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What do you think of vinegar and water?

Chibi
March 9th, 2008, 05:16 PM
I have read on countless websites that a good way to deter your dog from doing bad things is to squirt him with a squirt bottle with the tiniest amount of white vinegar in it, because he hates the smell. It has actually worked for me to rub some vinegar on computer wires to keep him from chewing, and I figured that a good spray along with a strong "No" would get the point across, and get him to actually associate the word No with Don't do that.
I have been told just to sound firm, but that just is not enough. I tell him no in a firm, calm voice, he just looks at while he chews. I yell NO and he'll pause for a second, and then go back to doing whatever he is doing.

So my question is where do I spray him, because I don't want it in his eyes, and if anyone has ever tried this?

jessi76
March 10th, 2008, 08:05 AM
I love vinegar & water... to clean my coffeepot, not to train my dog.

I would only use water if squirting an animal - it's just safer. As for keeping the dog from chewing things... saying NO isn't enough, nor is squirting. NO is too general a term and gets used for EVERYTHING, so IMO, it's not a great term to use.

Instead, try to actually train LEAVE IT. teach your dog that LEAVE IT means to literally LEAVE IT ALONE. start with crumpled up paper towels on the floor. walk your dog up to it on leash, when he goes to sniff or grab it, slightly tug the leash once and say LEAVE IT in a firm tone, and guide the dog AWAY from it. reward him. (small treat/praise).

practice this command with all sorts of things - toys, shoes, trash on the ground, computer wires, etc... with repetition, and positive reinforcement he will learn the command. you must practice though. this isn't something that's learned in a day, or remembered in a day. so use it often and always reward your dog for listening and obeying.

as for the vinegar... save it for cleaning and cooking purposes. ;)

kiara
March 10th, 2008, 10:34 AM
The best bet is to invest money for a dog trainer and you will never have to worry again. Chewing wires is dangerous, something could happen when you are not home. I have several friends with unruly dogs, can't figure out why they didn't get them trained???

shane 123
March 10th, 2008, 11:44 AM
The only thing I can think of right now is "Apple Bitter". They use it a lot for horses that chew and pet shops carry it for dogs also. Better to spray all electrical wires to deter the chewing in a hurry. I have a friend who found her pup on the floor laying in urine and excrement...the dog had chewed through a wire and gotten electrocuted. They rushed the dog to a vet but a year later the dog had to be put to sleep because of all kinds of things due to this...it seems it had affected the brain.
Don't put aside the training though, this is just a temporary aid until the dog is trained to "leave".

onster
March 10th, 2008, 11:45 AM
sorry I cant really input on this (no dogs) but I was wondering if anyone has tried vinegar on wires for cats? Or if this is safe for cats/dogs? I wish I could train my cat..but can't..lol...so any input would be awesome on this.

Sorry once again for thread-jacking...i had just never heard of using vinegar 4 chewing (the usual is hot sauce etc)

jessi76
March 10th, 2008, 12:00 PM
you can try it, but I don't believe it'd last very long. vinegar shouldn't hurt the animal, it's perfectly safe to eat - however, I still wouldn't recommend using it in a squirt bottle as in the OP.

To keep my cats from the wires, I simply stuffed the area w/ lots of thick beach towels. when they were out of the kitten stage, the temptation to chew the wires was gone.

you can buy wire covers, cable protectors, etc.. if it's a big problem. If your animal is chewing through wires, I would opt to cover them completely rather than relying on something that is sprayed or wiped on. if you remove access to it, at least the safety issue is addressed. I'd still teach the dog how to LEAVE IT though.

Bitter Apple is available at pet stores, but in my house, my dog thought it was a condiment. it didn't deter him from anything, only real training did the trick.

hazelrunpack
March 10th, 2008, 12:24 PM
Jessi is right--vinegar evaporates too quickly to keep a determined pet from chewing on wires.

And vinegar and water isn't much of a training tool. We keep a half-and-half mixture in a spray bottle to break up spats between dogs if they get too intense, but if we just had one dog, we wouldn't use it at all.

