no worries, I was just trying to point out that the grabbing on and holding was a behavior I'd seen in a lot of puppies. It strikes me as pretty obnoxious, but one of my dogs seems to love it :shrug:

If I were in your position I would find an experience behaviorist or trainer to at least get an assessment on the situation done.

I hope you can figure it out, he looks like a really cutey.

doggie
April 9th, 2008, 10:40 PM
First, thank you for rescuing this little pup. Obviously he was neglected. Please, please, please quit pairing your hands with your displeasure. He sees your hands as front paws which are used exclusively for play in the canine. Everytime you pair your hands (front paws) with your displeasure you are confusing him. This is the specific reason he is responding with aggression.

I have made a living for 30 years because people continue to use their hands to push, shove, hit, scruff-shake and dominance-down. All of these correction methods are still taught by the dog training industry - and they are WRONG! Even Cesar Millan uses his hands to shove and correct dogs. Nobody realizes that there is as long as an eight month conditioning period in dogs. So you solve a puppy issue with the wrong method and eight months later your dog bites someone, or attacks another dog. Which, while I'm thinking of it, reminds me that the misuse of the familys' hands is the cause of the majority of dog aggressive dogs I take into training.

Please let me know if you want to know the proper way of correcting the dog for playfully biting. Also, I am of the opinion that when a younger dog pesters an older dog, and won't back-off when the older dog says, "I've had enough of you right now," it is time for you to step in and give the youngster a little time out. This is not as a punishment, rather just a chance to cool his jets. Even attaching him to something heavy for a time-out is effective. The barking while attached is also something that is relatively easy to handle. But I won't spend more time typing unless you want more info.

Shannon Schaefer / Doggie Tech

Akira
April 10th, 2008, 02:05 PM
I want plenty more info! You seem to know what your talking about so please tell me more. yesterday was the first time i put him on his back, i dont believe in that type of dicispline, but the vet was actualy the one who said to try it. :shrug: Whenever my husband says his firm no and points at him with his finger he gets very scared so as of right now i'm not sure how to discipline, ive always use the no and the finger point. It is so sad whenever i put him in his crate or put him in time out. even when i put him outside without akira he cries and cries. Akira used to whine all the time in her crate or whenever we left but i could deal with it. He makes my heart ache when he cries soo loudly and when i come to him hes so happy and jumps into my arms to give me kisses. I think being left outside all the time was part of the reason why he doesnt like to be left alone. Ive been looking for some obedience trainers, but is there anything I myself can do? If hes being bad with akira ill seperate them and give him a toy, he'll give it a couple chews and then start trying to fight with her again. Is putting him in time out and getting an obedience trainer all i can do?

doggie
April 10th, 2008, 06:30 PM
I just picked up your reply. I have clients the rest of the day so a quick message to start. Put a collar (any kind-nylon, leather) on him. Put a leash at least 2 feet long on the collar. Tie a knot in the end of it so you have something to grab. Leave this on at all times IN YOUR PRESENCE. If you don't like where he is or what he is doing, don't point, don't grab at him, calmly grab the far end of the 2 foot leash and pull him away. Use that loud, angry "no" - but only if he is actually doing something wrong. This will give you a way to control and maneuver him without using your hands when you are displeased.

I don't know if they will post links or allow it and I don't have time right now to look at the rules, so I'll hope you get this message. Go to www.youtube.com/doggietalk Carefully listen to all the videos except "Bad Dog" and "Dog Training" - they aren't instructional.

I'll be back with more later this evening.

Shannon Schaefer
Doggie Tech

doggie
April 10th, 2008, 11:52 PM
If you watched the video clips you already know that when he comes out of the crate and jumps all over you he is asking you precisely what you want him to do. Don't humanize it and think he is just happy to see you. He is asking questions! If you don't answer them, your other dog is his next source of information. And, again, if you watched the clips you already know that he is so frustrated he is taking it out on the other dog.

Likewise, when he cries while outside, or when he is whining in the crate, it is the same problem. He doesn't have answers except pointing fingers and "no!"

He growled at the vet because: "It is always the people in the family who are confusing the dog with the hands. And it is almost always somebody outside of the family that gets bit." I've been saying that for 30 years.

In one of your posts you said he is always kissing you. I wouldn't be surprised if he is trying to lick your lower jaw. That is right out of his own play book (or hard drive). He is most willing to submit to your leadership. You just need to act like leadership. That's where obedience comes in. So many posts mentioned obedience. Yes! Yes!

First things first. I will be happy to email you the exact instructions for a couple of your immediate issues. At his age, you can treat the aggressive biting just like playfully biting as far as correcting him. I can't attach the file here because it is either in Adobe (pdf) or Word. My email is fetchball@gmail.com If you want the info please sent me the request.