Better methods of training to positive reinforcement, redirection, patience, and persistence to get across the idea of what's acceptable and what isn't.

Chibi
March 10th, 2008, 12:40 PM
We decided plain water would do just as much good and would be so much safer, so we are going to try that. I figure that a spritz along with the word NO will eventually get him to link the word NO to unpleasantness.
We do plan on having the dog trained, but the only reputable trainer in our area requires him to have all of his shots as he will be working with other dogs. She has a variety of different methods, an 8 week program once a week, or a 2-4 week live in session where she trains him alongside all of her other dogs and teaches him to live in a pack with a human alpha. My boyfriend thinks the two week session with her would be faster, more convenient, and better for the dog - it sounds wonderful, but I don't know if I could live without him for two weeks! But then again, people do kennel their dogs when they go away... Oh well, it's awhile off. She can train a dog to stop at every curb, stop car chasing, even teach him never to take a treat or food from strangers without an owners permission! lol.

EDIT: Jessi, your method of Leave It training sounds fantastic. I will have to give it a try. So, I tug him away from from the object and say leave it, and as soon as he steps back he gets a treat, or does he get the treat if he shows no interest?

hazelrunpack
March 10th, 2008, 12:47 PM
Why do you want to link the word NO to unpleasantness? It's much more effective to use NO as an indication of inappropriate behavior and then show your dog what acceptable behavior is--for instance, if he wants to chew on wires, say No in a firm voice (not yelling...just no nonsense) and then redirect him to a toy that he is allowed to chew on. No unpleasantness needed. With patience and persistence, he'll catch on.

jessi76
March 10th, 2008, 12:59 PM
We decided plain water would do just as much good and would be so much safer, so we are going to try that. I figure that a spritz along with the word NO will eventually get him to link the word NO to unpleasantness.

Hazel is right. It's better to mark a good behavior than mark a WRONG/BAD one. mark and encourage the right behavior and that's the one you'll end up with. if you continually mark the bad one, your dog will learn that he gets attention (yes, even negative attention is STILL attention) when he does something wrong.

ETA - the squirt bottle is really only effective to get the dog's attention. as hazel noted above, she uses it to break up spats. I use it to get my dog's attention, then redirect to a positive, always ending on a positive note.

She has a variety of different methods, an 8 week program once a week, or a 2-4 week live in session where she trains him alongside all of her other dogs and teaches him to live in a pack with a human alpha. My boyfriend thinks the two week session with her would be faster, more convenient, and better for the dog - it sounds wonderful, but I don't know if I could live without him for two weeks! But then again, people do kennel their dogs when they go away... Oh well, it's awhile off. She can train a dog to stop at every curb, stop car chasing, even teach him never to take a treat or food from strangers without an owners permission!

my problem with that is SHE is doing the training, not YOU (or your bf). IMO, it's always better for a trainer to train the dog's OWNER so the owner can in turn train the dog. as my trainer said on the first day, "I don't train dogs. I train owners to train their dogs." IMO, a good trainer should be able to teach YOU the techniques so you can train your dog to meet your lifestyle/needs.

Chibi
March 10th, 2008, 01:04 PM
I guess because I have always seen it done that way? I don't know.
We have tried giving him nice toys, he will chew it and go back to whatever he shouldn't be touching. It's almost as if he is a little ADD. He doesn't seem to notice if we are happy, or upset. I praise him and he doesn't get perky or excited, just kind of looks at me.

jessi76
March 10th, 2008, 01:13 PM
how old and what type of dog? Perhaps we can suggest some irresistable toys/chews for you to help keep his attention on that instead of wires.

Chibi
March 10th, 2008, 02:04 PM
10 week old miniature Daschund.

jessi76
March 10th, 2008, 02:31 PM
a few toys that you may want to consider to keep this pup entertained....

a puppy kong:
http://www.kongcompany.com/worlds_best.html

this is a hard rubber toy that you fill w/ treats (or just regular kibble) the dog then works to get the treat out, thus keeping puppy busy and providing an object suitable for chewing on.

a busy buddy twist n treat: http://www.busybuddytoys.com/moreinfo.cfm?Product_ID=2

The Orka Jack w/ Rope (toy for pups) available at most large pet supply stores.

Just three high quality toys that will satisfy chewing, and reward the pup at the same time. by placing treats (even just kibble) inside a toy, it rewards the dog for using the toy. therefore the pup is more likely to opt for the toy over your computer wires. be sure to vary the treats in the toy (so it's not boring) and rotate your toys - only keep 1 or 2 out at a time, then switch them out w/ other ones, so it's always "fresh" for the dog. If I take a toy away, and put it back 2 wks later, my dog acts like it's a new toy again.

Chibi
March 10th, 2008, 06:02 PM
I didn't see any place to order the Kong, so pet stores only?
What does everyone think of the kibble dispenser balls? Is that squeeze food really okay for them to eat?

rainbow
March 10th, 2008, 07:13 PM
Jessi and Hazel have given you very good information already. :thumbs up

As far as the Kongs they are available almost everywhere..... pet stores, Walmart, Zellers, Canadian Tire. They are very popular. As far as stuffing them I wouldn't buy any of the premade stuff available. Here are a few options and if you google "stuffed kong recipes" you'll find lots more....

http://www.labmed.org/catalog/kong2.html

Also, remember whatever you put in the kongs or treat dispenser toys is considered part of the dogs daily food intake. :pawprint:

Harley's_Mom
March 13th, 2008, 10:29 PM
Have you tried buying him a Loofah dog toy to chew on? Harley absolutely loves them. He used to drag his everywhere with him. I have found with Harley that he prefers the stuffed dog toys. He does have a Cuz which he plays outside with in the summer and he has an Orbee rubber toy which he plays with if I put treats in it. His stuffed toys he plays with all the time. It's been my experience with Harley that as long as he has one of his favourite toys to chew on then he leaves all the forbidden stuff alone.

Chibi
March 14th, 2008, 12:02 AM
Our boy has lots of toys - squeak toys, stuffed toys, rope toys, rattle toys - soon he will have a KONG too. I can redirect him from the wires and etc. to a toy and that usually works, but I am just afraid of not catching him in time and him either hurting himself by chewing something with a substantial current in it, or doing some damage to something a little more important than a speaker wire, such as a power cord or something.

He now has a fetish for socks - not socks laying around, I can take those away and he doesn't care - but socks that you are wearing, as well as the cuff of your pants, those things he wants to tug on and bite at. we usually just tell him no and dislodge him, but he seems keen to ignore us.

jessi76
March 14th, 2008, 07:38 AM
I can redirect him from the wires and etc. to a toy and that usually works, but I am just afraid of not catching him in time and him either hurting himself by chewing something with a substantial current in it, or doing some damage to something a little more important than a speaker wire, such as a power cord or something.

if you cannot supervise, the dog should be confined in a SAFE area - where no cords are available. I highly suggest you get an X-pen to contain this little one during the times you can't watch him closely. if a dog that small bites into a cord with enough current - well, the results could be dangerous, electrical burns or worse.

He now has a fetish for socks - not socks laying around, I can take those away and he doesn't care - but socks that you are wearing, as well as the cuff of your pants, those things he wants to tug on and bite at. we usually just tell him no and dislodge him, but he seems keen to ignore us.

this is very NORMAL puppy behavior. just keep discouraging it, saying NO BITE or AHT! AHT! then redirect to a toy. I think all pups tug at pant legs... it's a fun game for them. this phase will pass soon enough. hard to be mad at such a cute fuzzball tugging on your pant leg, huh? :rolleyes:

Chibi
March 14th, 2008, 10:22 AM
We're looking at getting an exercise pen or something similar, but for now I am home all day to watch him - puppies can be quick though.

Yes, it is very hard to discourage him - especially when he looks so hopeless and can't do much damage. But he'll get bigger... I just keep telling myself that when he chews socks, pants, and nibbles my fingers.